(Topic ID: 68869)

IJ Williams "You Cheat, Dr. Jones!" Club

By RDReynolds

10 years ago


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  • 11,590 posts
  • 667 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 hours ago by zimzam
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There are 11,590 posts in this topic. You are on page 126 of 232.
#6251 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

This one (hi-Z) works PHENOMENALLY !!!
This is a difficult metric to collect. All I can say is that every time I tried to get the shot... from either flipper it stuck!! Random fall-ins during game play or multi ball were not considered.
With the factory deflector ... I could rarely make the shot with the right flipper. In fact I was resigned to just making it with left flipper.
[quoted image]

Is there enough vertical height to install a foam pad to dampen the shot?

#6252 3 years ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

Is there enough vertical height to install a foam pad to dampen the shot?

Changing the inertia vector upwards should be enough to kill off the bounce back.

#6253 3 years ago
Quoted from PtownPin:

Is there enough vertical height to install a foam pad to dampen the shot?

I don’t think so... and I don’t think a foam pad really is a good thing. The stuff breaks down and it’s something you would have to deal with.

I’m going to get a video of it.

#6254 3 years ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Reversing the inertia upwards should be enough to kill off the bounce back.

This is precisely why the lo-Z version doesn’t work as well... It doesn’t take much ... like 1/8” vertical to slow it down enough not to pop back.

#6255 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

This is precisely why the lo-Z version doesn’t work as well... It doesn’t take much ... like 1/8” vertical to slow it down enough not to pop back.

Yep.

Maybe a small lip at the top to keep the ball dropping down vertically, in the case of a high speed rebound off the flipper.

#6256 3 years ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Yes
Maybe a small lip at the top to keep the ball dropping down vertically, in the case of a high speed rebound off the flipper.

I may do that. I’m going to get a few more cut and I’ll try that.

#6257 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

I may do that. I’m going to get a few more cut and I’ll try that.

Looks like a winner!

#6258 3 years ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Looks like a winner!

Yup... I’m going to double check the clearance of the ball and that opto transmitter on the left side of the ramp. I think it’s fine... didn’t witness any problems... I just went back and looked at the pic. The original deflector is forward faced so the optic PCB is behind it.

Like I said I think it’s actually fine... but it needs to be verified, it’s just the angle of the pic makes me

#6259 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

This one (hi-Z) works PHENOMENALLY !!!
This is a difficult metric to collect. All I can say is that every time I tried to get the shot... from either flipper it stuck!! Random fall-ins during game play or multi ball were not considered.
With the factory deflector ... I could rarely make the shot with the right flipper. In fact I was resigned to just making it with left flipper.
[quoted image]

Take my money now please! I need this in my life. I’ve had to change my pad out every couple days lately given increased playing time and more accurate shooting.

#6260 3 years ago

best for my machine was to remove the bracket completely, but dead bounce foam in the back and lower the actual scoop some more... i get 99% retention from strong flipper forehand now, good enough

#6261 3 years ago
Quoted from hisokajp:

best for my machine was to remove the bracket completely, but dead bounce foam in the back and lower the actual scoop some more... i get 99% retention from strong flipper forehand now, good enough

Yes, I understand. It is apparent in the thread there are two schools of thought...Team Thud, and Team No Thud. Personally I like hearing the thud of the deflector, and I don't want to add any foam. For these reasons, I would rather keep my temporary solution going until a better designed deflector is made. I have nothing against Team No Thud, and I'm sure it works great. I need a loud thud in my life...

#6262 3 years ago

You can see how it works pretty well in this video

https://photos.app.goo.gl/KskM7QLtdLCRgLpJ9

#6263 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

You can see how it works pretty well in this video
https://photos.app.goo.gl/KskM7QLtdLCRgLpJ9

Thats exactly how i envisioned it would work.

Now, TAKE MY MONEY!

LOL, good job!

#6264 3 years ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Thats exactly how i envisioned it would work.
Now, TAKE MY MONEY!
LOL, good job!

Thank you! I’m going to lengthen the hood a bit (to minimize the ball bashing the plastic) and try with and without a lip... however the basic design is good.

#6265 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

I’m going to lengthen the hood a bit (to minimize the ball bashing the plastic) and try with and without a lip... however the basic design is good.

The pinbits plastic protectors extend out a smidge towards the shooter, not sure if you need to take this into account or not.

#6266 3 years ago
Quoted from orlandu81:

The pinbits plastic protectors extend out a smidge towards the shooter, not sure if you need to take this into account or not.

I’ve got those on my machine ...it’s really not an issue the top of the deflector sits flush with the plastic surface... whether it has a protector or not.

#6267 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Thank you! I’m going to lengthen the hood a bit (to minimize the ball bashing the plastic) and try with and without a lip... however the basic design is good.

The video tells it all.

Im in.

Now start making one for Merlin hole on MM.

Throne room on WOZ, etc.

Same exact problem.

#6268 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

You can see how it works pretty well in this video
https://photos.app.goo.gl/KskM7QLtdLCRgLpJ9

Well done Jim - your persistence has paid off!

Now to quote a local KFC ad, "Shutup and take my money!!"

#6269 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Thank you! I’m going to lengthen the hood a bit (to minimize the ball bashing the plastic) and try with and without a lip... however the basic design is good.

Bravo! I go camping for the weekend, only to come back and discover that Ricochet has solved one of life's most enduring mysteries. One that has plagued all of mankind for dozens of years.
Now the easy part - invent a time machine, bring this back to the Williams design team in 1993, and BLOW. THEIR. MINDS.

#6270 3 years ago
Quoted from AaronZOOM:

Bravo! I go camping for the weekend, only to come back and discover that ricochet has solved one of life's most enduring mysteries. One that has plagued all of mankind for dozens of years.
Now the easy part - invent a time machine, bring this back to the Williams design team in 1993, and BLOW. THEIR. MINDS.

#6271 3 years ago
Quoted from orlandu81:

I’ve had to change my pad out every couple days lately

#6272 3 years ago

I read that too and I thought maybe I was the only one who would notice. Now it’s a stain on this thread forever...

#6273 3 years ago
Quoted from orlandu81:

I read that too and I thought maybe I was the only one who would notice. Now it’s a stain on this thread forever...

#6274 3 years ago
Quoted from AaronZOOM:

Bravo! I go camping for the weekend, only to come back and discover that ricochet has solved one of life's most enduring mysteries. One that has plagued all of mankind for dozens of years.
Now the easy part - invent a time machine, bring this back to the Williams design team in 1993, and BLOW. THEIR. MINDS.

Quoted from orlandu81:

I’ve had to change my pad out every couple days lately given increased playing time

Quoted from orlandu81:

I read that too and I thought maybe I was the only one who would notice. Now it’s a stain on this thread forever...

LMAO you boys are funny

#6275 3 years ago

I want y’all to know that I’ve been playing with the hi-Z deflector and it’s really working very well.

I’ve had a couple of fall-outs but they were attributed to back and forth wobble between the posts (basically the ball never really makes it into the scoop). Every single shot I deliberately attempted at the mode hole stuck! I’ve been waiting for failures and they are just not happening.

I’m gonna to make a couple of protos with the longer hood and send them out to a few folks.

I’ve been working with Cliffy and he has it all set to be made. I’m not the guy to make this type of thing in quantity and with the proper quality control. I can do a few by hand and that’s about it.

I want to try the extended hood before I call it done done. I’m hoping the longer hood will do what I think it will... but you never know... the physics of these things are often times counter intuitive.

#6276 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

I want y’all to know that I’ve been playing with the hi-Z deflector and it’s really working very well.
I’ve had a couple of fall-outs but they were attributed to back and forth wobble between the posts (basically the ball never really makes it into the scoop). Every single shot I deliberately attempted at the mode hole stuck! I’ve been waiting for failures and they are just not happening.
I’m gonna to make a couple of protos with the longer hood and send them out to a few folks.
I’ve been working with Cliffy and he has it all set to be made. I’m not the guy to make this type of thing in quantity and with the proper quality control. I can do a few by hand and that’s about it.
I want to try the extended hood before I call it done done. I’m hoping the longer hood will do what I think it will... but you never know... the physics of these things are often times counter intuitive.

My IJ was previously modded with the deflector removed and padding added on the sides, with probably 80-90% success however I am keen to try out the new deflector. Well done on all these mods you've been doing to help dial in all of our machines.

#6277 3 years ago

new pinball topper
incl RGB Controller
just connect to 12V DC

140,- shipped.

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#6278 3 years ago

Finally got Cliffy's right outlane guide installed properly... Fits perfect. Closing this one out as done done.

Here are some install pics:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/23TQc1cqutGBnz1A7

I used electrical tape to get the position right... Set the post to far left... and that determined my Y position of the guide... then picked a happy X position by making sure the distance between the switch and the guide was sufficient that the guide will do its job. Cliffy ob-longed the holes a bit which is a nice touch for that adjustment (especially if you have drilled your screw holes a little off-center).

Drilled 1/16" pilot holes (not all the way through... just a bit), counter sunk then secured with two #6's

ij-right-outlane-guide (resized).jpgij-right-outlane-guide (resized).jpg

#6279 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Finally got Cliffy's right outlane guide installed properly... Fits perfect. Closing this one out as done done.
Here are some install pics:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/23TQc1cqutGBnz1A7
I used electrical tape to get the position right... Set the post to far left... and that determined my Y position of the guide... then picked a happy X position by making sure the distance between the switch and the guide was sufficient that the guide will do its job. Cliffy ob-longed the holes a bit which is a nice touch for that adjustment (especially if you have drilled your screw holes a little off-center).
Drilled 1/16" pilot holes (not all the way through... just a bit), counter sunk then secured with two #6's
[quoted image]

Well done !

#6280 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Finally got Cliffy's right outlane guide installed properly... Fits perfect. Closing this one out as done done.
Here are some install pics:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/23TQc1cqutGBnz1A7
I used electrical tape to get the position right... Set the post to far left... and that determined my Y position of the guide... then picked a happy X position by making sure the distance between the switch and the guide was sufficient that the guide will do its job. Cliffy ob-longed the holes a bit which is a nice touch for that adjustment (especially if you have drilled your screw holes a little off-center).
Drilled 1/16" pilot holes (not all the way through... just a bit), counter sunk then secured with two #6's
[quoted image]

I like it. This thing, it is a good thing.

Now, watch me sweat bullets at the thought of drilling more holes in my playfield.

#6281 3 years ago
Quoted from AaronZOOM:

I like it. This thing, it is a good thing.
Now, watch me sweat bullets at the thought of drilling more holes in my playfield.

Didn't phase me one iota, and I honestly thought it would. It just looks (to me) like it should have been there all along so meh... no biggie.

Remove the apron wireform and have a drill bit that is long enough that your drill chuck won't hit anything.

#6282 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Didn't phase me one iota, and I honestly thought it would. It just looks (to me) like it should have been there all along so meh... no biggie.
Remove the apron wireform and have a drill bit that is long enough that your drill chuck won't hit anything.

It is an irrational fear. I have already foolishly put new holes by the mode start to hold my Cliffy in my new, deflector-less world.
Installing this guide shouldn't make me think twice, and yet, part of my brain still shouts, "Oh no! Your original playfield! You must not compromise her integrity!"
That ship has already sailed, man.

In the end though, for those if us who are planning on keeping our IJ forever (I'm going to be buried in mine), this upgrade will be an absolute no-brainer. Kudos to you for solving this, when we all were content for decades to keep our misbegotten quick-escape points.

#6283 3 years ago

I'm back in the club.
Didn't want to sell the last one.

This one is staying for good
Same owner for the last 19 years.

Already tearing it down for a good cleaning, topside first.

Looking for the Lior mods for it.
I had the ramp cover on my last one, and liked it.
Anyone looking to sell theirs.

avZypLoZRP2YPKU3DiFxZg (resized).jpgavZypLoZRP2YPKU3DiFxZg (resized).jpg
#6284 3 years ago

Hello Everyone - A new problem reared its ugly head tonight.

In short, when I go to the POA, if I move the mini playfield the switches on the playfield don't register when the ball trips them and it's like the mode just kind of ends. In fact, if I fall through the pit hole it doesn't do the scream noise and it actually will show the cut screen of the snow sledding scene that happens when you trip the microswitch under the mini PF directly in front of the arrow as the ball crosses it. If I do NOT trigger the mini playfield to move at all during the POA mode, the switches trip fine and when the ball drops into the pit, I hear the scream and see the proper video sequence.

Any ideas what is causing the movement of the mini PF to cancel out the mode? The only thing that I did differently is earlier today I had to adjust the metal post slightly at the point the ball drops into the PF because the ball was dropping more to one side (I recently changed the armor the other day and that messed with L/R balance of the machine slightly). Nothing else is different. No errors are showing up. The switches all activate properly in test mode. The mini PF motor works great in test mode.

Please any advice would be appreciated, the game is currently unplayable if I can't rely on the POA to work properly all of a sudden.

#6285 3 years ago
Quoted from orlandu81:

Hello Everyone - A new problem reared its ugly head tonight.
In short, when I go to the POA, if I move the mini playfield the switches on the playfield don't register when the ball trips them and it's like the mode just kind of ends. In fact, if I fall through the pit hole it doesn't do the scream noise and it actually will show the cut screen of the snow sledding scene that happens when you trip the microswitch under the mini PF directly in front of the arrow as the ball crosses it. If I do NOT trigger the mini playfield to move at all during the POA mode, the switches trip fine and when the ball drops into the pit, I hear the scream and see the proper video sequence.
Any ideas what is causing the movement of the mini PF to cancel out the mode? The only thing that I did differently is earlier today I had to adjust the metal post slightly at the point the ball drops into the PF because the ball was dropping more to one side (I recently changed the armor the other day and that messed with L/R balance of the machine slightly). Nothing else is different. No errors are showing up. The switches all activate properly in test mode. The mini PF motor works great in test mode.
Please any advice would be appreciated, the game is currently unplayable if I can't rely on the POA to work properly all of a sudden.

Weird... Smells like an intermittent connection. I would snoop around column 7 (green-violet).

#6286 3 years ago
Quoted from orlandu81:

Hello Everyone - A new problem reared its ugly head tonight.
In short, when I go to the POA, if I move the mini playfield the switches on the playfield don't register when the ball trips them and it's like the mode just kind of ends. In fact, if I fall through the pit hole it doesn't do the scream noise and it actually will show the cut screen of the snow sledding scene that happens when you trip the microswitch under the mini PF directly in front of the arrow as the ball crosses it. If I do NOT trigger the mini playfield to move at all during the POA mode, the switches trip fine and when the ball drops into the pit, I hear the scream and see the proper video sequence.
Any ideas what is causing the movement of the mini PF to cancel out the mode? The only thing that I did differently is earlier today I had to adjust the metal post slightly at the point the ball drops into the PF because the ball was dropping more to one side (I recently changed the armor the other day and that messed with L/R balance of the machine slightly). Nothing else is different. No errors are showing up. The switches all activate properly in test mode. The mini PF motor works great in test mode.
Please any advice would be appreciated, the game is currently unplayable if I can't rely on the POA to work properly all of a sudden.

To me, it sounds like a crossed wire somewhere. The same old problem of having multiple switches fire when you trigger something unrelated. Perhaps when the POA triggers its left/right limit switch, it ALSO triggers a lower playfield switch, tricking the game into thinking the ball had already left the POA. Could be the flippers doing it, too.

I'd put it into switch test mode, and test both the flippers and activate the optos on the POA manually (the ones on the board, not the pit or EB holes), and see if you get that flicker of more than one switch activating. You said that it works fine if you don't move it side to side, so that probably rules out the POA entry switch or any of the lane switches.

Also, I just woke up, and it's possible everything I just said is nonsense. Good luck!

#6287 3 years ago
Quoted from pingod:

I'm back in the club.
Didn't want to sell the last one.
This one is staying for good
Same owner for the last 19 years.
Already tearing it down for a good cleaning, topside first.
Looking for the Lior mods for it.
I had the ramp cover on my last one, and liked it.
Anyone looking to sell theirs.
[quoted image]

Welcome back, fellow Calgarian! I see Lior still sells a few similar sculpted mods through his Pinside shop "The Art of Pinball," but I don't see that specific one.
You might be hard pressed to find an IJ owner willing to remove theirs to sell, but maybe you'll get lucky! It seems that "I bought this years ago and never got around to installing it" is a common pinball condition.

#6288 3 years ago
Quoted from AaronZOOM:

Welcome back, fellow Calgarian! I see Lior still sells a few similar sculpted mods through his Pinside shop "The Art of Pinball," but I don't see that specific one.
You might be hard pressed to find an IJ owner willing to remove theirs to sell, but maybe you'll get lucky! It seems that "I bought this years ago and never got around to installing it" is a common pinball condition.

Thanks ,
I can use your target decals too.

#6289 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Weird... Smells like an intermittent connection. I would snoop around column 7 (green-violet).

Quoted from AaronZOOM:

To me, it sounds like a crossed wire somewhere. The same old problem of having multiple switches fire when you trigger something unrelated. Perhaps when the POA triggers its left/right limit switch, it ALSO triggers a lower playfield switch, tricking the game into thinking the ball had already left the POA. Could be the flippers doing it, too.
I'd put it into switch test mode, and test both the flippers and activate the optos on the POA manually (the ones on the board, not the pit or EB holes), and see if you get that flicker of more than one switch activating. You said that it works fine if you don't move it side to side, so that probably rules out the POA entry switch or any of the lane switches.
Also, I just woke up, and it's possible everything I just said is nonsense. Good luck!

Thank you both for your input. I will have to look this over later today. Not sure if it helps, but what I did prior to the issue surfacing was I replaced all my armor with powdercoated pieces from Robert Stone (they look awesome by the way). Upon doing so, I think my left/right balance was off slightly and I noticed the ball dropping into the mini playfield and going left by default instead of dropping in the middle. So I took the glass of and manual triggered ADVENTURE and manually rolled the ball up the ramp to the Mini PF over and over to test that it was dropping in the right place after adjusting the tabs. Once I got it where I liked it, it seemed fine. Then later when I played I noticed the issue.

I have done nothing else to the machine, and it worked flawlessly before these events took place. It definitely seems like when I activate the flippers after the ball drops into the mini PF now, the game acts just like it does when the POA run ends...you know what I mean? You know how normally after running the ball down the mini PF you have 1-2 seconds of being able to move the mini PF with the flipper buttons before it goes back into "normal mode"...this is what seems to be happening immediately when I activate the flippers once the ball drops into the playfield. I get about 1-2 seconds of moving the mini PF and no switches on it are tripped. It's like the machine time travelled forward a few seconds and is skipping the run.

#6290 3 years ago
Quoted from AaronZOOM:

To me, it sounds like a crossed wire somewhere. The same old problem of having multiple switches fire when you trigger something unrelated. Perhaps when the POA triggers its left/right limit switch, it ALSO triggers a lower playfield switch, tricking the game into thinking the ball had already left the POA. Could be the flippers doing it, too.
I'd put it into switch test mode, and test both the flippers and activate the optos on the POA manually (the ones on the board, not the pit or EB holes), and see if you get that flicker of more than one switch activating. You said that it works fine if you don't move it side to side, so that probably rules out the POA entry switch or any of the lane switches.
Also, I just woke up, and it's possible everything I just said is nonsense. Good luck!

Ah, my mistake. The POA left/right optos (switch 94 & 95) don't show up on the switch edge test matrix. They only show up during the mini pf test. So my testing suggestion for those optos ain't gonna work.

Still feels to me like something off the POA is triggering when it shouldn't, though, which is causing the game to assume that there isn't a ball in the mini playfield.

#6291 3 years ago

Z-flector proto 2 comes in tomorrow... I will have them made and tested this weekend. Yeah that’s right I’m calling it the “Zee”flector... instead of Deflector ‘cause I’m old and I find punny things funny.

#6292 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Z-flector proto 2 comes in tomorrow... I will have them made and tested this weekend. Yeah that’s right I’m calling it the “Zee”flector... cause I’m old and I find punny things funny.

Except I'm Canadian, so to me it's the "zed"flector, which doesn't quite have the same ring to it.

#6293 3 years ago
Quoted from AaronZOOM:

Except I'm Canadian, so to me it's the "zed"flector, which doesn't quite have the same ring to it.

Dammit!

Who’s Zed? (what movie?)

#6294 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Dammit!
Who’s Zed? (what movie?)

Zed's dead, baby, Zed's dead (said in a Bruce Willis tone)

#6295 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Dammit!
Who’s Zed? (what movie?)

I dunno. The only thing that comes to mind is Rip Torn's character in Men in Black, or Lord Zedd who was the villian in Power Rangers. I met him at a comic convention once. Seemed nice.

Other than that, "zed" is just what us Canucks say when we get to the end of the alphabet.

#6296 3 years ago
Quoted from Ricochet:

Z-flector proto 2 comes in tomorrow... I will have them made and tested this weekend. Yeah that’s right I’m calling it the “Zee”flector... instead of Deflector ‘cause I’m old and I find punny things funny.

I like it

#6297 3 years ago
Quoted from AaronZOOM:

Other than that, "zed" is just what us Canucks say when we get to the end of the alphabet.

And you're not the only ones ... that said I'm happy to go with Ricochet on this one and call it the zeeflector

#6298 3 years ago
Quoted from Manny65:

And you're not the only ones ... that said I'm happy to go with ricochet one this one and call it the zeeflector

Agreed. Let's hope he just isn't hit with a copyright strike from the creator of this thing:
https://www.amazon.nl/LEEDA-L1004-Leeda-Rig-Flector/dp/B00EX4MOI0

#6299 3 years ago
Quoted from AaronZOOM:

Agreed. Let's hope he just isn't hit with a copyright strike from the creator of this thing:
amazon.com link »

Hahahah!

#6300 3 years ago
Quoted from pingod:

I'm back in the club.
Didn't want to sell the last one.
This one is staying for good
Same owner for the last 19 years.
Already tearing it down for a good cleaning, topside first.
Looking for the Lior mods for it.
I had the ramp cover on my last one, and liked it.
Anyone looking to sell theirs.
[quoted image]

What are the Lior mods?

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Playfield - Protection
UpKick Pinball
Protection
From: $ 33.00
Gameroom - Decorations
Rocket City Pinball
Decorations
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