Quoted from cjchand:
Sounds like investment advice from WuTang Financial
"Protect ya neck!"
This is fantastic information! I am trying to do the same exact thing with a small route. Ultimately I don't care about making money, but I would like to ensure I don't loose my ass on the investments. I really appreciate you doing this!!
The Op's real problem is he didn't do his homework and bought all the wrong games.
None of the one's he owns promised him a return on his investment like some of the other titles from this era.
Quoted from Coindork:
Those are actually shitty returns on your money over that long of a period of time.
Yes! Exactly. Here are some actual figures on pinball price inflation, taking emotion out of it, and it shows it’s been pretty shitty low. While most of the time people are running around with hair on fire about it.
Incidentally it seems many folks didn’t read my post too closely and misunderstood my intent. It’s a hobby, for fun, and I did this out of curiosity. if anything my figures indicate it’s a shitty investment. But it does about break even, which is better than many hobbies.
This is pinside, you are going to get a lot of sanctimonious types frustrated with anyone that makes a profit (what they call "greed"). I guess it depends on what side of the political spectrum you fall on. Are there flippers out there asking crazy prices? Yeah, I tend to ignore them because they are just ridiculous. If a sucker walks off the street to buy from them, so be it. You need all types to make the world go around.
Like any hobby I partake in I often want to build my collections for free. Buy well, sell better. Roll it into the next purchase, rinse repeat. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with being financially responsible. You work hard for your money, you should do everything you can to make it work for you. Pinball machines are assets. Would you blame anyone for buying a commodity or a stock and making money on it? Treat every asset you purchase this way and just know that some things are expenses (cars (unless vintage), clothing, other consumables). The beauty of pinballs is they are assets you can enjoy. How often can you find a hobby you can enjoy and break even or make money? This should be celebrated in this hobby, not criticized. If you beat the bushes and are fiscally conscious there is no reason you should lose in this hobby unless you buy NIB, but I'm not positive on that NIB statement because I only buy B/W games.
I’ve done fairly well breaking even in this hobby. I’ve taken some losses to just move on and roll on to the next game I’ve had lined up. But I’m also coming from an avionics background where I can fix what most people can’t. Anyone that says they don’t flip is a fool, between pins and vids everyone flips. I was taught buy an older gentleman when first getting into this hobby was “ let this pay for itself”.
Coming from another hobby which had the market tank( pro hockey stock) I lost $100’s. And just walked away at loss, the market was never going to rebound with the influx of newer stuff
This and pricing bubble threads are like the "chicken or the egg" of Pinside.
Which came first?
Quoted from jackd104:
We all know that pinball machines can be considered an investment. I was curious exactly what return my collection has brought (by the way, this is not of great importance to me, since pinball is a love/hobby, but I was curious since I’m a finance nerd in other aspects of life). What I mean by return (APY, annual percentage yield): what did I pay for a machine, how long ago was that, what’s the current value, and therefore what was the APY? How does that compare to other investments I could have made? All the machines are in good condition, 100% functional, players machines, except TSPP which is a superb condition HUO. And the results:
Purchase price: $1,200
Purchase date: March 2001
Time owned: 18.5 years
Estimated current value: $4,000
Return: 6.73% APY
The Addams Family
Purchase price: $4,500
Purchase date: December 2011
Time owned: 7.75 years
Estimated current value: $6,000
Return: 3.78% APY
Purchase price: $5,000
Purchase date: May 2012
Time owned: 7.33 years
Estimated current value: $6,500
Return: 3.645% APY
The Simpsons Pinball Party
Purchase price: $4,500
Purchase date: December 2014
Time owned: 4.75 years
Estimated current value: $5,300
Return: 3.51% APY
Average APY for the collection: 4.41%
My reaction... my emotions led me to believe the returns were going to be higher, but there it is. And I know I paid top dollar for most of them, so that affects the return of course. Finally, I suspect that if I factored in repair costs and parts, it would pretty much destroy my return. Boo hoo!
If you want to do something similar, find a future value calculator on the web (something like the link below). Num. of periods = the years you have owned the machine. Starting amount = the price you paid. Interest rate = fiddle with it until Future Value equals your estimated current value, and that is your APY. Leave Periodic Deposits at 0.
Not really sure what is with the downvotes, it's fun to discuss, and interesting to see your costs from some time ago (for me anyway), as I only began coll---- accumulating 2 years ago or so.
That said, I think you definitely need to factor in repair and maintenance, and perhaps even factor the plays as an entertainment assessment, not necessarily coin value, but perhaps some estimate of play factor, since it is not like you have them vaulted up somewhere.
My biggest problem is I love to hunt the deal, but typically end up with something that needs 10+ hours of work to get it running and cleaned up (at least), + parts and plastic, so I'm lucky if I break even, but I get the feeling this is the 'fun' of the hobby for me.
All that said, the machines can also be a liability, something to insure and maintain. As with many collectibles, there will be a time when the demand will dip, and so to will the value of many of the machines. Fun topic tho.
Be careful of that "estimated value" part in your equation. I always have a tough time getting that. Have one for sale right now and it could take a long time, if ever.
If you can break even after you've purchased, played, and maintained your game, you are doing very well. The return on investment is your fun, not your money.
Quoted from wayout440:
The return on investment is your fun, not your money
And don’t forget memories...ahh the memories.
Like trying to solder for the first time and accidentally touching a wire harness and ending up with a huge fucking problem when you were just trying to swap out 1 coil that was fried. Good times. Fun.
Not sure if it is worth "investment" dollars, but I like that you are taking a logical approach to it.
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