(Topic ID: 73213)

Home for the Gottlieb SYS1-SYS80B guys, Yep it's a club :)


By Gerry

5 years ago



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There are 3013 posts in this topic. You are on page 37 of 61.
#1801 1 year ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

What kind of shape is the MPU in? Does it have battery damage?

Didn’t get to check. I will have him take a look.

#1802 1 year ago
Quoted from REGNE:

desertt1
Step one: channel the spirit of blownfuse
Step two: Listen to forceflow
Step three: Make sure your Voltages are stable.
Step four: battery corrosion?
Step five: good connection to the PCBs? Repin necessary? Do you have 5v on PCB?
I have a Touchdown that was similar. Would start a game but had random resetting. Tried to kick the ball out but repeatedly but failed. Was then blowing the solenoid fuse. Would also sometimes randomly kick ball into the lane on other ocassions. Like when we were watching a movie. My voltage was stable from PS. I took all the chips out of sockets and cleaned them with an eraser. Same result. Wonky. Did the wigggle/jiggle of the chips and found the game ROMs on the PCB to be to blame for the random ressetting. I replaced sockets with machine pin sockets. Same. Found out I needed to clean chip legs more aggressively than an eraser on U2 Game rom. (Chip that is just south of the Premier label in the image.)
I think you might have some other chip issues with the PCB too, maybe, but wonkyness is proportionally related to the quality of the connections. At PCB edge connections and sockets to chips. Oxidation and corrosion are your main issues I believe.

Ice Fever seems to be alive again. I pulled the game chip, inspected it and wiped it down a little (nothing looked out of the ordinary) and put it back. Game booted, but was still cycling a relay. I looked and it was the outhole relay. Checked the fuse and it was blown. Replaced that and now it's working just fine. I had also replaced the power supply board to get my 5V back. So a few things combined to take this game down for a little while. Thanks for the help to you and Forceflow.

There are still two pop bumpers not working even though their fuses are fine. I have a board to swap out and see what that does.

#1803 1 year ago

can someone tell me what the length of the legs should be for a 1983 gottlieb royal flush deluxe?

#1804 1 year ago

I got the Big Daddy Enterprises Sys 1 PSU rebuild kit, but there is no reference guide on their site or in the games manual for what parts go where.... The big caps etc are easy of course but I have a ton of small diodes that would be helpful knowing. any ideas?

#1805 1 year ago

Just picked this up. Thought you guys would think its neat. Thats REAL volcanic ash in there people!

IMG_6779 (resized).JPG

#1806 1 year ago

That is cool, where did you get it? Did you have the logo put on it or did it come that way?

#1807 1 year ago
Quoted from RWH:

That is cool, where did you get it? Did you have the logo put on it or did it come that way?

To my knowledge it was a promo item they gave away when they sold the machines. The logo is inside the glass.

#1808 1 year ago
Quoted from northvibe:

I got the Big Daddy Enterprises Sys 1 PSU rebuild kit, but there is no reference guide on their site or in the games manual for what parts go where.... The big caps etc are easy of course but I have a ton of small diodes that would be helpful knowing. any ideas?

Do you have the schematics? They are in the parts catalog.

Also:

http://pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php?title=Gottlieb_System_1#Recommended_Power_Supply_Updates_.26_Repairs

#1809 1 year ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

What kind of shape is the MPU in? Does it have battery damage?

So it turns out that he thinks the battery has been removed in place of NVRAM. He removed the edge connectors for the displays, cleaned them, and replaced them and everything worked.

Then, he was adjusting the gap of a slingshot switch with a switch adjuster, heard a pop and now can't figure out what happened. Says GI will turn on and lights will do attract mode, but no displays and can't credit up and start a game. Apparently this has taught a lesson of turning the game off before playing with stuff.

#1810 1 year ago

I have a folder with paperwork but only pulled the manual out. I’ll check when I go back into work if I have the parts catalog!

#1811 1 year ago

Just looked in my folder. Warranty cert, gameplay, money and rule card papers, no parts catalog

I just sent an email to PBR to see if they have one. Otherwise I'll use your link to pinwiki and fumble through

#1812 1 year ago

Added victory to the club!

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#1813 1 year ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

Added victory to the club!

Let us know how it plays!

On my SYS1 PSU rebuild journey. PBR wants $12 for that book and at that price + shipping, plus parts, I should of just bought a new PSU....so I'm going to try to fumble my way through this.

I contacted Todd at BDE, to see about getting some help on the list. He didn't have a cheat sheet, but I started one. All that is left is to figure out the zener diodes.

CR5, 10, 11, 12, 23, 101, 201

Once I have those. I will post what each part is in a nice list

#1814 1 year ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

Added victory to the club!

What is that other pin you have there?

#1816 1 year ago
Quoted from RWH:

What is that other pin you have there?

Looks like a Fast/Quick draw (a much better game if you ask me)!

#1817 1 year ago

It is a fast draw. FD is a great em. Really trying to build a nice 80b collection. I have five now
Lethal weapon, rock, robo war, Tx sector, victory. I know lethal weapon is sys 3 , but it’s really an 80b

#1818 1 year ago

I was sent a decent schematic so I compiled the PSU parts list. I'm 99% sure it is correct but there were a few hard to read parts. If there are any changes please let me know!

PSU rebuild (resized).png

#1819 1 year ago

I just finished the play field swap on my victory (With no Rotisserie). Boy it was fun and the machine looks brand new now. VICTORY FOR DRIVER 1!!!

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#1820 1 year ago

Do you have any backstory on the PF differences? One looks ultra old and one looks like it was remade art?

Congrats! it does look good!

#1821 1 year ago
Quoted from northvibe:

Do you have any backstory on the PF differences? One looks ultra old and one looks like it was remade art?
Congrats! it does look good!

So yeah, the original machine had a play field similar to the one that is currently installed (With all the high res graphics and stuff). It's called a Vitrigraph it has the art all printed on a thick piece of Mylar and then glued down to the pf (So not silk screened). However due to the issues those pf's, Gottlieb sent out silk screened replacements (Which I think looks kind of crappy but to each his own). So that is what was currently on the machine when I bought it. I switched it out for a NOS Vitrigraph Play field as I feel in the home use setting the issues operators faced won't really be a problem and it just looks 10 times better. Some things I've noticed is the middle of the pf has a nice indy car with the games name on it where as with the replacement (Silk screen pf) it just had a flag. Also the font on the "Don't Lose it" is different colors.

#1822 1 year ago

I had gold wings system b for many years and really liked it. I think it would be a good addition to a system b collection.

#1823 1 year ago

Hey gottlieb people! This guy ran into some strange voltage stuff when he was fixing a gold wings with a vifico swapped playfield. The plugs were wired a bit differently. I thought I would repost it in this thread to spread some knowledge. https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/gottlieb-gold-wings-crazy-flipper-problem

#1824 1 year ago

What playfield angle do folks use on your Haunted House? Mine when I got it is 6 degrees measured on the playfield...but makes hitting the ramp hard

#1825 1 year ago
Quoted from Colehvac1:

It is a fast draw. FD is a great em. Really trying to build a nice 80b collection. I have five now
Lethal weapon, rock, robo war, Tx sector, victory. I know lethal weapon is sys 3 , but it’s really an 80b

You mean DEADLY weapon, right? Lethal Weapon is a Data east

#1826 1 year ago
Quoted from statictrance:

You mean DEADLY weapon, right? Lethal Weapon is a Data east

Yes, deadly weapon. I will have all five of these games together at pintastic in June!

#1827 1 year ago
Quoted from darcangeloel:

I just finished the play field swap on my victory (With no Rotisserie). Boy it was fun and the machine looks brand new now. VICTORY FOR DRIVER 1!!!

I have to come play, it looks great!

Quoted from Colehvac1:

Yes, deadly weapon. I will have all five of these games together at pintastic in June!

I don't have enough room to dedicate to 5 system 80 machines. I have three again now that I picked up a Tag-Team Pinball. Raven and Genesis seem to stay, but I do rotate the third spot pretty often.

#1828 1 year ago

I have never played a tag team.
Is it fun to play?

#1829 1 year ago
Quoted from PinballAir:

I have never played a tag team.
Is it fun to play?

Yeah, it's pretty fun. It has lots of stuff to shoot at and a three ball multi-ball. The sounds kinda stink, but it was the 80s

#1830 1 year ago
Quoted from zimjoe:

Yeah, it's pretty fun. It has lots of stuff to shoot at and a three ball multi-ball. The sounds kinda stink, but it was the 80s

I just passed on one at $1200 local.how much was yours?

#1831 1 year ago

Would like to add a diamond lady or Excalibur in time for the show.

#1832 1 year ago
Quoted from pinostalgia:

I just passed on one at $1200 local.how much was yours?

Not that much You guys in California pay top dollar.

That said, mine has a few cabinet defects, a few playfield wear spots, and what looks like a kicked in coin door. Nothing terrible, but enough to make it cheaper. Mine also has some super bright insert LEDs that I will be toning down.

#1833 1 year ago

So I'm testing on a sys1, power at the A2J1 plug (goes into power board) and I need some validation.

DMM set to AC w/ leads into sets of pins.
Pin 1-2 = 24.3v ac
pin 4-5 = 29.4v ac
pin 6-7 = 74.3v ac

pins 1/2 and 4/5 seem correct, 11.5v and 14 respectively but the 69v line ?

#1834 1 year ago

What is your line voltage sitting at? Any increase on that will result in slightly higher readings on the secondary side of the transformer.

When you say: "leads into sets of pins", I hope you don't mean that you stuck your meter leads into the front side of the connectors where the male header pins would go in? That often opens up the knuckle of the female pin to the point where it will have poor contact pressure on the male connector pins.

#1835 1 year ago

I tested the voltage at the transformer a few weeks ago and I thought it was good.

I tests on the plug via the back of the plug. Yeah, from reading the connectors and pins are sensitive.

#1836 1 year ago

Has anyone ever added a large capacitor to the 24V DC power supply to the solenoids (similar to the one on the 12V line), to provide more instantaneous current when flippers (and bumpers too I guess) are activated? Just wondering if that might add any kick to the flippers. If you have done it, what size capacitor would you need to make a difference? Any risks to the coils or surrounding circuitry? If you tried it and it didn't work, what problems did you run into? Just wondering. I'm working on cleaning up the circuitry to get my resistance path down, and rebuilding the flippers, but was thinking that some extra current when the coils engage would be helpful too. Enquiring minds want to know... Thoughts?

Capture (resized).JPG

#1837 1 year ago

Ok so I tested the transformers, ground on the trans lug and then the ac red on the tabs w/ voltage. I didn't get a reading off the 60 v or 40. The lower ones like 5 and 14 worked. The voltage at the filter was 120vac so that was fine.

I heard/read the small transformer is sensitive and easy to break, but are there good replacements?

#1838 1 year ago

No good replacements other than original pulls from junked games.

There was a discussion thread about using the LED replacements (don't require HV) and the replacement MPUs (that don't require the -12v). When your small transformer is Toast.

#1840 1 year ago

Thank you guys!

Forceflow - I was thinking I had read something and I must of found a post you made a few weeks ago and forgot!

This link has some nice break downs of power and testing.

http://www.pinrepair.com/sys1/index.htm

So as long as I have the 5, 12, -12 and 24v there really is now way to get the 69/45vac unless I find a donor transformer?

Was I testing the power out of the transformer correctly? If so and I don’t get 69v but all others I will get the Boston pin displays to circumvent the issue.

#1841 1 year ago
Quoted from northvibe:

So I'm testing on a sys1, power at the A2J1 plug (goes into power board) and I need some validation.
DMM set to AC w/ leads into sets of pins.
Pin 1-2 = 24.3v ac
pin 4-5 = 29.4v ac
pin 6-7 = 74.3v ac
pins 1/2 and 4/5 seem correct, 11.5v and 14 respectively but the 69v line ?

Before you run out and buy a bunch of costly LEDs. Can we revisit this? Above, you say you have 74.3VC at pins 6 and 7. On my Joker Poker, while connected, I m reading 71.4VAC across the last two pins (Orange-White-Red and Blue-White-Red). Looking at the wiring diagram, they show a 1/4Amp fuse in line with the Blue-White-Red wire. This is probably located on the lower wood power tray.

Otherwise, while its not cheap, if the only voltage your transformer is missing is the 69VAC, this might be an option too:

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Hammond-Manufacturing/167L70?qs=sGAEpiMZZMvwUzoUXIIvyQPvPmwnNFGy5CfLurVwWaQ%3d

1518325236288935606444 (resized).jpg

#1842 1 year ago

Also, before buying that transformer, make sure you have the 3VAC across transformer pins 13 and 15 and 5VAC at 10 and 12, since they are essential for the Fluorescent display tubes too.

#1843 1 year ago

got a stern stars and a gtb spring break in a trade. the SB plays but has issues i think it needs the ground mod done to correct. what is a fair price on a project SB. i would consider trades on both for a good EM

#1844 1 year ago
Quoted from CactusJack:

Also, before buying that transformer, make sure you have the 3VAC across transformer pins 13 and 15 and 5VAC at 10 and 12, since they are essential for the Fluorescent display tubes too.

Thanks catcus.

The game is at work, so when I’m back there I’ll write down each voltage and where. This is the first time having power tests at the transformer. Also a sys1. So I appreciate the knowledge/learning from you guys

I’ll post tomorrow

#1845 1 year ago

Kind of tough to follow a troubleshooting path when the info is intermixed with other posts and problems. Maybe it's time to start a separate thread where we can focus on your specific problem?

Anyhow, reading back, I think you might be testing the transformer AC wrong. Technically, AC does not always have a common reference to ground like a DC check would. Instead, you must read AC voltage across the windings themselves. So, you would not use ground.

For the most part, the 60/42VDC power is isolated from the other voltages until the regulator connectors are all plugged in. Just as the 5VAC and 3VAC are floating but end up being "grounded" via the center taps of the windings to produce it on an offset DC voltage.

Your earlier check that showed about 74AC proves the transformer is okay. So, What is your original issue???

#1846 1 year ago
Quoted from CactusJack:

Kind of tough to follow a troubleshooting path when the info is intermixed with other posts and problems. Maybe it's time to start a separate thread where we can focus on your specific problem?
Anyhow, reading back, I think you might be testing the transformer AC wrong. Technically, AC does not always have a common reference to ground like a DC check would. Instead, you must read AC voltage across the windings themselves. So, you would not use ground.
For the most part, the 60/42VDC power is isolated from the other voltages until the regulator connectors are all plugged in. Just as the 5VAC and 3VAC are floating but end up being "grounded" via the center taps of the windings to produce it on an offset DC voltage.
Your earlier check that showed about 74AC proves the transformer is okay. So, What is your original issue???

The game never booted correctly, couple coils locked on, no displays, wouldn’t coin up. Gi and back box lights work.

So I unplugged boards and started testing power.

#1847 1 year ago

Okay, thanks for the refresher.

If you are missing the 60VDC, it's kind of hard to tell if the MPU is doing anything since you can't see the displays. Having all the other DC voltage should allow the MPU to boot but again hard to know how it's reacting when you can't see the displays.

Therefore, you need a scope or logic probe to check for activity on the display strobes or switch matrix to see if the MPU board is FUBR'd.

Sadly, the best thing to have when troubleshooting a SYstem 1 game is another working System 1 game to swap parts. Otherwise, a Pascal Jamin All-in-one board is another great service alternative.

#1848 1 year ago

K, I’ll grab my logic probe too.

I ordered a rottendog driver board, been thinking of ordering the power board as well. Clive at coinopcauldron said it wasn’t worth trying to rebuild or fix them as it costs almost the same as a new one.

#1849 1 year ago
Quoted from northvibe:

K, I’ll grab my logic probe too.
I ordered a rottendog driver board, been thinking of ordering the power board as well. Clive at coinopcauldron said it wasn’t worth trying to rebuild or fix them as it costs almost the same as a new one.

Just for the record, it costs about $15 in parts to rebuild a system 1 power supply. However, because of the odd design, it does take some time to work on. There is a rebuild guide on pinwiki that I've linked to many times.

#1850 1 year ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

Just for the record, it costs about $15 in parts to rebuild a system 1 power supply. However, because of the odd design, it does take some time to work on. There is a rebuild guide on pinwiki that I've linked to many times.

Assuming, of course, that the main transistor doesn't die on you, as it's no longer available. I actually finally determined that's what happened to my original. It was probably the heat of desoldering it the one last time that did it in.

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