I have a crap poor project I need to start on.
Here's my Hook project I've got going on right now. Not too terrible, definitely need to hit the playfield with Novus 2 (I usually use Novus 1) to get that engrained dirt out. Ramps are in good shape, but very cloudy. Kind of hesitant to wash them with soap and water because of the rope lights, I'll probably end up re-attaching those afterwards. Putting LEDs in the GI, standard fare. Gonna hit the ramps with a good flame polishing too. Also gonna upgrade the bumpers to Sega mechs with self cleaning switches. Gonna add Cliffy scoop protectors, new bats, and Super Bands as well.
Anyone happen to have decals for the shooter lane ramp, or scans of decals? Plus I also want to upgrade the flippers to use linear springs, can that be done by adding the spring tabs?
Finally got some more time for my Hook project. Turning out pretty nice so far. Marco doesn't have the double yellow posts so I went with orange. Novus 2 powers through that dirt like nothing else I've ever seen! There was a thick line of dirt over the rollover inserts.
Open the coin door and press the green toggle switch on the left and make sure it is in the depressed position. Press the black button next to it to enter diagnostics. Use this button to step through the options and toggle the other switch to change direction. Scroll to the switch edges or "switch test" and place a ball in the kicker. Does the switch register on-screen? If not, lift the playfield into service position and trigger the switch with your finger. No talky? Replace the switch. Can you solder?
Just watched the movie again last night. The game seems to use a mixture of quotes taken directly from the movie and custom speech. For years I wondered what "Ru-fi-o" was supposed to be.
The skull shot is a major waste, I have to agree. I almost never go for it due to the risk of STDM drains from bricked shots. My initial thoughts would be to swap the skull scoops and the right comer scoop going up Hook's arm, but that may introduce too much risk into the the game's main mode shot. If you miss you can really lose control of the ball (though there is a kickback). Then again if you don't swap positions the scoop is still critical to lite a mode at the right scoop...
The left ramp seems to be hit and miss for a lot of folks. I can shoot it repeatedly without much problem and max out the value at 3 million. This resets after it has been maxed. I have actually had good players complain about the right flipper being ever so slightly out of adjustment which prevented them from spamming the left ramp. So even though it may not be an issue for everyone it definitely does need some rework. Similar to the Star Wars ramp.
Another area is the ship drop targets, the only time they are used is to advance the bonus multiplier IIRC (bonus is worthless so what's the point?) and claim Pirate's Extra Ball or Pirate's Special. Both of these are stupid easy, you have 10 seconds to hit one target out of a bank of 4. It would be a worthy challenge to, say, sink all 4 targets to claim the award instead. There are other easy ways to get an extra ball.
The home run shot to the right of the croc clock ramp can be used inventively too. Currently you make 4 shots for 3 strikes followed by a home run. The ball is fired back out from underneath the plunger ramp via a slingshot kicker. Balls are locked in the lane for multiball.
Quoted from ChadH:
I believe these are GI bulbs. Probably just extra light for that area. Mine have white covers on them. But maybe they were once yellow but have faded.
They are GI lamps with white condoms.
Quoted from Gov:
Can you change the end of ball music while you are at it?
That sequence is a bit drawn out. The loop is also interrupted, would it be possible to end the sequence cleanly in multiples of a single loop after the seventh beat?
There's at least one bug with the service menu. One is the directional pushbutton doesn't work. Regardless of whether you have the button depressed, you can only move forward. Please fix this! Oh and the tinkerbell selection sound and adjustment "Hook" voice are really annoying. Try setting a custom backup replay score...
Some observations I made yesterday while I had access to the game. Dang it I forgot to get the CPU version!
Replay value appears too briefly in attract mode (about half a second)
Top rollover bonus multiplier steps up from 2x, 4x, 6x, 8x, to 10x. Once 10x is reached this becomes a fixed award of 500k. Something to think about after end of ball bonus is adjusted for balance. Should 500k be increased?
Bug after game ends... "insert coins" is shown for a split second before game over screen/jingle. Insert coins should only display after the game over sequence and jingle ends.
Hook's mouth sprite flickers during attract mode when he says, "I hate, I hate, I hate Peter Pan." Is there a way to change the animation to fix this?
Green toggle pushbutton does not change direction when in diagnostics menu. Works fine in audits and adjustments.
Possible to add credit dot when a playfield status message is present?
Skill shot inconsistency... miss awards 100k x ball number, hit awards 2m, 3m, 4m depending on your ball number. This is incorrect with the hook shaped plastic at hole two that says, "One mil x ball in play."
Another skill shot bug... If extra ball is lit at hole three on the third plunge and you collect it, it is possible to collect the normal 4m skill shot a second time if you either lock the ball or drain the ball and trigger the ball save. I am not 100% sure on how to reproduce as I never noticed this issue before, but the one time I tried again with ball save it was not reproduced.
Possible to fix or lessen LED ghosting? The only LEDs I have in the game are in the center skull eyes and ghosting is pretty noticeable with those lamps being front and center. I'm an incandescent fan but since these lamps are impossible to replace without removing the entire ramp and skull plastic, I use LEDs.
Possible to use the "Ball one" and "Ball two" callouts when shooting the right baseball lane in other ways? Maybe at the start of each ball or when balls are locked? If an unused "three" callout exists it would make this a feasible idea since "Home run" is said instead of "Ball three."
The "What great games" callout is interrupted when pressing the start button to adjust replay value after opening the coin door.
More info for you Chad!
This is minor, but the score screen flashes briefly after a plunged skill shot miss, plunged lock miss, or playfield triggered skill shot/lock miss. The score is shown for a split second between the switch closure and the miss message/fanfare.
This may be my display outgassing, but the skull hurry-up award only displays two skulls on either side of the screen. What is supposed to show here, if anything? This screen also shows 20 million briefly before playing the skull collect animation or after draining with the countdown running.
"One," "two," "three," "four," "ball," "strike," and "home run" callouts are all used. You score a strike when you successfully make the right lane beside the baseball ramp and send the ball into the bumpers. If your shot misses it falls into the kicker lane behind it and you score a ball. Thinking of ways of using those callouts alternatively... maybe during the last four seconds of an important mode countdown?
The "500k x ball in play" left outlane insert does not always light when this feature is lit.
Completing the cannon drop target bank advances the windcoaster ramp value as indicated on the playfield. If you reach the maximum of 3 million this will actually roll back over to 250k if you, for example, miss the ramp or possibly complete the bank by accident when collecting a pirate award. This is the first time in pinball I've seen a feature actually reduce the value of a separate feature by completing it, the game punishes you for this (although you do get points for completing the bank regardless). Also, about the "3m plus" insert, is there supposed to be a way to get more than 3 million points before the windcoaster value resets?
Quoted from ChadH:
This is odd as the game is supposed to be showing the 20,000,000 during the 10 second count down. Not sure why yours is not.
Then it's my display, thanks for verifying. Most of that is dim text which often completely disappears on dying DMDs.
Quoted from ChadH:
Possibly your lamp needs tweaking?
Looks good in diagnostics. I didn't realize it was a lane change feature.
Quoted from ChadH:
I can see the code where they originally had the Left Ramp actually increase up to 12 Million but then they locked it at 3M. Probably for scoring balance and to try to prevent someone from spamming the Left Ramp all day.
Do you think it's possible to re-use those slots with much smaller scores like 2.1m, 2.2m, etc? This will make the insert text more accurate without further breaking the ramp scoring. Maybe to compensate for the additional awards figure out a way to severely limit the overall ramp scoring after one or two cycles?
I took a look at the sounds and found a few unused callouts and possibly some unused jingles around the croc clock hurry-up in the sound event table. I used m1 with the Bridgem1 frontend if you want to listen but I had to rip the callouts manually.
Not sure what the second sound is, Tinkerbell humming?
Quoted from ChadH:
I think that second sound is the sound test tone.
I'm not sure, I've combed through the ROMs of various games and don't think I have seen this sample anywhere else.
Quoted from ChadH:
The first one "come back and fight me now" and also that third one of the children chanting the rooster crow are not used.
I almost thought the war cry was used during the start of multiball but it's a more distinct group of people crowing rather than a muffled crowd.
Quoted from ChadH:
Which jingles do you think are unused? (I am not familiar enough with the game to identify what's used and not.)
I've been playing the game just about my whole life and have never heard tracks 3, 48, 52, 54, 56, 58, and 62. Track 50 is the current croc clock countdown jingle but 52, 54, 56, and 58 are single channel events, clearly not full tracks. It sounds like 56 and 58 are designed to fit together for an alternate croc clock countdown.
Here they are individually, followed by a mix of 56 and 58. Definitely sounds like something that was either not completed by Brian or not mixed/implemented.
Quoted from ChadH:
Also, I don't think that the "Strike Three!" voice call is ever used. Another one that is not used is "You can fly!", although that is heard but only with another longer voice call that has "You can fly, you can fight, you can [rooster crow]".
I think you're correct about "strike three." Is "You can fly" its own event though it's part of the sentence?
There's a slight possibility had it been on my game that I may have removed that gate and not put it back. This was over 3 years ago so I'm not sure. I think I found a bigger gate in my parts stash several months back wondering where it went. I certainly would have taken a photo of that gate installed, but there was a bug in the Pinside archive image uploader (I dug the second photo up from my archive pics) which means not all photos would have made it to the shop-out album.
Edit: Looking at more photos I'm absolutely sure that gate wasn't on my game at all.
All manual diagrams indicate the presence of the gate. I didn't see anything that mentioned advancing the umpire, only home runs. Perhaps the game's original design was to reflect new plunges only (ball one through three) but then again this would not explain why "ball four" is in there unless you changed the balls per game to four.
Quoted from LarryMac:
Had to share this - I was playing last night next to the manager of the brewery where my Hook is. He hit start and began to speak along with Mr. Tootles - "have to fly, have to fight ...."
And then he said "aftershave Maggie, aftershave Jack".
I always though Tootles was saying "hogie speck" for years when I was younger until I finally saw the movie.
I don't plan on posting a lot more detailed stuff in this thread but as reference material for everyone:
End of ball music starts twice when each ball drains
"Ball one" always repeats once if anyone was wondering
Umpire does not play callout and advance ball count when skill shot is collected
Skill shot DMD animation cuts back to score early, light plunge or full plunge back into the shooter lane to replay DMD skill shot sequence and fix this
Replay value disappears too quick in attract
"Hook" in "Hook by Steven Spielberg" flashes too quick in attract
Something flashes quick between Hook logo and number of credits in attract?
"Press start" animation flickers in attract
"Special thanks" flashes too quick in attract
High scores are a bit quick in attract
Quoted from Goonie:
Here it is. Just can't get 2 photos to upload to the same post for some reason.
The cap looks fine, you probably just had some corrosion from a high humidity environment at some point. The resistor in the first photo looks ok, but I would reflow the solder joints on all the resistors on that board except for the one in the second picture. That one looks like it's definitely getting too hot. Remove that resistor and check to make sure it isn't shorted.
Why in the world would there be code in the game to reset the score to zero? I would normally think a buffer overflow, but if this were an 8 bit integer it would go all the way up to 255 before rolling back around. A 7 bit integer would max out a 127, a 6 bit maxes out at 63.
I was assuming the bonus increments by the million but I guess it doesn't. Probably the same reason the Pac-Man kill screen happens, programmers didn't assume anyone would make it to level 256.
Don't forget if you miss the skill shot the diverter activates and send the ball back to the shooter lane for another chance so I'm guessing that would count towards the timer too. To fix this you could turn off the diverter/retry when the player does a full plunge to send the ball to the right habitrail. If you actually try the skill shot and overshoot there's a good chance the ball will go down the right baseball ramp and enter the playfield before it reaches the habitrail so I thought the diverter idea was novel but I've never thought of a practical use for it. I see people doing full plunges all the time and wondering why the ball comes back. Maybe you have an idea to use that diverter inventively?
Oh it never ends! A few more things I noticed:
The croc clock hurry-up timer sometimes starts late, immediately playing the faster paced music normally heard in the last few seconds of the mode. The last time I started it I had only about 5 seconds(!) to shoot the right ramp when normally you would get 10 or 15 seconds. This also happened after collecting the croc clock jackpot at that ramp following the opening jackpot at the windcoaster ramp.
There is no countdown timer on the DMD for pirate awards, just the sprite of the ship and mode text. This would be really nice to have.
The post high score message, "BANGARANG PAN THE MAN JAY" for example, flashes by too quickly before the game goes back to attract mode. I know the screwed up high score routine has been discussed before.
Quoted from bobwiley:
Chad, is there a way you could assign callouts individually rather than having them "shared?" To my understanding, certain switches are assigned the same sound file. It would be great if each action recalled its own sound location so more variety was added. By any chance do you know if we can modify the sound files? Maybe replace the chip to add better ones?
I'm not really sure what you're asking. Are you talking about taking existing sound events ("Hook, Hook, Hook!," "Ball one," "Ball two" etc.) and splitting them up into their own separate events so certain words can be called individually? I'm not sure this is possible but if it is it would also require more ROM space to add additional metadata to the sounds database. The requirement of extra storage would most likely force unused callouts and music tracks to be removed to allow space for this extra metadata, and I would rather hear the unused sounds/music that Brian Schmidt originally intended to include.
Regarding a PinSound project, I think it would be pretty easy to do for this game. It seems to have a more limited selection of music and callouts than other more popular DE titles. The movie was not recorded in 5.1 surround so lifting certain words and sound effects is a bit limited but it can be done like other games Endprodukt has worked on. The croc clock burp after Hook is eaten is heard clearly with little background noise and is actually used in the Jurassic Park game too. I don't think it's used in the actual movie though but they are both Spielberg titles...
Quoted from ChadH:
there are two videos played when you drain via the outlanes.
I looked at this with the glass off and I think there's a third one. I was watching a gameplay video and noticed something strange about the skull hurry-up. You can tell the display is outgassing like mine because the value in the center and timer on the right are barely visible because they are displayed using dim dots. However when he shoots the ramp and it comes back down, as soon as it hits the ramp gate switch the second time the score and timer text flash to full bright for a single frame followed by the normal gameplay score screen for another frame. This also happens when the mode ends via the timer. This is what I meant by "something" when I pointed out this flash earlier in the thread. Very odd, like the code is falling back on a brighter version of the text.
Ball exiting ramp:
Edit: Ok this is just silly. It looks like the fast scoring, victory lap, and multiball restart modes show the scores and countdown text at full brightness, unlike the skull and pirate hurry-ups. Can you confirm this?
Which makes me wonder, why are the display styles half bright and half dim? If you have an older display changing the dim parts to bright would help make things more visible, but if you had an LED or color display this wouldn't matter. With the PIN2DMD and PinballSP color DMD projects making fast headway into production I would personally prefer to make all of these dim across the board of you can. That way using a color palette with an RGB display down the road will give more colors on-screen.
If you complete more than one mode whose totals are added to the end of ball bonus the jingle is interrupted between totals during the end of ball sequence.
Also it turns out you don't even need to send the ball into the jets to get a strike. Just send the ball into the right lane and close the switch under the right ramp. If you close the switch and do not make it to the bumpers you will immediately get a strike awarded regardless of where the ball goes from there. It would be nice to use the bumper switches for verification but this could delay the award by several seconds... this would be ideal if there was a target in the upper corner of the bumper arena like in Dracula or Terminator 2.
Do the sound amps need a regulated +12v power supply? Having the same issue with an X-Pin power supply, Brett says to remove the regulator which turns the +12v regulated supply into an unregulated source. Had sound dropouts whenever the windcoaster rope lights flashed.
Quoted from PinballManiac40:
New product for Batman, Checkpoint, Hook, Star Trek 25th Anniversary, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
Replaces Data East Display P/N 520-5042-00
128x16 LED DE displays are now available.
Xpin's 128x16 LED DE displays due out in the summer 2016
Dang, a couple of new options there for 128x16! Fantastic. The Boston Pinball one looks pretty promising, maybe a monolithic LED panel (no blocks/segments)? It looks great and the decision to use through hole component design is significant. The X-Pin one, not sure. It's awful expensive for using 8x8 modules that would likely show grid lines, and uses surface mount technology in contrast.
Quoted from ChadH:
What do you all think about the Skull shot?
This shot currently serves these purposes:
1) It will spot a Top Lane (to help build your Bonus Multiplier)
2) If the Right Scoop is not lit, it will relight the Right Scoop.
3) It collects the 20 Million Skull shot during that mode.
4) It collects Extra Ball when lit.
5) It is one of several shots you can shoot during Bangarang to build the Bangarang bonus.
Does this seem to be enough? Should it do anything else?
Ever thought of putting the right scoop on a timer? Maybe turn it into something like Bride of Pinbot's left lane, light more valuable modes/awards if you can make the skull/scoop in sequence quick enough within a certain amount of time? That's one way to add a little more focus to the skull. Shoot the skull to light the right scoop. If you dont shoot the scoop or the skull again within 30/45 seconds the scoop is no longer lit. Another comparison would be the ramps on your custom TFTC. The skull can be the left ramp and the right scoop can be the right ramp. IMO this would make sense from a shot difficulty point of view as although the skull can be a bit risky being above the flipper gap, it's easier to shoot than the right scoop. This would make things more interesting than just skull/scoop/skull/scoop and add a risk/reward factor.
Quoted from Crash:
I would like to think there are other things that spot the weapons targets to qualify multiball like in Jurassic Park.
I paid attention to the weapon targets and the only thing I see that spots them is plunging at the beginning of a new ball. You can hit or miss the skill shot and it spots one target.
Funny thing about these though, when you start the game you have the bottom insert flashing on all three banks. If you hit the bottom one it turns solid and the center insert flashes. If you hit the center one it turns solid and the top one flashes. If you hit the top one it turns solid and completes the bank. However, if you hit them out of order it gets confusing. For example, start a game and hit the top target of any one bank. The top insert goes solid and the bottom remains flashing as expected. Hit the center next, then the bottom one last. The center then goes from solid to flashing, misleading the player into thinking the center target had been collected, but it hasn't. I agree with the need to hit them in order, but the way the game presents progress of this is misleading. It would be better if any targets hit out of order are not lit at all.
Also, when the ball lands under the shooter ramp sometimes the kicker will fire too soon and miss it. Often the ball will bounce up about half an inch and settle down again. There should be a timer on this kicker to allow the ball to settle. It happens more going backwards out of the jet bumpers.
Chad once again I think your suggestion is spot on. I wish I had room for some input of my own, but this would be perfect. "Shoot twice lites croc time." Then shoot the ramp a third time to start it. Given the way it's worded on the playfield it seems like this is the original intent. You would expect the mode to be lit, not start. Just have both inserts lit solid until the mode starts.
Quoted from judremy:
I thought Chad said it right above? It is due to the ball not getting in the drain quick enough. It might bounce around before hitting the switch that tells the machine the ball drained. No grace period and only one second.
No, this happens independently of the scoop ball save. In fact it happens if you don't shoot for the scoop at all. I haven't been able to determine a pattern, but sometimes it can be as long as 5 or 6 seconds before the game plays the end of ball sequence. I think the ball is returned to the trough first in all cases. Also, the ball does not get ejected when placed in the skull and right scoops during attract mode. I have to press start and let it do the pre-game ball search before this happens. The other two shots (under shooter lane ramp and clock shop kicker) do this as expected.
Interesting point on what I like to call the "pity extra ball." What does everyone think about the score threshold for this? It will have to be updated once the balance changes take effect, or else you will never see it.
Quoted from dmbjunky:
Also does anyone else think the call outs aren't from the movie? They sound rerecorded with different people. Except Tootles. He sounds like the actor from the movie.
I believe all the actors are original, but most of the speech is custom. Which begs the question, had anyone considered doing a PinSound project for Hook?
Quoted from dmbjunky:
Hook sounds like Dustin Hoffman as well as Tootles but like generic child actor saying to hit the ramp doesn't sound like anyone from the film. I also don't hear any Robin Williams in the callouts.
Quotes like "Fly up the ramp" and "Try again" sound like Tinkerbell from the movie to me. Peter sounds like Robin Williams as well. Maybe I'm not paying enough attention to the voices?
Quoted from armi0024:
Ok guys, I have a good vac forming place and I'm going to take the my Rufio in to copy it. Is there enough interest to run as many as 50-100 of these?
I may be interested, not sure. Mine has a hole in it as well. To be clear this is the small right ramp behind the baseball jackpot plastic? Is there any estimate on what each ramp would cost at a run of 50?
Quoted from Mizzoo70:
Hey guys. I was wondering if someone could do me a solid and post some pics of their bumper area with the Tree plastics. I was finally able to track down the piece that I was missing and am having a hell of a time finding pics of the best way to attach it. Thanks.
Check out my photos:
Quoted from ChadH:
My unofficial Hook patch has been released!
Bangarang!!! This classic movie themed pinball machine from 1992 now plays better than ever. Newly balanced scoring. Ball Save has been fixed and is now user adjustable. Completely rewritten Left Ramp and Drop Target logic adds a whole new risk/reward challenge. Right Scoop Awards have been overhauled. Multiball jackpots have been increased for better balance. New optional Tournament Mode adjustment has been added. Previously unused voice calls and music have been added. Many, many, bug fixes. Much more!
You can read all the details of the changes and download the patch from my website at:
Let me know what you think.
Excellent, will have to update the beta code in my game. For the record I believe the sound callout is "fly up the ramp" under the audio changes section at the end.
Holy crap, thanks!! Also, pretty creative!
Played it some more today and the last minor issue I knew of (which was Tinkerbell repeating "Shoot it!" every 5 seconds in the shooter lane and wasn't expecting you to fix) is now gone. I'd say it's perfect now.
I would replace the connector and header on the display driver board for the 5v power supply. But before doing that, I would verify you are getting a stable 5v (or close to 5v) to the connector. You can press your meter leads against the pins in the IDC connector from the back to check this. I would do this with the display unplugged as from experience a poor connection at the board can cause this to read low and make it appear to be an issue between the power supply and the connector.
Quoted from garretswinning:
Well i found the problem with the restart with alot of help from todd at tnt amusements. its the board that runs the rope light on the wincoaster.
Are you using an aftermarket power supply? If so check the solution in this thread.
Quoted from ChrisRAD:
Excited to be part of the club! Picked it up with one broken plastic (already have a replacement ordered) and some lights out. Just general cleaning needed otherwise. Anyone know where to get a repro clear red shooter rod?
Where did you find a single replacement plastic? This game and a lot of other Data East games use partially transparent plastics. I know CPR has been doing Data East sets in the past year but like you I occasionally have only one or two that need replacement.
Quoted from chuckwurt:
Anyone have tips to reduce the speaker hum? My LW3 has it too, but this one is much louder and is going to a home where they will only have this game.
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