Only if Stern created the withdrawal code. Then I'd have several years of free play before it was actually implemented.

Ugggh.

It doesn't matter how much the game costs to build or if PP had to do the R&D or if it simply bought the blueprints. The fact is, someone (Williams) spent money on R&D testing and code etc...

It might have cost less money back then or it might have been paid for over more games as Williams was selling way more games. But the point is, we don't have to pay PP less because someone else already did the work.

For explmple, if Apple sold the patents or design to XYZ phone company to build an iPhone, and XYZ phone company could make the phone for $99 but comparable phones are selling for $599. There is no obligation for XYZ to sell the phone at the lowest possible price, they can sell it for what it's worth which is determined by how many people are willing to pay whatever amount for it. If they charge too much people won't buy them.

I don't think anyone is debating what you HAVE to pay PP. I think what they are saying is what they could sell the game for and still make money..

8K was my absolute max and even at that I'm staggering a bit over the cost. Its really a 8.5k machine after shipping CC fees and such. I'm actually embarrassed to tell people what I paid for it. For 6-6.5k I would have been completely satisfied over the purchase with no buyers remorse whatsoever. I'm expecting the quality to be top notch for the cost and that is the expectation you set when you ask a premium price tag. Its now on PPS to deliver a rock solid pin with no corners cut anywhere or there will be riots in the streets.

8 for MMR seemed reasonable for some reason. I know $8500 and I would have thought long and hard and would have passed, Seems they had it priced right for me. I have high expectations for quality. I assume PPS wants to keep printing money by knocking out knock offs so they have to deliver on it.

I agree. For me, for MM, I'd rather pay $8K and expect and get absolute primo quality across the board than pay $6.5K and have them cut some corners.

I know that paying $8K doesn't mean I'll get and excellent quality product, but in my head I can expect it.

It is probably 8k because they did a cost analysis and found the current market is almost double that for a "mint" machine. So it sounds like a deal. Would I rather pay less? f ya. But since the stupid market brought the machine up to 10-12k or more for a "players" machine, this is a good deal (as crazy as that sounds).

People posted rumored MM to be 6k and everyone chimed in they would pay 8. Bammo!!!

If this speculation that MMR is priced so because it can be sold, than likely BBB would be same cost or a bit more but other Williams titles should be cheaper.

Never played mm really, maybe a couple balls on a beat up unshopped machine at the Winston salem auction in 2003. I think it went for 4K. I thought it was overpriced... Lol. Watching the papa vids and the promo, I can see why it's so popular.

I 'like' how the OP starts this thread then adds a sales pitch and bounces.
That's the dude I want to take my money.

X10....I was thinking the same thing. It was supposed to be 6-7K and then a couple of neophytes got over enthused and bang we have an 8k remake.

Worth what we charge you.gif

Really Nibbles? Nothing new to add? I've never clicked "IGNORE" before, but...

^Why not charge $10k? You could have expected to get solid gold armor and "spared no expense"... you have to dream/spend big, to live big.

Spared no expense.jpg

Looks like all 1000 to me, all at Expo for more money. His Patience paid off it appears.

All great news for all involved. Very happy for everyone

Bill

Another one bites the dust on my list!

Getting pretty close to trolling here Nibbles. Most here know how you stand on this one now please just let it go and let others discuss.

"It could conceivably be a game that resurrects this industry."

Yea...but who would have thunk over 16 years later?

MM is the only game of 52 sold that I would like to get back. My strategy is to wait until the dust settles and some folks (with originals or repros) get tired of the game when they see most of their buddies have one to play as well. If it doesn't work out - I'll buy another title. Last one I bought was pretty nice for $6.75K so lets see how close we can get to that (eventually)

Scott

Im with you on this Dude. CC 8k...I will take it. MB 8k SOLD!! BBB 8K now where do i put this...

To Honch, You rate Fish Tales over MM so we are not on the same level. Nuff said. A shirt has nothing to do with how I spend my money.

Umm, I was referring to Wayne's MM's, not PPS's.

LTG : )

There will be a guy who rated MM a 1 and then when he receives his MMRLE it will be changed to a 10. Guaranteed.

I know My reply was appropriate, they are one and the same MM

Anyone who rates MM at 1.0 (<5.0 for that matter) is clearly just trying to manipulate the rankings or make a point.

I'm pretty sure that was my point. Then when they finally get their hands on a new one for $8K they rate it a 10.

well, i think these people are a small enough minority that they can be comfortably ignored. there's enough negativity around here without inventing more classes of people to disdain.

My mother would never let me drop a teacher from grade school to high school because she wanted me to have to deal with all kinds of people. Just ignoring people will not work at your place of employment, public forums, etc.

It's part of life.

Damn it how dare people actually like their newly acquired pins more than they thought they did in past ratings!! Just joking around egg.

I know Dude...you're awesome man!

So is anyone else gonna get to play the proto and offer opinions?

Just taught my son this lesson. Then a month later the teacher gets fired. HA!

Or maybe even before he gets it.
10 by Christmas.

Works great on public forums, at work not so much.

th-20.jpeg

I didn't take notice til you pointed it out. Pretty funny!

Well, I was invested in MM at $4500, and it wasn't even worth that to me to keep it. So there's that. Fun wise, it's probably a $2500-3000 game. (meaning the fun factor is equal to games in the price point.)

MM is ok....no Scared Stiff....but ok....

I had an SS and just couldn't get into it. To each their own I guess. I personally found Scared Stiff BORING.

It's no Fish Tales, I'll admit that

In all seriousness I'd agree, but $3000 that's about my maximum budget. If I could have any machine for XXX price it would probably be a MM. I like the theme, humor, toys, etc. My biggest complaint about it would be the rules. In some ways it's pretty simplistic.

I actually thing fun factor vs price is something worth discussing. I defiantly wouldn't put MM near the top of that list. What game(s) would be near the top your fun factor vs price list?

If your not into horror or Elvira, I can see where it may become a little flat for you. I love both, so to me its a great game.

As you said...to each their own. I enjoy SS more than MM or AFM.

Never thought I'd hear the words "Elvira" and "flat" in the same sentence...

I'm with you on this one. Love the theme, the art, the callouts, the dots, the spider... but in the end the game is just too easy IMO. The TPA verision is RIDICULOUSLY easy, and the real thing it still not that much more difficult. The first time I played a real one after playing the TPA version, it took me all of three games to get and clear the Stiff-O-Meter.

A modular design like you are describing has advantages and disadvantages like everything. Sure, less wiring is certainly an advantage. However, you lose reliability with all the additional connections. It almost sounds like there will be no diagnostic system at all (if it is modular like you describe). Can you elaborate on the diagnostic system(s) at all?

The new boards have less components so they produce less heat, this fact alone makes them much more reliable. Remember the home appliances from 20 years ago? The TVs,VCRs and PCs, remember how often they used to break? The old stuff was easier to repair but not more reliable. The diagnostics will be the same, switch rows and columns sort of like WOZ.

*fewer* components, less heat...

Back on-topic: Will the lighting be the same lamp matrix or will it be converted to a serial-addressed lighting system?

Yes and agreed!!!

I don't think you understand the advantage/disadvantage dynamic. The components are simply "spread out" in a modular design. There are less components on "the main board" or "driver board" or "head of the machine". They are instead, placed in the cabinet or under the playfield. This system has distinct advantages AND disadvantages over what companies like Stern produce.

This "advantage" you point out is not necessarily true. The heat is simply spread out better, not reduced or eliminated. The heat in the head is certainly changed/moved. However, it is only reduced if the power/transistors/coils/boards are more efficiently designed. Again, if they are better, that's great. I would like to also know the disadvantages. With new design, always comes new cost/diagnostics/reliability concerns.

Correct me if I'm wrong but is there is no such thing as a pinball machine that never breaks or requires service? I've never seen one in my life.

Unfortunately, a "NEW WAY" Solid State concept regarding the engineering of the pinball transistor/coils that "makes the magic happen" has not come to light in my lifetime. Sure, things have gotten better and more efficient (even with Stern) but you still have to have a cost effective way to mass produce a system to get those balls and coils do what you want them to do. I've seen technologies like pin2000 tried and fail. I am encouraged by JJ using a conceptually similar approach and, it seems to work very well for what they were trying to accomplish.

I am really curious to see if a modular design is successful. It is something I have ALWAYS thought about for years but have never really seen put in to practice until the last few years in pinball. (one-off custom pins come to mind)

Unless I'm missing something obvious here, please correct me.