Each state holds (potentially) many tournaments over the course of the year. The players that outperformed all others in that collection of tournaments, get the option to play in the state finals. What isn't fair about that?

so state championships should have nothing to do with people that live in the state? If its a NV state championship and someone from california that only went to nevada twice all year wins the tournament then it wasnt a state championship in my opinion. Maybe just do zones if the state lines are too hard to enforce but i dont see why it would be.

In the top 16 in FL there are 7 people from FL, 2 people unkown, and 7 people from out of state. Thats no where near 90%+.

No. They should have everything to do with who played in the events. Maybe it should be called "Championship of pinball tournaments held in Arizona"?

What if I lived in Cortez Colorado, but played events in AZ because they were closer. I win all the major events, but can't play in any SCS because of where my house is located?

NV either needs to have more events, or not hold an SCS. One of those options encourages more players and events, the other doesn't.

State boundaries are already arbitrary, but at least it's an easy thing to administer (and is more clear from a marketing perspective, and gives you roughly 50 players which is a nice amount to have for a playoff at the next level). Time zones? I guess it's just going to be a playoff of NYC Superleague players then. No matter where you draw the line, someone is going to have problems.

that would make a lot more sense. When i was in high school and went to the "State championships" i only played against other teams from my state.

What "State Championships" in any sport is open to other states? Maybe it happens but not in anything ive ever played to my knowledge.

He said the "SCS fields"...which means: people who actually played in the event.

You know that nearly all of those out of staters in FL will be playing in other states, right?

All I know is that if anyone calls out a hit on Bob Matthews they're going to be in a world of hurt from SoCal!

doesn't that mean the top 16? As of right now we have no idea who is and isnt playing?

So atleast 7 people that dont live in FL got an invite to the FL state championships. Maybe 9 depending on where the other two unknowns live. They should be skipped right over and given the top 16 in FL the chance to play for the FL state championship.

This is what i was thinking, not changing the name obviously but to help people understand it.

Hey my horse doesn't have registration papers.

http://www.ifpapinball.com/tournaments/scs/state_registration.php?s=fl

that would technically be a much more appropriate name for what the SCS is.

His 90% reference was specifically in relation to the actual players who attended the SCS.

In 2014, the PAPA Circuit finals was held in Colorado, as well as the IFPA Worlds. And the Lyons Spring Classic was a few days before that. The Colorado standings was primarily people from out of state (and out of country). Exactly ZERO players from out of state played in the SCS. I was the first alternate to the top 16 even though my final ranking was somewhere in the 40s. It's a very common situation for states that have huge events that draw players from afar.

And much more dumb, and less catchy, and stupid.

And lame.

I don't see where the name SCS means people that live in the state.

well yes, but sometimes Ill take correct over sounding stupid

We should just make a cool abbreviation, and then it can be awesome again.

Just common practice in all other sports that calling something a state championship means it is based on people/cities/schools/etc... from the state.

For example all high school sports had state championships and in order to compete your school had to be in the actual state.

i.e. teams from WI and IL border towns commonly compete against each other during a season for HS sports, but they can only play in a single state championship and that has to be the one for the state they reside in.

Doesnt SCS mean "State Championship ..."? what does a state championship mean to you? What other state championships are open to other states?

It's actually 100%

1 Sebastian Bobbio
2 Jeff Palmer
3 Atticus Palmer
4 Joe Geneau
5 Dan Coyle
6 Ron Donohue
7 Kurt van Zyl
8 Brian Dominy
9 Carlos Porta
10 Kirby Rients
11 Carl Reedy
12 Joel Cohen
13 Jim Beam
14 Shannon Stafford
15 Cody Miller
16 Michael Lipof

Every one of those 16 players competing for the right to be crowned the Florida State Champion is from Florida. There's literally a 0% chance the winner comes from out of state.

I also would feel really bad implementing this rule for Grant Mortensen who is from Arkansas. Talk about getting shafted

Yeah sure but this is pinball and we're not in high school. I know in other niche competitive events, they have state championships that are open to anybody to participate.

Our calendar requires the full address of each tournament, and then that ends up being filtered into the state in which it's located for the SCS standings.

So there's nothing really "fuzzy" about where things are drawn up. You would literally have to just lie about the location of the tournament in order to somehow get it to count for Kentucky (and then hope that none of the players report that fact to us)

was going off info i had. if you want to get technical then texas has less than 90%+ as 2 people are playing from out of state and 2 are unknown.

So how is that fair to the texas people who now have to play the 40th ranked person when the best person in texas is only ranked at 58th.

This is 100% correct. You don't need to look any further then the first statement on our website explaining what the SCS is all about:

"The IFPA is proud to present the IFPA State Championship Series. The IFPA will be tracking the WPPR performance of players by results from each state within the US. At the end of each calendar year, the top 16 players with the most WPPR points from each state will qualify for that state’s IFPA State Championship."

so how is it state championships if you dont have to live in the state??

In that case you should be able to qualify for all the state tourneys and play in them all. Says nothing about that in your statement. From your first statement this would be allowed.

Maybe if you had to declare what state you are in the running for at beginning of the year. That would solve the distance problems and also solve the cherry pickers that qualify for multiple states and cherry pick the easiest tourney in their mind. You should never be able to qualify for 2 state championships.

There are many state championships for niche competitive events that are open to people out of state. TCGs like Magic and Pokemon. Smash Bros. Those have more in common with pinball than High School sports.

Actually Mark Meserve I believe is from Austin . . . so we're at a 94% success rate for Texas . . . NEXT!

The Bob Matthews/Jason Werdrick situations are literally '1 off' situations for very few states every year. To me that's simply not material enough to warrant a change that ends up screwing even more people over that only qualify in 1 state that isn't their home state.

It's fair because Bob earned his Texas points . . . wait for it . . . IN TEXAS! He was the second best player IN TEXAS with respect to WPPR points earned in the state.

What wouldn't be fair is if Bob worked all year in Texas, didn't qualify anywhere else, and then was forced to sit out the SCS.

Maybe he meant the "original" top 16 prior to declarations.

Actually i was talking about bob from cali and steve from new york.... so we are back to less than 90%+ rate for Texas unless you have bad info out there going straight from your site.... NEXT

Make him pick his state at the beginning of the year is the only fair way. It isnt fair for others to have one person qualify for 20 different STATE tournaments.

Fine . . . I guess I'll post the next sentence on our SCS homepage:

"All IFPA State Championships will be held on the Saturday following Super Bowl Sunday, with the 2015-16 IFPA State Championships scheduled for February 13, 2016. With all of the IFPA State Championships being held on the same day, no player will be eligible to compete for multiple IFPA State Champion titles, however it is possible for someone to qualify for an IFPA State Championship in a state in which they do not live in."

Declare what state at the beginning of the year, for a state championship where you don't know where the location is yet. And what about new players who don't even exist yet in the beginning of the year? If a new player wins a tournament in December and qualifies for that state, would they not be eligible because they didn't declare 11 months earlier?

I'm sure he did

Ultimately the issue people have with this lack of residency rule is someone being crowned the STATE CHAMPION that doesn't like in the state.

I wanted to make sure we're all on the same page that there is a 0% chance of that happening in Florida this year, so it's a non-issue.

Damn I missed Steve! Check-mate . . . SCS rules will be changed for 2016-17

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Understood. Everyone on the declared Florida SCS list lives in Florida. I would be proud to have anyone on that list represent our state

I think this depends on the purpose of what you're trying to accomplish.

Your argument two years ago was that players would see they are 60th in the standings, and then be motivated to not compete anymore. Versus if they knew they were actually '19th', they would be more motivated to compete.

If you reach out to players, even in an unofficial capacity, you'll get the answers you need. I knew Bob was going to Texas a while ago, and I'm sure he wouldn't have cared to share that with the TX State Rep if they asked for anything 'unofficial', or any of the other states looking to ping Bob on where he is leaning.

At some point if Bob refuses to give up that information, then he's taking this far too seriously and we can call him out on PINSIDE to let the verbal thrashing begin (in the basement of course) . . . with only Aurich around to defend him

It's a shame you and Atticus are on the same side of the bracket! No Palmer Final! (That happened to Zach and I last year for IL)

I screwed up and forgot to let Josh know I wanted to play in IL - mostly b/c it was the state I was the highest in, and it would be fun to give him a chance to avenge Expo, which I am certain he would since he's hosting

Bob told me he wants to compete in as many different SCSs as he can which I think is fine if he or anyone else earns it based on the rules of how it's set up now

I'm below the cut for KY, but not blaming the system for that. Josh and the IFPA have obviously worked super hard to get things where they are and it's obvious they have thought of just about everything. I'm definitely going to do my best to increase tournaments in my state and also do a hell of a lot better in my state's one event to hopefully represent KY next year.

Happened last year also Atticus and I played to game 7 in the semifinals. It came down to his last ball on Bad Cats as player 2 where he barely beat me with a 250K curiosity spin. We were cracking up meowing and acting silly waiting for the "award". The way we had it figured, one of us was going to be competing in the finals which was good all around. Best loss ever!

As the Texas IFPA State Representative, I welcome Bob to our event. Bob consistently attends the two major Texas events. He has earned the right to participate.

So as far as I am concerned, it is fair to every participant in the Texas Event.

We respect Bob, and many of us enjoy playing with him at the Texas Pinball Festival and Houston Expo.

Bob earned his points in Texas and those points were enough to earn a spot in the event.

And even with Bob's tremendous pinball talent, he will be earning his victory should he win the Texas State Championship. Bob is no stranger to the Texas field of players. He has not chosen the easy path this year. Bob has tasted victory and defeat in Texas. So in my mind, it is completely fair.

Marcus

What if I put in Chuckwurt's address, but left a GOTO statement in his driveway....

It's a bummer for border towns but no big deal. I'm liking the regional thing though... maybe eventually a new system on top of SCS

Ok, so here you go... first stab at regional based pinball conferences! Tried to group contiguous areas where it seems people tend to congregate and travel within. Obviously not perfect but what the hey for quick first draft. Apologies to neighbors to the north... Cuyahoga, Flint and Kalamazoo, oh my...

Flame away!

pinconf_(resized).png

Sounds like we'll need a public council to make sure there's no gerrymandering

well, when you register for ifpa, you could have people pick a state to represent....I'd still play Missouri since im 12 miles from the border, but that would fix it. make the registered player pick a state. If they move, they can change their state effective the next calendar year. or hell, leave it the way it is and deal with it. I don't think it's a huge issue, but yeah some people do pick easier routes to the national championship.

SCS is like the Olympics. While the majority of participants stick to their countries for national pride, there are a handful of crossover situations every year... Russians on the U.S. team, Chinese on the Russian team, etc.

it really would be that simple...

And would be a huge improvement.

I question what is the more desired reasoning:

1. Request players denote the state they are playing for by a specific date each year that is before the end of the season >> results in everyone having the ability to accurately gauge play and desire while the season is actually still occurring. This has the net result of MORE playing the last few months. People looking to get in and also people looking to jockey position for which bracket they play through.

2. Allow everyone to pick state after the whole season is over >> results in some players picking the easiest route through to the nationals. Detracts from the camaraderie of regional based competition. Provides a clear advantage to people that are capable (financially and work life balance) to travel and qualify in multiple state.

I will say one of these passes the stink test way easier.

I also tend to not like pinball that favors cash/life ability over just plain competition. One of the things I like about competitive pinball is the low barrier to entry in order to play. This is a big reason I have personally ensured that the majority of events held in WI are only coin drop and gas to get there. Keeping the advantages low for those that are more privileged is a good thing fro the sport in the long term. I know it does not impact many of the people on here, but trust me that some of the competitive players in our state are pretty cash strapped and don't have the ability to qualify in other states based on the barrier to entry (side bar: the majority of our SCS players chipped in for additional set of trophies for 1-16 finish but I know 1 person specifically did not have the extra discretionary funds) . Making it more fair for these people to play towards a SCS would be a good thing for the sport.

As a native Kentuckian, I must Object to the proposed Region name: " Cheese Coney Conference" How about, ""Bourbon Conference""

How about based within for example 150 mile radius of your home address?

Still not a fan.

I register as Illinois in my profile on January 1st.

I find out in July that we are planning on having CP Pinball host the State Championship, and find out its Milwaukee's turn to host the WI championship.

I don't think it's fair for me to be penalized by being forced to spend money on gas and a hotel to travel to the St Louis area versus being able to choose to take an hour day trip north to Milwaukee (assuming I've earned the right to do so based on my play).

I'd also rather give players choices to make their lives easier (logistically, financially, etc) based on whatever variables impact them, then ever telling them to "deal with it".

Like Gene said he earned his highest SCS seed in Illinois, his home state is California, but ended up choosing Nevada. IMO whatever reason he felt to choose what he did is something he earned. If that meant him choosing to want to come to my house for deathmatch 2.0 I would have been ready!

I'm telling you this can definitely be done in an unofficial capacity to much success.

I know because I did exactly this for IL

Seriously give it a shot next year. Just message me for email addresses and I can send them to you easily.