Interest in Magic Girl. Poll included.

(Topic ID: 120560)

Interest in Magic Girl. Poll included.


By thedarkknight77

3 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 47 posts
  • 32 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by zizzlemeplease
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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Topic poll

“Would you buy a Magic Girl if production was increased?”

  • 200 unit limit @ $10,000 43 votes
    27%
  • 100 unit limit @ $15,000 5 votes
    3%
  • 50 unit limit @ $20,000 3 votes
    2%
  • I don't care how nice it looks, or how little is produced, no machine is worth those prices! 106 votes
    68%

(Multiple choice - 157 votes by 0 Pinsiders)

#1 3 years ago

So given JPOP has finally started showing us Magic girl, who would consider buying it? Despite the frustration many have faced with the production timelines, I think we all can agree on a few things.

1. JPOP has an amazing skills as it relates to designing pinball machines.
2. None of us want to see JPOP go tits up.
3. Creating a limited run game of only 19 units does nothing to advance pinball.
4. Without additional backing to get this game done, it may never get produced.

PS, Not knowing the margins or economies of scale, I am not sure my production/costs numbers align with reality. I am just trying to see what interest would be out there.

#2 3 years ago

How much r they now? I thought the production run was way more than 19.

#3 3 years ago

I thought I heard they are making around 20, I think someone mentioned the most recent buyers paid $18,000????

#4 3 years ago

If you want a 10k 150 unit run then buy a RAZA (people want out)..Same color pallet, same quality of work.. And since neither is finished you know the same about them at this point (or will when the blog opens up). Let MG be as intended for the people that have been waiting years.

Or AIW even..

#5 3 years ago

The artwork is beautiful but I am priced out

#6 3 years ago

Agree keep MG as collectors and make Raza available.

-1
#7 3 years ago

I'd be in for $15k that's my vote. I'd be in at $17K even, but only after they are built and shipping, and after I could play it for myself.

I'd not be in for any pre-order. If that's the only way they will be sold, I won't get one unless I buy one second hand.

#8 3 years ago

Currently, RAZA is set for 125 machines.

#9 3 years ago

All he is doing is hedging his bets with an ultra low production number.
It has beautiful artwork, but I guess us mere mortals will never get to see if it is a great player or not.

-3
#10 3 years ago
Quoted from SealClubber:

All he is doing is hedging his bets with an ultra low production number.
It has beautiful artwork, but I guess us mere mortals will never get to see if it is a great player or not.

If it is like all the other JPOP games it will be a piece of art and a snooze to play. No love lost.

#11 3 years ago
Quoted from thedarkknight77:

I thought I heard they are making around 20, I think someone mentioned the most recent buyers paid $18,000????

Wow, to me there is not 1 machine that is worth $18,0000

#12 3 years ago
Quoted from SealClubber:

...
It has beautiful artwork, but I guess us mere mortals will never get to see if it is a great player or not.

When they're made, take a road trip to CP Pinball near St Louis. I don't think Chuck's given up hope yet and was planning on putting his in the arcade.

--
Rob Anthony
Pinball Classics
http://LockWhenLit.com
Quality Board Work - In Home Service
borygard at gmail dot com

#13 3 years ago

I love jpop's pins but the price is just too outrageous.

#14 3 years ago
Quoted from dung:

If it is like all the other JPOP games it will be a piece of art and a snooze to play. No love lost.

Based on seeing it play right? Oh wait, no one has seen that.

#15 3 years ago

I need an option 4

"Not interested in MG at any price, but if he gets it out and Alice doesn't still look like a hooker, I'd buy that at 10k."

#16 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Based on seeing it play right? Oh wait, no one has seen that.

He did say "if".

#17 3 years ago
Quoted from Frax:

I need an option 4
"Not interested in MG at any price, but if he gets it out and Alice doesn't still look like a hooker, I'd buy that at 10k."

I miss the 3750 NIB price

#18 3 years ago

Not impressed. Lets first see a playing game.

I must say the art does have a triple A exposure. Still the playfield is nothing i get excited off. 'I have seen this before' feeling is to strong in the art for me personal. And not a fan of the pinkish look.

The cabinet art is awesome.

#19 3 years ago

Some people, about 50 of them, think MG is worth $17k to them.

Then you have the people that say well it sure is a shame that more people won't get to enjoy such a great looking, fully packed pin.

MAYBE, its simply in the cards, once the Hardware/Software platform gets set, that there could be LIMITED versions and PRO versions?

Hmmm, I wonder who else uses that model.

Then if you don't like it, don't buy it. He's got to get MG out there and he knows it.

As for the software for his older games that he designed, he wasn't responsible for software any more than Steve Ritchie is on his games.

In today's world, with the right system that integrates with the hardware seamlessly, supposedly with a system like Aaron uses, you could have a pin coded as deep as Keith and Lyman with not nearly as much effort.

Hey, after all, technology has advanced a little bit since the 90's. Why go back to that technology?

#20 3 years ago

Fyi, there will be at least 50 MG's produced at $17k. Too much? Sure it is.

The MG guys are somewhat falling on the sword for the future stuff, that's just the way it is. I'm one of them.

#21 3 years ago

Until he shows he can build one functional playing game, it's irrelevant.

#22 3 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Until he shows he can build one functional playing game, it's irrelevant.

It really is kind of relevant, people need to decide if they will actually fork over 17k for MG, when its time to pony up. The info we all get the better.

Since the list is full and many are paid up, I guess that part is irrelevant.

He will just need to decide which hardware/software platform to use over the next 3 pins. His hardware system that is already done, or a fully integrated one like Aaron would implement.

We should see shortly.

#23 3 years ago

I'm in the minority, but I think J-Pop's pins are over rated (and now, it seems, over priced as well). ToM got boring quickly and didn't last long for me. He is a fabulous artist, no doubt.

#24 3 years ago

I agree Billy, he should work for a big gamestudio, working on an original IP.

It looks great.

#25 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

It really is kind of relevant, people need to decide if they will actually fork over 17k for MG, when its time to pony up. The info we all get the better.
.

Well those who are in already are in already. I got the feeling this thread was trying to see if people who hadn't ordered one were now interested. I can't bring myself to be interested unless I see proof the game is complete & playable....and then rolling off the line in some reasonable fashion.

#26 3 years ago
Quoted from Billy16:

I'm in the minority, but I think J-Pop's pins are over rated (and now, it seems, over priced as well). ToM got boring quickly and didn't last long for me. He is a fabulous artist, no doubt.

For the most part though the things people don't care for are software, not his designs or the style he likes. And as Stern has shown, software makes or breaks a pin.

#27 3 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Well those who are in already are in already. I got the feeling this thread was trying to see if people who hadn't ordered one were now interested. I can't bring myself to be interested unless I see proof the game is complete & playable....and then rolling off the line in some reasonable fashion.

And it assumes the possibility of 100 or 200 which isn't happening. Although once they are rolling off the line, or IF they roll off the line, he could probably sell 200 at 10k.

Why not? Stern is getting there with the LE and JJP is damn near there.

When its rolling Greg you can make your check out to Zidware, Inc. Aaron says he can get em out the door in 3 months, all of them. The "project manager" becomes critical at this point.

#28 3 years ago

Can we all agree that Steve Ritchie doesn't do the "software" for Stern, he's just the designer?

You can't change the layout, shot making or design once its done, right? To be critical of John for code on his Bally games makes no sense. It like saying Steve Ritchie sucks with Star Trek because he didn't do the coding.

You can fix the code and software system. John doesn't work for Bally/Williams anymore obviously!

Stern has the new "Spike" system. Let's see what comes from John and crew. Like I said, I'm lobbying hard for Aaron and his team. I'd like to take pinball forward like they do.

#29 3 years ago

I am not a fan of Jpop's previous games at all. They look beautiful for sure, but looks aren't everything. To answer the poll I have zero interest in pre-paying no matter the number or price.

#30 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Can we all agree that Steve Ritchie doesn't do the "software" for Stern, he's just the designer?
You can't change the layout, shot making or design once its done, right? To be critical of John for code on his Bally games makes no sense. It like saying Steve Ritchie sucks with Star Trek because he didn't do the coding.
You can fix the code and software system. John doesn't work for Bally/Williams anymore obviously!
Stern has the new "Spike" system. Let's see what comes from John and crew. Like I said, I'm lobbying hard for Aaron and his team. I'd like to take pinball forward like they do.

People aren't being critical of John for not developing great software for his past games. They are merely pointing out that John's games historically have had the software as the weak link in what are otherwise great games from a design/art/etc perspective. If only he had been paired up with someone like Lyman along the way. Imagine what the results could have been!

It really is no different in the case of Ritchie (or any designer for that matter). When he's paired up with Lyman great things happen (ACDC/SM). When he isn't, the results are mixed with ST being the most recent example.

What I think people are getting at is that it isn't surprising that the new games look great and have innovative design. These aspects of a pin are right in John's wheelhouse and he's always delivered in these areas as his past pins demonstrate.

The lingering questions beyond production are around software. What will the rules be like? Who will be doing them? And so on and so forth. Hopefully the answers to those questions will be forthcoming in the not-too-distant future.

There has never been a Popadiuk game with great rules IMO. Maybe MG will be the first!

PS: To answer the poll. There's no way in hell I'd be in at any of those prices. 5 digit prices for a pinball machine are a bit rich for my blood (and wallet).

#31 3 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

For the most part though the things people don't care for are software, not his designs or the style he likes. And as Stern has shown, software makes or breaks a pin.

Agreed. I don't think it would ever happen, but I'd love to see what John could come up with paired up with Stern. Get some great programmers behind great design, interesting takes on licensed property, etc. However, many, many roadblocks (timeline, license restrictions, etc)

#32 3 years ago
Quoted from Robotoes:

Agreed. I don't think it would ever happen, but I'd love to see what John could come up with paired up with Stern.

Yeah, then instead of software that sucks, it could just be software that's never finished enough to be able to tell!

I want to see the indie programmer community step up and show Stern what's what.

#33 3 years ago

If there were mass produced at a more reasonable price point, these would fly out of the warehouses.

#34 3 years ago

If you read the blog, he had some plan to use the Mission Pinball Framework for the rules. That means anyone can modify the rules once they get the game in their hands, since MPF is mostly driven from config files and some Python coding.

We're not talking Assembly programming like on the WPC games.

#35 3 years ago
Quoted from jarjarisgod:

People aren't being critical of John for not developing great software for his past games. They are merely pointing out that John's games historically have had the software as the weak link in what are otherwise great games from a design/art/etc perspective. If only he had been paired up with someone like Lyman along the way. Imagine what the results could have been!

What's up Jarsky, no doubt, imagine what could be in the future. What's done is done in the past.

John is intent on moving pinball forward.

What are our options? If you love pinball why not get behind it no matter what, regardless of whether you are in on MG, RAZA or AIW?

It's a new day, let's go!

#36 3 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

What's up Jarsky, no doubt, imagine what could be in the future. What's done is done in the past.
John is intent on moving pinball forward.
What are our options? If you love pinball why not get behind it no matter what, regardless of whether you are in on MG, RAZA or AIW?
It's a new day, let's go!

Damn straight! Glad you're jumping in and helping where you can to get things moving in the right direction. Will be pretty awesome to see these pins finally see the light of day.

#37 3 years ago
Quoted from thedarkknight77:

So given JPOP has finally started showing us Magic girl, who would consider buying it? Despite the frustration many have faced with the production timelines, I think we all can agree on a few things.
1. JPOP has an amazing skills as it relates to designing pinball machines.
2. None of us want to see JPOP go tits up.
3. Creating a limited run game of only 19 units does nothing to advance pinball.
4. Without additional backing to get this game done, it may never get produced.
PS, Not knowing the margins or economies of scale, I am not sure my production/costs numbers align with reality. I am just trying to see what interest would be out there.

Why not just post what you would pay and see if people think you are in the right ballpark.

#38 3 years ago

I'd happily pay for a magic girl at 17K. Seems that enough went in it to justify it being 2x the price of a JJP game or Stern LE, no?

#39 3 years ago
Quoted from kaneda:

I'd happily pay for a magic girl at 17K. Seems that enough went in it to justify it being 2x the price of a JJP game or Stern LE, no?

Absolutely.

#40 3 years ago
Quoted from Pinballmike217:

Why not just post what you would pay and see if people think you are in the right ballpark.

No machine is worth more than $8000 in my book. I would never consider it. The most I have ever paid for a machine is $6300. I get the whole limited edition concept, I just don't trust it as I have been burned in my other hobbies. When Big Bang Bar remakes are selling in a few years for $8000 I will thank myself for not buying into the hype. It's the lesson of the Walking Dead Premium all over again. Where there is money to be made, it will be made. It doesn't matter how many JPOP makes, if he dies and his wife sells Zidware, who's to say the new owner won't make another 500???

#41 3 years ago

When people are so critical of Stern's games because of code, I find it funny other people get a pass at higher prices.

#42 3 years ago

You can't compare this to a stern game. Like comparing a Bentley to a Honda.

#43 3 years ago

For the price it would literally have to be magic and be able to blow me........just sayin'

#44 3 years ago

I would pay $7~8k max

#45 3 years ago

I love magic and wouldn't buy it.

But the biggest factor is that, I personally don't find John to be very trustworthy.

#46 3 years ago

... if 50 are only made I guarantee not one buyer is gonna have remorse forking over 17K. Imagine if only 50 Cirqus Voltaires existed today... WOW~

#47 3 years ago

I like the guy, I like his work too, but also think he's in over his head with his effort to solo. he's an artist-designer, good one too, business and production is a much different beast. I do wish he were able to roll like Spooky is doing now, from announcement to production wasn't very long at all..

also think Zizzle shot themselves in the foot going too flimsy with hardware, encountering deserved dissatisfaction for problems and running away, instead of stepping up to build more and better. I sure dont think thats John's fault, the concept of easily shippable affordable 3/4 size machines is good, a re-visit by a more product-customer responsible manufacturer could be great. if good "toys" were flying out the door they could build larger darn near as easily, and stay affordably priced too.
not knocking John or trying to pidgeon-hole him, just think design IS what he's good at and needs a solid manufacturer to produce.. which sure does seem the reality to me.

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