The way idiots talk about their games, bragging about 200 plays on a 6 year old machine, only lends credence to the Cargument™. What matters is the condition at the end of the day, which can be figured out by using your eyeballs to inspect the playfield and cabinet.

Im drawing the line at about 10000000000000 plays

Seriously, it's only a number and only dumb people cares about it. The normal people check the games overall condition and ignores nr of plays.

Here in Sweden I almost never see any for sale ads where the nr of plays are even stated. A few pictures is worth so much more.

Pinballs are like guns. They have a break in period. I would rather buy one that plays good after 500 plays vs a low play or a NIB. That’s just me though.

i bought my TAF about eight years ago with no idea how many plays it had on it. it's been on location most of the time since and has gained at least 50k more.

i get compliments all the time on how well it plays and have been asked often if i would be willing to sell it (answer: no.)

i've also got a GB pro that i picked up as a show-special when they were first released. it took nearly six months of being on location to get everything adjusted so it played well (Slimer was a thorn in my side for so long.) it's been enjoyed now more than 20k+ times and still operates better than it did right out of the box or even with 2k plays on it.

it's about the ability to make small adjustments and doing maintenance/repairs when necessary more so than very low play number, especially when you're talking about HUO games with a few thousand plays or less on 'em.

Guessing if your an operator the more the merrier...
More equals coins in box .

Condition is king.

More plays tends to lead to wear but it depends on maintenance (cleaning, waxing, tightening loose posts, etc), protection, the title, site conditions, what mood the factory workers were in, and luck.

I draw the line at 17.

Anything over 140,000 is where I draw the line......

play meter (resized).jpg

First you take the number of plays, then you carry the two, subtract the temperature of a can of coors light when the mountains are blue, square root all that, then multiply by the year the game was made.... still with me here?

And your answer is... who cares

giphy.gif

Until the new Stern's, there wasn't any reliable way to count total number of lifetime plays.

Thus there has never been an emphasis on the 'Lifetime Play' number.

All the other machines could have the hard meters disconnected, the battery backed up soft meters reset.

Condition is thus the only consideration you CAN have on older machines.

And I'd much rather have a High End Pins restoration of an Eight Ball Deluxe than I would a 'It's been in the back of the Warehouse with a tarp over it for twenty years' machine.

download (3) (resized).jpg

No such thing as too many plays, as long as the machine is maintained and taken care of properly.

I only buy a pin so I can stare at the shooter lane, so it really ticks me off when market place sellers don’t include a picture of it. There’s nothing like a perfect shooter lane, makes you not want to play the game itself and mess it up.

Pinball machines are made to be played and enjoyed. That being said if op/owner takes the time to properly do some slight prevention/maintenance here and there mylar in shooter or cliffys, coil stops, flipper rebuilds, change balls out regularly etc. Machine should play & look as it should. IMO plays doesn't matter.

225

Play count does not matter as much as maintenance. I currently maintain a number of sterns all over 100k plays nearing 200k you would never guess the play count was that high on

1.

Just like cars after you drive them off the lot they lose $6000 in value.

So...anyone looking to sell slightly used

About 350

I throw my machines away after each game because real collectors want museum pieces. Depending on the manufacturer some aren't new enough out of the box so I send them off to a restorer to ensure perfection. Games I keep are wrapped in 25 layers of bubble wrap in a hermitically sealed container buried underground so that they will remain timeless. After six weeks I throw those away too because they are starting to break down.

I paid more for this than my first 3 cars, you expect me to PLAY it?

If it’s

You took it out of the box?!?!

No, it does not matter. Only condition matters. All parts are replaceable. It’s like the ship of Theseus.

You could have a machine with 2000 plays that’s trashed because no one ever cleaned it. Or one with 15000 that’s great because it’s been cared for. It’s not like a car and miles at all. Car is a far more complex system and it’s much more difficult to clean and maintain every single aspect of the machine over time.

Wow! A Theseus quote. We are getting high brow over here on pinside!

People play with their pinball machines?

We can sure all relate to when our AR-15 isn't broken in yet, and we only manage to blow up 23 out of the 24 Bud Light cans in the case without reloading. Hate when that happens!

My pins are very well-maintained and play great. Even with 20 high-res listing pics showing an immaculate cabinet and playfield I still get morons asking me for a play count and shooter lane pic. And that's all they ever ask. And they don't respond back after you provide. They think 500 plays is a lot. Screw those guys.

42

Of all the machines I've had the last 40 years I don't recall ever really looking at either the EM counters or the plays in memory. Maybe once or twice and then 5 minutes later I forgot because it doesn't matter to me. Even the few NIB games I had, I never kept track of how many plays I put on them before I sold them.

Same here, I've never looked at an EM counter or stats in a game before buying.

I absolutely look at the counter in an EM. I like to laugh at what 50,000 plays will do to an old playfield (not much if it has been in climate controlled environments, a lot if it was at a beach). When a game has 50k plays, you start doing math, like averaging 5 plays per person, at least 10,000 different people have sworn at the game I am about to start swearing at when I get it working. It is the games living history. It doesn't mean anything to the price, but it is fun to look at. Just like it is amazing to find an old tax stamp inside it to realize the game has traveled half way across America to get to me.

Depends on the price.

You want top dollar? It better have a “perfect” shooter lane and be true HUO.

You have a “well maintained” 10000 plays+ game? Better have a great shooter lane or you won’t get the dream $$$.

Asking how many plays is too many is like asking how many times for your partner to have gotten laid before you is too many. Civilized folks try not to think about it like that.

IMG_0334.gif

If it has more than 600 plays in the last 12 years then it can no longer be considered immaculate and therefore its too many plays for me

my road kings has over 80k plays. but still it does work fine.. cant say it feels worst than my other machines

better question is maybe plays for system 11 or plays for a stern or gottlieb.

i have a feeling gottlieb where made better. the flippers have 2 "bearings", boards seems more reliable
system 11a b games play faster. it was not ment to get a higher score than 10 mil
newer games balls drain less. not made for "plays per hour" but more owner minded (longer play)

i do wonder how long a new stern last. rest has been proven to be oke

Maybe not from a newb who doesn't know better. Everyone else doesn't care and will pay commensurate with overall condition.

Now, stop beating off to shooter lane pics and go play some pinball.

Yikes, they have more than 500 plays? When are you gonna throw those old junkers out and buy a beautiful, new, sub-500 plays game?

Hell no! Never waste beer. Reloading almost sounds like you’re at the press making new rounds. Racking a mag sounds better. Now time to rant about random shit. They are not clips people. Magazine that’s what is now a days. Unless it looks like a chip clip on your round it’s a fucking mag. Now the pinball rant. The table…not a table. Unless you can play cards on it’s not a fucking table! Y’all must have some fucked up dinners that’s all I’m saying. Rant is over that felt good.

I am not in the habit of selling pins so I personally find it maybe amusing that this thread reads like an echo chamber of pintraders who are pissed off that buyers expect low wear on $10000+ items.

Y’all see a potential monetary disadvantage and that upsets you. That’s what this is all about. Be honest.

Yeah, I also don’t care about the shooter lane condition.

I never sell my pins either.

I play them.

I’ve been in this hobby for around 23 years already (bought a banged up TZ and restored it. Lot’s of wear that can’t be fixed with reasonable effort but I paid less than $2000) so it’s not that I’m new to pinball machines.

Maybe I should join the other geezers here and be all high and mighty how my worn TZ with probably 50000 plays is entitled to be desired by potential buyers who aren’t allowed to dare ask for pictures of the shooter lane when I put it on pinside market for $10000, huh? I did baby it the last 23 years after all.

It smells like arrogant attitude that one thinks shooter lane pics and number of plays have no meaning for a very expensive box where steel balls smash into targets at high speed LOL.

They do because no matter how much you wax and clean and love your machine, you can’t prevent physical wear. And the more you play it, the more it wears out. Thinking otherwise is delusional.

You want to have your cake and eat it too apparently.

I don't think anyone said that wear doesn't slowly occur. The general point is that the occurance on a well maintained and cleaned game is over many years and thousands of plays. It seemed like the OP's original question was regarding the much shorter term.

Your TZ is 30 years old and likely got thousands of plays on location before you picked it up. But who cares, as long as it plays the way you want it to.

I get requesting a picture of the shooter lane with these newer games as it's condition can be a sign of how well or poorly a game has been maintained. A piece of mylar and a shooter lane eject protector when buying a game new is an easy to way to help maintain a games value.

I would put greater value on the game with 1,000 plays that looks clean with a protected shooter lane versus one with 500 plays that was never protected and is now showing wear.

3 things every NIB buyer should do IMO to maintain value and keep a game looking nice.

1. Mylar in shooter lane + shooter lane eject protector

2. Mylar cabinet protectors around flipper buttons (prevents decal damage from slap hits caused by jewelry, has been posted here). https://www.pinballlife.com/pinguard-flipper-button-wear-protector-set.html

3. Nylon leg bolt protectors for every leg bolt, prevents wear on legs when tightening leg bolts https://www.pinballlife.com/pinguard-nylon-leg-and-bolt-protectors-colored.html

This is a joke in case anybody didn't pick up on it. If you know, you know....

I take my imamaculate games very seriously.

Too much? I would have to look at the play counter to know that. The chances of it being broken, missing or disconnected are high in the category that I shop in.

I wouldn't feel comfortable buying a machine with little use as the person might not even have played enough to find the faults. Anything under a few hundred and I'm out.... unless the person said they loved the game when it only had a few hundred plays, then I know they're lying.

I personally prefer to buy machines from people who play them, they know more about the bones than anyone else

Nearly an impepecable joke if I do say so myself.