I don't know Mike
There is a small factory in Geelong that recently closed that hadmost of the equipment to make a pinball machine

Great updates.

Regarding the coloured LED DMD, I hope it'll be one of the higher density / resolution ones, not standard 192x32. I know they're considerably more expensive, but I would assume you can obtain them for reasonable prices within China. I think it'd make the machine a lot more eye-catching. Also, personally, my preference would be for a taller 3 (SEGA) aspect.

Thanks for the reply.

I'd settle for higher resolution (i.e. eye candy) over taller aspect, though, if it were a choice between that. I'm afraid pretty wins over more information, for me. But then, the excessively letter-boxed format is going to suck for the guy doing animations ... 6 isn't going to allow too much scope for rockets blasting off vertically. I suppose that would be where creativity could come in, and things could head towards the player and make use of perspective.

Thanks for the answer. This is very interesting.

I just wanted to chime in here that from what I have been told from a number of people who I know that do work in China - not in the pinball world - this is all true. China has discovered some personal wealth, and as a country is now demanding better paying jobs and cleaner cities and so on. They are still the kings at making certain things (like electronics, plastic trinkets, and so on) because they set those up before the middle class started demanding things that the rest of the world expects already.

Because the infrastructure is there, they continue to have the ability to do a lot of this work significantly cheaper than other places, however the costs have been rising. If shipping costs go up significantly, or if tariffs are enacted, those types of goods will rise in price significantly as there really isn't any way to switch a lot of that manufacturing away at this particular point in time.

The above is also why, until HomePin came along, it really didn't make sense to send the few pinball manufacturing jobs overseas. You would still have to create all of the infrastructure to build a machine in a new factory, and then you would have to deal with shipping all of your product away from the country as China isn't a pinball hotbed (at all). By keeping manufacturing in the US, you are in one of your largest markets.

For HomePin, where the infrastructure doesn't exist in the country they are in, and where they are touching in other related markets, it makes total sense for him to use China.

Finally, I'll just toss out there that I bought a board from Homepin a few months ago, and it arrived quickly in great shape with some nice extras thrown in. I wish them nothing but the best!

Granted Australia's average wage is higher than China so that is one big benefit to make them in China but in years they might align more so, but Australia does have hardwood plywoods at reasonable prices and can be custom veneered for close to half that estimate.

A shame they aren't made in Aus, but you have a wealth of experience in China.

As for the rest of the infrastructure Australia's major cities like Sydney, Melbourne and Newcastle are capable to do press tooling, injection molding etc with 2 options do it in-house by hiring machinists to design and build in-house or use external companies, but as soon as you hire an external company to design / make a press tool the price jumps fast ($20k for a small 100-150mm part to $50k for a large 400-600mm 3mm thick part) but they know what they are doing and can often achieve results in 1 run maybe with a few minor component changes. In a previous job I got external companies to quote on all our press tooling but then used that to justify keeping most of the work in-house as the machinists work wonders at close to 2/3 the cost. My advice with your press tooling is make sure you store it and own it when not used and when shearing and stamping thousands of parts keep a few spares of the main cutting blades for quick swap out as depending on the machine steels used for stamping and the material you are reforming the critical blades could last 500 stamps to 20000 stamps.

More importantly, do they have good Chinese takeout food there?

China may be an emerging nation with a growing middle class, but they still have a long way to go before they reach the standards of many Western countries particularly in terms of employee conditions and guarantees, workplace safety standards and quality control for many of their mass produced export products.

It needs to be remembered that many of the current generation of entry level factory line workers in China are only one generation removed from an agrarian focussed economy, many of whom still have parents that eke out an existence on the family farm that has been held in the family for the last few hundred years.

When there is no reasonable long term prospect of flourishing there, of course many of that generation will move to the big cities in search of a more stable income on the factory lines. The problem being that without ever being exposed to this type of technology before, coupled with a lack of proper training and in house quality control you cannot expect to obtain an end product with a quality and durability that is befitting to its purpose and price point.

China's middle class will continue to grow and with that will come the expectations of further improved employment conditions and living standards. I predict at some point in the future, the concept of a foreign investor setting up a manufacturing base in the country will no longer be profitable/beneficial enough to make it a viable long term prospect given the amounts of capital injection required and evolving workplace standards.

We get some the items we sell from China and they are pretty good really. They will make you shit if you ask for it and will make it to a better quality if you ask for it. They are good at reproducing what you want them to make, just depends on the quality you are after and how much you will pay for it.

Made in China most certainly does not always mean crap product.

R&D ... replicate and distribute.

a good Chinese factory with a good QA manager is gold. Keep it up mike.

This is interesting. I assume though that Chinese workers are still very cheap compared to American labor because somehow it's still profitable for companies to have them make their item and ship it to the U.S.

Probably not. If you're talking about a US factory employing immigrants without papers, paying well under minimum wage, as a large % of the assembly labour, as has been repeatedly alleged for pinball past & present ........ Versus a foreign (particularly Western) owned and operated factory in China where the authorities and workers will both demand decent pay and reasonable lodgings. As Mike suggested, infrastructure, materials and machinery are another matter entirely, however.

It is as disingenuous to claim that all Chinese manufactured products are "shit" (which I didn't) as it is to lay all the blame for the lack of quality control in the end product on the Western buyer and their desire to only wanting to pay the lowest possible wholesale price.

By that rationale you could then put forward the proposition that due to being strongarmed by a Western buyer the Chinese manufacturer would therefore want to maximise their own profits by cutting corners or using substandard materials in the manufacturing process itself. For example, carbon steel balls that obviously contain impure raw materials and quickly magnetise when put into use in a pinball machine.

I agree that both views are a far too simplistic analysis of Chinese manufacturing (and the overall culture) as a whole and in such a case blame for any manufacturing defects must be apportioned both fairly and even handedly at both the manufacturing and managerial (quality control) level.

Clearly there are a multitude of reasons why manufacturing standards in China can and often do fall well below quality standards and are in many cases deemed not fit for purpose or fall below basic safety standards upon arrival in export destination countries. The reasons for some of these I alluded to in my previous post and cover not only practical firsthand on site problems (as well as subcontracting out manufacturing work to offsite third parties) but social and generational transitional issues as well.

Loving the thread Mike!

Keep the info coming, so awesome to see and read so much information that we would not normally get a chance to know about.

So you're saying it's not cheaper to make an item in China and ship it to the U.S.? Then why are U.S. companies making a majority of items in China?

NAFTA.... you hardly pay customs or taxes to ship items from China to North America.

I thought NAFTA had to do with free trade among the countries in North America, Mexico, U.S. and Canada. Nothing to do with China.

Besides tariffs or taxes there's still shipping costs but I guess that's miniscule when spread out over a thousand items.

No I'm not ... read latter part of post.

"As Mike suggested, infrastructure, materials and machinery are another matter entirely, however."

Meaning they should be much more affordable and accessible.

The equivalence of NAFTA with China then LOL

He shoots.. he scores...!

I swear FedEx workers did that to my kitchen cabinets when I redid the Kitchen a few years back. You would think these workers or bosses would know this is the most inefficient way to load a truck.

I've seen american dock workers treat boxes way worse. There's a reason why there's extra tape on the outside of your box, it probably ripped open at one point.

The complete lack of care displayed in that video is shocking...

I'm sure it was something nice though........

I like old mate at the end, turfing them in there from way back

They are treated like a guest. LOL

Wow, great video. Those cabinets look sweet!

A very important addition, I've never had a lot of success with those squat ones

Nothing more important than good planning I say. That Western toilet is a stroke of genius and an absolute must have in the factory. Well done.

It was a good little video and great to be able to see a little of the factory. My only nitpick is he referred to them as pinball tables, but I won't harp on about that old debate.

We are getting closer and closer. I cannot wait to see it.

Will it be possible to order your more generic parts for doing custom games? I imagine your stuff will be both cheaper and higher quality than what's available now.

Mike, those flipper links (the whites ones in the first pic) look like soft plastic, can they stand up to 1000s of cycles? I don't remember but weren't the old flipper links made from some kind of composite?

Hi Mike-and fellow followers of this informative,educational and generally interesting thread here on Pinside,

It appears that Homepin is turning into just a great "New" pinball company-with what appears to have solid morals,values,business sense and their own resources from other ventures to support the "start up" and growing pains of a venture in the 21st Century.

Here is the link I found to Homepin when doing a Google search for "Thunderbirds are Go".............need to find some episodes and watch some of this program,this winter

Mike,Looks like it is almost time to update your website with the latest video you shared with us yesterday !!!

http://www.homepin.com/abouttag.html

Following with much interest,Kirk in Colorado

wow,

It's amazing how much shit Mike had to deal with on pinside early on, along with stated personal issues, and had the fortitude to put all that behind him, come back here, and now show with complete transparency what it takes to make a top quality pinball machine. Which is what I'm sure it will be.

Hats off to Homepin!

Things seem to be progressing nicely.

All this work without preorder money?!

Wishing you the best of luck! Great thread by the way.

Yeah, but that small number of fully paid preorders get their games first