What about postal money orders? I usually send those to pay for a game. The maximum amount is 1,000.00 on each one though, if it's more than that and it usually is you will have to send more than one. Ed

Nicely done, Vid! Minor update - back in November or so, Paypal revised their rules and extended the deadline for some disputes up to 180 days (https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/useragreement-full#13). You've got at least one ref to their 45 day limit (which was frankly bad enough).

ummmmm..... https://pinside.com/pinball/community/pinsiders/silky55/ads

Joined yesterday. posted this today. reduced by 500.00 today already

"3. The Buyer examines the game and makes sure it is exactly what was expected.

4. The Buyer signs off on the game."

And if the buyer "claims" there is a problem with the pin using an IES, then what? Money is in limbo land until resolved?

https://pinside.com/pinball/market/ad/17417

Here's the same machine in texas http://dallas.ebayclassifieds.com/video-games/hurst/monster-bash-williams-pinball/?ad=37505164&msg=OUT_OF_AREA

i f_ckin' hate people lol...

I have been having fun emailing this scammer all morning. Why are they always named "Patrick"? and why do they always say "I hope you understand" also that he borrowed the pinball machine for a couple of days...

ME - "Patrick that was quick. I worry about being scammed out there as I have responded to ads in the past for cheap machines and it turned out that they were fake. I have a good friend in phoenix that could come check it out for me and pay you on the spot if everything works out. That would be better than having you arrange the shipping etc and you could unload it today. Does that sound okay?"

Patrick - "that would have been ok,but the machine is presently at a friend's place at Charlotte NC,but that wouldn't be an issue because he will be the one to arrange for the shipping and i only accept PayPal which is safe for both of us,so you don't have to worry about being scammed as i am not that type of person. i hope you understand?"

ME- "I have friends in Charlotte also. Can I arrange to have someone check it out before we move forward with any shipping or payment details?"

Patrick- "yes sure..below is his address and he owns a barn outside charlotte,so let me know when your friend will be going there so that i will inform my friend to wait for him because he is often at his barn,i hope you understand. please this has to be fast because i will probably be moving to UK this thursday so i need to sell this machine before leaving."

Me-"Patrick if this is in indeed legit Do you want to send me your phone number so I can call or can I call daniel and discuss so we can take care of this? I appreciate you sending the address. But I don't want to send my friend out to a barn. Did you mean barn or bar? Seems kinda crazy to keep this at a friends barn in Charlotte as the pictures don't look like they were taken in a barn."

Patrick - "the machine is at his home not the barn,he is constantly at his barn because he has a couple of animals,so below is his phone number try to call him. i am at work right now and i can't talk on the phone but you can leave a phone number and i will call you later."

Me - "That phone number is not working so that makes me think this is not a real ad. Why did you keep it at a friends house?"

Patrick - "maybe his phone is not on at the moment he borrowed just for a couple of days..i will try to contact him and get back to you asap.."

Me - "Why would he borrow a phone? That seems really weird to borrow a phone that is disconnected? Why is the pinball machine in NC? Do you have other machines? Why did you post it on pinside?"

Patrick -"i said he borrowed the machine for a few days and i am sorry i don't have other machines..please if you are not comfortable with this deal then let me know,i only posted the machine on pinside because a friend of mine recommended the site to me."

Me - "I am comfortable with the price and making a deal but why would he borrow the machine in NC for a few days when you are in AZ that does not make sense nor does sending me a disconnected phone number. Obviously you can see some of my hesitations as I have bought and sold a lot of machines and this sounds kinda iffy. I am willing to help you out an make it easy for you to sell because I am close enough to NC to pick it up myself but worry about a friend borrowing it for a few days who does not own a working phone and lives thousands of miles away??"

Patrick"its my friend and his phone has always been working and gave the machine to him because i hardly play it,so if you are prepare for the deal then let me know when you want the machine.. all payments will be done via PayPal,so no one gets cheated."

Sounds Legit....LOL

"Thanks Patrick I am ready to proceed with sending you the 3000.00 I'm showing your IP address as 215.133.78.166 is that correct? From this I can get your paypal address or better yet send my friends to pay you in person"

LOL I just made that sh_t up. Not everyone is smart enough to do what you did. I am guessing if "patrick" were that smart he wouldn't be trying to scam pinsiders and as such probably wouldn't call my bluff

Just got the latest response.

"Hi,
you can call Daniel through this number..he is at the barn right now.
09802620674"

I like how he adds a zero to the number. Anyone want to call the barn?

i have included a photo of me sitting on the game to ease your concerns. Please call back if you are satisfied.

patrick.png

Bump because I have gotten myself into a wierd situation. I have cash deposits on two games right now, bought by two friends in the same area...games are supposed to be shipped to same location. Guys were at TPF, in person, so this isn't like it's some random interwebs scam, but just posting this as a good example of how you can potentially put yourself in a bind without even realizing it.

As I said, these guys paid me a cash deposit on two of my games. The issue comes up because when you are put on the spot without having a plan, you tend to say stupid things and not make intelligent decisions, so when they asked how I wanted to be paid since they didn't have a crapton of cash on hand (understandable...I would not walk around TPF with this much money in hand either..), I hadn't really thought about the possibility of having to ship a game and kind of blurted out "Personal check is okay, I guess." Oops.

So, now I have a check for one game in hand, it's from the one guy's business, but the address is a residential address...might be a small business, who knows. Check shows to be from Wells Fargo account, so I'm going to go to a local branch to see if I can directly cash it...I figure this is my "safest" option at this point, rather than depositing it to my bank. If they will not cash it, I am probably going to see if he would be willing to just wire the money instead, which makes me look like a douche. If the check from the other guy shows up and is not from a major bank, or is and can't be cashed, I am in the same situation.

I don't personally give a crap waiting 3-4 weeks to ship the game, they might not be too happy about it, but I'll do whatever I need to for my end to be covered. My issue with that is that there seems to be *no way* to actually authenticate that a check has fully cleared and cannot be cancelled or hasn't bounced. Chalk it up to being naieve I guess, but I had no clue the banking system was this incompetent with a tech that is THAT OLD... kind of crazy.

Just sayin'....if there's any chance you might need to ship a game, be prepared on what types of payment you're willing to accept, and to advise your buyers of timeframes.. = \

edit: off topic

I don't really give a sh-t what their motives are.. aside from what they get for processing fees and any interest they get from holding my money, my bank (BOA) gets very little out of my pocket, which is just fine by me. I think I have paid literally 20 dollars in fees to them in the last six years. I feel like I have gotten far more out of them then they have gotten from me...especially with the rewards program they put in about 6 months ago...have had 40 bucks paid back in refunds on stuff I'm buying ANYWAYS and haven't gone out of my way to buy...good example 2.80 cash back on any purchase from In-and-Out when you pay with the debit card. I get my free burger, they get the processing fee, I/O gets the business.. works for me. /shrug

I should've asked for a wire. Lesson learned. Tried to cash the check today @ Wells Fargo..they seemed just fine with cashing a 2k+ check, but they wanted to talk to the guy. Pulled the guy's number off his account and tried to call him...I didn't have his cell phone number (oops again!) so I couldn't provide it to them. I get that they want to verify the transaction is legit, so I didn't get TOO pissed off at them, but still annoying anyways... and for my reduction of risk, I'm happy to go back on monday now that I've talked to the guy and have his contact number in hand and he'll be expecting the call.

We never got that far..I'm going back to the branch after work today since the guy is aware we will be calling around that time so they can confirm his account and get "permission" to cash the check. I expect there will be a fee, but me paying 7.50 to cash a check is less than offering to pay the 25 bucks for a wire, so...yeah. If there's a fee, that's okay for me. I'm not a Wells Fargo customer, and don't intend to be ever again after how they tried to f--k me over when I had to close out my dad's account when he died..

The guy that bought the more expensive game from us wrote the check out wrong lol...misspelled my name. He's going to wire me the money for that one, so there's half of my problem solved. The one with the check I'm trying to cash said he would just wire the money as well if Wells has a stick up their rears this afternoon too.

Wouldn't it show in the transaction history as an ACH if they did that? Not sure I have ever *recieved* a wire with Bank of America. They're usually pretty good about differentiating the transactons though.

Okay, for the record, Bank of America at least does show wires as a specific transaction type. They did take out a $15 fee for receiving the wire. Wire "cleared" at start of business this morning, no longer shows as pending, has the following info when you look at the details in online accounting...obviously with a bunch of information I'm removing:

"Description:
WIRE TYPE:WIRE IN DATE: 150408 TIME:1150 ET TRN:<REMOVED> SEQ:<REMOVED> ORIG:<REMOVED> ID:<REMOVED> SND BK:<REMOVED> ID:<REMOVED>
"

Wells Fargo does charge 7.50 to cash a check for non-account holders. The second branch I took it to did not even want to call the guy, so possibly I was dealing with an idiot teller and manager at the other branch. It wasn't marked FOR DEPOSIT ONLY or anything so not sure why they even gave me grief over it in the first place. The second branch took my D/L number and info and that was about it. No fingerprint.

Hope this helps someone out if they have questions about these types of transactions in the future.

Any thoughts on whether paying with a cashiers check provides protection (or risk) for the buyer? I am looking at a game for sale for which the seller only wants a cashiers check.

It's pretty easy to make a call to the issuing bank to verify if a cashier's check is legit. But I'd rather send US Postal Service Money Orders by mail so I can sick the postmaster after the seller if he tries to be shifty.

When I buy or sell to anyone who can't deal with credit cards, I insist on USPS Money Orders sent by US mail if I am buying or selling. Mail fraud is a very big deal. That's why all the money order scammers send by UPS or Fedex.

I was thinking I could stop payment if shipping co didn't pick up. I decided not to go through with it, but had plans to discuss with my bank before agreeing.

Most banking officials rarely take time to consult with "Brady on Bank Checks", and often give an answer that's incomplete, or worse, incorrect. Having worked for an S&L as a back room accountant just out of college, with a boss who had the copy on his desk, he'd make us "look it up", before we could answer a customers question. The answers I get regarding endorsements when I cash checks now makes me cringe....

Hmm, more expensive than I'd want to pick up as a "might be interesting" book.

http://www.lexisnexis.com/store/catalog/booktemplate/productdetail.jsp?pageName=relatedProducts&prodId=prod-us-172#

Your youth may not have been entirely "Misspent"!

Ugh, I'm going to miss out on a sale because of Vid's common sense advice. The buyer is a Pinside regular who has bought and sold numerous times, clearly a stand-up guy. He lives about 125 miles from where I'm going to be on vacation in about 3 weeks (Shenandoah Valley). It's almost perfect - but he can only pay using PayPal. I'm bummed, but I guess it wasn't meant to be.

If someone is a pinside regular, I would make an exception - ....well maybe.

I pay with c/cards for their liability insurance, but still clear the card every month. It also helps you build a good credit score in case you need credit later, like for one of those overpriced houses.

vid, your the best!
Thanks again for all your excellent knowledge!
I have used escrow.com service before. Will use again.

for what youve done around here, those "regulars" are pretty fuking low.

btw, thanks for everything. most of us appreciate the enormous amount of help youve provided/given here.
probably answered millions of PMs as well.

Yes and he won't even accept Paypal beer money for all his efforts. LOL!!

I have a question.

I am in the process of working out a sale on my LOTR LE with friendly pinsider Bluefishy, but he's in the UK (London). I am not distrusting him nor the courier service he plans to use, but in an effort to protect myself (simply because it's an expensive game), I figured I needed to ask!

We are planning to do a money transfer through Moneycorp to my bank (Chase). How long do I need to wait to verify that the money has cleared?

Thanks. The guy is going to send me confirmation from the service, but I'll make sure to do exactly this.