Hi guys,

Hope everyone’s well.

Just had this issue popping out of the blue after a long game last night, first time i’ve seen this:

From time to time (often but not always) when the ball rolls over the I-N-D-Y switches and/or hits the pop bumpers, then the drop down target on the far right (the one indeed sitting next to the pops) goes down as if it had been hit by the ball. Counts as a target hit.

I checked underneath the playfield for cables touching eachother in a way that there could be some interferences between those but cant seem to find anything.

Any thoughts or ideas about where this may come from and how to solve the problem?

Cheers pinheads

Probably the single drop star get switch. Exercise the drop target and switch then run a test on it

I was thinking a matrix issue but then you said 'sometimes and not always', so it could be anything in the realm of pinball, lol...
I would do a quick switch test on that area and see if you can replicate the issue, take a look at the map on the screen and see if you see switch 11 close up when you are manually activating the others.

thanks guys.
i did check this just now and no, the switch 11 doesn't close when I try pressing the other switches in the area (namely the four I-N-D-Y switches, along with the three Pop Bumpers).
I would say "it" happens probably once every 8-10 times wether because the ball rolled oved an I-N-D-Y swith (mostly the one on the far right, closest to the drop target), or when the ball hits a pop bumper (mostly when it hits the one on the right as well, again the closest to the drop target).

i did a thorough check underneath the playfield to be certain that no switches were interlaced or touching other things and it seems real fine down under. nothing that could make me wonder.

now, I did see that the drop target's solenoid cable is the same color as the one attached to the three pops (purple & red).
could this be an indication?

Could it just be mechanical? Maybe the catch edge on the drop is worn. Does it false register or actually drop down when in the rollovers? Does it drop with a very light touch or not reset well?

it actually properly drops down (then goes back up, as it should) as it is registered as a proper ball "hit" on it... very strange.

it really is exactly as if the ball had hit the drop target. except this happens when the ball touches the pops and/or sometimes the I-N-D-Y rollever switches...And this "phenomenon" happens - I reckon- once every six or eight times when the ball hits the Pops. absolutely not every time at all...

mmmh, how is the connector at the CPU?

well, I mean the connectors all look fine at the CPU board... do you think it may come from up there?

a friend suggested to me that the Pop Bumpers' vibrations (when hit by the ball) could maybe cause the drop target to drop down if it is too "sensitive"... ?

yes but why is it dropping when going over the roll over.

if the connector is corroded, if could cause issues like this. check the connector, if the actual metal connector is green (inside the molex and not the actual female connector on the board), it is corroded. you will need to get close up to see it.

Next, with the game in test, give power to the solenoids (with your door switch pressed on) and throw a ball to replicate the issues and tells us what you see.

OK will do that!
thanks a lot for your help. will give you feedback soon then!

Maybe post some pictures

Looks like my Totem Multiball flasher is stuck on. Preliminary research suggests a faulty transistor, but I checked the associated transistor and it tested fine. Unless I'm looking in the wrong place? I actually checked every transistor on the 8 Driver PCB, and they all gave the same readings. Now, I admit I'm no wizard with a multimeter. What am I missing?

I spent the past several days installing LED/GI OCD boards and an entire Pinsound kit. The Pinsound boards are incredible. I'm loving how this is all coming together. Color DMD (LCD) arrives tomorrow. Powdercoat finished by Wednesday. It's about time to just play!

I've noticed that the right ramp has to be a nearly perfect shot from the left flipper. I'm at 6.5°. The left ramp is no problem. I have flipper rebuild kits and coils on hand. Is that shot just notoriously tight, or should I add another project to the list?

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wondering what kind of difference is lighting can you achieve in this game with the GI board?
I do not remember the game with incandescents, because I played with those 30 years ago, lol... and it was also pretty bright in the arcade I played it so I never got to see the light effects...

I have LEDs in my game now, and the flashers ... well... I dont remember the game flashing like that, so I am wondering if this is because it is supposed to pulse rather than flashing? the backbox is also all LED and it is a disco in there now...

Very curious to see if this can be improved.

My game was converted to LED just before I got it. There isn't much control over lighting, and lower settings flicker. The GI is definitely smoother, and isn't as washed out.

The LED OCD let's you adjust every light outside of the flashers and GI directly. The character inserts were far too bright. After adjusting everything to taste, the game looks amazing.

I had a similar experience recently with my right side flasher stuck on. I couldn't diagnose the issue but when I reassembled my machine the problem had disappeared which left me scratching my head. That said, 20V is directly applied to all the flashers from J107 and the individual transistors on the driver board (whether it be the PDB or the 8 Driver board) simply grounds the connection, in essence making the circuit and turning on that particular flasher. So if the transistor tests correctly, yet the flasher is stuck on, then somewhere between the flasher and the transistor is being shorted - for example it could be a damaged wire or possibly damage on a trace or header on the PCB. So I'm no expert myself, however I'd suggest using your DMM to see if you have connectivity between the flasher and ground

Looks great. Pinsound is def a must. And yes a really clean to near perfect shot sounds right. But that makes it fun/challenging to get your jackpots under pressure. From a roll it’s not as hard, nor if yiu crank it as comes down left orbit. From a standstill though the shot def has to be pretty perfect.

I lowererd the pitch to 6 degrees or less to make the game more playable.

Now i can make the right ramp and control the POA.

When I put the freshly powdercoated legs on later this week, maybe I'll try 6.3°.

I am over 6.5 degrees and have no problems making the ramp... it fact, I make the ramp very comfortably.
My flippers are new but before that with really bad flippers I could still make the ramp well.
I am wondering if you might have the EOS engaging a little bit too soon and losing flipper power...?

Mostly it has to do with slowing the roll on the POA without adding washers to change its angle.

I think a lot of IJ games are at 6 degrees. Williams standard adjustment is to start at 6 degrees and adjust to taste.

My game makes the ramp fine at 6.5 degrees, but with flipper fade, weak shots and less than freshly waxed playfield, the game is more playable at 6 degrees I think over all.

Some games are over 7 degrees with hotter flipper coils and substantial adjustments to the POA.

I have played with the pitch a lot in .1 degree increments.

I have restored 8 of these games. Each was slightly different. My current (and last one in the bunch) plays pretty good!

Too low and the ball will hang above the drops or sit next to the lower pop bumper in its little corner. Or hang on the seam in the mylars above the drops.

Im keeping things mostly stock. 6 degrees plays well for me.

Again, there is no set rule. Make your game play the way you want, its really a matter of taste and ability.

Games should be challenging but not impossible.

Operators always make the games steep and fast with weak flippers to force short ball times.
There used to be speed mods involving pulling wire off the coils and extending the rear legs etc.

Thats why I buy my own games. I want them to play the way they were envisioned.

Starting to put rad cals on my Indy. Next is the front then the rest of the body. The head is complete. Big change from the original faded ones

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@pinballinreno: just curious, where do you measure your 6.0 degrees angle from: between the flippers or at the middle of the table by the drop targets?
I’ve read many players measure the pitch from different areas of the pf.
I typically use a digital level.
Thanks!

I use an angle finder, one of those to set up a table saw. I find a graphic on the PF that is square with the side, usually just above the flippers and set up all my games for 6.5/6.7 degrees. anything else is too slow for me.

Thanks for the suggestion. I typically set them up at 6.5 as well.
Indy does have a steeper right ramp is why I was curious.

All things worth looking at. I just didn't want to try and solve a "problem" that was actually typical game play. I'll probably just rebuild the flippers with new coils. Might as well start ownership with a fresh set.

unless the sleeve is tight inside the coil you do not need a new coil, you might need everything else new but not the coil. Sometimes I change them out if the previous owner had the soldering skills of a chimpanzee and are unsightly, my OCD does not allow me to sleep at night knowing I have that under the PF...but otherwise, just rebuild - keep the coils.

I also have very high soldering expectations. This is one of my custom guitar pedals.

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There is not a lot of difference between 6.0 and 6.5 drgrees.

Mostly it affects weak or low inertia shots

Half a degree wont make or break a game.

All playfields have small bends and bows in them.

I use a digital torpedo level that has 10ths and hundredths of degrees.

I measure in 3 places as best as i can, high, center and low between the flippers.

Then i calculate the average of the 3.

I start at 6 degrees, play a few games on it, then add pitch until it plays right.

If i have it perfect, it gets played for a couple months before making final adjustments.

On a lot of games, pitch is a compromise between rejected shots, balls flying off wireforms, airballs and floatiness.

Newer games have a lot more control over dialing them in, with coil adjustments available.

High pitches and high coil power makes for an exciting game unless there are rejected shots in other areas.

This is especially true with IJ.

Before the antidote device it was impossible to hit the mode start if the game was set up fast.

With the antidote in place you can pretty much set the game any way you want and still make the mode start.

The only issues with high pitch would be with dialing in the POA.

I think its about finding the "sweet spot".

Hobbit is around 7.1
Houdini is around 6.1

Every game is different.

I find Indy has to be perfect. Centered of course before adjusting POA or you’ll be doing it again. I also find 6.5 on the money for several reasons. For me, The POA drop skips if it’s lower than 6.5. The outer orbit hits the slings if too low as well, shot needs some speed. 7.0 affects your ability to hit the big ramp. At 6.5, POA drops work great, Outer orbit can be hit multiple times in a row, and ramp is doable

I had to bend the bridge for the ball to drop consistently into the poa. It would sometimes skip it otherwise.

This is a good post. The only thing I would add is that there are so many factors at play that once you find a spot for the machine, you will need to tune it everywhere. Once leveled and at the pitch you are comfortable with, you may need to adjust your POA, and especially your outer orbit guides to get the machine fully tuned in. Then if you move the machine, just re-level it and remember the pitch you like and you shouldn't have to touch the POA and orbit guides again.

What do you mean by centered?
Do you mean levelled?

Yes, I adjusted the post.

Exactly. That’s pretty much what I meant. Once it’s dialed for all those factors (I forgot to include the subway ramp. At a lower pitch the ball hangs sometimes). When all these items are tweaked and dialed and everything is working, save that exact pitch setting. That is YOUR Indy pins setting. I find this unique to Indy because of the amount of items that depend on pitch & tweaks. I find any other machine fairly forgiving if you go up or down 2-5 degrees

You mean the rear up and down post skips on you?

I find if there is too little lean, the ball will continue around the bridge ramp after the post drops. If you lift the table higher it drops fine. I’ve seen tweaks fir the bridge but prefer stock with 6.5 lean vs 6.0 and bridge tilt

mine would not fall consistently even at 6.5, so not every game will work the same in my opinion. you know, pinball...
The bridge screw ears were bent slightly in mine so it seat slightly at an angle, now it works 100% percent.

Score of the day

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Does anybody know what model are the planes mod being sold?
I just bought an airbrush and want to build my own planes and paint them but want the same planes being used on the other thread.

Ideas?

Aren’t you asking in the wrong thread?

Protectors are on the way to Australia, Canada, Germany, Netherlands, UK, USA (all orders).

I just want to know what the models are so I can buy them, build them and paint them. I did not think it was appropriate to ask in the actual mod thread.

I just want to build the planes for myself and paint them myself and feel good about it.

Probably not appropriate to make a posting about it anywhere, just my two cents. KornFreak is buying multiple material inputs, then providing a transformative service creating additional value, to come to his final product. You asking that in this forum is (in an extreme example) is like going into Coca Cola HQ and asking what syrup they use so you can make your own Cola at home. I imagine they wouldn't be rushing to provide that info to you.

I am in the Indiana Jones thread, asking what are the planes used in the mod, it could be any plane reproduction that resembles the original, does not need to be the exact same he uses. These are plane repro, these are toys for kids... please...

Plane reproductions come unpainted, disassembled, no decals, no led, no motor, nothing. Therefore:

It does not affect the service he provides I believe. Do you agree?

For those interested, this has been discussed before:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/indiana-jones-scale-me109-plane-mod/page/2

Very nice. Do you use the bonus ball? Everyone has their preference. I do not. Largely because it used to infuriate me as a kid that it cost a whole other game to get one ball = rip off = I did it almost every time

no I have that de-activated. All stock settings/factory.
I might need to set it up a bit harder. I did get all the extra balls throughout the game. This game has lots, and just learned yesterday that 'survive the rope bridge' give you one extra ball if you finish the mode. I got that one, the medallion, and the path of adventure AND the 8X extra ball, a lot of these were unfortunately very short balls, I got all my point in BALL 2 and the last extra BALL, so it was a 30 minute game and lucked out with the extra balls lol... I am having a hard time getting through all the modes because the mode start eject is random and something it goes straight down the middle so it works against me often, not often enough or consistently but, just enough to add another layer of 'luck' to the game.

this is the only part I need to fix, just waiting on Ricochet mod to add to the game.

Sorry I’m a bit behind on my next batch … some life got in my way