Yes, that's correct, but sometimes they send a series of codes that will do alternate functions.... and sometimes the sound board itself decides to play one sound out of 2 or 3.

There was a map somewhere I remember seeing of the 'common' codes (like tilt, no sound, game start, etc.) that are the same for each game but I've no idea where I saw it or how long ago it was.

Slide a spackle spreader/joint knife down to work the nails out behind them once you get the head out a little bit you can grab it with your fingers or pliers and pull it out. Once those start to come out there's not much friction holding them in.

You don't want to mangle the metal guide at all once that's messed up it will never sit correctly once it goes back on.

The heat sink is also the +5 ground point isn't it? Probably they want it there so there isn't one wire going from the entire bundle back. I'd do whatever John Robertson at flippers.com says in this case since he figured it out in the first place.

No, he's Rec.games.pinball.

The whole newsgroup, at this point, with maybe 10-12 other people that occasionally post, but most of them are here now, including me.

He's got the info on his website as well:
https://flippers.com/gottlieb_ground_cures.html

System 80 has the 5 second boot time.

80a does not.

The 5 second boot time is widely assumed to be a set of startup diagnostic sequences similar to Bally/Stern of the time - it is not, it's just a delay loop! Cheap.

Nope, I do this all the time. Just make sure your machine post and tnut gets more than a thread or 2 into it - should ideally make it all the way to the bottom.

Almost everything smears/pulls the ink off, at least on system 1.

The single strip components are resistor networks, not ICs.

I thought the pascal 4 in 1 didn't use the small transformer just the large one?
The pascal just mpu board would need it since the original power supply is still being used.

Ni Wumpf.

Well.... a full rewrite anyway, for system 80.

Although for system 1, the byte code is documented at:
https://www.flipprojets.fr/Pgol_EN.php
with an assembler at:
https://www.flipprojets.fr/PgolASM_EN.php

They're designed to take whatever pulse length from the pop skirt switch and give a consistent pop. If the pop switch locks on, it's designed to only give ONE pop, until that input is cleared.

On the original boards, you need to update them per pinwiki:
https://www.pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Gottlieb_System_80#Updating_the_Pop_Bumper_Driver_Board

There may be individual fuses associated with each, a lot of Gottlieb's do use them. Manual doesn't call it out like some other ones do, though. They are usually in the front right of the machine.

You should be able to, system 80s let you set in 10k increments.

There are free play roms available as well, in addition to 6-7 digit conversions.

switch 19 off (replay limits), switch 20 off (normal game mode), switch 21 on (replay)

Yeah, that's not gonna work for you then.

All system 80a are 100k increments. System 80a is actually internally a /10 setup built off of system 80 and they just add a dummy 0 to the 1's digit. (Similar to how Alien Poker did it).

That's why 7 digit 80a games have '00' instead of '0' at game start.

For tournaments there are people that have the keys so just keep loading up the credits or do one of the non-invasive methods, or put the free play roms in.

Very possible if they are from the same lot. There's counterfeit chips everywhere!! I only buy pulls, erase and reprogram them myself.

Q39 or Z10 are bad on your driver board.

pops on system 80 are controlled by individual pop bumper driver boards. Try swapping one for another, it's likely either you have a blown fuse for that pop if they are individually fused like a lot of gottlieb's are or the pop board is bad (usually the one shot chip, passives, or the transistor.)

there is an upgrade that needs to be done to those boards as well pinwiki has the details

See if the fuse blowing follows one particular pop bumper driver board. It's is most likely a bad driver transistor on the one that drives the bad pop.

They're both connected, it doesn't matter. If someone is working on the board in the future and needs to desolder that pin, the ground wire will probably come off anyway because it's so close. Since on the actual driver board you're doing the ground mod from the topside of the board (IIRC that's the way most of the directions that are worded....) you don't want to get anywhere near any of the chip or component leads since that will be make that component more difficult to remove in the future. Unless you're doing the style of ground mod where you actually attach the ground lead to the component.

The purpose of the ground mod is to make sure the ground potential doesn't rise (get a voltage on it) due to resistance in the connections - which causes transistors driving lamps and solenoids to lock on. If you do the mod properly it will never lock on due to this in the future.

Don't forget to mod the under playfield driver transistors as well if your game uses them with the pull-up voltage, it's more common to get locked on under playfield transistors than on the driver board IMO. (This is NOT referring to the pop bumper driver board ones - it's for the ones that are on little L brackets that use a lamp driver instead of a solenoid driver to run.... for instance on black hole there are a couple to fire various kicker coils like ball release, the tube exit, etc.)

Yes, S2 on sound card plays attract theme when in game over approx every 6 minutes.

Likely your power supply is marginal and removing the extra +5 load from the sound board is giving the MPU board more headroom.

I see from earlier you only have 4.8 volts is that at the 5v test points on the boards or at the power supply? Adjust the power supply pot to give you +5 at the boards they are running, not at the power supply.

I don't see why not, just double check all the voltages are going where they should. Gottlieb parts catalog for 1987 doesn't even list differing transformers.

Parts catalog lists 17908 as the generic flipper coil stop.

It's nice when Marco lists the games it works in, but obviously they don't have them all listed for this part.

Like chuckwurt says, you could just get it from PBR and know you're getting the correct part.

I think that's what everyone is looking for, source of the connectors.

pintech nvram 62256 module works on Rottendog system 80 replacement MPU fine, but you have to remove the battery terminals.

I really dislike having to change batteries periodically on my games so I replace all of them with NVRam where possible.

Those are your switch matrix diodes.

Power off, disconnect all displays, reconnect one display at a time (still power off!)

Test between connecting displays - do each individually then additive once fuse/breaker blows, that display is likely bad (6184 drivers)

Could be fuse (it's individual for each drop reset on sinbad).... could be burned up solenoid driver. This part of system 1 is no different than any other solenoid drive on other makers' games. Transistor or predriver blown, blown coil, wires off, connections, etc. If you get back into the mpu board, you might run into an issue if it's one of the spider chips (u4) - if that's the case he should just get a replacement mpu as the spider chips just aren't available.

Marco specialties sells them search for cherry switch.

Wrong one though, you want the momentary contact one. I couldn't link from my tablet but here it is:
https://www.marcospecialties.com/pinball-parts/02-2141

The one you pictured has a pull out 'on' circuit which wouldn't be correct for your game it would probably work though as it still has a momentary push.

The one I linked (and there looked to be another similar) is just a momentary push button.

This type of switch is (or used to be...) ridiculously common on not just pinball/video games, but in a LOT of other things. Subway turnstiles used them for instance, as well as all sorts of industrial stuff. If you look at other suppliers they will be cheaper (probably about $3) but I find it easiest to just get them from pinball suppliers I have 8-9 of them in my parts bins. They don't get a lot of use in pinball machines vs. their estimated lifespans (usually between 100k-1m activations) so they don't really wear out.

pinball resource would be the go to place for the part

Most of what they have isn't listed on their website.

You are missing the D1 signal for sure on the score displays since it's completely out. (The credit display doesn't use that strobe... but the game also splits those up into 2 different strobes (D1/D9), D1 for p1/p3, and D9 for p2/p4) The segments ('c' appears to be the one that's out, but not on all your digits). The segments are split into 2 groups as well, players 1/2, and the credits display, then the other group is p2/p4. Oddly the c segment isn't out in the first digit though.

Have you tried just one display at a time to see if one is pulling the other segments down? The system 1 manual isn't much help as it just says "replace control board" haha.... yeah. There's discrete logic chips coming out of the U6 spider chip that you could test the inputs/outputs on with a logic probe, but it would seem odd that both would have failed.

if it's the normally open type bend the switch out of the way or cover it with tape/heat shrink.

If it's the normally closed type put the leafs together and wire tie them

The reset board monitors one of the address lines on the mpu and resets it if there's no activity for a bit. If it works fine just leave it but if you start to get random resets, pull it off.

Make sure that's actually the board in question as well - GTB/PRM loved to have special helper boards all over the place game to game. The board you pictured doesn't look anything like the reset board in my one game that has it.

Sounds like your audit data is corrupt, since the battery is dead you can't depend on it coming up with anything resembling correct data. So get the battery going first, then maybe think about replacing the battery backed ram if it persists.

The part of the rom that would control this is in one of the spider chips so you should hope it's not the rom issue. The eprom on system 1 just contains switch scripts, and you know they work since the game plays correctly.

There's no checking on gottlieb games of this era in regards to 'proper' segments (i.e., bad data to displays that other maker's decoder chips reject). So it's displaying the corrupted data as best as it can (missing segments and all....)

You mean the power feed chain? That would be the only wire that would go from coil to coil in the cabinet (chimes and coin lockout on door)

Only one of the spring break says it's 1 ball.... so that one.

It showed when I hovered over it it was the third one over for me.

Nvram. You have stuff in there because it's not necessarily cleared. Zero each entry out manually.

http://www.pinrepair.com/sys1/#roms

to convert to 2716

Yes

4 in one wouldn't need it/use it. Sounds like they just split off the power before the mpu instead of chaining it in. Follow the wires back to see where the power comes in for it.

Probably a 90s solution to the grounding issues GTB games have.

dip 32

It refers to play time, so it's from both player and operator.

Don't forget moderate! LMC. Most games ship with stuff in M.

Pascal boards fire the relays at bootup iirc.

Try reloading the defaults it's possible to power up the game after installing batteries or nvram and the defaults aren't loaded unless you tell the game to do it.

Bad dip.

Relays are the largest coil that could run. Anything larger does the under playfield transistor to drive a larger coil.

Would have been on the upper left but you didn't picture it.

You don't have nvram on yours that's a regular 5101. But the transistor is still in the circuit, I'm not sure what you'd need to do there to fix it. It's one of the surface mount ones to the right of the socket I don't know which one though.

The pinitech and likely the anypin 5101 will work on gottlieb boards - something about a second /CE being needed, or inverted - not sure. I just get the pinitech ones when they're in stock for all my games since they will work on all my boards.

Your existing 5101 might be bad as well have you tried changing it? Looked like it's soldered in on your board... bummer.

This is the one that should work:
https://www.pinitech.com/products/5101_nvram.php

The issues are usually cracked solder on the header pins, and people ripping out eyelets, through holes, and traces when removing on the main cpu board.

Jamma adapter finger board.

They were. The compilers of it got really angry when people shared the info too, as if they had wrote it.

Spirit has a spinning disc in the back box.

No way to do it on stock boards.
Maybe rewire that switch to something else.

It is, the 2nd rollover lights for EB when you get the 3 bank down IIRC. I'd probably just paralell the switch with another one that doesn't score extra stuff, and pull the bulb out.

Disconnect the wires from the EB switch and label them. There might be two on each lug keep them connected together. Then just run two jumpers from the other switch to the one you removed the wires from. Document this somehow like a tag that hangs on the harness so people in the future know.

Gottlieb paralleled switches like ten point standups all the time.
Don't double up lamps unless they're LEDs or you verify they're driven by a larger transistor.

No, those are bridge rectifiers. The QT relays are mounted on the underside of the PF near the top.

https://www.pinitech.com/switch_database.php
For switch matrix charts

Reset board not needed on working system

1> Everyone did it that way then, with the risks involved as you indicate.

2> Use a plastic lifter like Bally did instead. Less likely to wear and break than the fishpaper insulator.
Put heat shrink on the terminals. You can even put heat shrink on most of the switch blade and just leave the 5v contact exposed at the end.

The biggest thing is NEVER adjust switches with the power live. One slip=blown chips

Since they were mimicking chimes it's likely when it causes the hundred to go it's activating both the ten and hundred input at the same time on the sound board which probably plays the other sound.

It means its failing its checksum, so if you had an eprom burner you could read what you have in and compare to a known good copy (you will have to search the web for these... they are out there.)

You would have more issues if you had addressing or data bus issues (which might also report this) but if the game boots and does something it's likely a corrupt eprom.

minipro tl866cs but they are discontinued in the format that does all the early chips. The II version doesn't do the higher voltages needed. Also, it doesn't do 2532 out of the box you have to build an adapter. It will do the eeprom equivalent of 2716's the 2816 so that would solve that there, but some 2732's use a higher voltage as well.

I keep meaning to buy one of the mcmall ones that everyone else seems to use, but just haven't got around to it yet.

You will need an eraser as well.

I can't live without an eprom burner since I do so many rom mods/test burns.

depending on what I'm looking for, ebay, jameco (grab bag is a good deal you have to sometimes clean off label and erase) or amazon.

I have a 40 capacity eraser, I had the cheaper style pictured, but they only do 4-5 at a time.

You'd have to replace the contacts. Cleaning a contact where the plating is gone isn't going to work long term.

Just replace the blades/contacts, you can buy just blades and contacts from pinball resource and other places (the other places usually get them from PBR so go to the source). It starts to get very expensive when you buy already built switches, but the blades and contacts are relatively cheap. You don't need a special tool to crimp new contacts in, the stem is made of brass and you use regular pliers to do it - protect the contact surface by wrapping a cloth around one jaw of your pliers.

You can sometimes do that, as long as the hole doesn't get any bigger. That's odd that the switches are plastic blocks I didn't think gottlieb ever used that type but hey, they're in there so I guess so.

You can also just grab some salvaged switches for parts. You'd still need the new contacts of course.

I did but on a black knight, not a gottlieb game; figured that the special solenoid circuit wasn't really a one-shot so I wanted the good pulse and to avert some locking on. Turned out I hated it (it was too 'crisp' if that makes sense). But there's no reason it wouldn't work.

With the newer replacements that take up less space it's even better. I hand built a 3 pop driver in one board for BK (pop and 2 sling control).