(Topic ID: 210020)

Is JJP pricing itself out of business


By JY64

1 year ago



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  • 384 posts
  • 131 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by master_of_chaos
  • Topic is favorited by 4 Pinsiders

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There are 384 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 8.
-20
#1 1 year ago

5 yr's back Pinside was on fire with JJP threads now few post in any 24 hr period. A poll asking will you buy POTC had %50 say cost to much https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/are-you-buying-potc . Now we know the themes have gotten better the quality is there yet each game has fewer Pinside owners. With a $500 price bump per game not sure JJP can keep it up.

#2 1 year ago

They are very expensive and only reach a certain demographic. JJP knows they have a market of wealthy collectors and operators and that’s their focus, they’re not worried about the casual fan. The prices do continue to rise and that could be a problem.

12
#3 1 year ago

They have a long way to go before equaling the most expensive Stern game...

And JJP knows their market. And not shockingly, they know I'm not in it because it's too rich for my tastes. I'm not insulted by their games being out of my price range.

#4 1 year ago

Simply put nope. They are still selling WOZRR pins. So there is an ever expanding market.

We were just talking about the JJP POTC last night at league and the problem was that the reveal party didn't provide enough playing time on the machine. Also the code was very limited. So I think there are a lot of pinballers waiting to play a released POTC.

#6 1 year ago

Haha have you seen the amount of monies people spend on shit here?

Quoted from JY64:

Now we know the themes have gotten better....

I understand your schtik and I'm fine with it, but I wouldn't say the themes have gotten better really.
Hobbit is a great theme but there were very mixed feelings on that one. Is Pirates really a "great theme?" How aboot Pirates sans Johnny Depp? Dialed in was laughed at by Theme whores and well...let's not get into OZ and what people were saying aboot it 5 years ago.
EDIT: I also don't know I'd say the quality up.

17
#7 1 year ago

Best pins made and only ones i will currently purchase

15
#8 1 year ago

They've priced themselves out of my business. Plus I don't find them as fun as Sterns. Looking forward to playing Pirates. That one looks promising.

#9 1 year ago

Defiantly priced out for me to purchase for my home, but I will play them on location. I enjoy playing Dialed In and am looking forward to checking out Pirates.

#10 1 year ago

I'm more interested in them finally releasing a theme that I can get into. I know theme is not everything, but it does matter. The themes so far have been at the wrong end of the spectrum, for me. The games themselves look to be worth the price tag.

#11 1 year ago

They know their targeted market. Now that there is a variety of manufacturers once again in the pinball hobby, you have to wrap your head around the fact that not everybody can afford everything and that is ok. I'm glad there are options.

The JJP machines are premium in every regard. The price of pirates is steep, but the game looks absolutely packed with no expense spared and full of innovation. That being said, I really hope the LE price of the next title is back down to 9k or less.

39
#12 1 year ago

I'd take a JJP pin over any other >$7500 pin on the market. Their quality and dedication to code is unmatched.

#13 1 year ago

I’m not buying 7500 pins. Stern priced me out with the last increase in price. Wait 6-12 months and I buy HUO. Done buying new pins from anyone. Bought somewhere around 10 new sterns in the past.

The buyer at 7500+ is a very very small market. This isn’t going to hold in the long run. So many threads with people talking about all these new people coming into pinball. This will burst. Its going to take a few more years before the decline will come. It’s going to happen.

#14 1 year ago

There's plenty of people willing to pay - look how many CEs they sold.

#15 1 year ago
Quoted from jwilson:

There's plenty of people willing to pay - look how many CEs they sold.

How many CEs did they sell?

I know it wasn't very many on DICE. The had to incentivize buyers with a jacket and a bowl of soup with Jack and Pat over at Mendy's.

#16 1 year ago
Quoted from Mike_J:

How many CEs did they sell?

The limit is 200. I believe they were spoken for before Expo ended.

LTG : )

#17 1 year ago
Quoted from LTG:

The limit is 200. I believe they were spoken for before Expo ended.
LTG : )

That's pretty damn good if they have all been sold to the end user or if the stocking dealer has paid JJP in full for the units.

#18 1 year ago

No,top notch product. Yes they are expensive.

#19 1 year ago
Quoted from Mike_J:

That's pretty damn good if they have all been sold to the end user or if the stocking dealer has paid JJP in full for the units.

Technically the dice sold out as dealer's bought them all . I expect some potcce are still available and more will be as people drop out once 12500 is due... its easy to put down a refundable deposit . Heck i have a deposit down and may end up canceling.

43
#20 1 year ago

JJP is doing it right. I'm done with Stern for the time being. JJP is producing a quality product coupled with great code. Stern is remixing the same old layout and pasting a popular movie or band on it and shipping it out the door with some beta ass code. The real tipping point for me is the abysmal warranty of 90 days on the board with the spike system that really isn't tested and super expensive to repair when node boards or the CPU go out. I'm not sure how OPs will continue to afford that option regardless of the smaller initial investment. The risk is just too high.

#21 1 year ago

I think they need to do more research on their themes before they make one. WOZ is well designed, but the theme just didn’t resonate with me. Dialed in, was the same. PotC. Looks cool, but another remake theme... Hobbit is a Lotr copy too. Really need something that resonates with the community in my opinion.

Stern games themes are good in my opinion, just not impressed with their quality lately.

#22 1 year ago
Quoted from alexanr1:

I think they need to do more research on their themes before they make one. WOZ is well designed, but the theme just didn’t resonate with me. Dialed in, was the same. PotC. Looks cool, but another remake theme... Hobbit is a Lotr copy too. Really need something that resonates with the community in my opinion.
Stern games themes are good in my opinion, just not impressed with their quality lately.

WOZ is one of the Best theme's possible I think.
POTC and Toy Story not so much .

The_Wizard_of_Oz_Judy_Garland_Terry_1939 (resized).jpg

#23 1 year ago

They nearly priced themselves out of business with Woz and TH and needed the investor to bail them out. Too low for what they were delivering and mostly just took way to long to deliver it. Fixed overhead churns 24/7.

JJP can't seem to produce more than 1 pin per year and that works for them as long as they don't deliver a dud. The plus factor for them is they can run Woz and DI forever if they need to keep the line moving and demand is still there.

I have a deposit down on a POTCCE and will def keep it. And it has no Depp face front and center!

#24 1 year ago

You could say Ferrari, Tesla, etc priced themselves out of the market also but you can't deny they make nice toys. Just not to everyones budget. When I first started in pinball I would Never consider a pin like this let alone NIB but with hard work (and a smaller basement) I have grown to appreciate quality over quantity. But thats just me. They make a beautiful pin and they don't seem to have any trouble finding buyers. I'm with #iceman44, can't wait for me POTCCE #17 and feel the cost was justified after playing many games local. (257) As for the "remake" comment... This pin couldn't be Further from a Stern remake in Every category. Unless your saying title alone which would make me question the 25 rock band themes they keep remaking. They Have to be out of bands by now!

#25 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I have a deposit down on a POTCCE and will def keep it. And it has no Depp face front and center!

I thought the CE came with an extra unpopulated playfield w/o Depp, not that it was installed?

#26 1 year ago

My first NIB game will be a JJP game, no doubt!

#27 1 year ago

Sincerely I found stern games highly more expensive compared to JJP regarding innovation, creativity, stuffs on playfield on JJP games.
How a game like GOTG with the Metallica layout can be priced like a new game??

#28 1 year ago

They are definitely too much money for me to consider buying one. They are obviously selling enough of them to stay in business though i guess.

#29 1 year ago

Just bought a really nice judge dredd for less than 1/3 of the price of a new JJP you couldn't manufacture a pin like dredd and sell for $10k today. It's the "I got the newest thing" hype that you're paying for with NIB these days. Fully featured loaded fun pins with great art are out there. You may be priced out of the "Cool kid on the block" club but not out of great pinball machines. Plus when the bubble bursts you will be in a more stable place to enjoy playing.

#30 1 year ago

I only have room for 4 pins, own a WOZ, a Stern Star Trek and two older games. Eventually, I will sell the Star Trek and get another JJP game. Not sure yet if it will be DI or JJPOTC. Once I have two, I can always fund another by selling one. In that way, I’m only paying $1,000-2,000 in incremental costs, which for me would be affordable. I guess that’s the benefit of having a small collection. I have no choice but to sell one to get one.

Regardless, JJP has me salivating over every game they make. From the look, the toys, the code, the layout. Stern just isn’t doing it for me anymore. While I have fun playing the Stern games on location, they just seem too stripped down and cookie cutter to interest me in buying again. And the code is a crap shoot. I’m not against Stern. I think they are a great company. But JJP has all my interest right now, and if I’m going to spend a ridiculous amount of money on a NIB pin, I might as well get what I want for it.

#31 1 year ago

I am another one who, they have priced me out of their market. But the same goes for Stern

#32 1 year ago

I think this is happening all over. Pinball is a very expensive hobby. To spend 10k on a new pin is very indulgent. To ask yourself is it worth it is silly in itself. Buying multiple pins per year at prices from 6,500 to 12,500 is crazy. Why do we do it? Because we are dumb and somehow we justify it to ourselves that it is going to be ok. Anyways I feel prices on pins should come down but in all actuality they probably will not. How high will new pin prices go? Not sure but at current prices for most people it is not obtainable. Love the new stuff. Bells and whistles. Pretty and flashy. But the price tag really sucks.

#33 1 year ago

It's not just the money, it's the JJP games. They just aren't that good.
They do not hold up on location - they play sloppy - they have way, way too many components underneath the playfield.
You need to take apart 6 things to get to the 1 area needing repair. No thanks.
Great big color full video screens in the head. Excellent, but who has time to look at the them when you are playing?

All my circle talks about is what Planetary is releasing soon:
When the pinball world cares most about which 20 year old game is being remade, that ought to show you that the new titles and sellers are not cutting it.
My orders for Cactus C and BBB get placed the day they announce, whenever that is.

Still love Metallica, though...

#34 1 year ago

I think Dialed IN is the best new game out there and seems to be priced pretty fair when you consider all that's packed into the playfield compared to competitors.

Do I wish they were cheaper? Yep. But as long as they produce games like DI, I'm in.

10
#35 1 year ago

If you can afford a Mercedes-Benz you buy a Mercedes-Benz. The new Pirates is great and the rules are so deep that you will never get tired of it at home. I played at 257 with someone that barely plays he loved it. Rules are deep but by ball 2 everyone was talking like a pirate.Try not to judge a game until you've played it.Comparing JJP POTC to Sterns is like comparing the the new Avenger movies to the original Avenger movie

Screenshot_20180217-064537 (resized).png

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#36 1 year ago
Quoted from ejg10532626:

It's not just the money, it's the JJP games. They just aren't that good.

Im sorry. I have to disagree with this. I think they are the best pins out there right now. However, I will admit that they are often set up poorly on location with too shallow a pitch and weak flippers. Also, to truly appreciate the code, home use is the way to go.

#37 1 year ago

JJP will set its pricing at current levels until the market is no longer willing to pay it. Are they pricing themselves out? Not yet... if they were, they’d be out of business yesterday.

You may not like the pricing, but apparently it fits their needs for sales.

I agree with everyone that expresses frustration over market prices... but the reality is: you gotta pay for certain eras of games. And there is plenty of pinball to be had for less coin - EMs and some late EMs/early solid states - that still deliver the magic of the game.

-8
#38 1 year ago

2 reasons why I don't buy JJP games: software & no decent distributor for Belgium

14
#39 1 year ago

Hard to drop $8,000+ on any pin for me.

JJP packs much more into a pin than Stern though, for the money. It's not even close.

No more $8K's though. I survived a GBLE purchase.

Never forget.

#40 1 year ago

For a majority of us, I would agree they are pricing themselves out of the market, but they don’t need the majority to survive. Is their time coming?? I believe it is and I say this because all of the new companies will drain more revenue from JJP than Stern. Pick your future themes wisely JJP.........Winter is coming.

21
#41 1 year ago
Quoted from pascal-pinball:

2 reasons why I don't buy JJP games: software & no decent distributor for Belgium

???

JJP has arguably the best software support in the business. Certainly miles ahead of Stern.

#42 1 year ago

I love woz and potc, dialed in and hobbit not so much. Stern can suck a dick with their bullshit qc issues. Wont be buying nib from them again. Both companies are over priced. Im buying project em's to fill the void. BOTH stern and jjp are pricing themselves out

#43 1 year ago
Quoted from Nokoro:

Im sorry. I have to disagree with this. I think they are the best pins out there right now. However, I will admit that they are often set up poorly on location with too shallow a pitch and weak flippers. Also, to truly appreciate the code, home use is the way to go.

Nothing to be sorry about Many would agree with you.
But you must admit - they are always changing hands, and usually south of purchase price, so some agree with me too.

I absolutely loved Dialed IN first 6 times I played.
Soon as a location copy was put in near me, I grew to hate it quick - but there is some truth to what you said about a good HUO copy.
I may still like that.

#44 1 year ago
Quoted from ejg10532626:

Nothing to be sorry about Many would agree with you.
But you must admit - they are always changing hands, and usually south of purchase price, so some agree with me too.
I absolutely loved Dialed IN first 6 times I played.
Soon as a location copy was put in near me, I grew to hate it quick - but there is some truth to what you said about a good HUO copy.
I may still like that.

Yeah, I started off hating WOZ when I played it on location. Hated hated hated it. Now I own one. LOL.

In terms of changing hands for less than purchase price, I think you have to expect that. They are still making all of their games so why pay close to purchase for used. I expect to lose at least a grand on each one if I sell. I’m ok with that.

#45 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I have a deposit down on a POTCCE and will def keep it. And it has no Depp face front and center!

No Depp face is worth the extra 3k, 100%!

#46 1 year ago
Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

They've priced themselves out of my business. Plus I don't find them as fun as Sterns. Looking forward to playing Pirates. That one looks promising.

I understand your comment looking at your collection.

#47 1 year ago

I love everything about JJP pins from the complexity, visual interactions, code and even technical support. I don't even own a JJP, but inquired about some WOZ issues when considering a used and was amazed at the detailed and fast response from tech support. When looking at new I've bought two new Stern's in the last few months. Financially they are within reach. New JJP are not. Perhaps I'll join the JJP train in the coming years, but more than likely it will be buying a used JJP.

#48 1 year ago

I do think a new car is out of the reach for most but with that being said, a used car like 2 years old, is not.

#49 1 year ago

They priced me out. I'm glad they are around and I'll play them at shows or friends houses but it's simply not worth the money. I can't get that much fun out of a game and there are a ton of other things I'd rather do with my money. Good for them if they can sell enough $9500 and up games to stay in business.

#50 1 year ago
Quoted from Mike_J:

bowl of soup with Jack and Pat over at Mendy's.

I hear the soup is the best...the best

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