(Topic ID: 120247)

Infrequent EMBRYON anomaly

By Heretic_9

9 years ago


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  • 17 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 9 years ago by ZEN
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switch2.jpg
pftilt.jpg
#1 9 years ago

This comes up rarely, but it just happened again, under similar conditions. I was in the middle of a game, with a pretty good score and closing in on an even better one. In the midst of play, suddenly the game starts warbling back and forth (I liken it to one of those European ambulance sounds, or at least the stock representation of them you hear in movies), with flashing lights, score displays go blank, and that's the end of that game. It probably resets spontaneously after several seconds of this most times, though I may have had to power cycle the game On & Off manually, in a couple cases. I cannot really I.D. any specific "trigger." In this latest example, I think it happened right after a shot went into the kickout saucer.

Have you run into this before -- on this or any comparable pins ? Do you know what the cause might be ?

This pin has Alltek MPU and lamp driver boards, rather than the originals, if that makes any difference. I would be more annoyed or concerned if this was other than a pretty rare occurrence.

#2 9 years ago

That's the slam tilt, right? It probably happened because there is a shorted diode on one of the switches somewhere in the game. Best way to track it down is to take an ohmmeter and test every switch diode.

#3 9 years ago
Quoted from dothedoo:

That's the slam tilt, right? It probably happened because there is a shorted diode on one of the switches somewhere in the game. Best way to track it down is to take an ohmmeter and test every switch diode.

Wow, nice call. I had never heard the sound of Embryon slam tilting before (although I've got to admit I've heard the normal tilt sound a bit more than I should have). So I opened up my Embryon and closed one of the slam switches. It sounds and looks just like the OP described.

Before checking the diodes I'd probably just check to make sure none of the slam tilt switches are gapped too close.

#4 9 years ago

Good point, start with the easiest first

#5 9 years ago

Thanks for those leads. I'm not an aggressive player (like some), quite the opposite in fact. So, I would not really know what a slam tilt looks or sounds like, on early SS or later pins. I'm not technically inclined either, beyond the simplest things, so I'll add that to the list for the tech to look at.

#6 9 years ago
Quoted from Heretic_9:

I'm not technically inclined either, beyond the simplest things

Tonight if I have time I will pop open my Embryon and take some pictures of what you are looking for. This image of a slam switch is from Google.

pftilt.jpgpftilt.jpg

The silver weight closes the switch if the machine is shaken too violently. However sometimes over the years they may get bent a bit so they are almost closed. Just the coil of a saucer going off may be enough of a shake to close the switch triggering the slam.

It may be that simple, or it may be more. If you know how to lift the playfield and look at a switch you could probably get through it. And you could also just trigger one intentionally to see if it is the exact same behavior you are seeing.

-1
#7 9 years ago

If the tilt switches have caps on them clip them off. IMO, these do not need to be there.

#8 9 years ago

In the meantime, is there a way I can temporarily disconnect the whole slam tilt thing on this pin ? It would have to be easy to do, nothing removed long term, no soldering or anything like that -- easily reversible ?

#9 9 years ago

Other than desoldering the return wires on the switches, no. But if you do desolder them and it still happens, then you know it's a bad diode on another switch.

#10 9 years ago

Then I'll just have to wait for the next service call. I don't do soldering.

It may be that the frequency of this occurring has started to increase -- not sure yet. If so, perhaps that's a clue ?

#11 9 years ago
Quoted from Heretic_9:

It may be that the frequency of this occurring has started to increase -- not sure yet. If so, perhaps that's a clue ?

Like Cody said above, it is possible that there is a flat orange (or green) disc cap on the back of that switch.

Clip one leg of the cap (as shown here) and see if the problem is rectified.

The caps made the computer see the switch closure as a longer function, so the CPU would not miss the event.

Old caps can sporadically trigger the switch.

If this switch was a playfield scoring or pop switch, it would be worth replacing the cap with a new one. But for a slam switch in home use, it's not worth replacing it, just clip it.

switch2.jpgswitch2.jpg

#12 9 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Like Cody said above, it is possible that there is a flat orange (or green) disc cap on the back of that switch.
Clip one leg of the cap (as shown here) and see if the problem is rectified.
The caps made the computer see the switch closure as a longer function, so the CPU would not miss the event.
Old caps can sporadically trigger the switch.
If this switch was a playfield scoring or pop switch, it would be worth replacing the cap with a new one. But for a slam switch in home use, it's not worth replacing it, just clip it.
switch2.jpg

Hah! I got vetoed for saying that!

#13 9 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Like Cody said above, it is possible that there is a flat orange (or green) disc cap on the back of that switch.
Clip one leg of the cap (as shown here) and see if the problem is rectified.
The caps made the computer see the switch closure as a longer function, so the CPU would not miss the event.
Old caps can sporadically trigger the switch.
If this switch was a playfield scoring or pop switch, it would be worth replacing the cap with a new one. But for a slam switch in home use, it's not worth replacing it, just clip it.
switch2.jpg

Thanks vid1900, I'll take a look underneath. In that pic, are we talking about the green blob @ left, or the amber "termite" @ bottom center ?

#14 9 years ago
Quoted from Heretic_9:

In that pic, are we talking about the green blob @ left

Yes, "green blob" is a disc cap (yours may be orange...).

Note how one leg has been cut because it was behaving badly.....

#15 9 years ago
Quoted from cody_chunn:

Hah! I got vetoed for saying that!

That's Pinside for ya.

I've probably got more downvotes that upvotes in total.....

2 weeks later
#16 9 years ago

Update: just had that service call. There was no cap on the slam tilt switch, but it turns out that the switch was apparently stuck ON, *or* in contact / very near contact with the coin door. The net result was that it didn't take all that much to trigger a slam tilt condition. This was probably (hopefully) the sole cause. At least until some evidence to the contrary comes up. Testing every game switch & diode sounds like it would be a major chore, so I'm hoping this won't be necessary. Anyway, you guys seem to have nailed this, and I do appreciate it !

#17 9 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

That's Pinside for ya.
I've probably got more downvotes that upvotes in total.....

OP good to hear it working for ya.

To Vid, I wish I could upvote you 100+, but it only lets me do it once , thanks for all you do

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