(Topic ID: 159525)

Home Owners Insurance Covers Pinball Machines?


By WackyBrakke

3 years ago



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  • Latest reply 1 year ago by MrBally
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    There are 103 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
    #1 3 years ago

    I have 8 pinball machines in my collection, when you add up the value it is pretty staggering. What do all you guys with lots of machines do about insurance? I suspect they would not be fully covered by standard home owners insurance?

    #2 3 years ago

    I have asked my agent that several times and he keeps telling me they are covered as part of the contents of my house, and no special rider is needed. I have State Farm in case that makes a difference.

    #3 3 years ago

    You have to add them to your insurance. Pictures, descriptions, value and serial numbers.

    #4 3 years ago

    I have documentation from my insurance agent that there is no supplemental coverage needed for my pinball machines. They fall under the "contents" section of the policy and are not considered special, like jewelry. I was concerned that they might be labeled "collectables" and therefor excluded.

    As long as I don't exceed my maximum dollar coverage amount, mine are covered. So if you have $500,000 in coverage in contents and you're below that including the pinball machines, you're in good shape.

    Disclaimer: I'm not an insurance agent, nor do I play one on TV. My coverage might be different than yours, so you'll probably want to contact your agent.

    #5 3 years ago

    This was just asked a few weeks ago. The answer was "yes" your machines would be covered, however you may have a hard time claiming what they are worth. I would meet with ( yes meet, not call) your insurance agent and go over estimated values and get everything signed, documented, and in writing. Don't assume anything or take it word of mouth.

    #6 3 years ago

    Agreed with Spyder. I have been told they are covered. But, the value can be very difficult to prove.

    Jaz

    #7 3 years ago

    Almost anything is quantifiable (background in derivatives).

    Would agree that a face-to-face with your risk off-taker would be beneficial.

    I am a Chief Risk Officer for a Fund and have to do several "meet and greets" with all of my insurers / hedge fund partners.

    #8 3 years ago
    Quoted from arcademojo:

    You have to add them to your insurance. Pictures, descriptions, value and serial numbers.

    I have a separate rider for each of my 12 pinball machines. I have had several discussions with my insurance agent regarding this issue and this is what I am most comfortable with.

    Gord

    #9 3 years ago
    Quoted from GRB1959:

    I have a separate rider for each of my 12 pinball machines. I have had several discussions with my insurance agent regarding this issue and this is what I am most comfortable with.
    Gord

    Best thing to do right there.

    #10 3 years ago

    It's tricky. I talked to my agent and I have coverage of up to $250,000 on personal items, but they still recommend I "schedule" them separately.

    I'm not sure why I would have to do that if I'm already covered for $250,000.

    They did tell me to have receipts, serial numbers and pictures of all of them incase there is a fire and they cannot be recovered

    #11 3 years ago

    My games are in a polebarn, when I discussed it with my agent, I was told best way to go was agreed value of contents of said polebarn. So I put a replacement value on everything, and that is what I am covered for. My agent also said to take pictures/video of everything to prove what is really there in case of a claim.
    Aaron

    #12 3 years ago

    Mine are covered under my personal property and are part of that limit (~$435k). Mine may have a value around $20k, so there is no problem there. There is no schedule for pinball machines with my company as there is with jewelry/coins/watches/furs/firearms/arts etc....
    Coverage shouldn't be an issue unless your pin value is a significant percentage of your personal property coverage and then you can always increase your personal property coverage for an extra premium if needed.

    #13 3 years ago

    I went with collectinsure after my insurance agent changed their story multiple times. Pretty much every time I asked I was told something different.

    #14 3 years ago

    I have pictures and video of mine. Agent says I'm covered.

    #15 3 years ago

    Thanks for this thread. Just emailed my agent.

    #16 3 years ago
    Quoted from gliebig:

    Mine are covered under my personal property and are part of that limit (~$435k). Mine may have a value around $20k, so there is no problem there. There is no schedule for pinball machines with my company as there is with jewelry/coins/watches/furs/firearms/arts etc....
    Coverage shouldn't be an issue unless your pin value is a significant percentage of your personal property coverage and then you can always increase your personal property coverage for an extra premium if needed.

    Sure there covered until your house burns down and you have no prof of what games you had. Lets see what happens then. My one friend thought the same. He got $800 from his insurance on a $3500 pin.

    #17 3 years ago

    My house is insured for almost twice what I paid for it. When I questioned my agent about that, he said, "well, if it burns down, there's all the demo and clean up, and it will cost a lot more to build it to today's code. Also, you have $1,000,000 worth of coverage for your possessions". "I don't have a million dollars worth of stuff". "Doesn't matter. It's all part of the package". Gee, I guess I forgot to update my pinside collection to include BBB and King Kong.

    #18 3 years ago
    Quoted from arcademojo:

    Sure there covered until your house burns down and you have no prof of what games you had. Lets see what happens then. My one friend thought the same. He got $800 from his insurance on a $3500 pin.

    ? I have proof of what games I own. Easy enough nowadays to take a walkthrough video of your house/possessions and store it. Also sounds like he has a shifty insurance company or cheaper out on paying for contents replacement cost. Bunch of holes in that little blurb of info.

    #19 3 years ago

    I am an insurance agent. You need to schedule them. They are considered collectibles to claims adjusters. Collectibles have a cap of limits on a policy typically 2500$ in TOTAL COVERAGE FOR ALL MACHINES NOT EACH MACHINE.

    The advantage of scheduling them as well is they are covered for ANY direct loss unless otherwise stated in your policy. A standard policy is only going to cover fire, theft, and other things not likely to happen. Scheduling covers power surge, the jack ass friend picking up your machine in rage and slamming it(we all know THAT GUY) a drink spilled in it frying the boards etc.

    I can tell you 100% first hand from my JOB you need to schedule them. As a collector I made damn sure to ask the right questions to my underwriters, they are 100% considered collectibles/fine art.

    Please please trust me. It's not a lot to schedule them.

    #20 3 years ago

    I am a chief risk officer and underwriter for a $9bn portfolio.

    You need to schedule..full stop.

    Last time I warn you guys.

    #21 3 years ago

    Thanks for all the info, I am going to contact my insurance agent and schedule them, not going to chance it with "normal" coverage.

    #22 3 years ago

    So does "scheduling" them cost more or just a formal process?

    #23 3 years ago

    If you have a lightning strike zap out the tv's in your house are they not covered? If you knock your flat screen off the wall, if you spill your drink on your tv and fry it, Is it not covered? I had a power surge that caused 10k in damages. All was covered. None of which was scheduled items. Why would you say a pinball machine would be an exception?...it isn't.
    I spoke with underwriters from several companies that I deal with today and each one told me they are covered under the personal property coverage.
    Always a good idea to document what you own and save it electronically so you have proof. Take photos of receipts etc..

    #24 3 years ago

    They are covered, but you will not get replacement value, you will get far far less, especially for games that are not currently being made, which is like 98% of them.

    If you are truly concerned about them, you need to schedule them, its not that much. I have all my games scheduled and covered separately from my home insurance policy. They required that I gave them a copy of the Mr. Pinball 2016 pricing guide, so that the underwriters could have something to base true market value off of.

    Here is what to ask your insurance agent, let's say you have an awesome shape, HUO twilight zone worth roughly 6500-7000 in value. Ask them if that machine gets destroyed or stolen, will you be able to claim that full 7k and get it without hassle under your current home owners policy? I bet you find the general answer is no for that specific scenario.

    #25 3 years ago
    Quoted from altan:

    So does "scheduling" them cost more or just a formal process?

    It is both.

    #26 3 years ago

    If you have replacement cost on your contents and your five year old 80" tv is lost in a claim, are they going to give you $100 for an old tv? No. They will replace it. Sounds to me like you guys have cheap insurance companies or are getting answers from people that don't really know coverage.

    #27 3 years ago
    Quoted from gliebig:

    If you have replacement cost on your contents and your five year old 80" tv is lost in a claim, are they going to give you $100 for an old tv? No. They will replace it. Sounds to me like you guys have cheap insurance companies or are getting answers from people that don't really know coverage.

    Sure, and this one is simple, those style of TVs are still being made. It is easily replaced by a current model, and you are nice and happy.

    The answer I was given for general coverage, is that if something happens to my Big Bang Bar, worth 15k, they will look to currently being made machines to try and replace it. I will not get anywhere close to 15k, not gonna happen, unless its scheduled, and its value is documented for the underwriters.

    #28 3 years ago
    Quoted from gliebig:

    Sounds to me like you guys have cheap insurance companies or are getting answers from people that don't really know coverage.

    Sounds to me that you are too trusting of your insurance company. I have been fucked by insurance enough to know that they are e not there to help you when you need them. They will however tell you what they need to to make sure they are able to stick it to you without lube.
    Trust me. Your insurance company is not your friend. Fine art is not covered and either are pins.

    #29 3 years ago

    Limits to fine art coverage is specifically listed in the policy, as is jewelry, coins, cash, firearms, etc... there is no such wording for pinball machines.

    -2
    #30 3 years ago

    How can a NIB pin be considered a "collectible," especially when it's WWE?

    #31 3 years ago

    I was told by many they were covered as personal property, but that is incorrect.

    As stated, maybe one machine at $2500, but the agents are not always listening or knowledgeable.
    They should be scheduled...sorry..thats the way it is.

    Sadly the cost quoted to me was a number that made no sense.

    Looking into private collectible insurance now.

    #32 3 years ago

    I know my Home Owners policy covers up to $250,000 for personal property (including pinball machines coming directly from a supervising manager). Documentation is key for filing a claim. The more documentation you have the better including video, pictures, serial numbers, and preferably any receipts for purchases. Then keep in a safe place preferably outside the home in case of a fire. I asked my agent about all of the possibilities of the machines not being covered and the only thing that came up is flooding, where special flood insurance is necessary if you are located in or near a flood plain. According to my agent any additional coverage for personal property was not necessary and was a waste of money.

    #33 3 years ago

    My issue with insurance companies is they will verbally say yeah no problem, it's covered. Then you read the extremely long policy contract and it seems like there are lots of loop holes on what is and is not covered. There are aways limits of jewelry, computers, and other random crap. So I basically do not trust anything they say to me verbally, and I'll bet you anything they would not fully cover, or come anywhere close to it, the value of the pinball machines. Has anyone on here had an incident where they actually had to use insurance on their machines? If so how did that go? I think for me it's worth it to schedule them and pay whatever extra that costs. This way it's in writing, which is the only way I will know they are covered. Having an agent tell me verbally doesn't do it for me at all.

    #34 3 years ago

    As I always say; Insurance COmpaNies are your friend, until something goes wrong.

    #35 3 years ago
    Quoted from OLDPINGUY:

    I was told by many they were covered as personal property, but that is incorrect.
    As stated, maybe one machine at $2500, but the agents are not always listening or knowledgeable.
    They should be scheduled...sorry..thats the way it is.
    Sadly the cost quoted to me was a number that made no sense.
    Looking into private collectible insurance now.

    Let me know what you go with Art, I did collect insure as they seem to be well liked online. Always willing to change though.

    #36 3 years ago
    Quoted from WackyBrakke:

    My issue with insurance companies is they will verbally say yeah no problem, it's covered. Then you read the extremely long policy contract and it seems like there are lots of loop holes on what is and is not covered. There are aways limits of jewelry, computers, and other random crap. So I basically do not trust anything they say to me verbally, and I'll bet you anything they would not fully cover, or come anywhere close to it, the value of the pinball machines. Has anyone on here had an incident where they actually had to use insurance on their machines? If so how did that go? I think for me it's worth it to schedule them and pay whatever extra that costs. This way it's in writing, which is the only way I will know they are covered. Having an agent tell me verbally doesn't do it for me at all.

    Someone had their BBB stolen a while back and insurance tried to give them something like $600.

    #37 3 years ago
    Quoted from OLDPINGUY:

    Looking into private collectible insurance now.

    The last time we did this thread (and you will find this thread repeated at least once a year if not more often) there were a lot of folks recommending the collectable specific insurance. In fact one of those agents actually joined in on the thread. After a lot of back and forth it was revealed that collectable policies are typically secondary insurance coverage. Which means you still have to collect on a loss with your primary insurance company. The only thing they will pay is the difference that your primary provider won't pay as compared to the agreed value of each item. So for instance your TZ burns up and your primary only pays you $5000 to replace it, but you had collector insurance that says it's worth $5500. So for all the money you pay for that secondary coverage they are only on the hook for $500 in the case of a total loss. When you look at it that way it's a LOT of money for very little actual coverage. Weirdly there were people in that thread that still wanted to stick with it.

    For me I went around and around with my insurance company. Because they don't have exclusions or exceptions for collectables I was told my contents replacement would cover them. I kept those emails to have something to fall back on, and I've video documented my collection. In the end insurance is all about trust any way you look at it.

    #38 3 years ago
    Quoted from viper001:

    After a lot of back and forth it was revealed that collectable policies are typically secondary insurance coverage. Which means you still have to collect on a loss with your primary insurance company. The only thing they will pay is the difference that your primary provider won't pay as compared to the agreed value of each item. So for instance your TZ burns up and your primary only pays you $5000 to replace it, but you had collector insurance that says it's worth $5500. So for all the money you pay for that secondary coverage they are only on the hook for $500 in the case of a total loss. When you look at it that way it's a LOT of money for very little actual coverage. Weirdly there were people in that thread that still wanted to stick with it.

    But say your primary only pays $500 for the TZ (depreciated value from the NIB price) then you are screwed.

    #39 3 years ago
    Quoted from viper001:

    In the end insurance is all about trust any way you look at it.

    Exactly!
    Why do they call it Home Owners Insurance- To Insure your belongings and your peace of mind.

    On a side note-I got hit with hail hard two years ago and the process was very easy, simple and they covered everything with no problems or delays.

    If you want extra peace of mind they sell devices and security systems that have sensors that can detect changes in environment like water, heat, and also have motion sensors/cameras that instantly notify you when triggered via your cell phone.

    #40 3 years ago

    This has been covered several times, if you search you'll be able to find all the answers. I'm an agent. Collectibles to us here isn't a collectible to an insurance adjuster. A penny from 1890 is worth $.01. You need to have something separate for anything collectible of value. With my company you are covered but not nearly for what you need to be covered at. It's a set replacement value of $500 because its considered commercial equipment. Other companies will classify it as electronics, which some will have set limits there. Others won't care. It will also vary state to state. The best thing you can do is have a separate policy for them. It was determined here on Pinside that there is a company that sells insurance on collectibles and that was the best route.

    And I'm going to say this again and I cannot stress this enough. When something happens, its not your Agent who deems something a covered loss, it is your adjuster/claims department. Check with them at your company.

    #41 3 years ago
    Quoted from futurepinhead:

    This has been covered several times, if you search you'll be able to find all the answers. I'm an agent. Collectibles to us here isn't a collectible to an insurance adjuster. A penny from 1890 is worth $.01. You need to have something separate for anything collectible of value. With my company you are covered but not nearly for what you need to be covered at. It's a set replacement value of $500 because its considered commercial equipment. Other companies will classify it as electronics, which some will have set limits there. Others won't care. It will also vary state to state. The best thing you can do is have a separate policy for them. It was determined here on Pinside that there is a company that sells insurance on collectibles and that was the best route.
    And I'm going to say this again and I cannot stress this enough. When something happens, its not your Agent who deems something a covered loss, it is your adjuster/claims department. Check with them at your company.

    Here is a great answer, yet people will STILL argue.

    #42 3 years ago
    Quoted from Syco54645:

    But say your primary only pays $500 for the TZ (depreciated value from the NIB price) then you are screwed.

    This is true. The goal is to have just one company that will agree with your interpretation of the value. My point was you can get that with just one insurance company, having separate policies with different companies on the same items is a windfall of profit for those 2 companies, and they will certainly encourage you to do such a thing as it limits their exposure on your loss. Using my TZ example if you can prove it's worth $5500 you aren't going to end up getting more than that, both companies will only be paying a partial claim to end up at that number. Using this logic you could have 7 or 8 policies on the games but you will still only end up with the same payout.

    #43 3 years ago
    Quoted from viper001:

    This is true. The goal is to have just one company that will agree with your interpretation of the value. My point was you can get that with just one insurance company, having separate policies with different companies on the same items is a windfall of profit for those 2 companies, and they will certainly encourage you to do such a thing as it limits their exposure on your loss. Using my TZ example if you can prove it's worth $5500 you aren't going to end up getting more than that, both companies will only be paying a partial claim to end up at that number. Using this logic you could have 7 or 8 policies on the games but you will still only end up with the same payout.

    Yes however keep in mind that insurance companies are masters of deception. For instance a 3 month old car will depreciate $8k with some insurance companies. I suppose it is all about trust and I do not trust a company that cannot give a straight answer to my question. I spoke with my agent multiple times and was told something different every time.
    First call was yes, 100%. Second time it was covered to 2500 total (for all of the games since that is the cap on industrial equipment). Then it was fully covered on games I can still buy new, collectibles under 10 years old it doesn't cover however older up to 2500 total for the entire collection unless I schedule. I said eff this noise and ordered a supplemental policy. It was I think $115 a year.

    #44 3 years ago

    I've spoken with underwriting and a couple claims adjusters, and yes, I also have their email responses saved on my computer. All have said that the machines are part of the contents coverage. My policy is also in their "Promark" tier, which gives me All Risk coverage on my property. You should check your coverage to see if you are covered for named perils or all risk. It is still extremely important to document your machines with pictures/video/receipts. I took a walkthrough my house and recorded each room, opened closets..etc. Took all of 10 minutes. Extremely valuable if you have a large claim like a fire.

    #45 3 years ago
    Quoted from Syco54645:

    I spoke with my agent multiple times and was told something different every time.
    First call was yes, 100%. Second time it was covered to 2500 total (for all of the games since that is the cap on industrial equipment). Then it was fully covered on games I can still buy new, collectibles under 10 years old it doesn't cover however older up to 2500 total for the entire collection unless I schedule.

    At the risk of pointing out the obvious, why would you want to stick with a company you obviously can't trust? You need them to pay off the rest of your contents in case of a total loss, right?

    #46 3 years ago

    Your insurance agent is not the underwriter who actually makes the decisions. I wouldn't trust the agent aka sales guy on any of the 'am I covered' questions.

    #47 3 years ago
    Quoted from flynnibus:

    Your insurance agent is not the underwriter who actually makes the decisions. I wouldn't trust the agent aka sales guy on any of the 'am I covered' questions.

    To kind of build off of what you said, yes, ask the underwriters directly. But you made it sound like the agent is just looking for a sale. I promise you, that will almost never be the case. If you are an agent like I am, you'll never say anything just to get a sale. An agent might be confused on a coverage, but ultimately, if something goes wrong, you're the person the customer will come to confront if its not covered. Not all sales guys are scumbags for the most part, that breed of salesman died with the internet.

    #48 3 years ago
    Quoted from WackyBrakke:

    My issue with insurance companies is they will verbally say yeah no problem, it's covered. Then you read the extremely long policy contract and it seems like there are lots of loop holes on what is and is not covered. There are aways limits of jewelry, computers, and other random crap. So I basically do not trust anything they say to me verbally, and I'll bet you anything they would not fully cover, or come anywhere close to it, the value of the pinball machines. Has anyone on here had an incident where they actually had to use insurance on their machines? If so how did that go? I think for me it's worth it to schedule them and pay whatever extra that costs. This way it's in writing, which is the only way I will know they are covered. Having an agent tell me verbally doesn't do it for me at all.

    Yes, a friend of mine had a house fire and lost his restored Haunted House. He had paid $3500. For it. He got $800. From his insurance company. This was a few years ago. The game didn't burn but was smoke damaged and everything was covered in black soot. Plastics melted and backglass shattered.

    #49 3 years ago
    Quoted from futurepinhead:

    To kind of build off of what you said, yes, ask the underwriters directly. But you made it sound like the agent is just looking for a sale. I promise you, that will almost never be the case. If you are an agent like I am, you'll never say anything just to get a sale. An agent might be confused on a coverage, but ultimately, if something goes wrong, you're the person the customer will come to confront if its not covered. Not all sales guys are scumbags for the most part, that breed of salesman died with the internet.

    I wasn't inferring that - only that the agent isn't the actual decision maker, he's the sales agent. Good intentioned or not, 'my agent said it was covered' will not change an outcome if the underwriters rule against you.

    -1
    #50 3 years ago
    Quoted from OLDPINGUY:

    Looking into private collectible insurance now.

    Good idea.

    The Art of Coverage: Collectibles Insurance vs. Traditional Homeowners Policy
    http://www.propertycasualty360.com/2013/06/24/the-art-of-coverage-collectibles-insurance-vs-trad

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