(Topic ID: 73213)

Home for the Gottlieb SYS1-SYS80B guys, Yep it's a club :)

By Gerry

5 years ago

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You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider gdonovan.
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#2843 6 months ago

Good Morning Pinsiders!

I picked up a Gold Wings with some problems.. and I'm on the fence about the machine. It is very fun, but I can't play when something is not 100% as it drives my OCD nuts. If it is something fairly simple, no harm no foul as they say. My biggest problem is working 50-60 hours a week in healthcare I have zero time to be picking up another problem child nor do I wish to invest what extremely little time I have becoming a System 80 technician. There is literately a backlog of things for me to fix at home that is months log it not longer without adding to that pile.

If you can point me in the right direction, I'd be grateful.

1) The 500,000 light does not come on under the aircraft carrier on the right side. It does not light during lamp test, attract mode nor during gameplay. The scoring however works fine. The MPU is seeing the roll over and adds the regular score or 500,000 when conditions are meet (along with the siren going off when 500,000 is struck) A digital volt meter shows a very low flickering voltage below one volt which maybe just oscillations from the other playfield lights going on/off. Led or #44 bulb, no difference.

2) The top left lane roll over does not register during play or test. If I pull the 2 balls out and run the switch test from the menu it comes up "All Switches Open" as it should. Triggering the switch does nothing in gameplay or testing. What is interesting, if I trigger any other switch in the test, that switch will stay up on the display till a different is triggered, is this normal? One would think it would go back to "Open" again but doesn't.

3) The loop the loop bonus build up does not work. The switch tests fine for the entry but the bonus and special light there never come on during gameplay. However during lamp test and attract mode the lights clearly function! During gameplay they are dead as a doornail nor is any bonus awarded.

4) Something curious- During lamp test #2 light will pulse the siren, is this normal?

That is all I can think of off the top my head. I have examined the connectors and they are all clean. At some point the mainboard has been sent out for work as it has a tag on it indicating that a slam switch mod had been done to it and it has a VRAM for high score. The watchdog board was disconnected, which I'm told is ok.

Oh, and where can I find the checksum for the game? I picked up a manual but didn't see it listed but the whole manual reads like something for a Winnnebago Lesharo, in French. Can't make heads nor tails of the wiring diagram.

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#2845 6 months ago
Quoted from JodyG:

Have you done the ground mods yet? The first thing I have been doing lately before I do any deep dives on System 80B machines is reseat the switch connectors on the MPU. I've fixed a couple of strange switch issues lately from doing this alone.

I have plugged and unplugged all connectors which changed nothing and was told ground mods were done in the lower cabinet, which I have verified as being done.

I'm not sure I'm keeping it, was told at time of purchase it was 100%. I paid the asking price, with that in mind. If it is something simple, then no harm, no foul. If it is going to take hours of troubleshooting or board repair then I need to have that discussion with the seller, whom I have been in touch with and wish to give the benefit of the doubt.

I know little about System 80's aside from the ground mods seem popular and a few mentions in TNT videos when discussing bullet-proofing machines. Reviewed them since and if the machines stays I'll do that after.

Would checking continuity of wiring for the 500,000 light or roll over switch to its terminus be of some help? I just need to know where to look. Everything else seems to work fine, no display flicker, etc.

#2846 6 months ago

Follow up- Spent some time troubleshooting when I should be replacing an alternator!

Problem #2 and #3 look to be effectively fixed as I found a bad solder joint or two and fixed them. #4 is normal I think as Gottlieb will use a lamp driver circuit to drive non-lamp items.

#1 I think is a bad driver board. I have continuity from the 500,000 lamp base to pin #9 of the connector but there is no output. Thoughts? How do I isolate one lamp driver line to determine if it is the driver board or MPU?

#2848 6 months ago
Quoted from Topher5000:

I've got a flasher out on my Raven. I know it's cracked solder on the transistor for it, but I haven't fixed it yet. Could it be something like that?

Not sure, the former owner (who has been very gracious through this) indicates it is fairly new. Have to wait and see if anyone can chime in how to determine where the problem lies.

#2851 6 months ago
Quoted from Inkochnito:

The driver board switches to ground. So you never get an output.
You need to check the voltage at the lamp.
If the lamp doesn't light, you must have 6VDC on either side of the socket.
If not, the bulb or socket may be broken.

No voltage at the socket wiring, socket and bulb are therefore eliminated and there is continuity from the socket base to pin #9 of the driver board.

Updated- Socket and bulb tested fine, braid to socket is fine, tapping center of bulb to ground (done briefly) lights bulb in socket.

So were back to ground not being provided by driver board to light lamp.

My mistake on how bulbs are driven on this pinball platform, sorry about that.

I rechecked continuity from pin #9 to the 500,000 point socket center pin, all is good there.

#2852 6 months ago
Quoted from mrm_4:

Doesn’t always boot but when it does I love playing this game!
Also what I’ve found during switch testing is once you adjust a close switch, hit the start button for it to clear and report all open.

Its a fun game, I have managed to get the loop special twice and extra ball a few times. I find the tight playfield to my taste, it really keeps you on your toes! Maddening trying to get the multi-ball release shot when the lane lights up, I'm not anywhere near close to perfecting the shot yet.

Thank you for the tip on the switch "reset"

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#2856 6 months ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

Gold wings is a fun game.
I owned on for almost 10 years.

Now that I have most stuff working played a game with the Mrs. last night, she said she saw the attraction. It is a little fast and tight for her tastes, she really likes the EM's. Me too but it all depends in what you are in the mood for on any given day and I like the variety.

Did a deep dive into the System 80 PinWiki this morning to understand how the lamp circuit works. Were going to try and swap out the driver board as a fairly quick tests but at least I know how the circuit works now and may pickup a meter to test a few items this weekend if I have any spare time.

#2858 6 months ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

That restored gold wings is stunning.
I love the colored rubbers. Nice accent.

It is, I just noticed I have the wrong display mask for mine.

#2860 6 months ago
Quoted from mrm_4:

Since Gold Wings is getting some love at the moment, anyone know of any air craft carrier or plastic arch repos?

I think back one page someone mentioned doing ramps.

#2868 6 months ago

Question for Gold Wings owners- Do the two cockpit lights work? I just noticed them when cleaning some connections and they don't come on during gameplay or light testing. I watched some videos on Youtube and didn't see them come on in those games either. Something that was never implemented?

#2870 6 months ago
Quoted from mrm_4:

I only notice them during the lighting sequence when a ball is dropped in the shooter lane at the start, they flash a few times before you plunge. Also if you nail the spinner really good the cock pit of the jet and the light for the missile flash for a few spins. But nothing during attract mode. Same with the shoot again bulb, only blinks when you get the extra ball.

L18, they are in the test menu under lamp and solenoid tests.

The missile flashes on mine during spinner operation but no cockpit.

#2872 6 months ago
Quoted from mrm_4:

Have you checked/tested the transistors for those lights and the others you were having issues with? I know you mentioned some other problems with lighting previously, did those issues get resolved?

The seller is sending me a driver board that was to go with the machine, he swapped them by accident when troubleshooting his other System 80. No sense picking at this driver board if another will be here in a day or two.

#2882 6 months ago
Quoted from gdonovan:

Question for Gold Wings owners- Do the two cockpit lights work? I just noticed them when cleaning some connections and they don't come on during gameplay or light testing. I watched some videos on Youtube and didn't see them come on in those games either. Something that was never implemented?

Ok, follow up to my questions!

1) The cockpit lights have to be 44's! I was examining the wiring and noted the sockets are wired in SERIES. Popped the LED's out and popped in a set of 44's and we are back in business. I tried 47's and it just smirked at me. 44's worked perfect. Problem solved.

2) The 500,000 light now working! 100% the driver board. I swapped in a Ni-Wumpf driver board and the 500,000 lamp was doing its thing.. but other ugly problems arose.

As soon as I installed the driver board on boot up the lower part of the display was slightly scrambled. This made me cringe and I turned everything back off, rechecked connections and even took some jumper wires with gator clips and made sure the boards had good grounds to each other. After several minutes the problem abated but would return if the machine was off for a bit. I happened to remove the plexi from the display to check the connection there and noted a very ugly looking cap. I think that is going to be replaced next and possible cause of cranky display.

Edit- I let it run for a bit and the display does it all the time now, I think it is best to shut down and leave off till caps are changed.

The other problem is when playing for a fairly short period of time some of the playfield insert lights would get dim.

Release, 100,000, 500,000, Capture and a few others would simply loose their brightness but still work. I checked all connections again, wiggled the harness, examined the bulb sockets with no change noted. Popped the old driver board back in and *poof* problem gone.

At this point in the program planning on doing final ground mods to circuit boards, replace the caps on the display board and check/replace the transistor on the driver board for the 500,000.

What say you on the garbled display? Cap? Did not start till the new board was installed, I'm assuming just coincidence it acted up the same time the board was swapped..
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#2885 6 months ago
Quoted from psd4me:

It looks like the big resistor below them was replaced and that's what put the smoke stains on the caps.

I think you are right, still prudent to replace all the caps on the board. I'm running into a hell of a time in my other hobby (vintage computers) with caps just failing sitting in the box! 20 years is a generous estimate on their life span as they just dry out.

Any other thoughts about the jumpy display? I'm almost starting to regret this, far more work than I have time and money for at the moment.

1 week later
#2898 6 months ago

Waiting on parts..

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#2911 6 months ago
Quoted from JodyG:

I had a customer request a Gold Wings ramp in pink... I kinda dig it! I have pink LED's in my pops... I'd probably go back to white if I ran the pink ramp though.
[quoted image]

I'm thinking about one of your Gold Wings ramp, have to fix the stupid game first before I pump another dime into it though. I might set it on fire and save myself a great deal of aggravation.

1 week later
#2933 5 months ago
Quoted from cadmium:

Howdy! I've recently purchased a Genesis in need of work. I have done the ground mods and have the machine almost working fully. However, I am stuck on an issue with the alphanumeric display. As you can see from the pictures only a few segments light and some are very faint. The broken display segments are frozen and never change.
I put a display from my Bounty Hunter in Genesis and it works fine. I've replaced the two 7147 IC hex buffer chips on the board but that had no change. Any suggestions on where to troubleshoot next? Thanks.

The two "939" Rockwell chips drive the two displays and is what I would suspect if everything else looks good. Frankly for the cost of the two chips you could pickup a good used display and be done with it. Just make sure the voltages are good on the board though, odds of both chips acting up are slim in my opinion but possible. I just got my Gold Wings display working correct and I'm picking up a spare for good measure, let me know if there is any readings I can do for you.

FYI looking at your pictures it caught my eye the cap has been replaced, is it the correct value? Looks far smaller than the original.

1 week later
#2945 5 months ago

My only thought is to check the slam switch on the coin door and make sure it isn't tripped, just had that problem with my Spring Break.

#2948 5 months ago
Quoted from Mtkst19:

Good ideal. My coin door wiring is hokey. I lol check it out after work.

Mine was sensitive enough that the balls launching and striking the drop targets would set it off. Puzzling till I figured it out. Had the meter on the CPU board, watching the 5.0 voltage and trying to get it to act up.. and it was just a switch. Tweaked it and fine ever since.

#2950 5 months ago
Quoted from Mtkst19:

Only thing "off" is game sits very high. Front legs are 27 rears are 28.5 inches. Game leveled out still runs at a 8-9 degrees. Feels off to me.

I really don't know why people do this, manual states 5.5-6 degrees.

#2953 5 months ago

I'm going to be diving into the switch matrix for the first time of a System 80B system, I have a drop target that is not registering as being down. Any advice? I looked over at Pinwiki to get up to speed, but still a little greek to me. First thought is check continuity and then check the diodes in the circuit to make sure there is no failure. I did a visual exam last night and saw nothing and the switch looks good and clean with no broken wires.

#2955 5 months ago
Quoted from Mtkst19:

I agree 100%. But even jacking front legs up rears down I can't get it lower. Would lead me to think rear legs were swapped out. Can anyone confirm leg sizes.

Gottlieb 4337 in my Hot Shots manual is 27 3/8" quantity four.

Some websites list short/tall sets; my factory manual would indicate this is incorrect and borne out with the three System 80's I have here. With the rear jacked up too high you can't even make some of the shots in Spring Break as the ball "falls off" trying to get across the table and will impact the upper turn low.

I just purchased 27" chrome legs from PBResource this week for this very problem, very reasonable at $13 a pop.

#2959 5 months ago
Quoted from jjoravec:

Need help
I have a Gottlieb Diamond Lady that I put all new boards in and I still cannot get any sound? I hear a hum from the speakers and the volume control works, but no game sounds. It will coin up and ply but nothing. Event the test buttons on the sound card produce nothing.
Any thoughts?

Need more info.

Which boards were swapped out? Did you change out the sound board? Were the sound ROMS swapped out for the game?

3 weeks later
#2995 4 months ago

Maintenance on the Spring Break!

Since purchase a month ago the game was vaguely fussy; sound would not initialize right or was distorted time to time and would take a reboot or two to make right. I knew the 5V pot adjuster was fussy and erratic so ordered replacement pots (which didn't fit!)

This morning I drilled out the 5 volt board PCB so the new pot fit and dialed in 5.05 volts, grounded all the circuit boards and took off the battery (which had been changed in 2007 according to the tag) and simply remotely mounted it so even if it fails can't cause any damage.

Machine fired up and is running beautifully, rock solid.

Picture taken before I removed the battery and plugged in the upper MPU connector.

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#2997 4 months ago
Quoted from gweempose:

That's the most tidy grounding job I've ever seen ...

Would have been neater but I'm working on the machine while it is in the line up which entails kneeling on another machine's rails to avoid stressing the glass. I'd pre-cut the wire, tin it and added the eyelet before hefting back up to solder in place.. so lengths were done by eye, a little longer than shorter.

#2999 4 months ago
Quoted from gweempose:

What type of crimping tool do you need to do those eyelets?

Nothing special, standard automotive style eyelets. In this case I was using linesmen pliers which has a built in crimper.

#3001 4 months ago
Quoted from Inkochnito:

I'm back in the club.
I've got a Hot Shots game to restore.

Fun game! I have a really nice one in the line up but we're tight for space and thinking of rotating out. Can't keep them all!

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#3003 4 months ago

Cheap and sleazy Gold Wing mod that looks awesome!

Installed an LED below the capture outhole to illuminate the lens, LED is connected to the capture lamp.

Bright light to the right of the outhole is a lighted post to brighten up the area.

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#3007 4 months ago
Quoted from mrm_4:

To share a mod in return around lighting, I installed 3 spot lights to help with this game. 2 on the slings and 1 on the post at the end of the ramp.
[quoted image][quoted image]

Had not really considered spots; I prefer lighting more indirect and come through the plastics if possible to make them pop a bit. I have considered getting some 4" strip lighting and trying them in various locations. The playfield lighting on mine has been pumped up with some 5SMD towers and 2SMD in the other locations. I'll have to grab a few spots and play around a bit.

The outhole lighting is actually fairly bright, the lighted post is throwing off the camera.

I used a Comet 2SMD orange bulb in it and the "capture" insert. I considered red but that is used in a few other spots and wanted it to be different but still indicate "danger" as in being captured.

Two pictures of my playfield, one with overhead lamp on and the other with off. Camera had trouble focusing when the light was off.

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#3009 4 months ago
Quoted from jdoz2:

I had my cleopatra working great but after a week of play it has developed a problem where two chime coils and the right saucer coil lock on when the game is turn on.
I switched driver boards and the problem still occurs. Is there anything I need to check on the mpu? Anything else it could be?
Ground mods are done, stock mpu, stock driver board, aftermarket power supply.

I'd look at the diagram of the MPU and see if the 3 items are related in any way as to what is controlling them.

2 weeks later
#3021 3 months ago

Still picking at my Gold Wings; 4" frosted led strips came in from Comet and I have one tucked behind the upper flipper to illuminate the plastic fully and the flipper itself.

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2 weeks later
#3054 3 months ago
Quoted from Luzur:

So bros, men, the ROMs on Gottlieb sys80b (Hot shots), are they easily found (and what number do they have other then just 2764? all i can find in the manual) brand new?

Search for arcade emulator sites.

#3056 3 months ago
Quoted from Luzur:

Ah, i already have the files, i meant the chip itself.

Oh, the EPROMS themselves!

Odds are no, anything you find now will be pulls being that old.

You need 2764? I might just have a new stick on the shelf. LMK how many you need.

2 weeks later
#3075 83 days ago

Not an obvious modification to the naked eye but a pleasant one none the less. When I picked up my Gold Wings it had the "popular" short leg/long leg modification which I abhor. The manual states 5.5 to 6 degrees, which is a fine suggestion. I had to crank up the front levelers just to get it in the ball park which made a tall machine even taller.

So yesterday while pushing pins around I freed up some time to take the generic black legs that were on GW, run them through the chop saw, fired up the welder and made them all an equal 26" as you can see in the picture. The flipper buttons are now at the same height as the Williams Touchdown right next to it and I can see more of the playfield.

Little gold paint and all is good.
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#3081 78 days ago
Quoted from Pin-up:

Any chance you have an extra speaker panel for Gold Wings? I've been looking for one for a bit now.

I have a Hollywood Heat one on mine, though I'm toying with making one from scratch. With a laser printer and water slide decals could come up with something pretty cool.

2 weeks later
#3115 63 days ago
Quoted from Andreas:

On timeline there is a bell inthe game..really awsome. Did they put this in any other sys 80 games?[quoted image]

Air raid siren in Gold Wings!

1 month later
#3156 13 days ago

Anyone with a good system 80 board for sale? I have a game to bring back to life. Current board has damage over a wide area and I'm not sure worth investing my time.

#3158 12 days ago

I'm considering a Swemmer if I can find one or a Rottendog if a good stock MPU doesn't pan out. No particular hurry, I have plenty of projects to keep me busy but thought I'd throw it out there I was looking.

#3160 12 days ago
Quoted from dmieczko:

Have you looked at the lisy board? Just put one in my Pinball Pool (system 1) and it's pretty slick...


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