Quoted from PoMC:Yeah avengers has some really bad cracking and popping On a few tracks, noticeably the start of the game Thanos audio.
Yeah the audio package on AIQ leaves something to be desired and is really the only knock I have against the game. Maybe the video could also be a little better. Speaker upgrades including external sub and tweaking the settings helped my AIQ though.
Quoted from awesome1:Yeah the audio package on AIQ leaves something to be desired and is really the only knock I have against the game. Maybe the video could also be a little better. Speaker upgrades including external sub and tweaking the settings helped my AIQ though.
I made a really good video update to the game. Changed the Iron Man multiball ball lock animations, made a way cooler hulk gamma spinner video, really cool Thanos bonus animation and some really nice attract mode videos. I’m in the process of replacing the audio tracks that have the cracking and popping sounds
Quoted from PoMC:This morning I removed the Pinwoofer Kit from Avengers. I’m swapping it over to Aerosmith so I took the stock speakers out of Aerosmith and installed in Avengers.
First thing I noticed when I started the game, was how much better the game sounded with the stock speakers. I don’t know why that is, I never played Avengers with the stock speakers because I received it in a trade with the pinwoofer kit already installed. I always hated the way the game sounded so I’m happy with the end result.
I haven't installed the kit in Aerosmith yet, been working on this while on teams calls for work.
[quoted image]
Wondering if you looked At pinwoofer site to see the correct amp settings. Makes a huge difference, game to game are very different.
Quoted from Hayfarmer:Wondering if you looked At pinwoofer site to see the correct amp settings. Makes a huge difference, game to game are very different.
Yes I did. Went to the site and use the exact settings for avengers that is listed there. The guy who owns them also gave me the settings.
Quoted from Sleal16:Yeah, once I get to read up on this thread again and a couple of other places on tapping in to the power, like the board pinwoofer uses as an example, might move to doing it like this moving forward. 3d print some enclosures for protection, find speakers that I really like (prob stick with the kickers), etc etc.
It will be really easy to tap the power right at the main switch in he backbox. I wouldn't mess with trying anything like what is shown in the pictures and connecting anything to the board to get power.
In my opinion it's over engineered and complelty unnecessary to go into any of the boards like that.
Quoted from Sleal16:So you found those boards to be pretty reliable? 20-25 bucks doesn't sound bad. Guessing the 50-80 dollar amps on Amazon with the 200w max total would provide equal performance
Yeah, I've had great luck with them. I buy the non-Bluetooth version though. I tried one with Bluetooth but it defaulted to Bluetooth mode on power up which is a pain when it's inside a game.
2 weeks of having the parts for IMDN and finally took the time to get it all set up...all i can say is *drool
Didnt realize the 8" sub i got to replace the cab speaker was the same model Stern uses for the LE's. Well at least my GZ has the same goldwin. Might still need to slightly tweak the amp and the games settings to get it just right. Not sure if its a good thing, but sound effects overpower the music in the game it seems now. Overall loving the results so far.
Quoted from Sleal16:2 weeks of having the parts for IMDN and finally took the time to get it all set up...all i can say is *drool
Didnt realize the 8" sub i got to replace the cab speaker was the same model Stern uses for the LE's. Well at least my GZ has the same goldwin. Might still need to slightly tweak the amp and the games settings to get it just right. Not sure if its a good thing, but sound effects overpower the music in the game it seems now. Overall loving the results so far.
Did you use the Fosi 2.1 and the L+R from CN5 pinsound?
yeah, that combo. Glad that once I can get it all set up properly that volume control can still be set up front at the coin door
Nice.
Now just a little bit of time dialing in the settings and you will be set.
I have the Fosi, Nobsound, and Dayton here. I've had all of them running but still working through reviewing them. Hopefully, I can finish up and get writeups done soon.
Got the power supply in for the Boss AVA-1404 pre-amped equalizers today:
pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png
Now, I need to go get a 120V plug with wiring and cut the plug off. I'll wire that to the main power switch in the backbox so I don't have to go plugging and unplugging the power supply every time I fire the game up.
I would have this done this weekend, but my significant other is coming to visit 1 week from tomorrow, and she wants to learn how to do stuff like this, so I won't have results until sometime during the week of 04 April.
I'll keep everyone informed once it's all hooked up. Won't be much longer : ).
Quoted from davegauth:Nice.
Now just a little bit of time dialing in the settings and you will be set.
I have the Fosi, Nobsound, and Dayton here. I've had all of them running but still working through reviewing them. Hopefully, I can finish up and get writeups done soon.
Think the main thing I need to be patient with is the gains/filters/etc. From random reads people say to turn off all filters and let the amp run things, but as I'm messing with the EQ vs no filter, looks like i'm getting better results with tuning an active EQ filter. Its the daunting part. What to leave at what dial setting on the amp to pair up with game audio settings. I'll do it during the day when I can crank it up louder to soak in every little tweak
Quoted from NPO:Got the power supply in for the Boss AVA-1404 pre-amped equalizers today:
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
Now, I need to go get a 120V plug with wiring and cut the plug off. I'll wire that to the main power switch in the backbox so I don't have to go plugging and unplugging the power supply every time I fire the game up.
I would have this done this weekend, but my significant other is coming to visit 1 week from tomorrow, and she wants to learn how to d stuff like this, so I won't have results until sometime during the week of 04 April.
I'll keep everyone informed once it's all hooked up. Won't be much longer : ).
Good stuff. Definitley post up when you do. Pics of how you connected the power will help others see how easy it can be done.
Quoted from davegauth:Good stuff. Definitley post up when you do. Pics of how you connected the power will help others see how easy it can be done.
Will do. My intention is to empower everyone else here who wants to learn how to do this stuff. Like you said, not hard at all - visuals and pictures can go a long way in helping others get over the mental hump and be able to do cool stuff like this!
@Steal16
Yep I hear ya. I can post some pics tomorrow of where mine is set at just for reference. (Right now the Fosi is connected)
Quoted from davegauth:@Steal16
Reference pics. This is with Kicker CS5, with JBL. Game set at 35 vume, backbox speakers set to 8 ohms.
Your mileage may vary, but a starting point.[quoted image][quoted image]
35 Volume?!?! Yowza! 
Also - don't forget the attenuation settings can make a difference as well to bring different parts of the audio package more to the front or back.
Quoted from awesome1:35 Volume?!?! Yowza!
Also - don't forget the attenuation settings can make a difference as well to bring different parts of the audio package more to the front or back.
Lol - I like to rock out. 
I use the volume on the amp to control overall volume, so I don't have to mess with the pin volume.
Quoted from davegauth:Lol - I like to rock out.
I use the volume on the amp to control overall volume, so I don't have to mess with the pin volume.
Heh, i'm like the opposite. I like to control it at the coindoor. Though, keeping the volume on high in the amp screws with how the speakers power off. Once I get it where I want to I'll work on moving the amp from the backbox up to the front. Thanks for all the other info!
I’d look forward to a full diy list of items needed to provide a nice sound upgrade with a budget up to $200. Links to best backbox speakers, cabinet sub and amp with instructions how to power it up safely.
I’d like to take the plunge on a diy setup but need some hand holding
Quoted from davegauth:Reference pics. This is with Kicker CS5, with JBL. Game set at 35 vume, backbox speakers set to 8 ohms.
Dave, is this the current front running combo in your bake off? I'm about to put an order in and join this party for my Godzilla LE
Quoted from ray-dude:Dave, is this the current front running combo in your bake off? I'm about to put an order in and join this party for my Godzilla LE
Yep, that's my current front running cookie recipe for GZ.
I dont have a favorite amp just yet. Been working with 3 different mini amps here, each has some good and bad and will depend on what you are trying to do with it.
Quoted from Mattyk:I’d look forward to a full diy list of items needed to provide a nice sound upgrade with a budget up to $200. Links to best backbox speakers, cabinet sub and amp with instructions how to power it up safely.
I’d like to take the plunge on a diy setup but need some hand holding
Definitely doable, and not difficult - what game is it going on? Are you comfortable with everything you've seen thus far in the post. Amps, speaker adapters, etc?
Quoted from davegauth:@Steal16
Reference pics. This is with Kicker CS5, with JBL. Game set at 35 vume, backbox speakers set to 8 ohms.
Your mileage may vary, but a starting point.[quoted image][quoted image]
I like the way this brought out the music, but lots of the in-game sound effects came out a bit distorted/blown. Sucks I cant have one of those running non-stop to make the final adjustments. Easy to tune the music in though.
Quoted from Sleal16:I like the way this brought out the music, but lots of the in-game sound effects came out a bit distorted/blown. Sucks I cant have one of those running non-stop to make the final adjustments. Easy to tune the music in though.
I wonder if turning down the game sound a bit, may help. Could be the signal for the effects come through a bit hot from the pin at this volume and is getting passed to the amp.
Quoted from davegauth:Definitely doable, and not difficult - what game is it going on? Are you comfortable with everything you've seen thus far in the post. Amps, speaker adapters, etc?
It’s going on GZ. I’m very comfortable thus far. I have no issues with connectors on boards or soldering etc. The type of amp and it’s connection to power is what I’m mostly concerned with.
I’m also now too sure regarding when it’s appropriate for 4ohm or 8ohm speakers and I don’t know if the game comes stock at 4 or 8. I hear conflicting things regarding safe operation when you have 4 ohm speakers for example and the game is set at 8 ohms. I just don’t want to blow anything up.
Quoted from PoMC:Here are the photos of the backbox connectors. The CN1 and CN4 Output to a 1/8 inch jack to the left right RCA connectors that are plugged into the amplifier
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
Oh my. As an electronics engineer, I can honestly say this is one of the worst designs I have ever seen. Installing that daughter board power supply directly onto a connector with it sticking out like a diving board is just begging to have it broken off causing damage to that expensive Stern MPU board along with the Pinw00fer board. It would have been so easy install the board in the backbox with magnets and run a cable to the MPU and connect the existing harness to the external board. The way it's designed there are any number of ways that board can be snapped and broken off including being pulled by a cable when the head is lowered or raised for transport.
To me it would be simplest to order a 48v-to-24v buck converter and tap into the main 48VDC power supply in the machine with a connector or "Y" cable to power any DIY amplifier mod. And as a note from above: always make sure any cables or wires installed for a mod have enough slack and/or free motion to not pull tight and cause damage when the head is raised or lowered.
Quoted from davegauth:Definitely doable, and not difficult - what game is it going on? Are you comfortable with everything you've seen thus far in the post. Amps, speaker adapters, etc?
Also would be great to have a solution that works with the type 13 speaker lights. I know you have said the kenwoods are not great, but I already have 6 pins with these speakers and light kits. So if anyone knows of a good cabinet speaker and cheap amp on a budget that would work with the kenwoods that would help out a lot of people that like the look of these lights. Not an enthusiast solution I understand. Also a replacement for the kenwoods that still look great with speaker lights would also be a consideration going forward. Please disregard my post if this is not suitable for your topic. I know you are in the pursuit of excellent sound, I just really like a nice light show at the same time. Thanks in advance.
Quoted from Mattyk:It’s going on GZ. I’m very comfortable thus far. I have no issues with connectors on boards or soldering etc. The type of amp and it’s connection to power is what I’m mostly concerned with.
I’m also now too sure regarding when it’s appropriate for 4ohm or 8ohm speakers and I don’t know if the game comes stock at 4 or 8. I hear conflicting things regarding safe operation when you have 4 ohm speakers for example and the game is set at 8 ohms. I just don’t want to blow anything up.
Sound like this should be pretty easy for you then. The hardest part will be picking what is right for you and working through a couple options. I'll send you a dm and will help you out there so we can go back and forth a bit. Once you get setup you can post back here with your setup and your thoughts.
No worries on the 8ohm 4ohm thing. There is nothing to blow up. Your replacement speakers will all be 4ohm. The setting you see in the menu has more to do with gain control than anything else. Nothing is going to smoke regardless of speaker and seeing etc.
Quoted from gumnut01:Also would be great to have a solution that works with the type 13 speaker lights. I know you have said the kenwoods are not great, but I already have 6 pins with these speakers and light kits. So if anyone knows of a good cabinet speaker and cheap amp on a budget that would work with the kenwoods that would help out a lot of people that like the look of these lights. Not an enthusiast solution I understand. Also a replacement for the kenwoods that still look great with speaker lights would also be a consideration going forward. Please disregard my post if this is not suitable for your topic. I know you are in the pursuit of excellent sound, I just really like a nice light show at the same time. Thanks in advance.
People have mentioned the Kickers work with the light kits, no issues.
You could always amplify the Kenwoods you have too. To start with anyway - as you tinker and become comfortable with adding an amp etc. But there are much better options, and you could upgrade later.
Keep in mind - without direct A/B testing it's hard to say one option sounds better than the other. Most people won't do what I'm doing and buying and testing everything A/B style. It's time consuming, and costly. It's been almost 3 months and non of my machines have a permanent upgrade yet.... (Sounds bad now that I read it - what the heck am I doing)
Anyway - my point is, if you don't have anything to directly compare then what you do have maybe just fine for you. So start there and experiment with amps, or replace just one of your pins kenwoods, so it moves you a couple steps forward.
Quoted from gumnut01:Also would be great to have a solution that works with the type 13 speaker lights. I know you have said the kenwoods are not great, but I already have 6 pins with these speakers and light kits. So if anyone knows of a good cabinet speaker and cheap amp on a budget that would work with the kenwoods that would help out a lot of people that like the look of these lights. Not an enthusiast solution I understand. Also a replacement for the kenwoods that still look great with speaker lights would also be a consideration going forward. Please disregard my post if this is not suitable for your topic. I know you are in the pursuit of excellent sound, I just really like a nice light show at the same time. Thanks in advance.
Here is what the kickers look like in my Rush LE not lit.
52E49813-92DC-417D-83BD-1EB3FB228F0F (resized).jpegQuoted from gumnut01:Also would be great to have a solution that works with the type 13 speaker lights. I know you have said the kenwoods are not great, but I already have 6 pins with these speakers and light kits. So if anyone knows of a good cabinet speaker and cheap amp on a budget that would work with the kenwoods that would help out a lot of people that like the look of these lights. Not an enthusiast solution I understand. Also a replacement for the kenwoods that still look great with speaker lights would also be a consideration going forward. Please disregard my post if this is not suitable for your topic. I know you are in the pursuit of excellent sound, I just really like a nice light show at the same time. Thanks in advance.
I run my Sterns with the Speaker Light Kits as well and am using Boss or Pyle speakers with them. The Pyle's didn't fair well in Dave's tests, but I think they are better than the stock 4" speakers in my Premiums and Pros. I may look into upgrading them as well based on Dave's tests, but if you haven't replaced the stock Cab speaker, I have had good results going with the affordable Skar Audio FSX8-4 and set the Cab to 8 ohm and adjust settings to your liking. I also use external subs, but not entirely necessary depending on your budget and goals. I'm certainly no audiophile, but the above speakers are a noticeable improvement over stock to me.
Quoted from gripwhip:Here is what the kickers look like in my Rush LE not lit. [quoted image]
I almost had a Rush LE, it was just out of my price range(13.5) I really do like the yellow/gold art work. The Kickers look good in there too.
I'm jonesing to get one, gonna go full ham with audio when I do.
If anyone has one, and can get it to me - I'll install a crazy system at cost for you. 
Guess just realized, since using the amp and cab speaker is plugged into it, the cab eq settings are moot since its only messing with the direct cab output on the board. Am I right to assume this?
Quoted from Sleal16:Guess just realized, since using the amp and cab speaker is plugged into it, the cab eq settings are moot since its only messing with the direct cab
Guess just realized, since using the amp and cab speaker is plugged into it, the cab eq settings are moot since its only messing with the direct cab output on the board. Am I right to assume this?
They do impact it.
If you are taking the signal out of the Stern using the pinsound then it is tapped between the Stern DSP and the Stern Amp. Using the L+R plug on the pinsound means anything you do to the backbox adjustments in the Stern settings(DSP) gets passed to your RCA signal going into your Fosi. Any changes to the cabinet speaker settings will not pass through as that is tied to the subwoofer output connection of the pinsound plug.
Quoted from davegauth:They do impact it.
If you are taking the signal out of the Stern using the pinsound then it is tapped between the Stern DSP and the Stern Amp. Using the L+R plug on the pinsound means anything you do to the backbox adjustments in the Stern settings(DSP) gets passed to your RCA signal going into your Fosi. Any changes to the cabinet speaker settings will not pass through as that is tied to the subwoofer output connection of the pinsound plug.
Ah, gotcha. then nvm my previous assumption.
When I install the Boss AVA-1404s, I plan to turn off the factory set equalizer and tuning specifically with the 1404s. Don't want my settings to overlap or "compound" with the factory equalizer. That'll just be........weird.
Quoted from gripwhip:Here is what the kickers look like in my Rush LE not lit. [quoted image]
That’s a nice lookin pin!!! The kickers look great unlit. I guess with speaker lights the acrylic would be lit only. Could look cool.
Great thread, I’ve read almost all of it trying to develop a plan to upgrade sound on a Godzilla premium, but on a couple of points I am still not clear if there’s a best practice or if it’s more like voodoo and try different things til it sounds good to you. I am looking at using the 5.25 Kickers in the backbox with an external Polk 10 sub, and using the Pinnovators external sub adapter (1) what to do with the stock cabinet speaker in this setup: disable it or try to incorporate it into the mix (or replace it with yet another upgrade?). (2) what to do with Spike ohm settings for new Kickers vs stock cabinet speaker?
Quoted from jackd104:Great thread, I’ve read almost all of it trying to develop a plan to upgrade sound on a Godzilla premium, but on a couple of points I am still not clear if there’s a best practice or if it’s more like voodoo and try different things til it sounds good to you. I am looking at using the 5.25 Kickers in the backbox with an external Polk 10 sub, and using the Pinnovators external sub adapter (1) what to do with the stock cabinet speaker in this setup: disable it or try to incorporate it into the mix (or replace it with yet another upgrade?). (2) what to do with Spike ohm settings for new Kickers vs stock cabinet speaker?
I have the same adaptor and sub. I suggest you leave cabinet for now. Replacing mine with JBL. Set both at 8ohms.
DIY - Side chat.....
OHMs... What is it, am I going to blow up my pin?
The subject or rather concern, surrounding proper Ohm speakers and settings within the Stern utility menu is a recurring question. So let's cover it here, then can use this as a reference.
First thing first - If you are concerned you will blow something up then you are overthinking it. So let's demystify.....
Ohms is just a measure of the speaker voice coil(this is the copper windings in the speaker) it's job is to magnetize and demagnetize quickly. This magnet then reacts with the fixed speaker magnet(what you see on the back of the speaker) to move the cone of the speaker. Think of it like a cylinder pumping in and out when electricity is applied. OHMs is the electrical resistance that coil is creating against the power going into it.
The standard, for a very long time anyway, has been 8ohms. However; with improvements in amplifier technology etc. many speakers and amplifiers now run at 4ohms or even less.
What does lower OHMs mean, 8ohms, 4ohms, 2ohms...? The lower the OHMs the less resistance the voicecoil is to the electrical current going through it. The lower the resistance(ohms) the more power the amplifier can deliver to the speaker. Car speakers have all been going the way of lower Ohm speakers for a while now. Why? Because they allow the amp to push more wattage to the speakers so you get more volume out of your system. Amplifiers are being designed to run at lower and lower Ohms. This is why you will often see amplifier ratings in terms of how much wattage they will put out at different Ohm loads. For instance..
2x25watts @ 8 Ohms
2x50watts @ 4 Ohms
2x100watts @ 2 Ohms
The lower the resistance the more the amplifier can deliver in terms of wattage.
So how does this apply to pinball. Well, if you replace your stock 8ohm speakers with quality 4 ohm speakers, it means the Stern amplifier(or any amplifier) can deliver more power to them. More power, more output etc.
Will this blow up my Stern amp? NO not at all. The Stern amp can delivery power safely at both 4 ohm and 8 ohm loads. (Go back a few pages where I go into the Stern Amplifier in detail)...
If 4 Ohms is more efficient than 8ohms, can I go down to 2 Ohm speakers and be even more efficient. Not really, the Stern amp is not one that can operate safely at 2 Ohms. if you run 2 Ohm speakers off the stock Stern amp it will draw more power which in turn will create more heat. Over time this will lead to a premature death of the amp chips. Also, running a lower Ohm speaker load on an amp not designed for it will introduce distortion and clipping because the amp isn't fast enough to control the signals it is sending out to stop and start the speaker movement. Rule of thumb: Almost all mini class D amplifiers will run down to 4ohms easily. In order to run below 4ohms generally car Audio amplifiers are the way to go, as they are being designed to run down to as little as 1 Ohm. Just read the specifications closely if you want to play with speakers 2ohms and below.
Ok great so far.... Now what the heck should I do with the 8ohm/4ohm setting in the settings, it sure makes it seem like it is important. Will I blow something up if I don't set this to match the speakers?... NO... As far as we can tell, the 4ohm and 8ohm setting is only changing the audio signal gain.(think pre-amp volume) this signal is then sent into the amplifier. The 8 Ohm setting seems to have a higher signal level(think volume) and the 4 Ohm has a lower signal. No one seem to be 100% sure why this is. There are also some other things going on with the signal that seems to change the audio quality - but that is something completely different. The general consensus is that by controlling the gain between 8ohm and 4ohm setting Stern can keep the end volume the same even though the amplifier is delivering more power to 4 ohm speakers. So by choosing the 4ohm or the 8ohm setting you are effectively just increasing or decreasing the level of pre-amp gain, which results in higher or lower volume levels in the end.
Which setting should you choose? Well based on the above - It's up to you. But in general, you are going to be replacing all of your speakers with 4ohm speakers, don't bother with 8ohm. The cabinet speaker(sub) will be set at 8 ohms in the setting's so you can get the most volume out of it. The back box speakers you can choose either 4ohm or 8ohm depending on how much volume you want out of them, and how you enjoy the sound quality coming from them at a given volume. This area is very subjective and according to taste and need.
A Quick side note on Dual Voce Coil Subwoofers - Please don't be fooled into thinking a dual voice coil speaker is somehow more powerful than a single voice coil. It is NOT. The only reason Dual Voice coils exist is because auto installers can carry less inventory of speakers. remember Car audio has been going to lower and lower Ohm loads for a while now. This means auto installers need more and more options available in order to achieve the end Ohm load they want to present to the amplifier. A duel voice coil 4 ohm speaker for instance - has 2 connection points on it. Each is 4ohms. Depending on how you wire both of those voice coils the speaker can present either an 8 ohm load or 2 ohm load to the amplifier. Anyway, if you are buying a dual voice coil subwoofer make sure you wire it down to 4 ohms. Search YouTube for more on this if you need more info.
Hope this helps a bit... back to work for me...
Quoted from davegauth:DIY - Side chat.....
OHMs... What is it, am I going to blow up my pin?
The subject or rather concern, surrounding proper Ohm speakers and settings within the Stern utility menu is a recurring question. So let's cover it here, then can use this as a reference.
First thing first - If you are concerned you will blow something up then you are overthinking it. So let's demystify.....
Ohms is just a measure of the speaker voice coil(this is the copper windings in the speaker) it's job is to magnetize and demagnetize quickly. This magnet then reacts with the fixed speaker magnet(what you see on the back of the speaker) to move the cone of the speaker. Think of it like a cylinder pumping in and out when electricity is applied. OHMs is the electrical resistance that coil is creating against the power going into it.
The standard, for a very long time anyway, has been 8ohms. However; with improvements in amplifier technology etc. many speakers and amplifiers now run at 4ohms or even less.
What does lower OHMs mean, 8ohms, 4ohms, 2ohms...? The lower the OHMs the less resistance the voicecoil is to the electrical current going through it. The lower the resistance(ohms) the more power the amplifier can deliver to the speaker. Car speakers have all been going the way of lower Ohm speakers for a while now. Why? Because they allow the amp to push more wattage to the speakers so you get more volume out of your system. Amplifiers are being designed to run at lower and lower Ohms. This is why you will often see amplifier ratings in terms of how much wattage they will put out at different Ohm loads. For instance..
2x25watts @ 8 Ohms
2x50watts @ 4 Ohms
2x100watts @ 2 Ohms
The lower the resistance the more the amplifier can deliver in terms of wattage.
So how does this apply to pinball. Well, if you replace your stock 8ohm speakers with quality 4 ohm speakers, it means the Stern amplifier(or any amplifier) can deliver more power to them. More power, more output etc.
Will this blow up my Stern amp? NO not at all. The Stern amp can delivery power safely at both 4 ohm and 8 ohm loads. (Go back a few pages where I go into the Stern Amplifier in detail)...
If 4 Ohms is more efficient than 8ohms, can I go down to 2 Ohm speakers and be even more efficient. Not really, the Stern amp is not one that can operate safely at 2 Ohms. if you run 2 Ohm speakers off the stock Stern amp it will draw more power which in turn will create more heat. Over time this will lead to a premature death of the amp chips. Also, running a lower Ohm speaker load on an amp not designed for it will introduce distortion and clipping because the amp isn't fast enough to control the signals it is sending out to stop and start the speaker movement. Rule of thumb: Almost all mini class D amplifiers will run down to 4ohms easily. In order to run below 4ohms generally car Audio amplifiers are the way to go, as they are being designed to run down to as little as 1 Ohm. Just read the specifications closely if you want to play with speakers 2ohms and below.
Ok great so far.... Now what the heck should I do with the 8ohm/4ohm setting in the settings, it sure makes it seem like it is important. Will I blow something up if I don't set this to match the speakers?... NO... As far as we can tell, the 4ohm and 8ohm setting is only changing the audio signal gain.(think pre-amp volume) this signal is then sent into the amplifier. The 8 Ohm setting seems to have a higher signal level(think volume) and the 4 Ohm has a lower signal. No one seem to be 100% sure why this is. There are also some other things going on with the signal that seems to change the audio quality - but that is something completely different. The general consensus is that by controlling the gain between 8ohm and 4ohm setting Stern can keep the end volume the same even though the amplifier is delivering more power to 4 ohm speakers. So by choosing the 4ohm or the 8ohm setting you are effectively just increasing or decreasing the level of pre-amp gain, which results in higher or lower volume levels in the end.
Which setting should you choose? Well based on the above - It's up to you. But in general, you are going to be replacing all of your speakers with 4ohm speakers, don't bother with 8ohm. The cabinet speaker(sub) will be set at 8 ohms in the setting's so you can get the most volume out of it. The back box speakers you can choose either 4ohm or 8ohm depending on how much volume you want out of them, and how you enjoy the sound quality coming from them at a given volume. This area is very subjective and according to taste and need.
A Quick side note on Dual Voce Coil Subwoofers - Please don't be fooled into thinking a dual voice coil speaker is somehow more powerful than a single voice coil. It is NOT. The only reason Dual Voice coils exist is because auto installers can carry less inventory of speakers. remember Car audio has been going to lower and lower Ohm loads for a while now. This means auto installers need more and more options available in order to achieve the end Ohm load they want to present to the amplifier. A duel voice coil 4 ohm speaker for instance - has 2 connection points on it. Each is 4ohms. Depending on how you wire both of those voice coils the speaker can present either an 8 ohm load or 2 ohm load to the amplifier. Anyway, if you are buying a dual voice coil subwoofer make sure you wire it down to 4 ohms. Search YouTube for more on this if you need more info.
Hope this helps a bit... back to work for me...
Wow!!! Best detailed writeup explanation of this issue on Pinside! This needs to be a KEY POST!
I have a 1kw 1 ohm Hertz monoblock amp and a dual coil 2ohm 15” sub, amp runs at 1ohm! (In my vehicle)
Amazing what can be done these days, that has been running fine since I installed it in 2009. Vision goes a bit blurry when cranked up though.
Always been careful with ohms on WPC and SAM, I heard WPC can have issues with lower ohms but not heard anything with SAM so I use 3 ohm JBL’s in series to be safe.
Quoted from davegauth:Definitely doable, and not difficult - what game is it going on? Are you comfortable with everything you've seen thus far in the post. Amps, speaker adapters, etc?
Thanks so much awesome thread!
I am Looking to do a speaker upgrade to the following machines:
AC/DC Vault Prem
AFM LE
Guns and Roses LE
Willy Wonk CE
Zilla LE
Elvira 40th Anniversary
Rush LE
Cactus Canyon
Halloween CE
And supplies for Metallica, I don't have yet most likely a pro or prem
Prefer just speakers but would do an amp on your recommendations, I also love the idea of turn on the pin power and it is it. My hearing is damaged already but want the thumping base with shaker feeling.
thanks so much! Can I buy you a mod for one of your games?
Quoted from JohnTTwo:Thanks so much awesome thread!
I am Looking to do a speaker upgrade to the following machines:
AC/DC Vault Prem
AFM LE
Guns and Roses LE
Willy Wonk CE
Zilla LE
Elvira 40th Anniversary
Rush LE
Cactus Canyon
Halloween CE
And supplies for Metallica, I don't have yet most likely a pro or prem
Prefer just speakers but would do an amp on your recommendations, I also love the idea of turn on the pin power and it is it. My hearing is damaged already but want the thumping base with shaker feeling.
thanks so much! Can I buy you a mod for one of your games?
For sure! Thanks for the good words and the offer.
I've been really wanting to do something special with a Rush LE. Too bad you were not closer.
I'll send you a PM, and we can work through your pins 1 by 1.
I decided to swap out the Kenwoods on the LE in favor of the the Kickers CSC5 (5.25"), and they sound great. They do, in fact fit, easily over Doug's Speaker Light Kit without having to move any of the back box innards. The Kenwood cones are grey and reflect the lights wonderfully. The Kickers, however, use a dark charcoal cone and don't reflect the light nearly as well, but still look OK under the color-splashing ring. You see more of the flashing, revolving ring instead of the whole cone. However, further amplification was needed. At first I was a little hesitant of using the Pinwoofer system, but I eventually pulled the trigger (not needing the Pyle speakers). Before I got it dialed in properly, I did not see a big difference and actually thought I screwed up the install. After a few emails with Dan (thank you), and experimenting with the settings, it now sounds amazing. Be sure to turn down the back box speakers and turn up the cabinet speakers so as to blend them all together. Now, the result is what I expected from a music pin. Warning: anti-rattle tape is necessary, since I tend to like it on the louder side (former rock drummer [non-successfully] who now suffers from hearing issues, what...?), and my glass is now bouncing along with me to some awesome Rush tunes.
Quoted from RatShack:Spend the extra money for something like a Meanwell.
I had one of these fail due to vibration. It's your typical cheaply made PS. Don't mount it next to a subwoofer, lol.
Thanks for the comments on this. I settled on this MW power supply to run my amps. It even turned out to be maybe a dollar cheaper than the rando PSU I was originally looking at. These are 15v -7A which I am going to dial down to 13-14v.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B019GYON9E/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00
To keep the AC lines contained to the head and to reduce vibrations, I decided I wanted to mount it in the backbox. I designed and printed up my own mount.
Since the heads are metal construction, I had to figure out how to use pre-existing studs. This is what I came up with.
PXL_20220331_013639720.MP (resized).jpgPXL_20220331_013439199 (resized).jpg
I am running a similar thread :
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/speaker-re-design-for-pinball#post-6059386
My efforts are trying to use what is there and make it better. I don't know if any acoustical measurements have been done on these setups. I provide the data in the thread on my current three machines. Indiana Jones (Williams), World Cup Soccer and Goldeneye.
Just another log on the fire.
Quoted from Tortfesor:I decided to swap out the Kenwoods on the LE in favor of the the Kickers CSC5 (5.25"), and they sound great. They do, in fact fit, easily over Doug's Speaker Light Kit without having to move any of the back box innards. The Kenwood cones are grey and reflect the lights wonderfully. The Kickers, however, use a dark charcoal cone and don't reflect the light nearly as well, but still look OK under the color-splashing ring. You see more of the flashing, revolving ring instead of the whole cone. However, further amplification was needed. At first I was a little hesitant of using the Pinwoofer system, but I eventually pulled the trigger (not needing the Pyle speakers). Before I got it dialed in properly, I did not see a big difference and actually thought I screwed up the install. After a few emails with Dan (thank you), and experimenting with the settings, it now sounds amazing. Be sure to turn down the back box speakers and turn up the cabinet speakers so as to blend them all together. Now, the result is what I expected from a music pin. Warning: anti-rattle tape is necessary, since I tend to like it on the louder side (former rock drummer [non-successfully] who now suffers from hearing issues, what...?), and my glass is now bouncing along with me to some awesome Rush tunes.
Can you post a pic with the Kickers and the light kit turned on? Did you also buy any of the speaker surround sets or just use what came with the LE? Did you also get the sound activated RGB controller? I am curious on how that would work.
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