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Apparently the mods gave up on this thread.

Any news on The Hobbit pin? I miss beezelboob's comments on that score.

Yea, can someone take this opportunity to give me sparknotes on:

1. Any drama/updates related to the Hobbit
2. Any drama/updates related to TBL
3. What the GoT complaints are?

CITIZEN'S THREAD EJECT!!!!

To ALL of you on Page 3 and 4, all of you!

Seriously? You should run for office. The big man upstairs isn't fooled.

I agree 100% and have had a similar experience.

Boob's lovin this sh#t........hi beelze....... ..............Joey

I just poured out some of my arizona iced tea for my homie Beelzeboob.

Well, after reading the thread that ended in his banning, I can't help but think it was worth it. The OP was instigating/trolling and I think it's twisting things to ban or eject somebody for directly pointing that out.

isn't ek the "pinhead" from the tom brady thread blackbeard? now i see this. that guy is awesome...

Yes. Same guy. Always antagonizing.

You have done an excellent job as a moderator. Honestly most of the moderators here are very fair IMO. There is literally only one mod who a number of people, definitely include me in that pool, who experienced a very bad mod. This mod seriously abused his power to support an agenda. I wish the mods would also police one another as one bad mod has a big impact on the site. I think people just dislike the moderation and not the moderators. There are ebbs and tides. Sometimes it turns into a free for all and other times, for short periods, it's a police state.

So to sum up, most good. One bad. Moderation is not a science. I like pinball!

pinside is a huge asset and privilege. i got booted from a thread where i was dishing it hard to one d-bag. i get it. what i did not get was that it said i had been warned via a message that i never received. when i asked i got crickets. i just wanted to be clear on the process. no biggie. these guys volunteer i think so we should cut them some slack.

Hi Robin,

I completely understand and support your desire to maintain a family friendly environment and I also get that it's important to maintain order and make the site inclusive for the masses - but seriously - if one "moderates" this venue to the point that it becomes a Nazi dictatorship where free speech is banned and people are booted for stating opinions that happen to differ from ones own - then eventually the moderators will enjoy the site alone.

BTW, (and I realize you know this or Pinside would not be as successful and popular as it has become) It is NOT the moderators who make this site great (and they ARE needed and help it to be so) but it is really the input and participation of the people from the community who participate in the discussions, provide the content, and yes even the drama at times. The participants of this site are the ones who make Pinside interesting and worth visiting.

The bottom line is that ANY business that forgets to LISTEN to the voice of the customer will not survive in the long term. Worse it is arrogant to ban supporters from what is essentially "social media" because they have an opinion that differs from that of a moderator.

I genuinely hope that I misunderstood or just missed something in the post where Beezle was booted - but it seemed to me that all he did was to state his opinion. Is that seriously against TOS here on Pinside?

As a private site one certainly has the right and the power to edit or delete posts and to issue bans - and conversely it is also the user's right to choose where she or he will patronize.

This post is not intended to challenge you or one of the moderators to ban me for stating my opinion - but it is intended to challenge you to think about and discuss the consequences heavy handed moderation will eventually have on the site overall.

I genuinely don't understand how this approach is good for Pinside or the community.

Overall - you and the moderators do a fabulous job and I genuinely appreciate your efforts to make Pinside an acceptable venue for all.

Example please.

way to set the tone for an open mind man

Sure, "IF" that ever happened. It's not.

Hey Boob-Meister, where you at?
What are you up to this weekend? Pinball or non-pinball activities planned?

***
Richmeister: Boob-yyy! The Boob-man! Boobatollah!

Beelzeboob: Hi, Richard. Just making some copies.

Richmeister: Alright! The Boob Old Opry, makin' copies!

Beelzeboob: It's nice to see you, too, Richard.

Richmeister: The Boobster! Boobly selected for your listening pleasure!

Beelzeboob: That's a new one. I like that one.

Richmeister: Boob-yy! Likin' the new one! The Great Boobino-o-o-o!

Beelze: Now, that one I've heard before. [ exits ]

Richmeister: The Boob-ipulator. Doesn't realize how hard it is coming up with new names. The Complain-meister! [ RD enters ] The Rotor-nator!

RD: Rich! The Richmeister!

Richmeister: RD, the Invisiscreen-arino!

RD: [ laughing ] What??

Richmeister: RrrrDee! The Davester!
***

I hate telling people "if you don't like it, go elsewhere". It's not in my nature. But please know this: all this negativity is really bumming me out.

What's more, it's in the way of innovation. There are so many cool plans waiting here at Pinside HQ, ready to grow the site and to help grow pinball around the world (our main mission). We have ideas for cool new sections, adding a social element, pinside app, a pinball quiz and much more. If some people weren't so harsh with how they criticise things, we might even have actual pinball designers and other folks from the biz posting here more often.

But all the constant negativity is weighing me down. Being critical is no problem. But you need to be respectful when you bring your opinion across. If you cannot bring yourself to do that, then maybe Pinside isn't for you.

What also annoys me is that some people here seem to think that the only right way of running this site is *their* way. People who say: "I have no problems with nudity - so it should be allowed here!". Truth is Pinside has quite a lot of members, some more vocal than others, and I want to try and accommodate all of them. That includes the largest part of Pinside, the lurking users (who rarely post). So if everyone could compromise a little bit, that would go a long way.

I've got some ideas cooking to hopefully *help* in this respect. But there is no perfect solution other than YOU being considerate towards other Pinsiders. But if you have a good idea to improve the site, an idea that goes beyond: "moderation sucks!" or "the mods are evil!" then by all means... PM me! I wish more people would step up and let me know what they think would improve the site in the long term. Not all ideas are executable or even good ideas, but you can at least let me know if you think you have one.

'nuff said. I hope Beelzeboob comes back soon, so you all realise he was just taking a break/holiday/whatever. Or maybe he was sick of posting online and is playing some pinball somewhere.

I get the feeling we're running in circles here and that I keep repeating things I've said before.

But I just want to quote this and emphasise that this is not what's happening. Having and stating an opinion that is different from mine, the moderators or popular consensus is obviously no problem. How else could this be a discussion forum?

The problem lies in the way that some people choose to bring their opinion across. Really all we're asking is that you do so without attacking the Pinsider whose opinion you disagree with. It's about respectful discourse.

We have community rules and guidelines that explain how we expect our guests to conduct themselves on Pinside. They exist to give as many people as possible the best experience we can; Not to annoy you or make your Pinside time miserable.

Good post Robin.

If you look at the people logged on, there are often 500 members and 300 guests reading Pinside. But I would say there are maybe 10-15 guys who are mega posters, 50 guys who post a lot, 50 who post occasionally and 50 who post rarely. And the large majority who never post at all.

^^ this ^^

This is the key.

If someone has a different opinion to yours, who cares? No reason to get your panties in a twist. Move on.

I've got a secret to share ... You don't get a prize for winning an argument on the Internet.

rd

Someone's been drinking.

rd

You gotta love a happy drunk though. Hilarious.

People Skills

According to the Portland Business Journal, people skills are described as:[1]

understanding ourselves and moderating our responses
talking effectively and empathizing accurately
building relationships of trust, respect and productive interactions.
A British definition is “the ability to communicate effectively with people in a friendly way, especially in business.”[2] The term is not listed yet in major US dictionaries.[3][4]

The term people skills is used to include both psychological skills and social skills, but is less inclusive than life skills

I really thought my post about my Playboy collection would be too much for Beezle to ignore. Now I am thinking he has been kidnapped.

Or his dog is having a really good meal...... ...............Joey

Well said

One word not used as much today as taught in the 60's....Courtesy.

Boobs favorite Video!

Absolutely true. If the 12 to 15 troublemakers would be gone, many of the "Lukers" would begin to post and get involved.

Oh that Mr. Bungle.

Courtesy is something I discuss as a concern with friends and colleagues all the time. People complain about the world being P.C. First, the term is misused and second ask yourself, is there something wrong with compassion? Don't think think of it as P.C., think of it as being inclusive. If you are the kind of person that thinks it's okay to talk crap about anything you don't agree with and that people should just 'deal with it' or 'laugh it off' perhaps you aren't used to being on the excluded end of courtesy or you weren't taught or didn't learn courtesy. What does it cost to be courteous?

This whole thread hasn't really been about beezleboob as much as it's been about some wanting Pinside to be like other places on the internet, Wild West Online. Robin, you aren't the only one the negativity has gotten to. Many people on other forums don't come here because of the negativity and it's everyone that loses on the added knowledge and experience of those who aren't here b/c of the negativity. Maybe a little "Everything I needed to know...Kindergarten" is in order.

Personally I think the ability to thumb's down someone's post has to go. It only breeds animosity towards others.

Make a bitching and complaining sub-forum, anything moved there does not show on the front page (you have to go look for it) - that way visitors won't see embarrassing threads and think pinball is a bunch of whiny negative people.

People that want to participate in the B&C threads can still go and have all of this fun.

Love the Lord of the Flies rework, Blondetall. So very appropriate.

I recently had an issue where the moderator and I settled it with four private messages. It wasn't completely to my satisfaction but who cares. (Note: Some of you people want to argue endlessly)

Bottom line for me is I support our moderators and this format. I've seen a lot of good things they've done but never get the affirmation.

The chronic public complainers that expect perfection, rather than work within the system, bore me.

Amen brother. I like to think we are the silent majority. I'm guessing more than 95% of Pinside members somehow avoid most of the drama, and really enjoy the site...but like life, there are always a few troublemakers.

Alas, I fear that the negativity will continue while threads like this one are around. Perhaps RTR has a good idea. Still, there's negativity in threads that belong on the front page. In Digitalhome.ca 's forums, posts that are irrelevant or inflammatory are deleted.

On a positive note, my 75 year old neighbour & I play a lot of pinball. He really likes it. I think it helps with his coordination & reflexes.

Edit: I like bacon too.

When I was in school, we were taught that "you can disagree with someone without being disagreeable" I've carried that all my life and it works very well. More of that needs to be used here on this forum....

Exactly. In my fumbling way, this is what I was proposing with my "Kaneda Members Only" thread. Moderators could tell people to take their off topic squabbles to a bitch thread and yell themselves into a black hole.

It is really only a matter of a small percentage that have learned a negative way of communicating, because it produces attention and that is what they want. It is as easy to hurt someone, and say, "free speech", "get thicker skin", "laugh it off".
Id rather see someone be empathetic and understanding, that if they have to type that often, or there is lots of negativity around your posts...it could be you, and not everyone else. It doesnt hurt to take a step back, and improve.

My passion for Pinball and my joy in this site, and the people here, cant ever by fully explained, but hopefully the hand full of people that create the drama, and have that way of communicating, might just put a more positive foot forward.

I know that I post only about half of what I type. Especially if its emotional. I try to remember to walk away, and come back and read it again and see if its appropriate.

To Boob....this thread is for you and your wife, that we miss you here. Robin I hear you. This is your site.
Moderators, not perfect, and people should stop expecting that. Thank you for the time you have volunteered to watch the classroom.
And to everyone else, Kumbaya, my life is complex and all of you, and Pinball, have given me more then I could have ever imagined.

It seems as though thing changed during the Bowen/nudity discussion and never recovered....mods started pushing a little harder to make those who were complaining about adult content feel more welcome and pinsiders who were happy with current conditions began to push back......now that time has passed those who are against all the extra moderation have really dug in and are still resisting change....unfortunatley a happy medium wont be reached, the site will be heavily moderated and some long time pinsiders who really are the nucleus of pinside will move on and what will be left will be a shell of its former glory.....its sad to watch it unfold.....I miss the old pinside as do a lot of us but those who built the site have the right to run it as they see fit.

I keep seeing mention made of "all the extra moderation". Aren't only about one in a thousand posts moderated?

The old Pinside? ....two years ago? I don't think that's the 'old' Pinside.

Keep in mind, there's also been a surge in membership/visitors.

When you have situations like Kevin Kulek and Jpop that have stolen $$$ in the Seven figure range from "Pinsiders", I'm not sure what you expect to happen.

98% of Pinside posting is "respectful". You'll never have 30,000 people act the way you want them to act and say it in a way you want them to say it, 100% of the time. That's life.

The people that post here have strong opinions one way or the other. I've stated a lot of time that there usually is "no right or wrong answer".

If the guys that post frequently like Boobie leave then what will the lurkers have to read?

For about 2000 posts a day. I don't think the site is being over moderated.

The thumbs down are nowhere near as bad as the posters that post some of the stupidest/malicious/pointed shit on here, and then put a smiley emoticon at the end of it, to signify they were "just joking" after being called out on it..... I really don't think the thumbs up/down thing is anything more than yes, I agree, and no, I don't agree....

As far as moderation goes, I think it only hurts Pinside in general to have the moderator complaints private. Transparency goes a long way into clearing the air, and often times, will save a lot of time and reduce the number of repeated issues as people can see why and how a decision was made.

True...but posts that were not moderated before are moderated now.....Look Im not against the additional moderation, Im not contemplating leaving because I can't post booby pictures.....and to be honest after re-reading my post about Bowen I'm not even sure what my point was...

It looks like soon all the fun people will be gone from this forum. And all that will be left are those that argue over nothing.

I hope not. Pinball folks are some of the best people (face to face). I met a great friend last year at Expo and we give each other all kinds of shit all the time, but we don't get all pissy about it when we disagree. Yeah, it's just pinball here, but in the end it is personal relationships that really matter. Make some good ones and don't push people away, even if you disagree. Life's too short.