(Topic ID: 267418)

Indiana Jones playfield swap and restoration

By RCSP

3 years ago


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  • 388 posts
  • 23 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by RCSP
  • Topic is favorited by 26 Pinsiders

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    There are 388 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 8.
    #51 3 years ago

    To followup on @filthyrich's advice...

    All of your lamp sockets should use the following screws:
    https://www.pinballlife.com/6-x-38-unslotted-hex-head-screw.html

    All of your mechanical assemblies should use the following screws:
    https://www.pinballlife.com/6-x-12-unslotted-hex-head-screw.html

    Always check the clearance of the screw you are using to make sure it won't breach the surface of the playfield... when in doubt... use the shorter screw For example I noticed that my newer 1/2" screws were a tad longer than the originals AND since I had sanded the back of my playfield... I was concerned that I was on the edge of maybe poking through... so I used the small screws for the switch brackets and cable L brackets. To your point about the L brackets only using one screw... In some cases I added a second screw to sturdy it up.

    #52 3 years ago
    Quoted from Ricochet:

    The right bracket is mounted to the stud on the end of the idol ramp.
    The left bracket is mounted on the middle stud of the steel ball guide on the left.

    I never would have been able to figure that out.....thanks!

    #53 3 years ago

    Ricochet is this the proper location for this light? It’s got brown wire, white/brown wire and one yellow wire. The yellow wire - I’m not sure where it goes? Was detached when I bought it. Thanks!!

    53FFA836-ECFB-41F4-B7BC-CA98B24710BB (resized).jpeg53FFA836-ECFB-41F4-B7BC-CA98B24710BB (resized).jpeg
    #54 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    ricochet is this the proper location for this light? It’s got brown wire, white/brown wire and one yellow wire. The yellow wire - I’m not sure where it goes? Was detached when I bought it. Thanks!!
    [quoted image]

    That is the correct placement. That yellow pigtail is the return for the GI of your pop bumpers.

    B9EDD7F8-B028-437B-8633-ADD970200B5D (resized).jpegB9EDD7F8-B028-437B-8633-ADD970200B5D (resized).jpeg
    #55 3 years ago

    Ricochet you rock, thanks. I have 2 of the 3 wiring harnesses mostly installed. A few things to finish up for sure.

    Did you put any mylar on your PF?

    #56 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    ricochet you rock, thanks. I have 2 of the 3 wiring harnesses mostly installed. A few things to finish up for sure.

    You’re welcome. You’ll find it will pick up steam pretty quickly. I had a few hiccups along the way (mainly waiting for replacement parts and my decision to make an acrylic backboard) that slowed me down. This process really shows you the magnitude of manual labor that was involved in making these machines. If modern pinball companies had to build them like this we would be paying many thousands more for them. I can’t wait to do my next one... just need to take a break and rejuvenate

    #57 3 years ago

    I edited my last post before I refreshed my browser. Did you put any mylar on your PF? I'm going to install the pop bumpers tonight, I thought I better wait and see if any mylar is going in that area.

    #58 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    I edited my last post before I refreshed my browser. Did you put any mylar on your PF? I'm going to install the pop bumpers tonight, I thought I better wait and see if any mylar is going in that area.

    I’m not sure if the repro playfield has the mylar dotted line indicator or not? That helps with guidance. I put mylar around the pop bumpers and where the ball drops from the POA playfield.. and where the ball drops out of the wire ramps.

    I got my Mylar from eBay:
    https://ebay.us/X3iMED

    You’ll find that listing shows the placement of the major pieces.

    #59 3 years ago

    I did a lousy job on the Mylar. Had small bubbles I just couldn’t get out. So I’ll start over. The new Mylar takes 10-14 days to arrive or so.

    Now got to get the glue off. Not happy.

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    #60 3 years ago

    Oh man... I had a ton of micro-f'ups along the way. They all feel like some sort of major setback ... but end up being small potatoes. When I installed the mylar, I taped it down into position along the halfway mark then cut back the backing off. I applied the first half then removed the tape and the other half of the backing and applied the second... working it slowly. There were a few bubbles I carefully popped with the x-acto knife. After I got it all down I used a hair drier to soften it to get a good adhesion (I read that somewhere here). A coat of wax or two can help keep that adhesive from clinging to the playfield.

    This will be but a blink of an eye in terms of your entire project.

    #61 3 years ago

    Ricochet has me hand sanding my ramps. Nobody locally has those flap wheels. Still have 2 places to check, Farm and Fleet and Fleet Farm. I hand sanded this then used my buffer wheel.

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    #62 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    ricochet has me hand sanding my ramps. Nobody locally has those flap wheels. Still have 2 places to check, Farm and Fleet and Fleet Farm. I hand sanded this then used my buffer wheel.
    [quoted image]

    That looks very good. If I had to pick one thing about the entire project to dislike... its refinishing the steel, especially the odd shaped pieces.

    #63 3 years ago
    Quoted from Ricochet:

    This process really shows you the magnitude of manual labor that was involved in making these machines. If modern pinball companies had to build them like this we would be paying many thousands more for them.

    Can you elaborate a bit? What is different about how they make them now?

    #64 3 years ago

    Everything on a WPC machine is discrete. You've got a matrix of switch and lamp wires going from each switch/led and a daisy chained common connected back to the driver board in the head. If you look at a modern Stern machine for example, they use a SPI bus architecture. This allows one pair of wires to service up to 256 io pins (I think that's the SPI limit). So its more of a networked design... you have a bus architecture... more complex (because of the bus abstraction) but a lot less wiring. All of the WPC logic runs on 5V ttl. This provides a very robust design... but ... 5V logic needs more power than today's conventional 3.3V logic (modernization here is actually a good thing... less power... less heat... more capacity). Consequently with WPC you have lots of heavy gauge wire == $$.

    As far as lamps/leds... each led on a modern pin is just on a small PCB... makes it super cheap to manufacture. Those little LED PCBs are pennies in quantities.

    Roll over switches have two screws that hold them onto the playfield and two screws that hold them onto the steel bracket. Nowadays, plastic bracket, spring grip push nuts.

    Look at the woodworking... mitered cuts, cabinet grade plywood. Stern doesn't even use wood on the back box anymore. JJP puts more into their machines... but you're paying for it too.

    Lots of little subtle things like the gauge of the steel in all of the mechanism.

    Tons and tons and tons of fasteners.... this equals labor.

    #65 3 years ago

    Thanks so much for the detailed response. I just got my first pin (DE Jurassic Park) so what I have been seeing in this rebuild and others aligns to my perception of what a pinball machine looks like

    I look forward to getting under the hood of a new one as well.

    #66 3 years ago
    Quoted from scootss:

    Thanks so much for the detailed response. I just got my first pin (DE Jurassic Park) so what I have been seeing in this rebuild and others aligns to my perception of what a pinball machine looks like
    I look forward to getting under the hood of a new one as well.

    Take a look at the underbelly of a Chicago Gaming Remake and its original WPC design... you will see how much more it is integrated.

    #67 3 years ago
    Quoted from Ricochet:

    Take a look at the underbelly of a Chicago Gaming Remake and its original WPC design... you will see how much more it is integrated.

    Just did it. Thanks for the suggestion. Totally different approach, but still lots of coils

    #68 3 years ago
    Quoted from scootss:

    Just did it. Thanks for the suggestion. Totally different approach, but still lots of coils

    Yeah you can’t really simplify the mechanics all that much

    #69 3 years ago
    Quoted from Ricochet:

    Yeah you can’t really simplify the mechanics all that much

    Unless...https://www.vpforums.org/ - but let's not discuss that

    #70 3 years ago

    I could research this, but don't want to! Too much work to do. How do I get the mylar glue off the PF?

    #71 3 years ago

    I made this little tube. It’s PEX tubing with 2 end caps. Who can guess what I used it for?

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    #72 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    I could research this, but don't want to! Too much work to do. How do I get the mylar glue off the PF?

    Never done it... but this method seems safe enough...When you've got it cleaned... put a coat of wax on it, this will prevent the adhesive from sticking too much if you ever need to remove it.

    #73 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    I made this little tube. It’s PEX tubing with 2 end caps. Who can guess what I used it for?
    [quoted image]

    Shipping back box metal trim? You sending stuff off for powder-coat or plating?

    #74 3 years ago
    Quoted from Ricochet:

    Shipping back box metal trim? You sending stuff off for powder-coat or plating?

    I filled it with Acetone and dropped the metal bar in there for a few days to remove the paint.

    #75 3 years ago

    Hi

    I am hoping someone may be able to help me please. I am seeking a left ramp guard for a Williams #IndianaJones, part number 01-11757.

    I've been unable to source one in Australia so may have to resort to having one made locally.

    Just wondering if anyone might have a pattern or could supply the dimensions for me please?

    It seems like a fairly simple manufacture - so I'd ideally like advice on the thickness of the metal and the length, width and curve design along with the dimensions o the tabs that are used for fixing it to the playfield.

    Is the metal stainless steel?

    Many thanks for all your help.

    Regards Jim

    image_64295_1 (resized).jpgimage_64295_1 (resized).jpgimage_64295_2 (resized).jpgimage_64295_2 (resized).jpgimage_64295_3 (resized).jpgimage_64295_3 (resized).jpg

    Left Ramp Guard Dimensions.pdfLeft Ramp Guard Dimensions.pdf
    #76 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    I filled it with Acetone and dropped the metal bar in there for a few days to remove the paint.

    That is a good idea !

    #77 3 years ago
    Quoted from Plungeroo:

    Hi
    I am hoping someone may be able to help me please. I am seeking a left ramp guard for a Williams #IndianaJones, part number 01-11757.
    I've been unable to source one in Australia so may have to resort to having one made locally.
    Just wondering if anyone might have a pattern or could supply the dimensions for me please?
    It seems like a fairly simple manufacture - so I'd ideally like advice on the thickness of the metal and the length, width and curve design along with the dimensions o the tabs that are used for fixing it to the playfield.
    Is the metal stainless steel?
    Many thanks for all your help.
    Regards Jim
    [quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
    [quoted image]

    This is Brushed Stainless Steel (304 series) @ .048 thickness.
    ij-rampshield (resized).jpgij-rampshield (resized).jpg

    ittpa-rampshieldbend.pdfittpa-rampshieldbend.pdf
    #78 3 years ago

    RCSP ... how is the adhesive removal process going?

    #79 3 years ago

    I found some flour in the kitchen (at least 12 years old), and I tried it and it worked great. The alcohol alone worked, but the flour absorbed the glue and made less of a mess. Alcohol alone smeared the glue around, the flour made it go quicker and with less of a mess. The flour did get in the pop bumper nail holes though, not a big deal. Thanks for checking on me!

    The acetone worked great on the outside edges, but the inside of the U it's not working at all. That paint is really on there! I'll just buy a new bracket, I like to use as much of the original game as possible.

    #80 3 years ago

    Glad that worked out for you!

    You may be able to get that paint out with a wire brush. Keeping it as original as possible is always a good thing. Most aftermarket stuff is usually pretty good but it always seems to be slightly off from OEM in my opinion. However if you want to get a new piece mantis is my go to for that stuff, top notch.

    https://mantispinball.com/product/misc-u-channel/

    #81 3 years ago

    It takes a while to sand all the stainless steel. It’s hard to tell but it’s got a slight mirror finish.

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    #82 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    I could research this, but don't want to! Too much work to do. How do I get the mylar glue off the PF?

    rapid-tac adhesive remover.

    mylar glue is gone in 60 seconds. no muss, no fuss.

    https://www.amazon.com/RapidTac-Rapid-Adhesive-Remover-Fluid_Ounces/dp/B006RU65UG/ref=asc_df_B006RU65UG/

    #83 3 years ago
    Quoted from pinballinreno:

    rapid-tac adhesive remover.
    mylar glue is gone in 60 seconds. no muss, no fuss.
    amazon.com link »

    Wow good to know....

    #84 3 years ago
    Quoted from PtownPin:

    Wow good to know....

    I use a plastic razor blade as a mini-scraper to move the glop around and finish with a little naptha.

    Freeze spray to separate the mylar from the glue.

    Rapid-tac adhesive remover for the glue.

    Mylar is generally removed with zero damage and cleaned up in seconds.

    #85 3 years ago

    Still in the parts ordering and deconstruction phase of the very worn IJ I just purchased. Loving these threads! Please keep taking tons of pics! Ricochet you may be getting hit with questions as this project proceeds!

    #86 3 years ago
    Quoted from Paddy-o:

    Still in the parts ordering and deconstruction phase of the very worn IJ I just purchased. Loving these threads! Please keep taking tons of pics! ricochet you may be getting hit with questions as this project proceeds!

    There is a line for @ricochet, starts around the corner

    #87 3 years ago

    I bought a new toy.

    Can I install the large stainless “U” shaped ball guide? My Mylar hasn’t arrived so that limits installing things on the top of the pf. If I could install a few pieces at least it would feel like something is being accomplished.

    09D19CE3-1177-4C0B-B947-122B607E72A5 (resized).jpeg09D19CE3-1177-4C0B-B947-122B607E72A5 (resized).jpeg74639DAF-C123-4CC0-9ADB-B8B3D8F7EB6C (resized).jpeg74639DAF-C123-4CC0-9ADB-B8B3D8F7EB6C (resized).jpeg

    #88 3 years ago

    Hello. I don't have anything useful to contribute, but I'm very interested in watching your project, and posting this will very helpfully allow me to quickly find this thread in "topics in which I've posted."

    That is all. Good luck!

    #89 3 years ago
    Quoted from AaronZOOM:

    Hello. I don't have anything useful to contribute, but I'm very interested in watching your project, and posting this will very helpfully allow me to quickly find this thread in "topics in which I've posted."
    That is all. Good luck!

    u can provide all the great decals for the game

    #90 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    I bought a new toy.
    Can I install the large stainless “U” shaped ball guide? My Mylar hasn’t arrived so that limits installing things on the top of the pf. If I could install a few pieces at least it would feel like something is being accomplished.
    [quoted image][quoted image]

    Yes that is a fairly benign add.

    I love my Dewalt cordless screwdriver! I used it more for tear down but it is one of my favorite light duty tools.

    #91 3 years ago

    I rebuilt the drop targets. The targets are new, everything else is original. I can't find the circuit board that goes with this @#$%^&*. I didn't throw it away, it's here somewhere!

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    #92 3 years ago

    Ricochet I see the new backbox locks I have are shorter than the original. Did you reuse your lock or you have a source for a new lock? I usually use Pinball Life, they are 90 min away, just because ship time is less.

    #93 3 years ago

    FYI - When you remove all of the stainless steel parts, do not put them all in a big box. The sharp corners scratch other pieces and make the clean up process a lot more involved.

    #94 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    ricochet I see the new backbox locks I have are shorter than the original. Did you reuse your lock or you have a source for a new lock? I usually use Pinball Life, they are 90 min away, just because ship time is less.

    I purchased my back box lock and and lock plate kit from marcospecialties and there was no issue with fit. Pinballlife clearly has the same stuff... perhaps they sent you the wrong one by accident? I would check with them, its a pretty common part and you should have no problem with fit.

    #95 3 years ago

    I have two of this tumbler https://www.harborfreight.com/5-lb-metal-vibrator-tumbler-67617.html?_br_psugg_q=vibrator

    In one tumbler I have this media https://www.harborfreight.com/25-lb-black-aluminum-oxide-70-grit-abrasive-media-61871.html

    I am using it dry with metal polish. It makes a lot of dust. I let it run a day, turn it off and let it sit several hours so when I open it up a dust cloud won't come out.

    My question is should I add some water to the tumbler?

    #96 3 years ago
    Quoted from RCSP:

    I have two of this tumbler https://www.harborfreight.com/5-lb-metal-vibrator-tumbler-67617.html?_br_psugg_q=vibrator
    In one tumbler I have this media https://www.harborfreight.com/25-lb-black-aluminum-oxide-70-grit-abrasive-media-61871.html
    I am using it dry with metal polish. It makes a lot of dust. I let it run a day, turn it off and let it sit several hours so when I open it up a dust cloud won't come out.
    My question is should I add some water to the tumbler?

    I wouldn't add water. I didn't use metal oxide media... I used crushed walnut media. https://www.harborfreight.com/25-lbs-fine-grade-walnut-shell-blast-media-92155.html
    No dust... it absorbs the polish nicely.

    I used the same vibrator tumbler... it died on the last bit of parts I had to polish... good thing it was cheap.

    #97 3 years ago

    I have walnut shells in the other tumbler. I also bought 50lb of corn cob media, which is supposed to be even better than the walnut shell media. I haven't tried the corn cob media yet.

    Been waiting about 3 weeks for my mylar from Germany. DANG let's GOOOOOOO. I want that in place before I start to populate the top of the PF. I have been cleaning metal parts for 2 weeks, most look very good.

    Ooooo and the best news of the day, I have a big Craftsman sander which is currently on the floor because I need the space on the workbench. I moved it a foot and there was the drop target circuit board underneath.

    #98 3 years ago

    I rebuilt this gearbox and I am 99% sure I reassembled it correctly. But there is a small gap now. I used a vice grip to keep it closed tightly as I tightened the screws.

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    #99 3 years ago

    Double check your assembly... there are a couple of ways it can go together wrong and kind of still function.

    Also... be sure to de-burr your threaded holes ... that can keep your halves from fitting properly.

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    #100 3 years ago

    Today I see a package on the front porch. It's my MYLAR! Finally I can start populating the PF. Open the package, it's not IJ Mylar, no idea what it is for, but I'm not happy. Maybe in a month I'll actually receive the correct piece from Germany.

    There are 388 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 8.

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