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(Topic ID: 277661)

I'd like an explanation..I guess stealing is fine!


By flashinstinct

34 days ago



Topic Stats

  • 51 posts
  • 26 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 30 days ago by ralphs007
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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    There are 51 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.
    #1 34 days ago

    Do you guys notice something similar to these two sets?
    I do believe I need an explanation from tnts.

    Seriously who does this? And then sells copies on Ebay?
    ebay.com link » No Good Gofers Pinball Machine Laminated Ramp Flag Decals

    IMG_20200918_130507 (resized).jpgs-l5002 (resized).jpg

    #2 34 days ago

    Have you reached out to him directly?

    #3 34 days ago

    yes on ebay. Gave me the "I don't know what you are talking about I made these designs 10 years ago!!!" So I just checked to see if he was on Pinside. I'll let him explain himself here.

    #4 34 days ago
    Quoted from flashinstinct:

    yes on ebay. Gave me the I don't know what you are talking about I made these designs 10 years ago!!! So I just checked to see if he was on Pinside. I'll let him explain himself here.

    Ebay is the source of so much counterfeit product its criminal.

    Dont buy spark plugs there etc...

    #5 34 days ago
    Quoted from flashinstinct:

    yes on ebay. Gave me the "I don't know what you are talking about I made these designs 10 years ago!!!" So I just checked to see if he was on Pinside. I'll let him explain himself here.

    That sucks. It certainly looks to be the exact same to me. This happens way too much to artists.

    #8 34 days ago

    I don't see any duplicates in those and the ones on eBay. Maybe I'm not comparing the same ones?

    #9 34 days ago
    Quoted from JethroP:

    I don't see any duplicates in those and the ones on eBay. Maybe I'm not comparing the same ones?

    Take a look at the top left.

    #10 34 days ago
    Quoted from JethroP:

    I don't see any duplicates in those and the ones on eBay. Maybe I'm not comparing the same ones?

    The wood panel is identical.

    #11 34 days ago

    Ah yes IP infringement! Rates right up there with counterfeit memory cards and selling loaded hard drives with ROMS. We all see just how well eBay takes care of that kind of stuff. Best of luck to you sir, that's not cool when somebody rips off your work.

    #12 34 days ago

    Copyright = right to copy? Too bad they are playing dumb about it.

    #13 34 days ago

    The fact that he/she's on pinside is what's "rubbing me the wrong way" the most.

    #14 34 days ago

    Somebody on pinside directly copied something from me as well. Pinside just let him do it too which was disappointing.

    12
    #15 34 days ago

    In fairness, I can see why he stole yours. The rest are horrid.

    #16 34 days ago

    Sorry that happened. Your sticker mods brought my gophers over the top, just a fantastic mod! Then like a distracted dog I traded her for an Iron Maiden. Hope to order another set from you one day...

    #17 34 days ago
    Quoted from taylor34:

    Somebody on pinside directly copied something from me as well. Pinside just let him do it too which was disappointing.

    Same here.
    Pinsider selling a couple popular mods I created over 10 years ago - I saw them on eBay first and asked where he got the idea, he said he just came up with it. I said Really, you're using the exact same color leds, in the exact same spots, mounted in the exact same place on the playfield in the same positions......that's quite a coincidence.

    saucers (resized).jpg
    #18 34 days ago

    In 2020, everything is for the taking. Paid for or not.

    #19 34 days ago
    Quoted from pinzrfun:

    Same here.
    Pinsider selling a couple popular mods I created over 10 years ago - I saw them on eBay first and asked where he got the idea, he said he just came up with it. I said Really, you're using the exact same color leds, in the exact same spots, mounted in the exact same place on the playfield in the same positions......that's quite a coincidence.
    [quoted image]

    Same here when I created the LOTR Gandalf lighted staff mod..and then the WMS IJ German BF 109 airplane firing machine gun lights mod on the wings. Such as life, karma always comes around.

    #20 34 days ago

    I feel your pain, man. I think I’m up to 5 places that have copied my stuff at this point. It’s hysterical how I can almost carbon-date when they started doing it too, based on when I updated my design.

    #21 34 days ago

    It's everywhere sadly. We have one of the biggest culprits right on our doorstep here in Brisbane and I have been victim to it as well in varying degrees.

    A good friend was talking to me about it and he had some wise words....

    Think of it as it's impossible to stop, and that the plagiarizers have zero imagination or morale fibre.

    Then keep your imagination skill flowing and move on to the next idea..

    #22 34 days ago

    It's not really just an ebay topic, although eBay makes it easy for faceless thieves to sell their goods. Fakes can exist anywhere, even Amazon (look for any name brand perfume on Amazon and compare prices of "Sold By Amazon" versus the price other sellers charge). Try DHgate if you want to see how fakes can be made for anything and sold openly...

    I suspect for an item like this that is so obscure, a choice was made (by someone) in the past to use what they 'found' as the basis for something new, rather than create new from scratch. The seller today may have outsourced the artistry to a faceless 'gig' worker who lifted it...

    From an enforcement standpoint, there would need to be documentary evidence of the original, with ownership and dates. At minimum it's worth a written request for details, with a written request to change the artwork if you beleive it is stolen from you. If the party in question is ethical, they would honor your request and simply find another piece of art to replace it that is original or public domain.

    Then see what happens.

    #23 34 days ago
    Quoted from Markharris2000:

    if you believe it is stolen from you

    I've got the sources files....*cough*

    #24 34 days ago
    Quoted from Markharris2000:

    It's not really just an ebay topic, although eBay makes it easy for faceless thieves to sell their goods. Fakes can exist anywhere, even Amazon (look for any name brand perfume on Amazon and compare prices of "Sold By Amazon" versus the price other sellers charge). Try DHgate if you want to see how fakes can be made for anything and sold openly...
    I suspect for an item like this that is so obscure, a choice was made (by someone) in the past to use what they 'found' as the basis for something new, rather than create new from scratch. The seller today may have outsourced the artistry to a faceless 'gig' worker who lifted it...
    From an enforcement standpoint, there would need to be documentary evidence of the original, with ownership and dates. At minimum it's worth a written request for details, with a written request to change the artwork if you beleive it is stolen from you. If the party in question is ethical, they would honor your request and simply find another piece of art to replace it that is original or public domain.
    Then see what happens.

    I understand it happening on eBay or amazon, I just don’t like it happening on pinside and then posting about it right in my face.

    #25 34 days ago

    Worst is they charge $39 + 8 shipping US for their set..... I means really.....I have to up my game!

    #26 34 days ago

    Sucks man, sorry to hear. But on a positive note, this thread may earn you some new customers, as I for one didn't realize that you sold anything but the warning and bb decals.
    I need a set of pf decals for HRC. Long shot, I know. But I guarantee every one in existence needs new decals.
    And I'd rather buy them from a Pinsider than Bay Area Amusements.

    #27 34 days ago

    Source file #1. Since it's a 3d file I can do any angle.... The funniest part about his claim is that he created the graphic in 2010.... Funny my files are from 2014. So unless he travelled through time we have a serious timeloop problem on our hands.

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    #28 34 days ago

    Did you check out the seller’s picture/avatar on eBay . SHE is fine! Still shouldn’t steal.

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    #29 34 days ago
    Quoted from oPinsesame:

    Did you check out the seller’s picture/avatar on eBay . SHE is fine! Still shouldn’t steal.

    If she's in fact a she. Looks can be deceptive LOL

    #30 34 days ago

    And can’t spell shields.

    #32 34 days ago

    In litigation, He would have to prove the existence of the files prior to your claims. It gets ugly when some digs in and doesn’t admit their mistake. It’s not an easy process...

    #33 34 days ago
    Quoted from Markharris2000:

    In litigation, He would have to prove the existence of the files prior to your claims. It gets ugly when some digs in and doesn’t admit their mistake. It’s not an easy process...

    I'm not in it for the money, I just want them to take their stuff down.

    #34 34 days ago
    Quoted from oPinsesame:

    Did you check out the seller’s picture/avatar on eBay . SHE is fine! Still shouldn’t steal.[quoted image]

    That is almost certainly not them. Just reverse image search it and a ton of pinterest posts come up. Such as: https://www.pinterest.com/pin/487866572137084922/

    #35 34 days ago

    holy shit their labels are awful. They've sold 14 of them???

    Can you imagine going to see a No Good Gofers and someone has added this pack of clip-art garbage stickers to their machine?

    Sorry they ripped off your work.

    #36 34 days ago

    I feel for you. Sucks. Kind of like what the Chinese are doing to American Companies quite often. Anything to make a buck and if you're not smart enough to come up with it on your own, steal it and claim it as your own.

    #37 33 days ago
    Quoted from Blitzburgh99:

    In 2020, everything is for the taking. Paid for or not.

    "Peaceful Modding"

    #38 33 days ago
    Quoted from oPinsesame:

    Did you check out the seller’s picture/avatar on eBay . SHE is fine! Still shouldn’t steal.[quoted image]

    The seller is not a she. I dealt with this guy many years ago. Had an issue with a translite that I bought from him that was "restored" and never disclosed.
    He also sells lots of target decals and his own custom toppers for Munsters and TZ.

    #39 33 days ago

    Playing devil's advocate here

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/bally-williams-decal-revisions-help

    How is copying art different in this scenario?

    #40 33 days ago

    Its not different and it is possible that the current license holder PPS (if aware) advised them not to make a commercial venture out of this. That poster was planning to use William's artwork for personal gain (apparently) without any arrangement with PPS. I know places like Marco sell those labels, but I suspect there is some type of arrangement with the PPS. There is a very slight chance that the Williams label page was released by Williams for public domain usage, but that is a long-shot and I see no evidence for that possibility.

    I would say the label guy was doing the same thing being discussed here. The only difference is the 'artist' for the labels was Williams from way back when, and in this case above it is a real live person now.

    #41 33 days ago
    Quoted from Markharris2000:

    Its not different and it is possible that the current license holder PPS (if aware) advised them not to make a commercial venture out of this. That poster was planning to use William's artwork for personal gain (apparently) without any arrangement with PPS. I know places like Marco sell those labels, but I suspect there is some type of arrangement with the PPS. There is a very slight chance that the Williams label page was released by Williams for public domain usage, but that is a long-shot and I see no evidence for that possibility.
    I would say the label guy was doing the same thing being discussed here. The only difference is the 'artist' for the labels was Williams from way back when, and in this case above it is a real live person now.

    You do realize the OP is the person who is making the labels I linked, right?

    #42 33 days ago
    Quoted from Jigs:

    Playing devil's advocate here
    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/bally-williams-decal-revisions-help
    How is copying art different in this scenario?

    If PPS would have had a problem with these I would have been made aware of it a really long time ago. Kinda like a time when I completely redrew the WCS cabinet decals. I provided the decals to one person for their own personal project only to have them sold off and printed by PPS. PPS and I entered in a mutual agreement on the WCS situation and it was resolved.

    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/baa-wcs-decals-twist

    As for these stickers that you are mentionning.....I started these way back when no one was doing it or just a handful. No one was printing these. I carefully measured, color corrected, and drew this back from scratch directly from old games. Some of these icons are standardized icons for the electrical industry. Kinda like playing cards (kings, queen, Jack) those graphics have become public domain.

    So yeah if you want to nail me to the cross, sure I copied designs from picture references, that I took, that were no longer available anywhere and made them available to the public.

    -1
    #43 33 days ago

    I work with graphic artists all the time. Copyright infringement too. Scanning and cleaning up someone else's work, or sizing, re-drawing and coloring are done on your end to get your own source file is a razor fine line. If PPS wanted to shut you down, they'd have little problem.

    I just want you to be aware that you sound kind of hypocritical. You seem like a nice guy, I just want you to see how you are coming off.

    Also, those stickers this guy is selling are god awful. Don't worry about it.

    #44 33 days ago
    Quoted from Jigs:

    You do realize the OP is the person who is making the labels I linked, right?

    I lost track. My bad...
    8-(

    #45 33 days ago
    Quoted from Markharris2000:

    I lost track. My bad...
    8-(

    haha. no worries bro.

    #46 33 days ago
    Quoted from Jigs:

    I work with graphic artists all the time. Copyright infringement too. Scanning and cleaning up someone else's work, or sizing, re-drawing and coloring are done on your end to get your own source file is a razor fine line. If PPS wanted to shut you down, they'd have little problem.
    I just want you to be aware that you sound kind of hypocritical. You seem like a nice guy, I just want you to see how you are coming off.
    Also, those stickers this guy is selling are god awful. Don't worry about it.

    Hypocritical? I've dealt with Rick from PPS. I spoke to him about these and other projects I had on the go. Like I said if he had a problem with these he would have told me so more than 7 years ago when I started doing these. The link you posted was for revisions in the set I had created.

    You are entitled to your opinion. My conscience on the bally wms stickers is clear.

    #47 33 days ago

    I see. You had Rick's permission to sell these before you made your first set available....

    All the best to you and yours. Enjoy the day.

    #48 32 days ago

    Hello fellow Pinsiders this is TNT'S ...flashinstinct had got in touch with me and said that I stole his set, I had told him I made the set 10 years ago or so ,I did design all the artwork in that set however the slam ramp I did not,I read the message quickly and was mistaken "I thought he meant the whole set.
    I redid the ramp and the enclosed listing is provided,I apologize and took care of the issue.ebay.com link

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    #49 31 days ago

    We can now put things to rest. Thanks for the response. Best of luck in your decal business.

    #50 31 days ago

    If I would of known you were making sets to sell I would of never used the image , from what I remember it was an image by itself thru google or something. Funny thing is after seeing what some people said about the set (looks god awful ) I guessthats a hint to change some things, maybe just have the arrows like the Playfield or something .....Trust me it won’t be grass....lol...Yours is cool... it’s good to give the people choices, some like grass, some like arrows however I think it’s time to retire the silly characters.Best of luck. I’ve had people copy my stuff all the time especially the flipper toppers that I originally came out with,99% of the time people act like jerks.

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