Holy shit did this thread back fire on this guy.

Haha whoops

And that is exactly how it should go if a distributor has them in stock….but when they don’t and you buy anyway it can be a wait for the next run of games.

Yeeeep!!!!
Maybe we were a little harsh but others spoke the truth regarding shipping…..it’s a crap shoot as others have shared and his expectation was not realistic. More important than how long shipping takes is no damage….those are the worst issues regarding shipping. Claims can be a nightmare to deal with.

Yeah I get his frustration too - it's always exciting getting new pins and it feels like it takes forever for these to arrive (b/c sometimes it does) but I'm so thankful once I know they're not damaged that the rest doesn't matter. Costs are continuing to just shoot up but the same can be said for literally everything right now.

Uh oh, cargument. Same thing happens when shipping cars cross country. At least the pins are more protected.

I have had 11 games shipped for me in the last 2 years. Different shippers and all had about 5-10 days wait to schedule the pickup and approx 7 days later to receive it on the other end. It is a little slower now with COVID but only by around 2 days on average extra in a COVID world.

Personally, if a game was only around 500 miles away, I would have just made the road trip myself. I have driven over 800 miles to pickup a game in the past.

For collector cars/restorers/flippers they will use an enclosed trailer/truck shipper depending on the value of the car. There are shippers that do specialize in that. It’s not as expensive as you would think. We cry at $300-600 for games but 1K-2K or so depending on distance is probably cheap for a car…..specifically referring to collector cars if you can afford $30K-500K a couple grand for shipping is just part of the cost.

And think about the shipping costs for overseas collectors….there are people with money all over the world that buy/sell and have expensive/rare collectibles shipped…..imagine the cost/time/risk involved in those purchases. But people do it every day.

STI/Belchman suck. 2 for 2 earlier this year they decided my games should be thrown down a mountain before I play them

I put in a claim and ended up selling the games and just giving up because they NEVER got back to me

Dealt with Bianchi many times before with no issue but this was seriously disappointing

Cab was hammered, backless was shattered, speaker grill was just loose in the truck and more

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I mean come on....the less you can play a SF2 the better; they did you a favor.

I kid

Wow!!! Your game was even palleted an that crap happened. My gripe with Beltmann is it is very inconsistent on who picks up the game and how well they blanket or wrap it if at all. Some do a great job at blanket and wrapping and some can't get it on the truck quick enough and don't care.

You have a valid complaint!

It’s just amazing some have no issues and others have damage that make you say WTF. One that comes to mind is the guy that received a damaged TBL….that was a great example of shipping gone wrong. There is a thread if anyone cares for the details…pretty interesting actually.

One time it took them a 5 weeks just to pick up a game, due to bad weather, problems coordinating with the seller and it was a in a rural area. This doesn't necessarily mean rural by our standards, just means they don't have as many pickups or drops in that area. It wouldn't be feasible for them to drive 100-200 miles for one item, or our costs go up. Sometimes you have to look outside of your perspective and understand why a business runs the way it does.
All this covid stuff with fuel costs, labor shortages etc. probably aren't helping logistics either.
The game will come eventually.

I've had really bad experiences with normal freight companies, but never had an issue with STI. And I've used them at least 30-40 times.

never pick up when promised, never deliver when promised. just gotta play their game.

Looking at that second picture- corner board, one blanket and shrinkwrap? Seriously that’s hardly protected- you shouldn’t be able to see that game at all. Should be blackest wrapped all of the way around with corner board under and on top or blankets then shrink wrapped. And that’s before STI shows up and they wrap over what you have already done. I’ve shipped several games now zero issues.

Moving blankets are cheap at harbor freight. You can go to a grocery or big box retailer and get corner board for free from them- comes on pallets modules of detergents, paper products, etc. they just bale it. Shrink wrap from hardware store. $50 can significantly protect your game before the shippers come and wrap it as well.

Having a pinhead on both ends of the journey really helps too... If the sender does a decent wrap prior to the shipper arriving, and then demands (in your name) it be wrapped AGAIN once the shipper arrives, now that is one well protected machine.

What you have to watch out for is when they say "we don't wrap it here, we take it back to the depot and wrap it there before putting it on a truck..." which is code speak for "throw a shipping blanket over it and ratchet strap it to the truck" so don't let them leave until it is properly wrapped if you are looking for NO damage.

A proper pallet is essential too. That damage in the last set of photos looks like it could have been avoided if they would have used a pallet that supported the cabinet corners, which is the reason they got f-ed up IMO.

The below tl;dr method is offered for the sake of the lives of pinball machines everywhere... its time consuming and it requires more resources but it has never failed me.

I recommend a 5/8 plywood platform screwed on top of oak skids and centering strips screwed on all four sides to prevent shifting.

Ratchet strap the shrink wrapped head down to the corner boarded and shrink wrapped cabinet using corner boards.

When shrink wrapping the cabinet, center the four legs, duct taped together with cardboard between them and with leg bolts bagged and duct taped to that, in the center of the cabinet bottom.

Stand the machine on its shipping buttons and place a piece of cardboard on the pallet.

Center machine on pallet, and run ratchet strap from underneath pallet, over machine using corner boards on cabinet edges, then back under the pallet. DO NOT run ratchet straps under pallet skids to prevent abrasive separation of the straps, and always run straps parallel to the skids.

Tighten straps so machine and pallet become solid and machine will not rock back and forth. Wrap with shipping blankets and either duct tape them in place, or do a second shrink wrap.

Now, if there is ANY damage after you do all that, then I would stop using that carrier too, but so far this packing method has transported numerous machines thousands of miles for me damage free.

i love the grammar detectives on pinside you come of so douchie. is that a word GD's?

I think you mean "come OFF", not "come of".
; )

see what i mean? you a rat and fell in da trap

Yeah it came like they found it on a street corner and just threw it in the truck and managed to somehow find my house. I mean the corners look like they were testing out sledge hammers and how effective they are against wood. The back glass was broken, the front of the coin door was pushed in etc. The thing is the guy that sold it to me did the packing you see and STI did NOTHING to add. They saw it had a little bit of protection and said fuck it, were good boys! Lets see how many times we can let it fall off the truck before it explodes! A common competition sporting event they play

I mean I’m sure it got broken in transport, but I do have some questions about the corner damage. Do you think seller knew that damage was there and didn’t disclose to you? It’s weird to me how that would happen when it’s sitting on a pallet and has (a crappy) cover on it. Plus it’s exactly where the legs would go so you wouldn’t see it with the legs on. And you can see that where the leg ends, a piece of the cover is broken off and the plywood is exposed and repainted blue. So there must have been some damage there previously that seller (or someone who had it before) knew about and touched up.

I've had a couple games shipped but that was long ago, I only get games I can see and pick up myself.

And yeah, I've done the 1200 mile round trip in one day thing, s/e Michigan to Brooklyn, NY and back in 16 hours, a personal best so far.

But I've driven 600 - 900 miles round trip on several games, very few are local unfortunately LOL. Game in Chicago? No problem! Be back tonight, honey!

Everyone has their own level of personal discomfort, but if you consider the time out of your life, the risk of vehicular accidents, the gas, the wear and tear on your vehicle, food, lodging, etc. it's a hard sell to go pick up a game yourself if it's more than a day trip. $500 is real money but if you subtract the above expenses it's probably more like $250. I know people who own $250 pairs of shoes.

When I have a game delivered, I make sure the driveway is clear. I make sure the sidewalk is swept. I make sure I am ready to receive the game with the minimum amount of fuss for the drivers. I have the payment ready and I give them a $20 bill, too, as long as they get the machine indoors in one piece.

The other tip when having a machine shipped is make daily use of the tracking number, at least until the machine is picked up. Don't be a pain, but if it isn't picked up within 3 days...call and remind them that you love them, etc. On my last machine, they 'lost' the order in their system. If I hadn't called, who knows how many days would have been lost?

Those are all great points and I did consider them. However the game was actually not on the pallet when they delivered it. It was sitting on the floor of the truck next to the pallet. Plus the glass was broken, coin door was pushed in and the sub speaker cable was ripped out and pinched along with a few other things. So its hard to say but it certainly looked consistent with it being thrashed around by the shipper considering none of those things were in the listing pics

I use white glove, legs on service with Beltman on MANY machines and never had an issue. I supervise wrapping if I'm the shipper, and ask the seller to do the same. Zero problems. WAY better odds than when I used to pallet and sometimes crated them, when I did have occasional minor claims.

But that's only for long haul shipments. For within CA and some NV and AZ, I use Sly Fox shipping. Chris is about half the Beltmann rates and even better service.

This is how Beltman wrapped the last pin I shipped out. Delivered fine. Again.

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so...I was just curious what shipping rates are on a machine? I'm new to the addiction and I see so many that I would love to purchase on the East coast yet here I am in Oregon.

I am sure there's MANY variables but are we talking $500 or $2500?

$500 give or take depending on if you need them to go up stairs or not

I’d say 600 through STI/Beltman. Contact Michelle at [email protected]

Used to be around $500 pretty reliably for coast to coast, but creeping up past $600 for legs on white glove with Michelle/STI these past couple years. Last one I did from east coast to CA a few months ago was just shy of $650.

this may be true, its been a few years since I've shipped anything

Just completed my fourth shipment with STI/beltman, everything went perfect, no issues, no problems. Alabama to California, took just under 2 weeks.
All good. I think the op had expectations too high.
Will use them again.
B

Question, When receiving a game do you guys typically make the drivers stick around while you unwrap it and inspect for damage? has anyone ever found damage after the driver has left and tried to make a claim and had success collecting?

I had time to cut things open and look whilst they were putting the handcart away and getting the paperwork. Basically I was just looking for gouges and broken glass.

I started unwrapping when they were here still but everything looked good so I wasn't stressed. Tipped the driver, he was cool, remembered me from the last one.
B

This is the second result on Google, when searching for Beltmann/ STI, and it really worried me.

It's a couple years later, and logistics in general are a lot better. The machine arrived fine after about two weeks (I think?). I didn't have expectations of something super speedy. I didn't ever feel like I was in the dark, though.

Anywho, they worked great for me. It was really nice to have them just move it into the room I wanted, over having it dropped out front on a pallet, as was the case with my only other machine. It seemed to save the seller a lot of hassle, too.

When they pickup are they wrapping immediately or saying we will pack at our warehouse ?

I just want to chime in with my shipping experiences. First hate to admit it but Beltmann/STI is the best we have got based on over 100 pins shipped with various companies. Secondly, a few weeks delay is nothing. My last game from Beltmann took nearly 3 months, but it arrived in perfect condition. I have yet to find anything reliably faster. If somebody were to start a shipping company that charged reasonable rates, communicated with shipping parties and provided insurance for when things do go astray, they would easily take over all shipping business. Beltmann did provide better service and communication before covid and I think they use covid as an excuse to allow their service to go down hill, but the fact is they are still the best.

I have shipped about 10 games total with UShip. Here are some of the worst from Uship. One of them the driver stole the game was only recovered with some amazing luck and great people helping out on pinside (see TMNT thread), another time the pin was not properly covered on a cross country trip and was dripping wet when it arrived, the last delivery from uship the driver arrived at 11:30 PM after scheduling a 5:00 pm drop off.

I have had about 10 games shipped with FedEx over the years. Mostly good, but I can't ship out with them as I don't have a commercial account. The worst indecent was a pin was left out on edge of my driveway 5 hours earlier than delivery time scheduled with no notification in the middle of winter. I came home in time before the snow ruined it and nobody drove up loaded it in their truck and took off with it luckily.

Most of my pins have been shipped with Beltmann and the worst issues I have are delays, rude drivers, more delays, temporarily lost pins, and lack of communication. I have had some minor nicks and scrapes, but nothing worth filling out a claim so not sure how much of a pain they are with claims.

Shipping sucks! The best option is to go pick up the game if you can.

I don't understand the 'white gloves' comments...when I've had Beltman ship a game for me, they only offer one price/service. They have never indicated any optional attention or service. They do arrive, unload the game, and bring it inside (ground floor) but no one is wearing white gloves or doing anything special.

last one i had shipped to me they crushed it. never even recieved the game. game went missing in action for about 3 weeks, they never contacted me or the shipper.

I've had no issues having shipped about 10 games so far with legs on.

They have always said oh we will wrap at the warehouse,Is this the case for anyone else ?

Every time I’ve shipped with STL/Beltman I’ve had zero issues. Are people really shipping these things with the legs on and hoping these package slamming gorillas are going to take care of it?
Here’s a pic of the last pin I had them pick up for a buyer. I made it so simple they literally thanked me.
Saying most of the time people expect them to wrap and protect these things. I can’t imagine entrusting people who have absolutely zero skin in the game to care if this gets to you safe 3 or 4 drivers down the road before the buyer even sees it.
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Honestly, I've had more issues with games on pallets vs legs on.

Sounds like pure luck.

Anytime forklifts are involved, accidents happen. Its always been forklift damage for me.

That’s why a solid pallet is your friend.
Imagine expecting people in a poorly ventilated terminal full of truck exhaust moving hundreds of pallets and parcels and then they come across your pinball, legs on, wrapped with blankets. You think they care enough to carefully move it to the next shipping container? They care about how quickly they can move it.
Maybe I just have trust issues but I don’t believe any of these people care one bit how these look when they arrive.
At least not as much as you or I do.
I wrap anything I ship like 20 foot tall babies are moving it around. I’ve never had to file a claim for anything.

Lol, they’ve been shipping games on the legs for 20 years. I’ve had easily 75 machines in and out over the years this way. The worst thing I have encountered was a bent leg, which was promptly replaced. Pallets, on the other hand? I’ve had far fewer experiences overall and I can think of 4 or 5 that were stabbed with a fork. This is a specialty shipping company that deals in shipping unusual and valuable items. It’s literally their job to be careful and concerned how it arrives. To boot, we are dealing with the coin-op division here. They know what they are doing, and the proof is in their ubiquitous use and history of repeat use here. Use them or don’t. I’ll stick with what my 20 years of moving pins has shown me.

Great work. Would buy from you! I wrap mine the same way for shipment.

But you trust them to correctly and carefully operate a forklift?

More items have been damaged in shipping by an incompetent forklift driver who was in a hurry, than by anything else.

Also, if you are going to palletize and entomb the game, then you really don’t need white glove service.

Nope. They wrap in my garage or driveway and I supervise and photograph as they layer it up. I'm sure they're not thrilled, but 100% success rate shipping quite a few legs-on pins this way. I'd never let one leave unwrapped.

Here's pics from one of them...

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Yeah I used to wrap them before they came. This is a mistake. They need to note condition before wrapping.