This

Would not advertise HUO, but you could say never routed and explain it had been in a show.

I put a quarter in every single game that I play at shows so that they can no longer be called HUO (and to f*ck with crazy levi, I put canadian quarters in his machines

Lmao
-Mike

Let's be honest. I think we all know it's the other way around. The ones pushing the superiority of HUO and knocking pins which have been to shows are clearly the ones most concerned about selling for a premium.

I can't say my truck is "personal use only" if I bring it to Hertz for a weekend and a bunch of people drive it around without the responsibility of ownership.

Unless the show is in your home, no... it is not home use only.

If your fucking liar than thats on you....its pretty easy to tell when someone is full of shit....

What if you have a huge party and you arent tending to the machine the whole time but its being played all day. Is there a difference then?

I mean who knows, but for the most part YES....HUO games typically are in a temp controlled environment, rarely moved, and typically monitored closely by owners....when your at a show/bar the use and environment are all over the map. I've bought no less than 20 games the last couple years and all have been by owners with small collections, and with very little game play.....the guys who route can argue all day, but theres no doubt a low play HUO game has taken much less wear and tear (for the most part). Game value is all about condition and thats usually a function of wear and tear.

Good to see my games are not affected by such terminology, as I and most Texans, do not have basements.

If you take a HUO game to a show for a few days, I don’t see how you could still call it that.

Since I’m a straight shooter, if I ever list my B\W pins for sale, I’ll list them as RIYPBHUOAR.

Routed In Years Past But Home Use Only After Resto. Honesty is always the best policy

This is a really good point. I have seen restos that put NIB to shame. Obviously a resto can have more time spent on it than an assembly line.
-Mike

No doubt....a fully restored game is in an entirely different category

I 100% agree with this.

I could take a picture of myself unboxing a game and setting it up and then another picture 5 years later in the same spot and that is documentation of squat.

That’s the problem. HUO does not exist. It’s not a real thing.

Home Use Only. It's in the name!! How could it be HUO if it was played outside of the Home???

HUO means Home Use Only.........Clearly you have some trouble with your comprehension skills. I love threads like this as it let’s me know who to avoid when buying games.

What if you live in a hotel?

Are you going for the "home is where the heart is" angle?

HUO means nothing to me. I've seen true huo games that were wrecked, and I've seen routed games that were pristine. The machine tells the story to me...not the labels attached to them.

Legs On Once means everything to me.

I think we are dealing with semantics. The game was definitely not routed and not used commercially. If the only common alternative to express this is the HUO term, then I would say use but with a parenthetical Letting potential buyers know you took it to a show once.

BTW, in my mind showing pins doesn't detract value. I see dozens of pins for sale at TPF each year, and they certainly aren’t marked down or discounted because they are on the event floor (actually, seems like just the opposite most times - priced a little higher).

HUO means Home Use Only - if it's gone to a show it's not home use only.

What is wrong is using HUO as some kind of indicator of it's condition.

hotel use only? this would also work if you ran or resided in a hostel

It honestly blows my mind that this is the level of stupidity the hobby has become.

Condition is king! That is all that matters.

Home Use Only is a fluff term used to sell a game that holds little to no value on any game.
I have bought verified first owner home use only game where the glass was never pulled, is was filthy, switches not working, parts had gotten loose and then broken because it had 1000+ plays on a loose part.

I have bought routed games with 20,000+ plays that were well maintained and great condition.

Yes I agree with all of this...

How many plays would a single game get at one of these shows?

When I think HUO, to me that means low plays and in good shape due to low plays... Because its been in a home and not at a bar or wherever...

You know what I say: "If it ain't new......it better be LOO!"

So what if i took delivery of a NIB machine in my private office at my own company. And only i played it for 6 months.

I think most would consider that machine HUO, but accordin to the logic above, it never could be as i don't live in my office.

I personally believe that HUO = Never routed, but as others state, i dont really see how it matters, as condition means so much more.

Finally someone else that gets it!! Haha

The idea is you show the chain of custody. You can show the invoice to the named non-commercial buyer, onward to you. 'Documented' in the sense you show it was sold to private parties, not commercial operators. When your timelines, sources, condition, and paperwork match up... there you go.

At Magfest which is 4 straight 24hr days.. our games would get about 1200 plays.
At a regular pinshow... they may get 300ish or so games over the event.

When we have parties at houses for the end of season league parties.. games would regularly get 100-150 plays in a single day.

So are people who host parties at the house obligated to disclose that too?

How about a new name.. 'Private Use Only' - then people can feel good about their labels

I dated a girl once that had only been with one guy,,, except for a crazy weekend she wouldn't talk about...

But was she at home when she got crazy?

A show isn't a location? You're putting a game in a public place for anyone to play - that's the definition of a location. Hence it's no longer "HOME-use ONLY".
As for show games "not taking damage" like route games, that wasn't the question. Even though it's not there as long, a game WILL get treated differently at a show than it will in your home. The general public doesn't give a shit about accidentally spilling something on your game, or their unsupervised 7 year old engraving your cabinet.

That being said, I still take a game to almost every show I attend.

Hmm, disagree.

HOME. USE. ONLY. It’s pretty freaking clear.

Nominated for dumbest thread of 2019

HUO is a bullshit term. You always judge the machine with your own eyes and decide what you are willing to pay. Which machine is nicer? If I put 10,000 plays on my new Jurassic Park at home...is that game worth more than a machine that a distributor put put at a show for a weekend and has 1,000 plays?

Well, of course it is--isn't HUO Home Use Occasionally?

I saw a Craigslist ad recently for an HUO CGC MBRLE. That was literally the header. LOL

I found it humorous because 99.9999% of people don't speak Pinside, and not all pinball collectors are on Pinside.

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Wasn't the question. No one is disagreeing, but that doesn't apply.

Is a machine HUO if it's never left your home, not even during the fire? When buying, I totally disregard the term. I don't care what standards anyone want to use. Talk like adults and figure out the actual condition of the machine. I see a distributor selling a machine for more because it was a "Show Machine". I don't have an issue with that the game was decked out to show off at shows.

I walked out on buying an HUO Stern once because the manual wasn't still stapled to the cab inside.

Just kidding!

"Goody bag still attached!" +$500!

I shall have to pass on your "pin-ball" game, as you see, I am a buyer, a connoisseur of luxury and leisure. If this "pin-ball" has been... as you say... "at a convention," well then I see no reason to call it exclusively HOME USE! Dare I say it has been soiled with... the UNKNOWN! Bother me not with your pricing and stories of condition. This game of leisure is now worth no more to me than the dirt beneath my shoes! How would I sleep nights knowing that this toy has been pummeled by the world?

Were you fortunate to be allowed into my home I might SHOW YOU my "pin-ball" entertainments... but TOUCH THEM NOT! For then how would they hold any value at all? Pray tell, what LOCATION have you come from to play my games? I could not prove that you were "of mine home" while you enjoyed my investments! The value would be... lost! Utterly lost!

Looking at you collection, how can I be sure that your 1931 Wiffle was purchased NIB by you and has been HUO ever since?

I have seen 600 to 800 plays on machines at a show. ForceFlow has documented some of his own machines before/after a show.
And I'll add that yes some machines get damaged/worn areas during a show.
You're not exactly stopping during a show to say " hey we just reached 250 games, time for a clean and wax.
-Mike

Most of the time after the first day of the show, I wax some of the main areas of the playfield each morning. That at least helps a little bit.

Yes , of course they are . As long as they are not plugged in to an electrical outlet or turned on while they are there .

HUO gets blown way out of proportion here, just like the pics of the shooter lane. Themselves they are meaningless, but they are 2 out of 100 questions you could answer that represent the condition of the machine.

I refuse to believe there are people here who can afford pinball machines that don't understand what HUO means. So really, it's a matter of sellers willing to mislead buyers. Granted, it's just a little bit, but even a little bit isn't okay.

Puffing isn't against any laws, just because you have the right, doesn't make it right.