(Topic ID: 59959)

how do I stop cointaker led's from strobing?

By cougtv

8 years ago


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  • 35 posts
  • 17 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 8 years ago by Sc1f1
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#1 8 years ago

I love the cointaker leds In my sttng and most stopped strobing when I turned power saving off. The shield leds still strobe a lot and the backbox strobes when the machine dims them. I can't stand it. Do I have to change these back to bulbs or is there a fix?

#2 8 years ago

Patch your roms with the WPC Non-Ghosting patch. It will fix your problem.

#3 8 years ago

If you actually mean strobing, I don't know if anything will eliminate it, that's the way your brain/eyeballs react to it.

#4 8 years ago

At low power they flash. The full power ones do not. The shields seem always dimmed during play and look like they are flashing. It is really just 6 in the shields and the back box that does it.

Quoted from Meph:

Patch your roms with the WPC Non-Ghosting patch. It will fix your problem.

Can you provide more info on said patch.

#6 8 years ago
Quoted from cougtv:

It is really just 6 in the shields and the back box that does it.

Im not sure if we are talking the same issue. I used CT Supers in mine and they ghosted BAD. By ghosting I mean the inserts never fully turned off, they would dim and pulse. I upgraded to a patched LX7 and have no ghosting at all anymore.

#7 8 years ago

No. I used premiums and have no ghosting at all. In test the shield leds do not flash but at low power during play they flicker. The whole back box flickers when it is dimmed by the machine.

#8 8 years ago

Switch to incandescent bulbs for GI. The flickering on GI really bugs my eyes, i have trouble playing many games with too many LEDs in the GI. It flickers at 60 Hz and i can see it. Maybe my eyes are more sensitive than others.

#9 8 years ago

The shields are inserts. Gi on the pf looks good, I may have to do the bulbs in the box and shields, I am thinking maybe leds just don't dim well???

#10 8 years ago
Quoted from cougtv:

I am thinking maybe leds just don't dim well???

No they do not. The super double premium kick ghost assers yada yada help some...but not all the way.

Now some people can chime in on those european LEDs which are said to work well.

#11 8 years ago

Herg to the rescue. He sells a board on here that will eliminate or drastically reduce strobing. Contact him or see his thread for details. Many satisfied customers.

#12 8 years ago

It is recommended that you disable dimming when using LEDs. The way dimming is handled in WPC machines, it will enhance the strobing effect (Unlike incandescent bulbs, LEDs are switching immediate and this is visible). Some high priced LEDs have an integrated capacitor, which will "delay" the switching and will reduce the effect.

#13 8 years ago

Other than turning off power saving, how do I disable dimming? Where can I find just a few of the high priced leds? It is mostly just the six in shields that bug me

#14 8 years ago

Aren't the shields inserts? These are not GI and therefore it is not a dimming problem, but a lamp matrix related one (the lamp matrix only turns the insert on in a very short intervall, which could cause the flickering of LEDs).
The Optiflux LEDs from SupperfluxShop.de (http://www.superfluxshop.de/products-mainmenu-64.html?page=shop.browse&category_id=54) and the NoFlix Plus from PinballCenter.eu (http://www.pinballcenter.eu/catalog/t10-noflix-plus-teal-superflux-p-401.html?language=english) have a capacitor, which should reduce flickering (at least it is what they are saying).
Switching should be smoother (they are fading a little bit) as for incandescent bulbs.
I have not tried them myself, so I cannot confirm if this really makes a difference of not.

#15 8 years ago

OP, you are like me and are bothered by the strobing. I've tried a lot of things and haven't had much luck. Going with a frosted bulb seems to help a bit since the lights aren't as bright, but I still notice it.

The best option I've seen are these boards being sold. Seems like it is a full fledged fix for strobing. He doesn't have any for WPC at the moment, but if enough people pre-order/request them on his site, he'll be making them. I'd put in for one and we'll be one person closer to getting these out there again.

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/led-ocd-advanced-lamp-controller-shipping-with-wait-list

#16 8 years ago

This board only handles the insert (controlled lamps) and not the GI.
I just wanted to make this clear, so do not hope that it will remove flickering of the GI.
The cheapest solution would be (if you only have a problem with the shield inserts): Use incandescent bulbs for the shields.

#17 8 years ago
Quoted from cougtv:

Other than turning off power saving, how do I disable dimming?

I've got dimming disabled on my WPC games and it helps. STTNG manual says you can find it here:

A.1 Standard Adjustments 25
Allow Dim Illumination
The game program dims the General Illumination for special effects and during the Attract
Mode.
YES = Dim the General Illumination during the Attract Mode.
NO = Do Not dim the General Illumination.

#18 8 years ago

Regarding my LED OCD board:

As mentioned, it only controls the lamp matrix. The shield inserts on STTNG are GI under inserts, which is uncommon. An LED OCD board will not help in this case, nor will the WPC patch. I've done some work on a prototype for GI, but it still has a long way to go.

Quoted from sturner:

He doesn't have any for WPC at the moment, but if enough people pre-order/request them on his site, he'll be making them. I'd put in for one and we'll be one person closer to getting these out there again.

I am already in the process of building WPC kits, and they should be available mid-September.

Back on topic, the mentioned "Allow Dim Illumination" is the only way without extensive mods to eliminate the GI flicker completely. Even with incandescent bulbs, I can see some underlying flicker when they dim. It's much more pronounced with LEDs. As flugs mentioned, there are special LED bulbs available that try to smooth this out, but I don't have direct experience with them.

#19 8 years ago

Ok, that helps attract mode, but.........Ordered 8 of the fancy LEDs (2 spare for failures). Will post results! FYI cost was about 23 bucks. More shipping than LED cost!

#20 8 years ago

It should not allow dimming during attract mode + special effects during games (my games used to dim during end of ball for example). +1 to keeping game ROMs updated as well.

#21 8 years ago

Throw out those cointakers and get noflix from pinballcenter, problem solved

#22 8 years ago

They are the premiums, only issue I am having is with the 6 shield LEDs and the back glass LEDs. Mostly the shield LEDs. I will post my results. I like the cointaker LEDs far better than the old bulbs. My other machines look dark and dingy now (only Dr Who is due for a cleaning though).

#23 8 years ago

Be careful to take the right NoFlix. The standard NoFlix do not have a capacitor. Only the NoFlix Plus do have it.

#24 8 years ago

Be careful to take the right NoFlix. The standard NoFlix do not have a capacitor. Only the NoFlix Plus do have it.

I used PinballCenter out of Germany T-10 NoflickPlus superFlux Teal for my ST:TNG Shield inserts and I have zero ghosting coming from the Shield inserts.

100_0107.JPG

#25 8 years ago

i think you want this baby
http://www.pinballcenter.eu/catalog/t10-noflix-plus-teal-superflux-p-401.html?language=english
bend the led upward for increased pleasure

#26 8 years ago

I had used the Noflix Plus in my White Water, and they do help a great deal with the GI dimming. If you dim down enough, you'll still see some strobing from the GI.... but then again, if you dim the GI down enough even incandescent bulbs will strobe there too.

-Hans

2 weeks later
#27 8 years ago

Ordered the no flix and it was ng. At a dimmed level they flashed worse than the cointaker one. I experimented and I like the super bright cointaker blue frosted 555 super bright best for the shields! Now I just need to get 3 more. They were just all around better.
Will just buy cointaker leds from now on.....no flix is no good.

#28 8 years ago

There is strobing, flickering and ghosting. Three completely different problems with LEDs and all caused by trying to put a square peg in a round hole. In other words, older pins like STTNG were not designed to have LEDs.

Strobing is a problem with GI lights that gets worse when they are dimmed because of the circuity used. There is no cure for this except to put real bulbs back in or redesign the power supply in your machine to use DC power (or really fast AC).

#29 8 years ago
Quoted from cougtv:

Ordered the no flix and it was ng. At a dimmed level they flashed worse than the cointaker one. I experimented and I like the super bright cointaker blue frosted 555 super bright best for the shields! Now I just need to get 3 more. They were just all around better.
Will just buy cointaker leds from now on.....no flix is no good.

Did you get the "NoFlix plus" or just regular "NoFlix" LEDs?

#30 8 years ago

Plus, the description said no strobing. I am not complaining about ghosting, rather strobe effect of them being dimmed during play. After experiments, I found the Blue domed cointakers to look the best. I need a few more. I do plan to do my next several machines with cointaker. Only a small complaint.........

#31 8 years ago

Minor led strobing on my STNG but the funny thing is that,during play, the shields strobe slightly and almost look natural. I am gonna leave it like that.

#32 8 years ago

I am confused if you are still having issues with flicker/strobing. I turned off dimming and got my patched rom. I have 0 issues and haven't had to spend a single dollar on those overpriced "premium" bulbs....

#33 8 years ago

Never got the patched?? rom.
I think I am in

Quoted from smokey_789:

Minor led strobing on my STNG but the funny thing is that,during play, the shields strobe slightly and almost look natural. I am gonna leave it like that.

state with it at this point. Love the machine!

#34 8 years ago

Ghosting = controlled lamp lights lighting up dimmly when they should be turned off. Special WPC roms can help on some games that need it

Strobing = lamps flickering 60 times a second. No rom is fixing this.

Boris,

Some people do not notice the flickering and it does not bother them. It bugs the crap out of me. Much more so out of my perifieal vison, so the game next to me is very distracting.

LEDs in the GI is horrible for me. If it is a tournament game, forget it.

#35 8 years ago

BUY NO FLIX PLUS LEDs

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