(Topic ID: 217498)

Iron Maiden issues

By rvdv

5 years ago


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  • Latest reply 7 months ago by Skinner
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Topic index (key posts)

11 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

Display key post list sorted by: Post date | Keypost summary | User name

Post #96 sarcophagus switch fix. Posted by DG_Amuse (5 years ago)

Post #434 Black t-moulding pictured to replace stock banana yellow. Posted by Strummy (5 years ago)

Post #597 Stern fix for Newton Ball issues on LE Posted by Fytr (5 years ago)

Post #887 Fix for fast balls not registering on upper loop Posted by PinNin (5 years ago)

Post #1039 Picture of factory fix for bad mummy newton ball on Prem/LE Posted by RA77 (5 years ago)

Post #1343 Fix for fast balls leaving wireforms Posted by Kevlar (5 years ago)

Post #1452 Shim method to get auto launch to work nearly 100% Posted by hank35 (5 years ago)

Post #1713 TECH: PLAYFIELD. Fix auto launch consistency with stronger coil Posted by NeilMcRae (5 years ago)


Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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#1226 5 years ago

As a new pin owner, this thread has been invaluable! I noticed that 2 of my flippers did not have vertical play, and felt slightly underpowered during gameplay (for example, on hard flipper setting, it was difficult for my right bottom flipper to hit the pharaoh target). Got that raised, and I had to turn them to normal power since it really increased the force. Thank you!

#1227 5 years ago

Here is my guide on adjusting the manual and autoplunger, which is really just a compilation of other posts that have been written on the subject. I'm a new pinsider, but...I did spend at least 6 hours trying to get 90%+ accuracy on both manual and auto, which I have now done,...so, I have at least some experience on the plunger. I'm also writing this post to act as a reference for myself in case I start losing accuracy in the future.

Step 1: You should make sure the prongs of the auto plunger are hitting both sides of the pinball. You can use needle nose pliers to bend them. Manually push the auto plunger forward to ensure that at full stroke, both sides are still being hit.

Step 2: Start with having the manual plunger hitting the pinball dead center.
When I did this...I first tried to keep the bottom two bolts in the same position instead of creating new holes. So, I cut some strips from a credit card and used them as shims on the outside of the plunger. Which...actually does totally work but later I found I wasn't the ideal way to adjust the manual plunger.
20181019_155818 (resized).jpg20181019_155818 (resized).jpg

20181019_174215 (resized).jpg20181019_174215 (resized).jpg

So I went ahead and removed the two bottom bolts. The bolt on the left was stripped anyway, which..was obvious once I fully removed the plunger....from the factory the bolt was barely "eating" any of the wood.

20181020_131509 (resized).jpg20181020_131509 (resized).jpg

They don't really seem necessary anyway, especially in home use where the cab won't be as abused as out in the wild. The 3 other screws seem to keep the plunger in place plenty fine.

Step 3: Make sure the pinballs are not hitting the upper right flipper.
After I did step 1 and 2...I went to about 0% accuracy. I kept hitting the lower post/wall (below the upper left flipper). However, if I held the upper right flipper up, the balls would hit the upper left flipper. And, I noticed that the upper right flipper would "wobble" after each pinball would pass it. It was obviously being hit and then being redirected to the lower post on the opposite side of the PF.

First...I went ahead removed the right side plastics. Not that hard...maybe 6 screws/nuts. It makes the most sense to me, to have the screw holding the guide wall be all the way forward. That way, if balls hit the guide wall, you don't have to worry about the metal guide moving under the screw when you don't want it to. And for future adjustments, you won't have to take the plastics off.

20181019_134731 (resized).jpg20181019_134731 (resized).jpg

Its much easier/quicker to bend the end of the ball guide wall. I inserted a flat head screw driver between the post and guide wall and used a tiny bit of leverage to push the guide wall metal away from the post. Super easy to make adjustments later...I can either use my fingers to push the wall back towards the post, or use the screw driver to push it away. No removing plastics.

20181019_173725 (resized).jpg20181019_173725 (resized).jpg

Edit: Some users also found that adding a washer under the guide wall attachment tab seemed to help. Basically, the screw can possibly torque the guide wall enough where its not perpendicular with the playfield. If you are noticing that your guide wall is not perpendicular with the playfield, add a washer under the attachment tab at this time.

2018-11-08_1718 (resized).png2018-11-08_1718 (resized).png

Step 4: You need both the auto and manual plungers to send the balls on the same path.

Here is where it starts getting fun. You can't just start bending the guide wall to hope everything works. That's step 5. In my case...the manual plunger was hitting the bottom post, and the auto was hitting the top left flipper. Since bending the guide wall affects both equally, moving the guide wall away from the post would make the auto plunger work, but would make the manual even worse and vice versa.

Fortunately there are adjusters for both the auto and manual plungers.

Now...counter-intuitively (at least for me), increasing power makes the ball path move towards the bottom post and decreasing moves it towards the top left flipper. I would assume...that decreasing power would make it move "downward" due to gravity...but...such is not the case.

Auto plunger, after fixing the prongs in step 1 which would increase power (ball path moving downwards), you have:

Increase power: You could set your coil strength higher (like to hard). I would avoid this if at all possible because that also affects everything else (like flipper strength, popbumpers, slings, etc).

Decrease power: Easy....you just turn down the auto plunger strength setting (for example, moving it to 225 instead of 255). You can't decrease it too much because once you get past a certain point in power, a decrease in power really does move the ball in a downward path due to gravity (or not making it around the loop).

Manual plunger
Increase power: Setting the manual plunger to hit dead center on the pinball. If it already is...then you would have to switch the spring to a stronger colored spring.

Decrease power: Easy....move the auto plunger so its not quite centered. I would recommend that you keep the left/right alignment and move the plunger vertically to decrease power (if the plunger hits off centered horizontally it might slightly move the ball out of the ball guide in the lane). Its also possible maybe you could add a small washer to the plunger so it doesn't hit the ball quite as hard.

In my example....my manual ball path was lower than the auto (manual hitting post and auto hitting top flipper). So, I left the auto alone and decreased power to my manual. It was enough to get them close to the same path.

Step 5: Move the guide wall
Once both plungers have the same ball path, the easy part is then moving the guide wall so the path doesn't hit either the top left flipper or the bottom post. I would recommend trying to get the path closer to the bottom post. That way, for the manual if you don't plunge at full strength (like going for skill shot), the ball path will move upward so you want to leave some "space" so it doesn't hit the flipper. And for the auto...I would assume during the game after its used frequently (IMDN does have a lot of auto balls, revives, etc), the spring will warm up and thus lose power as well.
Now, if your ball path can't be quite exactly the same between manual/auto...hopefully they are close enough that you can still be within "tolerance" where you can move the guide wall so both paths don't hit corresponding obstacles (post/flipper).

Step 6: Add spacer to the guide wall (still under research)
I noticed that after adjustment, it doesn't take much for the alignment to get off again. I check the guide wall, and I see that its already pushed back enough to cause misalignment. With the guide wall (step 5), you are doing micro adjustments, so I can definitely understand how it quickly misaligns...the pinballs are acting like small hammer strikes every time they hit it.

So, currently I'm trying to find the best solution to the problem, which at the moment is inserting a small rubber spacer.

20181021_134754 (resized).jpg20181021_134754 (resized).jpg

I took a rubber cabinet door stopper, which was initially too big, and slowly sanded it down. It only took about 10 minutes of trial and error. I would push the wall back towards the post, insert the spacer, and test. If it was too big still (i.e., hitting the left post), I would take it out, sand it down, push the wall back in, insert spacer and retest. I did it slowly because if you sand it too much, you have to start over from the beginning. You can take away material, but you can't put it back! I'll edit this step if I find a better/easier to adjust spacer.

Step 7: Maintenance
Now, what about leveling the PF, or adjusting the pitch, or excessive nudging and now accuracy drops? Hopefully the auto/manual ball paths are still roughly the same, so you would just need to do step 5 again. If they aren't...have fun going through the steps again! I would assume that its mainly going to be step 5 maintenance...especially since after balls keep hitting the guide wall it could change the shape.

Final Notes:
To me, if you can only get 1 plunger to work correctly, I would do the auto-plunger. On a game, you are ever only doing the manual plunger 3 times, but the auto plunger gets used much more than that (well, as long as you don't have an awful game). And...its easier to do adjustments on the manual plunger "on the fly". I.e., if you are hitting the left post, then just don't do full power plunges. Hitting flipper? Try to only do full power plunges (or hold the left flipper up).

Anyway...hope you enjoy the guide and let me know if I should edit/add anything!

#1233 5 years ago

Ok...I edited my plunger guide. (look at step 6 a few posts back). Basically, I added a small spacer so balls wouldn't push back the guide wall when they hit it.

20181021_134754 (resized).jpg20181021_134754 (resized).jpg

Can anybody think of a better spacer idea that hopefully can be easily adjusted? Maybe a variety of different sized O-rings from home depot? That wouldn't require sanding, though would require buying a bunch of O-rings, plus you would have to figure out how to make sure it stays there....but maybe.

Actually...if you could have a o-ring that had the interior diameter of the post, you could slip it over the post sleeve and then hopefully you can get different thickness O-rings depending on your needs, though it would need to clear the rail behind the upper right flipper too....

I don't know...what do you all think?

#1234 5 years ago

Ok, my uppermost target is doing this ->

I can temporarily fix it. The problem is that the end of the coil spring for that target is getting stuck in the washer. I.e., the washer has some play to it with his inner hole, and the end of the spring is making its way in that hole and essentially getting jammed.

You can see it in the picture...the end of the spring is jammed on the left washer.

20181020_191030 (resized).jpg20181020_191030 (resized).jpg

I can take some tweezers and unjam it though and make it look correct ->

20181020_191323 (resized).jpg20181020_191323 (resized).jpg

It will happen again though eventually....any ideas for a permanent solution?

#1236 5 years ago

OK...I took apart the drop target mechanism, and both washers were exactly the same size interior diameter. So, I did what I thought best....just bend the spring a bit at the end ->

20181021_190555 (resized).jpg20181021_190555 (resized).jpg

So now it overhangs the washer and hopefully shouldn't get caught anymore.

20181021_190946 (resized).jpg20181021_190946 (resized).jpg

I guess this is just the state of pinball, huh? Where most NIB pins require various fixes and adjustments...and since I'm a newbie, I sure am getting a baptism by fire!

#1237 5 years ago

OK...I'm also getting this problem. Yesterday I adjusted the bottom right and top right flippers because they had no vertical play, which improved their power. However, now the top right flipper is really squeaky. I believe its coming from in the diode...

For info purposes....when I adjusted the flippers I loosened the allen screw, moved the flipper vertically up, then retightened. I didn't use a credit card to gauge distant...I just moved it a bit so it felt about the same as the left 2 flippers with their vertical play...

Here is the sound ->

#1238 5 years ago

Also saw this today...when I lowered the PF right after I made the video about the squeaky flipper, I got this when I turned it on ->

20181021_205423 (resized).jpg20181021_205423 (resized).jpg

I went around and checked all of the connections, which some were a tiny bit loose but nothing major. Still couldn't find the node board. Looked at the manual and then double checked that particular node board's connections....seemed fine, but I still wiggled a bit. Turned it on and it worked so if it happens again I'll contact stern.

#1240 5 years ago
Quoted from WJxxxx:

Am I missing something here?
To lower the power of a manual plunge, simply don't pull the plunger back so far. There should be no need for any other adjustment.
The only important adjustment is to ensure that the plunger tip hits the centre of the ball consistently.

No, you are absolutely right. Which is why I mentioned it in the final notes:

The problem with that mentality is....how about all the users that don't know they have to do that? Like, when its routed? Or...even at your own home, are you going to tell every person that comes and play that they shouldn't do full power plunges? I think you should still aim for allowing users to do full plunges and have them work.

1 week later
#1297 5 years ago

What do you all think of this? I can rest a ball on the screw, so it definitely hits the ball every time I make the right ramp, possibly nicking, but also probably slowing the ball as well. Should I try and just bend the wire guide? I would have to bend it a bit to try and clear that screw....

Do any of your maidens have the screw protruding into the path of the ball?

20181031_202626 (resized).jpg20181031_202626 (resized).jpg

#1301 5 years ago
Quoted from Shapeshifter:

No way is that right.
Check end of ramp - do you have the black spacer that raises the ramp?[quoted image]

Yes, I do have the spacer, on both of my wireforms.

20181101_123654 (resized).jpg20181101_123654 (resized).jpg

20181101_123301 (resized).jpg20181101_123301 (resized).jpg

However....either the factory seems to have overtorqued the nut above it, or I did...the spacer has indents from the wireform.

20181101_123514 (resized).jpg20181101_123514 (resized).jpg

But...even after flipping it over so the wireform is on the "good" side of the spacer and not re-overtorqueing, the ball still hits the screw in the path of the wireform.

Quoted from RA77:

That wireform looks trashed !
get a new one

What part of my wireform makes it look trashed? The game is only 2 weeks old....there is some lint/dust that you see in the picture. Is that what you are referring to?

Anyway....so...should I just throw on another washer to raise up the wireform? That would make the ball "drop" from a bit higher into the inlane but seems to be the only downside....

#1308 5 years ago

So, I also looked at the left wireform...and, noticed that it was also too low. It was pushing down on the plastic below it, enough to bend it.

20181101_190934 (resized).jpg20181101_190934 (resized).jpg

20181101_190922 (resized).jpg20181101_190922 (resized).jpg

I also noticed that the left black plastic spacer was also getting malformed. And the rightside spacer also got slight impressions from the wireform on the top and I barely torqued it. So...I have now concluded that the wireform spacers can not take the pressure from direct contact with the wireform. Also...both sides were too low.....so conclusion: I think stern either made a mistake and forgot to include washers for under the wireform, or....just plain made a mistake by not putting them in the construction spec.

Either way...I added a washer to both sides and now the left side plastics are not being touched and the right side screw is not hitting the ball. So its sling plastic, black spacer, washer, wireform, washer, nut.

#1323 5 years ago
Quoted from Rob_G:

The left wireform on my game doesn't have the best 'fit' and there's almost too much stress on the middle mount point when it's bolted down at the bottom. Maybe the hex post at the middle mount is slightly too long? Or maybe they are all just like this. If the hex post is any shorter, the wireform might hit the top of the left orbit spinner bracket.
[quoted image]
[quoted image]

I noticed the exact same thing with my left wireform....I have to push down on the wireform a bit more than I think would be normal to screw it onto the left slingshot screw. Its probably designed that way...

#1341 5 years ago
Quoted from Whifflebat:

I would also love to see a picture.

As I understand it, the washer would go under the guide wall tab. I.e., it would be PF, washer, guide tab, screw.

2018-11-08_1718 (resized).png2018-11-08_1718 (resized).png

However...I think this would only be a fix for those that have a guide wall that is torqued. I.e., where the guide wall is not perfectly perpendicular with the playfield. I'll go ahead and still add it to the plunger adjuster guide here ->

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/iron-maiden-issues/page/25#post-4645095

#1346 5 years ago

Well....I just cleaned my Iron Maiden (just novus 1 this time)...and, changed out my balls to ball baron ninjas. Of course....this drastically affects my plunge path. Since the ball is moving much faster it hits the bottom post about...100% of the time. I already pushed in the guide wall a bit (lowering auto plunger power didn't affect it enough), but I'm hesitant to do too much because as soon as the Playfield gets a bit dirty it will start slowing down some. Man, what a continual task this is going to be with adjusting the plungers!

#1348 5 years ago
Quoted from Tranquilize:

I chose to adjust mine after a clean and wax. The game reminds me when to clean and wax when the launcher starts to miss. I prefer to make my own decisions about when I work on my machines, but IMDN has a mind of its own. I expected far worse quality from Stern, so I'm pretty happy with the machine, even with its general Stern cheapness.

That's not a bad idea, though it still might make more sense to adjust after cleaning after....30-40 games? I mean, the game plays pretty different right after a clean/wax for a few dozen games, then after that is a much more gradual change, right?

Here is another question. I bought these LED lights, mainly as a 'proof of concept' or...just to try out some different colors ->
https://www.pinballlife.com/ablaze-1-led-4447-bayonet-base-lamp-with-frosted-lens.html

So...I also bought the "upgraded" versions in warm white for underneath the slingshot plastics, and they work fine ->
https://www.pinballlife.com/ablaze-premium-ghost-buster-1-smd-led-4447-bayonet-base-lamp-with-clear-dome.html

And...I think the warm white is a better color for that location (especially of the color theme of the PF near there). But...I was wanting to try Purple for the inlane/outlane plastics.

However, the cheaper purple LEDs don't work here? ->

20181111_130658 (resized).jpg20181111_130658 (resized).jpg

The same purple LED works fine if I put it in the backboard? ->

20181111_130649 (resized).jpg20181111_130649 (resized).jpg

The factory LEDs both say 6.3VAC on them in both locations (inlane and backboard), so...what am I missing?

#1355 5 years ago
Quoted from Tranquilize:

Yeah, but then every time you clean the game it will be screwed up. I'd rather just keep it clean. I don't need to wax each time. I just give it a quick wipe down.
As for your lights, I'd test the voltage from the sockets to get a clear idea of what you're feeding the bulbs.

Unfortunately, I'm not an electrician and haven't used a multimeter, though I am willing to try. Though even if I did check/know the voltage...it wouldn't tell me why the ablazes would work in the backboard but not in the inlane slots? And...the descriptions for the ablazes on PBL have no indication of needing a particular voltage. They just say they should work on a modern stern.

Basically...the $.89 ablazes work fine in the inlane slots, just not the cheaper ones, though the cheaper ones work in the backboard. Neither LED version on PBL describes voltage requirements...

Anyway.....as an update for my plunger. I did go ahead and add a washer to underneath the guide wall. And....it totally worked. Though....I don't think my wall was torqued/twisted...but I could be wrong. It did move my guidewall 'up' (closer to the post behind it), which is what I needed since balls were moving faster (hitting the bottom post on the other side), which is fine (and could explain the success), and I'll just have to bend the guidewall down later when balls move slower as it gets a bit dirty. But....happy for now!

#1358 5 years ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

Did you try turning them around? Some of the LEDs want specific polarity. Most don't care.

I mean....I put them in quite a few times so I'm sure at some point both directions were tried...but no, not specifically.

The factory ones have 'Stern 6.3VAC', and the ablazes are 'PB 6.3VDC', so...there is a DC/AC difference though on the PBL site it makes no distinction between the two, and the ablazes still work on the backboard.

I'll just call PBL tomorrow and see if they have an answer.

#1359 5 years ago
Quoted from Gogdog:

I mean....I put them in quite a few times so I'm sure at some point both directions were tried...but no, not specifically.
The factory ones have 'Stern 6.3VAC', and the ablazes are 'PB 6.3VDC', so...there is a DC/AC difference though on the PBL site it makes no distinction between the two, and the ablazes still work on the backboard.
I'll just call PBL tomorrow and see if they have an answer.

Ok, turning them around definitely didn't work. PinballLife said that most likely the wiring in IMDN was reversed, the cheap LEDs do not have a bridge rectifier in them, so they only work in 1 direction. He said I could swap the wires on the socket or put in LEDs that have a bridge rectifier in them like the ablaze ghost premiums. Of course...if they only work in 1 direction, I'm not sure why just turning them around to the other direction didn't work...but...whatever.

I'm not going to start messing with swapping the wires under the playfield just to get the cheap LEDs to work, so fortunately PBL said I could just return them for a refund and get new the premiums shipped. (as per their LED guarantee...if they don't work, I can get them swapped out).

4 weeks later
#1473 5 years ago
Quoted from hank35:

OK. After this fix, I went 50 for 50 on the auto plunge and had two perfect games with the auto fire working the way it was designed. I've tried every fix mentioned here and spent dozens of hours tweaking this.
Here's what (for now) finally worked.
Make sure your playfield is level.
Make sure both your auto fire prongs are touching the ball "at rest" and at the end of its cycle.
Clean and wax your playfield prior to adjustments.
MAKE ALL ADJUSTMENTS WITH YOUR LOCKDOWN BAR ON AND LATCHED.
Trust me on this one. Bar on and off produces different results.
1. I loosed the nut under the playfield that holds the top of the rail down.
2. I loosened the hex nut that adjusts the rail.
3. I inserted a plastic wedge to (slightly) move the rail more towards the playfield.
4. I adjusted the angle of the ball's trajectory with the wedge.
Pushing the wedge (down) towards the player moved the trajectory up towards the left mini flipper, while moving the wedge (up) away from the player moved the trajectory towards the rubber post.
5. After final adjustments, i'd say both screws on my machine are not loose, but they're also not snug. Tightening the nut under the playfield AND the hex screw at the end of the rail tight (like you'd expect) returned the game to erratic auto firing.
6. My final adjustments were with the wedge. I spent two hours yesterday and three hours today coming up with this "why does this work" fix.
If you're having problems, give it a try. Hopefully it'll work for you too.
[quoted image]

I think you are really on to something here. This has also helped by auto plunger success....(inserting a wedge)

#1490 5 years ago
Quoted from Tranquilize:

I would recommend getting the screwing started now. You’re going to have to learn it anyway.

If he is only adjusting the manual plunger, he doesn't have to adjust the shooter lane guides, or auto plunger at all. You can adjust the manual just by changing the position of the plunger where it hits the ball. You can increase or decrease power that way (or by changing a $2 shooter spring too...)

1 month later
#1801 5 years ago

How are you all ordering from BAA when they are out of stock on the coil?

#1830 5 years ago
Quoted from PinLen83:

Will do later tonight

Or...it sounds like the ball is hitting the tip of the upper right flipper.

Try holding the flipper up manually then launching a ball.

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