(Topic ID: 44445)

incandescent or LED's


By Pinballgeek

6 years ago



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  • 64 posts
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    Topic poll

    “incandescent or LED's”

    • incandescent 22 votes
      13%
    • LED's 67 votes
      40%
    • BOTH depending on what game it's for 80 votes
      47%

    (169 votes by 0 Pinsiders)

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    There are 64 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.
    #1 6 years ago

    Just what it says on the thread title

    #2 6 years ago

    Whitewater is a good candidate for both. It was recommended here http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/thoughts-on-cointaker-leds-in-white-water GI should be incandescent and the rest LED's. Haven’t reshopped mine yet but I picked up LED's for the inserts.

    #3 6 years ago

    I say both. EATPM is a good example of why you need incadescent lamps to provide the warm glow on the GI. That games just doesn't look right 100% LED's. Inserts should always be LED's as far as I'm concerned.

    #4 6 years ago

    Full on LED! Burn my eyes out if you can!

    #5 6 years ago

    I voted for the Edison invention personally. But then I am naturally averse to having seizures for some strange reason...

    #6 6 years ago

    I prefer full LED's. For those applications where incandescents may look better, I would use warm white LED's or the retro LED's from Cointaker.

    #7 6 years ago

    Incandescent for the GI... everything else LED.

    #8 6 years ago

    If you go LED for GI lighting , make sure you get the warm white. Cointaker always gives you cool white for GI in their kits and they look horrible. I love the LED's for inserts. Backboxes vary from pin to pin. For example , I did my AFM back box in LED but it didn't look quite right until I changed it back to incandescent behind the main title only.

    #9 6 years ago

    For me, I only like colored LEDS for faded inserts, for those delicate spots where a plastic can be ruined, and anywhere on F-14. For some reason the more blinding that game is the better.

    #10 6 years ago

    Both.....RBION looks good the old fashion way where as Ironman is badass with LEDs. SM didn't wow me with LEDs while Avatar looks really good. Indiana Jones looks nice with regular bulbs and Jackbot pops with LEDs.

    #11 6 years ago

    As I've said in the last 500 threads aboot this it depends which game, and area.

    #12 6 years ago

    I am going to post a thread later but here is a vid of my F-14 I just LED'd. Replaced all incandescents, very fitting for this game, IMO. Not sure all tables would look good though this way.

    #13 6 years ago

    I was thinking what game in my collection should have leds or not here's the list
    Taf
    Sttng
    Ij4
    Diner
    Jd(put blue & red leds in both pursuit lights)

    Post edited by Pinballgeek : More detail

    #14 6 years ago
    Quoted from Pinballgeek:

    I was thinking what game in my collection should have leds or not

    Dealing with the WPC titles, personally I think almost all machines look better with LEDs for inserts. Really you should just be putting a few in to replace bulbs and play it and see what you think. Had games look better, same, and you can never tell until you do it.

    #15 6 years ago

    All LEDs.

    #16 6 years ago

    I'm going 100% LED. Not for looks only,but now I can turn all my pins on at the same time & not trip the breaker.

    #17 6 years ago

    STTNG is great for LED's ! Adding blue 906 Flashers in the Borg ship is very cool effect. There are many light sockets that will need a flexible LED due to the horizontal position.CoinTaker has them as well as The PinballCenter based in Germany. Please note: that to get to all the light sockets you must remove both left and right VUK and the under playfield ramps/diverters. I did not think I could do it. But I rolled up my sleeves and made it happen!!

    100_0011.JPG

    #18 6 years ago
    Quoted from viper001:

    But then I am naturally averse to having seizures for some strange reason...

    I think that particular gripe about LEDS is overdone. I've never really noticed any distracting flicker during game play on my pins.

    #19 6 years ago
    Quoted from Honch:

    I think that particular gripe about LEDS is overdone. I've never really noticed any distracting flicker during game play on my pins.

    Flicker or strobing is an issue with a person's eyes, and not a common problem with the majority of players.

    Quoted from RobKnapp:

    There are many light sockets that will need a flexible LED due to the horizontal position./

    I always say to use Cointaker Frosteds, which are cheaper and will work for 90 degree bulb placement.

    #20 6 years ago
    Quoted from TheLaw:

    Flicker or strobing is an issue with a person's eyes, and not a common problem with the majority of players.

    Then I stand corrected.

    #21 6 years ago

    I have never experienced the flicker affect many talk about thankfully because I love non-ghosting LEDs. When it is not overdone LEDs illuminates the field much better than incandescent bulbs. I go all LEDs but choose the type of LEDs wisely so I get great illumination but it's not blinding. I just can't see the playfield or even the plastics well when some machines have all incandescent bulbs in. That said, I can definitely see why some don't like LEDs and think they are just too much.

    #22 6 years ago
    Quoted from Honch:

    Then I stand corrected.

    Well not really, I was agreeing with you I just mean that's why some people complain aboot strobing and others don't.

    LEDs like any tool can be good or bad. bright games don't usually bother me personally, but if every bulb is a superkickass9bulbhahaa bulb, yeah it's too much.

    #23 6 years ago

    When it comes to solid-state machines, I would to put LEDs in any I own if they aren't already installed, since they are far more practical to use in machines.

    However I wouldn't do so to EMs since incandescents are part of their vintage flair and visual "warmth" (Similar to why some people prefer analog audio over digital); which the strong, solid glow of LEDs interferes with.

    Despite the possibility that I'll mostly try collecting Solid States in the future, I'll go either way.

    #24 6 years ago

    I'm in the camp of incandescent in the GI with color matched LEDS in the inserts. I've never seen a machine that I thought didn't look right when done this way. Looks awesome and is not blinding.

    #25 6 years ago

    leds all the way for a lot of reasons. but i do agree with some, sometimes both depending on the game.

    em = incandescent or warm leds

    #26 6 years ago

    I had led's in my JP and RCT. I thought about doing my LOTR, but every one I've seen with leds makes me want to puke. I'm sticking with incandescent bulbs on this one. - Barry

    #27 6 years ago
    Quoted from RobKnapp:

    STTNG is great for LED's ! Adding blue 906 Flashers in the Borg ship is very cool effect.

    Dam that STTNG does look epic with leds

    #28 6 years ago

    It's all about the led's for me, I think my games just pop. It's not for everybody but around here the game is not complete til all the lights are changed out

    #29 6 years ago

    Incandescent for the GI only!!! I have tried to put LEDs in GI and it always looks like Ass. Maybe there are titles that look okay with it. But, I have yet to see one incuding shows. Most inserts i can handle. I really like the retro coin taker bulbs. My ideal for leds is to look to original as possible with the benfit of leds. However, I never like leds in white inserts. It just never looks right.
    I do like that all you guys load up the GI with LEDs. The last 2 games I bought I was able to build up a pretty good led selection just from the GI I removed.

    My 2 cents
    mike

    #30 6 years ago
    Quoted from Honch:

    I think that particular gripe about LEDS is overdone. I've never really noticed any distracting flicker during game play on my pins.

    I must be old fashioned in the fact that I am actually looking at the pinball(s) while I'm playing a game, and not necessarily just staring at the lights and inserts. In most of the "overdone" LEDed games I have played there is a noticable strobing effect on the ball itself which is distracting to the actual gameplay. I will readily admit, when not being played the hyper-bright GI and inserts that have been LEDed are certainly brighter and more eye catching but to me you are overemphasizing those when they were never intended to be ripping into people's retinas. Again, IMHO.

    I can't say there is 100% agreement on this topic, but from my unscientific sampling most serious players prefer non-LEDed games. If you are putting them in because you are trying to save electricity or burnt connectors or because you think they look better that is cool, but I disagree that it makes the game more fun to play.

    #31 6 years ago

    One Note about LED's installed in Pinball Machines. Made by Bally or Williams. They all have attract mode settings for General Illumination for special effects during Attract Mode. If set to On you will get LED flicker in the Attract mode. I find this annoying. I set my machines to NO: Do Not dim the General Illumination. This setting can be found under A. ADJUSTMENTS MENU A.1 Standard Adjustments . Scroll to A.1 25 Allow Dim Illumination. Set to( No ). Page 1-26 in Operations Manual.

    #32 6 years ago
    Quoted from RobKnapp:

    One Note about LED's installed in Pinball Machines. Made by Bally or Williams. They all have attract mode settings for General Illumination for special effects during Attract Mode. If set to On you will get LED flicker in the Attract mode. I find this annoying. I set my machines to NO: Do Not dim the General Illumination. This setting can be found under A. ADJUSTMENTS MENU A.1 Standard Adjustments . Scroll to A.1 25 Allow Dim Illumination. Set to( No ). Page 1-26 in Operations Manual.

    This is an incorrect statement, they don't "all" have these settings. Williams System 11s do not.

    #33 6 years ago

    LEDs depends on the game. Inserts seem to benefit quite well. Sometimes in the GI looks good, sometimes incandescents just seem "right" All my games are a blend of both to some degree. For instance taxi's cab lanes look great accented with blue LEDs in the GI.

    #34 6 years ago
    Quoted from viper001:

    but I disagree that it makes the game more fun to play.

    I'm not sure anybody is claiming it makes a game more fun.

    #35 6 years ago

    are folks using frosted LEDs for the GI lighting? I've got it in on my pinbot and looks okay, though i'm still shopping it and most stuff is off the playfield.

    #36 6 years ago
    Quoted from Dommer:

    are folks using frosted LEDs for the GI lighting? I've got it in on my pinbot and looks okay, though i'm still shopping it and most stuff is off the playfield.

    Yes, I did the PinBot "cliche" half red/half blue frosted in the GI. I always get compliments on how good that looks, all the inserts are still incandescent. Some folks even thought the playfied inserts were also LEDs but they're not.

    #37 6 years ago
    Quoted from Honch:

    I'm not sure anybody is claiming it makes a game more fun.

    So why would somebody mod an amusement device in a way that makes it less fun to play?

    #38 6 years ago

    For better or worse, I'm an LED convert. Bought a Pinbot that looked so nice with frosted LEDs, so I got my GL filled with Cointakers this weekend. Looks pretty sharp, but I'm still fine-tuning. The clear inserts look fantastic, and I like how the top of the playfield has brightened up.

    8 months later
    #39 5 years ago

    The first all LED game I saw was The Wizard of Oz. It looked cold and overdone in IMO, but it was new and I was not used to it. Anyone know if they used warm or none-ghosting LED's?

    Although, recently Im finding the glare on my pinball playfield glass from the light of the back glass is distracting. So, Im wondering if brightening up the playing field with LEDs overpowers the glare from the backglass? Suggestions?

    #40 5 years ago
    Quoted from kcZ:

    Incandescent for the GI... everything else LED.

    I did the opposite. Retro warm white LEDs for GI, incandescents for the rest. The only exception was cool white LEDs in the 5 transparent blue lane guides at the top.

    #41 5 years ago
    Quoted from viper001:

    So why would somebody mod an amusement device in a way that makes it less fun to play?

    It's just a matter of personal taste when it comes to the aesthetics of a pin. If your game play is affected, then I guess (for you) it's less fun. As far as I'm concerned, the ball rolls the same with either kind of lighting.

    #42 5 years ago

    LEDs everywhere! I can't stand that "warm orange glow" anywhere in a game anymore (especially G.I.) - and no warm white LEDs here!

    #43 5 years ago

    you have to be careful what game you do it on. Some games look like shit with LED's. TAF and LOTR being some of them.

    Then, you have to be careful what types of LED's you use in what spots. You can't just grab colors and a pile of GI colors and do the playfield and be done. If you do, your LED setup will look like shit. You have to spend hours and hours, testing different brands and tips of the same color in certain spots and test run it. to find what has the perfect light distribution and hue. Many LEDers don't know how to do this properly and the games look like ass. Some i've seen have done amazing jobs with LED's. You can tell right away who takes their time, and who just buys from one supplier and throws the colors in and done.

    #44 5 years ago

    I think a lot of the whole LED vs incandescent debate should be what YOU personally like in that particular machine. Everyone's tastes are different. I put nothing but LEDS in my EATPM except for flashers and the coin door. I think it looks awesome. So does everyone that's ever came over and played it. I say, put whatever you want in your pin and enjoy it. It's yours.

    2 weeks later
    #45 5 years ago

    I think both have their place. I like the reduced power usage of LEDs as well as making the inserts really show nicely. For the GI though I like mostly incandescent with some LEDs to accent certain areas. The incandescent filament sits well above the playfield and lights evenly vs. the LED element at the base of the bulb. Also i do see a little of that flicker when tracking a fast moving ball with LEDs, but less so when they are in the inserts. I think hands down LEDs in backglass to give the GI connector a break, and in inserts to make the light shows look amazing. For most of the playfield I'll stick with the oldies. Plus in the WPC game I have the LEDs don't look right when dimming. The system 11s don't dim so there isn't as much of a problem.

    #46 5 years ago
    Quoted from ritewhereiwant2b:

    The first all LED game I saw was The Wizard of Oz. It looked cold and overdone in IMO, but it was new and I was not used to it. Anyone know if they used warm or none-ghosting LED's?

    Probably not. They probably have a proper design, i.e. a design which is suitable for LEDs.

    The reason for applying non-ghosting LEDs (or flicker-free for that matter) is because you put in a LED where the game is designed for an incandescent bulb. Since a LED is a different component that doesn't always work. Ghosting happens because the lampmatrix is designed for a bulb. LEDs are faster and show a glow where that is invisible for a bulb. Same for flickering: a bulb has a glowing time, which a LED does not have.

    JJP probably has a different design where the game just controls the LEDs the way they should be controlled.

    I once read about a mod where a small processor pcb (Arduino/Raspberry or something like it) was controlling the lamps/LEDs in a proper way. It connects to the lampmatrix connectors of a WPC and then controls the lampmatrix itself. Can't find the link.

    #47 5 years ago
    Quoted from Richard_BoK:

    I once read about a mod where a small processor pcb (Arduino/Raspberry or something like it) was controlling the lamps/LEDs in a proper way. It connects to the lampmatrix connectors of a WPC and then controls the lampmatrix itself. Can't find the link.

    It's actually a custom PCB using a PIC microcontroller.
    http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/led-ocd-advanced-lamp-controller-shipping-with-wait-list

    #48 5 years ago

    All LEDs, but only with Harold's LED OCD and GI OCD.

    #49 5 years ago

    Depends on the game - I agree that F14 looks 10x better with LEDs. Mine is all LED expect for the flashers.

    I also use the warm retro bulbs in my EM under the pop bumper caps to save them from the heat - but regular bulbs in the rest of the game.

    #50 5 years ago

    Since nobody mentioned it before: For me it depens on the game...

    Most of my games have LEDs in the inserts and oldschool lighting for GI.

    But then there are games that just can't handle LEDs, one good example being CV. First of all you can only use white LEDs as the inserts have so many different shades of colors that "overruling" them with colored LEDs would completely ruin the unique color scheme used. Then CV uses a lot of dimming effects (e.g. when the ball is waiting to be plunged the complete lighting incl. the inserts is heaviliy dimmed and brightens up when the ball is plunged into play) which does not work with LEDs at all.

    For GI i think even more care is needed, again changing the original colors is a total no go! Under red plastics i might use a red LED if it fits perfectly, but blue LEDs for the in- and outlane-area of STTNG as shown above - no way, that's miles aways from the original design. Also for me it's crucial that the LEDs are not to bright - one look at the GI of Sterns ST and you go blind. It spreads that cold solarium flair you usually only see in overlighted Asian supermarkets, but for me pins need to have that special dimmed bar- and gameroom-glow.

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