(Topic ID: 307852)

Improving Sound Quality - The DIY Route

By davegauth

2 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

You

Linked Games

No games have been linked to this topic.

    Topic Gallery

    View topic image gallery

    3311120240422_225954 (resized).jpg
    222220240422_214549 (resized).jpg
    IMG_1701 (resized).jpeg
    504783-a257170fca2168983d2a6e1bbfec3f44 (resized).jpg
    received_6742998335800442 (resized).jpeg
    pasted_image (resized).png
    320-3350_HR_0.default (resized).jpg
    607DEEC4-36DB-45AA-8B61-018875778767 (resized).png
    pasted_image (resized).png
    slika-1109725-631a4b9a8ef1e-velika-3077129719 (resized).jpg
    5580B012-A4F2-4FA4-ADF1-E8801A418BC1 (resized).jpeg
    8CDE1FF8-62E4-40F4-85EF-E93F22435908 (resized).jpeg
    C5D15E76-AC5F-4258-BC0F-0ECB29263D5B (resized).jpeg
    Screenshot_20240222-214420_Samsung Internet (resized).jpg
    February 2024 DIY Super Kit (resized).jpg
    20240218_102558 (resized).jpg

    Topic index (key posts)

    11 key posts have been marked in this topic, showing the first 10 items.

    Display key post list sorted by: Post date | Keypost summary | User name

    Post #5 Simple front speaker swap instructions Posted by davegauth (2 years ago)

    Post #41 Cabinet speaker replacement instructions/info Posted by davegauth (2 years ago)

    Post #162 Kicker vs JBL speaker comparison Posted by davegauth (2 years ago)

    Post #165 MBQuart vs Alpine speaker comparison Posted by davegauth (2 years ago)

    Post #186 Kenwood vs Pyle speaker comparison Posted by davegauth (2 years ago)

    Post #244 Stern amplifier and sound signal output INFO Posted by davegauth (2 years ago)

    Post #269 5.25" speaker overall ranking to date Posted by davegauth (2 years ago)

    Post #352 Speaker baffles info and summary Posted by davegauth (2 years ago)

    Post #392 Adding an Amplifier (General) INFO Posted by davegauth (2 years ago)

    Post #424 Thingverse file link for printing 5.25" speaker mount Posted by Sleal16 (2 years ago)


    Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

    You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider gumnut01.
    Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.

    #478 2 years ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Definitely doable, and not difficult - what game is it going on? Are you comfortable with everything you've seen thus far in the post. Amps, speaker adapters, etc?

    Also would be great to have a solution that works with the type 13 speaker lights. I know you have said the kenwoods are not great, but I already have 6 pins with these speakers and light kits. So if anyone knows of a good cabinet speaker and cheap amp on a budget that would work with the kenwoods that would help out a lot of people that like the look of these lights. Not an enthusiast solution I understand. Also a replacement for the kenwoods that still look great with speaker lights would also be a consideration going forward. Please disregard my post if this is not suitable for your topic. I know you are in the pursuit of excellent sound, I just really like a nice light show at the same time. Thanks in advance.

    #488 2 years ago
    Quoted from gripwhip:

    Here is what the kickers look like in my Rush LE not lit. [quoted image]

    That’s a nice lookin pin!!! The kickers look great unlit. I guess with speaker lights the acrylic would be lit only. Could look cool.

    #502 2 years ago
    Quoted from barroncaliber:

    Went the same route and LOVE the results . way easier all around .

    Sort of undermines the whole point of this thread though being a DIY route. Think we have enough praise for pinwoofer in multiple threads, don’t need it in this one.

    #506 2 years ago
    Quoted from Tortfesor:

    Sure, here you go (Kickers with the light kit):
    As I said, I bought the Kickers for the backbox. I did not get the sound activated controller since it had less options that the regular controller, and is reactive not just to the music, but also call outs, sound effects, talking, other pin sounds, and any other room noise. [quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

    Quoted from davegauth:

    That doesn't look bad at all. Looks real good to me.

    I agree. Looks pretty good. I think they look classier when they are off and nice glow when they’re on. Everyone likes an accentuated ring…

    1 year later
    #1341 8 months ago

    I have an IMDN LE and an Foo LE. Both have JBL 502 backbox speakers and Goldwood cabinet speakers.

    But sound in Maiden is way better than Foo.

    Think this is down to 2 things:

    1) I think the digital recording of maiden music is far superior to Foo. Just think there is more dynamic range. The Foo recording sounds almost compressed compared to maiden. More tinny. Don’t get me wrong I’m not a maiden fan, just commenting on the quality of the recording.

    2) stern have changed their cabinet woofer speaker. I believe they used to use the GW-8024, which is what I have in maiden. Foo comes with the cheaper GW-208/4. I swapped them and sure enough Maiden did not sound as Rich with the 208/4. This annoys me a bit since Stern have increased the price of their LEs significantly and then put a cheaper woofer in. $10 difference. Maybe they had supply issues, maybe Goldwood is phasing out the 8024, but they could have put a better woofer in.

    So giving that this forum can’t help me with the quality of the recording, have Foo owners experienced better sound by replacing the cabinet speaker? I can buy another 8024 or try to upgrade to the JBL 810 (all sold out at the moment), and/or go with the fosi amp. If the Foo sound is just a bit weak then maybe the expense isn’t worth it.

    3F2370C7-195C-4642-BC48-FD5F66B5F123 (resized).jpeg3F2370C7-195C-4642-BC48-FD5F66B5F123 (resized).jpegBCCB1A05-00BF-47D0-A941-6B11FF04D9C4 (resized).jpegBCCB1A05-00BF-47D0-A941-6B11FF04D9C4 (resized).jpeg
    #1343 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    I just pulled my Kickers and GW out of Bond and swapped them over to Foo earlier today(I temp seapped Bond for a Foo, and the person needing Bond didnt need to sound upgrade)
    I didn't have much time to mess with it and the brewery was pretty noisy. I'll need to go back in when noone is there to tweak it. But initial impression - something was off, could be my settings as it was really hard to hear anything in the brewery today.

    Thanks Dave. Good to hear what you find. I need to also check out what the 3 channel amp that comes in the LEs provide. Is it ok or just crap.

    #1346 8 months ago

    Just bought 2 boss cxx8s. Wondering if you've had a chance to review yet. Will print me some spacers.

    #1349 8 months ago
    Quoted from Big_G:

    Did you check your ohm settings? Make sure it’s on 8 ohms. 4 ohms setting reduces the output significantly, which could be your problem on the Foo. Or check EQ settings if you haven’t already.

    Thanks. Did both those things. It does sound a bit better. The call outs are fine in volume now. I just think the recording quality isn’t as good in Foo as it is in maiden. I’m going to try out the cxx8 sub and play around with the EQ a bit more. Last step will be the 30d pro. Looking forward to the new expression speaker lights I just ordered. Know this won’t improve sound, but they look amazing!!

    #1351 8 months ago
    Quoted from Big_G:

    I only have one pin (Rush) so can’t comment on SQ across pins but certainly possible. Did you try turning off the EQ?
    Does anyone know what type of sound file is in the pins (e.g. MP3, FLAC, etc.) or if they’re are the same type between pins? Just curious. Thanks.

    Replacing the cabinet and backbox speakers helped a lot. Playing with EQ helped a bit too. Curious if rush sounds better than Foo or on par. I have a feeling rush songs would be a better recording like maiden. Could be wrong.

    #1359 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Here is the cable I make that plugs directly into the CN5 and transports the sound signal directly from the Spike board to the mini amp.
    Performing this function with a single cable eliminates having to piece this function together with 3 seperate items. (CN5 adapter, 1/8" m2m cable, 1/8" to RCA Y adapter)
    Just the way I currently like to do it. This will keep the final harness neat and tidy.. I'll post pictures as I go..
    [quoted image]

    This looks like something I can do! Thanks! Do I just search for pinmonks wiring diagram?

    #1362 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Here is roughly what a completed harness is going to look like.
    Signal - You are pulling the audio signal from the Spike CN5 connector and sending it into the mini amp.
    Speakers - New wires are run from the mini amp to the L + R backbox speakers and another to the cabinet sub.
    Power - Power can be tapped a couple of different ways, this one is taking power from the DBA 110v. Keeping it an easy 1 button turn on/off.
    The harness isn't 100% yet - but you can see what a harness needs to do to add a mini amp. Normally I'd also put a nice wire wrap arpind all of this to keep it nice and tidy.
    Now just install the speakers you prefer, connect it all up, and start rock'n out.
    [quoted image]

    Is the 30d pro a soft turn on/off or a physical switch? Was trying to work out from the listings. If it is a hard switch was going to use the piggy back setup that Doug uses with his speaker lights.

    #1367 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    lol, no I didnt. Its another one of those lingering projects
    My distro keeps saying its coming and will be here soon.
    Honestly, someone isn't telling the truth at this point - Stern or the Distro.
    My distro just wants to avoid the topic and goes right to.. "So you want to buy another machine, vennom, iron maiden, etc....." I also have a backlog of other outstandng items that should have been covered under warranty but havent been shipped yet either - rusted balls, broken foo ramp, service button sets that werent working, and a few other outstanding items piling up. It's extremely frustrating..... I haven't pulled the trigger on a Vennom for the brewery partly because of this.
    I just went through my pictures to see how long ago this happened, and how long its been open. July 19th of last year(2022)

    Can’t have rusty balls….

    #1371 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Ok - quick review time... Boss subwoofer...
    I'll make this quick... It has its issues.
    Pro's - It's well priced, and is not be bad for for a low volume level install. Overall it sounds fair - and can handle a little bit of juice.. Sorta.... It doesn't have the smooth depth of the JBL and certainly doesn't have the snappy punch of the kicker.
    Con's - it requires a spacer. It can't handle lower frequencies and clips when it tries at mid to higher volumes. This will require the lower frequencies to be turned down in the EQ. But if you are running jukebox mode pumping music through bluetooth, well this becomes a bit tricky. Also the spade terminals are a weird size, the standard 4.8mm are too small and the next size up are too big. You'll most likely need to solder this in as its not worth the extra time messing with it.
    Is it the worst - no, but the only real pro here is the price. Needing a spacer, detuning it, and having to solder it in chips away at the bennifits. Maybe it will be ok as speaker swap using the Spike amp... And of course - if it works for you or maybe a specific situation...
    Side note: I was going to button this thing up, but there seems to be something up with this Fosi.. It sounds different than the one I reviewed a while back. It sounds louder and I haven't triggered the internal fault protection. I may open this up and see if there are any noticable changes from the previous one, and plug it into GZ for a better once over.
    [quoted image]

    Well that’s a shame! Bought 2x cxx8s. Just the Jbl is not available and everything other option is too expensive in Australia. Guess I can use the boss in my non music pins without the amp. Would you say the Goldwood is better than the boss?

    #1377 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Awesome1 - does the Skar midrange bolt in without a spacer?

    I can 3D print so that’s not a problem about the spacer. Is the Skar better? Because that’s adorable as well.

    Is the fosi 30d pro a bit of a liability? Hearing some concerns. It’s also affordable and has a switch which is good.

    My project at the moment is to improve sound on my FOO Le and my maiden Le (which is actually pretty good). My DP already has the pyramid wh88? And I have the ordinary kenwoods in all my sterns except Batman. Pins I am happy to improve sound in (besides my music pins) are DP, GZ and Elvira. Don’t think JP and Batman 66 are worth improving. TBL is not bad already. Too scared to touch wonka.

    #1382 8 months ago

    Just bought 2 fosi bt30d pros and 2 Jbl stage 82am (the kicker costs about 1.5x as much). With my Jbl stage 502s hoping this setup will work well. As I said will put the Goldwoods and boss in my other sterns. Let you know how it all turns out.

    #1384 8 months ago

    Will do. So remove the mesh, if there isn’t clearance print a spacer. I found one that RobCraig posted here on printables. Is that the same you use?

    #1386 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Yes sir, pull the mesh as you don't want it vibrating and you dont want the speaker surround tickling it. When you get it rocking, go underneath and use the tip of your finger or a flat slim piece of plastic(the edge of the screen you pulled out) and feel beween the inside edge of the cabinet hole and moving speaker. If the dont touch -and there is some clearance you are good to go.
    For spacers, I just design and print my own as I need yhem and for the speaker I'm using. I'm sure whatever is of thingiverse would work fine too and save you the hassle and time of making your own.
    I'm about 80% done with testing the amps. Some interesting stuff, not what I expected. I'll post in a few days when its doen and I can collect the data and my thoughts.

    As long as it’s better than not having an amp at all. Not after excessive volume just improvement on clarity.

    #1388 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    HUGE improvement... you will not be disappointed

    I’m not alone in being greatly appreciative of your efforts and help in sharing.

    To give you an idea our dollar is buying about .6 of your dollar so we are paying around 1.6 time lane the US price.

    So Pinwoofer costs us around $700+ AUD for one pin. Not worth it.

    The Jbl stage 502 jbl 82am and the fosi pro sets me back around $300 Aussie. That I can justify spending on a pin. Less than a sheet of hd glass.

    I also like to do myself what I can do.

    Thanks again!

    #1390 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Let's see if this works...
    You may need headphones....
    https://rokmen-my.sharepoint.com/:v:/p/dave/Ed_IU6KifrRMrZAHJ_4T0CQBWiG_bbLYEDsoWVV8jVd6lA?e=irvecj
    And that is the coin door mechs you can hear rattling.. Kinda hard to chase down all the rattles with a base heavy song like this when 120watts are coming from the sub in the cabinet. But you can get an idea... It's a smidge better than stock...
    Kickers CS 5.25's in the backbox, Kicker CompC 8" in the cabinet, and Fosi Pro running on a 36v power supply at about 75% volume.

    Holy shit!

    #1399 8 months ago

    Just wiring up my fosi now. Are there any dos and Don’ts as to where to place? I guess I would put near the cabinet speaker so I can still adjust volume? Underneath the cab might be nice but not sure if problem drilling into bottom of Le cab for resale.

    #1401 8 months ago
    Quoted from Big_G:

    I just sat it on the coin box where I can adjust settings easily.

    Thanks. I miscalculated my wire length. I can fit it to the right of the cabinet speaker. Still within arms reach to adjust

    #1402 8 months ago

    JBL stage 82. Looks like no spacer required. This thing is hefty!!

    03779278-9246-478B-838B-506CE32C87F0 (resized).jpeg03779278-9246-478B-838B-506CE32C87F0 (resized).jpeg0DEBA4C6-24C5-4141-ADFC-3442A95B0750 (resized).jpeg0DEBA4C6-24C5-4141-ADFC-3442A95B0750 (resized).jpeg1E0F7652-3098-407D-B49E-C8C08C2DC5C7 (resized).jpeg1E0F7652-3098-407D-B49E-C8C08C2DC5C7 (resized).jpeg4C41355E-18D8-4CAD-A915-EEDE9391B40C (resized).jpeg4C41355E-18D8-4CAD-A915-EEDE9391B40C (resized).jpegFFD31F46-5E11-4C82-B40E-BD21CA09CDB7 (resized).jpegFFD31F46-5E11-4C82-B40E-BD21CA09CDB7 (resized).jpegimage (resized).jpgimage (resized).jpg
    #1403 8 months ago

    Compared to the LE goldwoods in bulk

    image (resized).jpgimage (resized).jpg
    #1406 8 months ago
    Quoted from SirMachismo:

    I was just looking at these today wondering if this is the new go to cabinet sub now that the 810 seems to be out of stock or discontinued. I would love to hear what you think about how it sounds.
    Thanks,
    Lb

    Just blue toothed No one Knows through it. Sounded awesome. Will try to YouTube it later.

    #1407 8 months ago

    Maiden up and running.

    First with 10 band EQ running

    Next without EQ.

    I think I like with EQ better. Have to work out when to use coin door volume at opposed to Fosi.

    Also think I’m getting a bit of hum which you can hear when he starts to sing.

    Btw, used pinmonks awesome harness for cn5

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/replacing-on-board-amp-with-external-amp-for-iron-maiden#post-4439126

    And linked into ac power as shown.

    I’m a bit overwhelmed at the moment!!

    0484EB56-A47B-45F9-AD40-E2C299CE9207 (resized).jpeg0484EB56-A47B-45F9-AD40-E2C299CE9207 (resized).jpeg9E3EC8F9-57D8-4E87-8F16-789CC3A8B636 (resized).jpeg9E3EC8F9-57D8-4E87-8F16-789CC3A8B636 (resized).jpeg
    #1408 8 months ago

    Here’s queens of the Stone Age through Spotify.

    Apologies that my phone isn’t as good as Dave’s.

    #1412 8 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Good job Gumnut...
    You have your own Holy-sh@t moment going on down there now too..
    Play something base heavy, like TNA or White Stripes and watch those coin returns pump air and spinners dance...
    There are many nights ahead of rocking out now... For whatever reason the best games always seem to be played on those nights when no-one is around and the volume is ..... way to high.... And a stiff drink or two is nearby...
    I like the chrome on your IM, really cool you took to the details and also did the coin door and shooter plate. Niiiiiiiicccce..

    Thanks Dave. I bought it like that from another dude. Thought it looked cool. My equal most expensive purchase, same price as my TBL. It is an awesome game.

    Can you check my settings. Do I go about halfway on all the dials? The sub freq when too low didn’t seem to allow enough to the cab. The 82am is a sub and not a midrange woofer like the Goldwood. Also it seemed to come more alive with the EQ on.

    I guess I adjust in a month after the sub settles.

    Also I have 30 on my machine do I now just use the knob for volume?

    In terms of hum, no hum occurred with Bluetooth, and I only noticed it when Bruce was singing in trooper without instruments playing, so maybe this is the recording. I am hearing so much more. Have Ménière’s disease so only got so many years of passable hearing left, gotta make ‘‘em count!

    #1413 8 months ago

    Just realised I’ve done something stupid. I would think that the 10 band EQ would either do nothing or only feed the backbox settings to the amp since we are only using the L+R channels from CN5 and the amp splits the frequencies. Will turn back off for now.

    #1415 8 months ago

    Awesome! Thanks!!

    #1420 8 months ago

    So I can find 5.25” spacer rings on thingiverse but no 8”. Can someone do me a solid and add or point me to a 3D print for the cabinet speaker? Thanks in advance.

    #1424 8 months ago
    Quoted from mbwalker:

    A FYI: Seems like the past few years, Stern started to install shorter speaker bolts. I definitely ran into some issues installing a different woofer some time ago, just not much bolt sticking thru the speaker flange to get a nut on.
    So you might need to order some longer bolts.

    Thanks! Ran into that with Foo. My Imdn was fine but Foo had the short bolts. Changed them.

    1 week later
    #1435 7 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    The EQ works... The L+R signal coming out of the CN5 is the backbox 10 band EQ. The cabinet EQ will do nothing as ut wpuld be the mixed mono signal for the cabinet.
    Keep in mind tapping into the CN5 is like tapping the signal before it goes into the stern amps.. 1 amp chip is L+R backbox and the othe amp is a bridged amp receiving a mono signal and sending 1 channel to the cabinet.
    As far as setting the dials and EQ. This is what I like to do:
    Set the amp main volume at about 60-75%(3oclock or less on the dial) - Line noise amplification gets to be a little too high beyond that plus many of the mini amps start to distort, clip, and send real dirty power to the speakers beyond this.
    Now play some bluetooth music over your phone - crabk your phone volume. Drop your sub volume all the way down so your are just hearing the backbox speakers. Now turn up the base backbox and treble until they sound good. Play alot of different music, base heavy stuff, rocking stuff etc. Once you are happy with that bring up the sub volume with the sub frequency set in the middle. You are listening to when the sub starts to sound just right with the back box speakers. The sub shouldnt stand out by itself - you'll hear that point where it starts to take off bybitself and its gone too far. Back it back down until you hear it, but it doesn't stand out as a seperate component. Now bring the sub frequency up a little, yiu will hear a point where the sub just spunds terrible as you are asking it to produce higher frequencies that it just isnt going to do cleanly. It's also starting to overlap with the backbox speakers, and you dont want much of overlap, thia will create phase issues and sound bad. Again find the sweet spot where it blends and doesn't stand out. Then revist the sub volume and set it again. Make any final tweaks - and yiu are good to go for Bluetooth.
    Now - set it for the pin. Leave the mini amp alone for this and set for bluetooth optimization you jsut did from above.
    Go into yout utilities and 10 band EQ for the back box. Some random track will play everytime you go into the audio settings. Turn your volume up to about 35-37 on the pin. This will be your max volume now, I use 37. You can go beyond this later when playing, but the signal generally starts to get dirty coming from the CN5. Start at the left slider and move it up and down until the sound is pleasent. Then move to the next and repeat. Just llike before you are goign to increase the slider until it sounds artificial and stands out by itself then back off a until it sounds smooth to you.. Not muted, but smooth, it should be there but not stand out. Do this for each slider... Done..
    Note: The far left slider is generally going to be at or below center. These are hard frequencies for the sub to make because It's not exactly in an optimal enclosure, so clipping some of it off helps. You may want to crank this slider as it is going to be tough to hear anythimg until its cranked, but you are better off squashing it to keep things clean down here.
    Now go into the DJ mixer and flip through the tracks - then go back into the mixer and tweak a bit. Play a few games and go tweak a little more(Sound effects may need to be compensated for as they can be screechy)
    *If you smell that burning coil smell after prolonged listening at loud volumes, then the amp is sending a dirty signal to the sub. This is a sign to turn the amp down a little or turn the sub volume down a little. The Fosi and Fosi pro will send dirty power after around 80% volume. (This isn't because there is too much power for the sub - its the amp reaching its limits to send clean power)
    Alright - it's late, I'm really tired and typing this on my phone, I can only imagine how many typos are in this. Too tired to fix now, going to bed.

    Thanks Dave I followed your instructions. Helped setting the amp up for sure.

    Observations:

    1. I don’t think the pro has the same aggressive hi pass filter that the non pro does. Plenty of bass.

    2. It’s a challenge bridging the gap between small monitor speakers and a sub. The woofer speaker in the cab did a lot of the heavy lifting for the backbox speakers. Now that is replaced by a sub the backbox speakers need to do most of the work. Don’t get me wrong the JBLs are good, but drive too much bass or volume and they become flabby and buzz - this may be partly due to speaker lights sitting in front vibrating to lower frequencies, I can put some felt between the 2 to try and isolate a bit. I know pinballs and adding speaker lights are not ideal acoustics but hey I need the bling! Especially Foo where my speakers are now synced to the expression lights (thanks ninja camp, awesome job!)

    3. After setting for Bluetooth, most of my dials were about 1 o’clock. Anything more than that I overloaded my backbox speakers

    4. The setting of 2 different pins was different. 1 seemed more aggressive bass than the other. So variation in same amps and speakers. Guess this may be obvious. For this reason your dial in method is a necessity. We just can’t copy what Dave does.

    5. I tried setting the EQ for the back box. And ended switching back to no preprocessing. When playing around with the EQ and going for a bowl type shape (with the ends turned down) suddenly I couldn’t hear Bruce (not a bad thing haha), I fiddled with it again but just found it easier to turn it off and adjust solely on the Fosi. Bluetooth definitely sounds punchier than pin output so a bit of tweaking just for the pin is required.

    6. Lastly I had to turn down the subs just a little.
    When playing the sub sounded fine, when spectating off to the side suddenly the sun sounded intrusive because the backbox speakers weren’t filling in the sound.

    Overall really happy. There was a point where I debated whether a good woofer would have been a better fit than a cabinet sub, but after turning off the EQ and tweaking again, all good

    Again thank you Dave, having this sort of upgrade for less than $200 usd is fantastic!

    1 week later
    #1439 7 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Thank you for the good words, and great observations.
    You are absolutely right - the Pro does not appear to have a high pass filter at all on the L+R channels. I have not run pink noise through it to know for sure, but I am 99% sure there is not a filter on it. During testing I could get the pro to go into protection mode using just the L+R channels and turning up the bass(requiring more from the chip running 2 channels). The Non-Pro has a pretty aggressive highpass filter, and it's one of my biggest complaints about it - though it's livable.
    I do prefer to get as much bass out of the backbox as I can. (good clean bass) Kind of why I am leaning towards the Pro, and good back box speakers.(I'm working with some even bigger speakers that can handle more low end)
    Every machine setup has been different, not only is the game recordings different - but things like personal listening taste, room environment, hearing abilities, gear chosen etc. just make each one a little different. The good news is that dialing it in doesn't take long and you only have to do it 1 time. You don't need to be an expert, just patient enough to learn the process. Certainly, sounds like you have this mastered.
    @aweseom1 has done some experimenting with a mid bass in the cabinet, maybe that is worth a try for you.
    It's just ongoing fun and spare time tinkering. But even the basic level makes for a big improvement.

    I will keep with the subs, the 82s are pretty decent. The whole setup is very good. Just required some tinkering which I agree everyone needs to do rather than just have someone tell them the setting. I also think the Fosi pro is pretty good. Only thing I’m not sure about is if the kickers are heaps better than the Jbl 502s. But at the end of the day I’m really happy and have got it working for me.

    2 weeks later
    #1443 6 months ago
    Quoted from Had:

    G'day mate, any tips or feedback on these? I'm thinking of doing the same ones in FF but aware that some thing are difficult to get in Aus.

    Hey, the speakers are all excellent. I haven’t tried the kickers, so can’t compare these to the JBLs. Both Foo and maiden sound great with JBLs. Fosi pro drives them well. Pm me if you need to know where I bought them from.

    1 month later
    #1501 5 months ago
    Quoted from Big_G:

    I totally get the market for plug and play products and no shame in going that route if you don’t have time or just don’t feel like DIYing. I’ve read on more than one occasion that his clients are satisfied but I think some of his actions towards non-clients or potential competitors leaves a bad taste in their mouths.
    As far as DIYing pinball audio, it’s really simple. I think wiring the expression lights on my Rush pro took longer. You can crimp on connectors if you want to avoid soldering. I think DIY really pays off if you’re upgrading multiple machines.

    Yup if you can cut wire and add to cart then you can DIY.

    #1503 5 months ago
    Quoted from beelzeboob:

    True. But I can't add more hours to my day.

    It’s the same process though. You still have to replace speakers. You run wires from speaker to the amp which sits loose in the cabinet. Then you connect amp power to the power supply. Then you set your sound preprocessing off on your stern. And you’re done. It’s the same steps. But with pinwoofer you get inferior amp and inferior speakers for twice the price. And I’m not going to publish this anywhere else except the diy thread.

    I mean you think of it. You’ve got a stereo line out, there’s no magic involved. Same as any old hifi equipment, you add an amp and speakers. I just think it has somehow had some mysticism wrapped around it. Anyway good to have choices and I’m happy Dave has spelt out how simple it all really is.

    #1521 5 months ago

    Or you can just do a molex connection to some rca plugs straight from the motherboards line out. Search for Dave’s link to PinMonk topic for improving sound on iron maiden I think. Saves you over $30. That’s what I did. Cos I’m cheap!

    Here’s the link

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/replacing-on-board-amp-with-external-amp-for-iron-maiden#post-4439126

    So you connect the amp this way to the pins sound output.

    Then with the Fosi bt30d pro you cut the plug off the power chord that goes in the wall socket, crimp some spade connectors to it and connect it in the power supply. There are posts in this topic that show how to do that. Then it’s just connecting speakers to the amp. The amp will then turn on and off with the pin.

    #1530 5 months ago
    Quoted from BigMorty:

    I have read through the last 5-6 pages of this thread. If the answer to my questions is I need to read from page 1, then I will.
    I have Rush Premium with expression lights and want to maximize the sound now.
    It seems these replacement main speakers provide a premium sound so plan to go with them - https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B084HLS3XZ/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1
    Since I have expression lighting, I want to get these also - https://pinside.com/pinball/market/shops/1326-ninjacamp-mods/07090-expressive-speaker-lights-kit
    I plan to get an external sub for under the machince, thinking of splurging since this is my only music pin and going with this - https://www.amazon.com/Klipsch-R-120SW-Subwoofer/dp/B07FK2WNW4/ref=psdc_172563_t1_B00MJ1YR8Y
    My questions are:
    1. Am I making good choices for premium sound for my all-time favorite band?
    2. What else do I need?
    - I think I need 4”-to-5.25”-inch speaker adapters.
    - No printer available so what should I buy? Do I need an amp for the main speakers?
    - How do I hook up to my external sub? And do I disconnect the current sub in the machine?
    Thanks much in advance!

    With the ninja camp expression lights, absolutely amazing! But 2 things to know, first go for the ones which are slim and not rotated (think it’s the last option), secondly you will probably need to remove the metal enclosure around the power supply as you beefy speaker will probably be pushed up against it. I just put a polycarbonate shield in to go over all the wires.

    image (resized).jpgimage (resized).jpg
    #1531 5 months ago

    Stupid question and sorry if it’s been answered. CN5 now has cabinet line out as well as left and right channel. Would there be any specific encoding for the cabinet speaker which we are losing from just taking left and right?

    I guess traditionally all stereo was taken from left and right and just split between the woofer, midrange and tweeter by the speaker itself. Just getting myself confused, I guess sterns not doing a 2.1 signal.

    Almost embarrassed to post this….

    #1535 5 months ago
    Quoted from mbwalker:

    Sorry, I may have not of fully answered your questions: Looking at the schematic, it looks like the cabinet woofer is coming from the dedicated woofer Codec chip (SGTL5000, prior to the amplifier I highlighted) and going to CN5. And the backbox is from a different Codec chip, but same part number, also going to CN5.
    Since the menu had setting for cutoff frequencies, I'm guessing there not much bass in the backbox audio, and not much high freq in the cabinet woofer. It looks like the equalizer settings might be done in the Codec chips (SGTL5000) on the left, prior to the amplifiers.
    So I think what you were asking is "Would I lose bass if I just used the backbox L&R signal?" It appears to be a 'Yes'.
    Apologies if I was bit technical (and long winded) in my answers, you probably weren't expecting to see a schematic and a datasheet!
    Did I answer your question correctly?
    [quoted image][quoted image]

    Yes you did! Thanks!

    #1548 5 months ago
    Quoted from davegauth:

    Kind of, sort of.....
    Its not exactly a full 2.1 setup. MBwalker has some good stuff above.
    The soike board has 2 amp chips. 1 runs a L+R channel(backbox) and the other is bridged(cabinet). When a channel is bridged it generally is going to receive a mono signal. What you are taping into at the CN5 is the signals that are heading into the different amps.
    Walkers diagram shows the pinout for the CN5 - top os you L+R heading to the first amp and below it is the mono signal heading to the second amp. At this point both are still full range, the only difference is stereo and mono. Each signal can be controlled seperatly within the settings. (backbox setting control the stereo signal, and cabinet controls the mono signal)
    This is where the 2.1 stops. I do not believe there is any level of filtering on either of these two channels beyond what you set from withing the settings.
    Your Fosi on the other hand does filter the signals that it is amplifying and sending to it's L+R and bass output. More of a true 2.1.
    But as you've found already - The Fosi(non pro) is very aggressive with its high pass filter for the L+R channel. Whereas the Pro does not appear to have a filter on the L+R channels. And one of the reasons I pick the pro over the non pro now.
    Not sure if this helped or just confused things more...

    Hi Dave

    I have the pro. You and mbwalker have been a great help.

    So cn5 produces
    L+r for backbox
    Mono for cabinet

    They produce the same signal just one in stereo and one for cabinet. And then you have two preprocessor equalisers in the stern audio setup to tweak sound to them seperately.

    So there is NO special encoding coming out of the stern woofer cn5 output.

    So all we sacrifice by using the l+r signal out of cn5 and ignoring the mono is dumping the cabinet stern EQ.

    I’m totally cool with that and now super happy with the solution I have feeding the l+r signal to a 2.1 amp. I’m not losing any sound coding or quality in doing so. As I said, dumb question but in the age of digital sound I thought it worth asking.

    #1549 5 months ago
    Quoted from BigMorty:

    Thanks mbwalker, gumnut01, and Big_G for your answers - it helps a TON!

    Yes if the speaker fits that’s awesome, but if it is a little tight I would not hesitate in just creating your own shield. The lights from ninja camp are magnificent!

    You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider gumnut01.
    Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.

    Reply

    Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

    Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

    Donate to Pinside

    Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!


    This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/improving-sound-quality-the-diy-route?tu=gumnut01 and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.

    Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.