(Topic ID: 77386)

Hobbit Update


By B9

5 years ago



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  • Latest reply 2 years ago by GravitaR
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#3982 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

I've sadly learned to check these "update threads" about once every 500 posts for an actual update
However, now it seems I have skipped too many!
As such, I guess I missed some key points:
What exactly happened to the whole "contractually obligated to ship before movie release" thing?
But now it's about dvd release dates?

What Jack said is that they would have games 'done' by Dec, which they did, at least proto's and sample games at shows, in several countries.
The feedback there was more on art packages and decal material, there was a significant playfield art change (or it was probably in the works for a while) at Expo Oct 2014, and there was also a slight modification to the entry into the pops, with the "book" becoming an Lcd in the back right corner.
Have you ordered one? Are you on the JJP group or just a pinsider content guy - we hear a lot more as owners over there or I hear it from talking to Jack directly at a show or by phone

#3983 4 years ago
Quoted from DarkWizard:

Jack, if your listening. Can we please get an option in the code to add a zero or 2 to the tail end of the points scoring. No one should be bothered by this, if you don't care about what the scores look like relating to your other games, just leave it default.
If it does, you can add a zero or 2, should be simple to code and not piss anyone off. Since code is pretty much the only thing that will be changing at this point. Certainly there are more important updates to worry about, but I'll settle for the option in an update later, that's fine.
I don't need scores in the billions or in crazy land like AFM, but 4000 points from 1 decent ball? Even some old EM's aren't that stingy.
Before everyone jumps on me, I realize it doesn't "really" matter, but the smaller scores just don't feel right to me.

See the 500 other posts on the score thingy.

#3984 4 years ago
Quoted from smokedog:

Who made that claim? They obviously have not been paying attention. Currently no pinball manufacturers ship a game with completed code. None.
I hope that changes.

Spooky did

#3986 4 years ago
Quoted from Cheeks:

No offense, but this is seriously one of the dumbest requests I've ever heard. It is literally no different than if I asked for someone to program a multiplier into MM scoring so it had super high scores like AFM.
Is it dumb that AFM scores are so high? Yeah, kinda. But frankly, why do other games need games in the millions? You could literally create a game with 1 point targets and 50 point jackpots. Who cares? As long as the scores within the game itself are scaled well against each other, who the hell cares how exponentially large or small they are compared to other games.
As someone else mentioned, if for some odd reason it bugs you that much, 4 Post-It notes and a Sharpie serves the exact same purpose.

These are funny comments on the scoring - Lyman made MM a 60 million good score, people wants more - so Monster bash had 600 mil as a good score. More, more - so Attack has 6000 mill (6 billion).
It was his coding joke, that if you want another zero to feel better about getting a lot of points - fine, here's your 10x or 100x. I've talked to Lyman about this - and it was purposeful to show how silly the concept.
KEF and Jack wanted a simple to understand 1000,000 as a good score. You know when Glinda is giving you 2000 while pops and slings give 10 or 100, that shots are worth different points - get a multiball or mode going, theres lots of points. Easy

#3991 4 years ago
Quoted from DarkWizard:

I did already 4 days ago.
See the other thread created by me after the post your responding to, but 4 days before your response.
In any case, I am done advocating this. Clearly your (the royal your) in one camp or there other. No way to change anyone's mind.

Keith choose the score levels purposefully. Jack likes the concept too. The decision was made years ago.

3 months later
#5853 4 years ago
Quoted from jfh:

Looks like the ramps are still harder to make then they should be. How did those shots feel like when playing?

The ramps are fine, the shots flow well. It doesn't take a "perfect" shot.

#5937 4 years ago
Quoted from pindel:

Widebody loaded with beef? This game must weigh a ton. I haven't seen a game with this much hardware. No shortcuts there.

abeef.jpg (Click image to enlarge)

Jack told me at the Expo reveal, that Woz was right around 300 lbs, and Hobbit (which they showed the PF and it looked about the same as this final), was 340-350lbs (at least as of last fall - and I can't think its changed much)

#6030 4 years ago
Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

I think most people would agree that a "couple" means 2 & a "few" means 3. If Jack said a few weeks, then we should just double that expectation, based on his track record. I think we can safely assume production will start in 6 weeks from now, which would put us right at the end of June.
You're both right.

My 2 cents is the line is ready, but vendor parts timing and quality are not in JJP control. I was on the phone with him just 3 weeks ago and he had a story about a vendor had not packed well, but thankfully nothing was broken (but they hadn't unloaded and unboxed it all yet as of our phone call), and it wasn't the first time with this vendor. Jack tells us what he knows, but he doesn't know what he doesn't know regarding vendors delivering (in all uses of that word).

2 weeks later
#6322 4 years ago
Quoted from Shapeshifter:

This is the quietest period I can remember from JJP. Very odd.

Quoted from HoakyPoaky:

I find the lack of updates completely unprofessional at this point..

Jack's not quiet, he's just not talking on Pinside. Why bother? It only brings negative posts regardless of the "news".

#6354 4 years ago
Quoted from Rockytop:

I'm thinking about selling my spot for what I have in it. (7k of 7500 total)
Do we have any clue as to when they might start shipping...I haven't read through this thread in a while. I've been in since 11/13 and I'm tired of waiting.

Best answer seems to be "soon". Which parts, and in what quantities, are at JJP? The past 5 months discussion boils down to parts on hand. Last pic was of backglasses arriving - was that part 3000 of 3000, or part 2500 of 3000?

1 week later
#6416 4 years ago

What are the feelings about the vendor/supplier issues based on the seminar presentation and Q/A's.
1. Are the quality of parts ok now and are vendors supplying in quantities to build games?
2. Are all parts coming in for a least complete parts sets to build entire games?

Seems most of the past 4 month delays have been blamed on "can't control" issues on those two questions - did Jack and team get specific on either question, or is it still generic answers?

1 week later
#6537 4 years ago

I'm hoping to have a choice later, had to bail on my pre-order for financial changes since day 1 order 11/2012, I am WoZ RR #7. Jack's post google.group owners post from today sounds very positive, feedback heard, but improvements cost 6 months.
Per Jack....
"We did not do a good job with The Hobbit before Expo. We believed we could do better and Expo was the proof that we needed to go back and make the game better. Unfortunately that caused issues with design elements of the game and of course it caused delay and redesign. We underestimated the time we needed to make the changes.

We know what we did after Expo made the game a lot better. You told us that. That “little” series of changes over a few weeks caused at least six months delay - that is all types of drawings, not only art but mechanical design drawings, wiring, parts that had to change, retooling, redesign after testing, first article parts, approvals, on and on….time and money spent to make the game better. We are selling more Hobbits every week as more people get to see and play it now. As they ship we will sell many more."

#6560 4 years ago
Quoted from dendoc:

Isn't it nice to have a "private " forum? Not sure why quotes have to be instantly posted over here as well......

Why do pinsders behave this way? I had permission. Apology is in order.

#6562 4 years ago

Thanks BB. Good point, I should have said w/Jacks ok. I prefer someone asking "did you have an ok" rather assume the worst, try assuming the benefit of the doubt. More of a general feeling that pinside seems to assume the glass is nearly empty v. half full.

Quoted from beelzeboob:I didn't thumbs-down you because I know you're a good guy and would probably never do anything to burn Jack. But you probably should have said that you were posting what he said with his blessing.
That said, I don't think anybody really had to comment on your decision to post...you were just trying to share info, and that's (almost) always a good thing.

1 week later
#6715 4 years ago
Quoted from KingPinGames:

start a new thread guys. this is supposed to be for Hobbit updates.

I met you at MGC KingPin, what can you tell me about TH delivery?

#6742 4 years ago

Guys, listen to the mod please?! Lets get back to worrying about the Hobbit delivery date

1 week later
-2
#7045 4 years ago
Quoted from SadSack:

sychophants strung along by liars. shit on shitter . basically shit on .just a dick.

Wow, ignored.

#7288 4 years ago

Has anyone heard any callouts at Pintastic or elsewhere, with the Gandalf talent? Which guy did they hire? THere were quite a few youtube links to some great options, and I think the majority here liked the Youtube guy of a thousand voices - who seems to be the fav by a large margin.

A voice callout post, or some update news on that front might get us through July!
Then we just have to limp along until Aug 29 when the thread will explode.

1 week later
20
#7401 4 years ago

Ah Damn. All the playfields were made upside down. There goes another 3 months

#7450 4 years ago
Quoted from lordloss:

The US ones also came in

432818.jpg

Given all the speculations about PF being ruined by all the speculators in this thread...
Where are you getting these pictures?

3 weeks later
#7794 4 years ago

What the heck does

Quoted from iceman44:Here's another flag for you.
What did I miss, just woke up from my bender
Hard to hit the right up or down vote when your drunk.
How do you even type out the right spelling? Drunken talent?

What does your drunken talent have to do with a Hobbit update??

-7
#7796 4 years ago
Quoted from jams77:

Well it could be an indication as to why Jack has to ban his own supporters from his Hobbit forum.

I've talked to Jack about that one, and Jack was really upset about taken content from the owners group and sharing with non-owners on Pinside. It would be nice if people typed the facts, from talking to the guy directly, rather than heresay and speculation.

1 month later
#8787 4 years ago
Quoted from wcbrandes:

Someone should put up the comparison between the Stern video mode DMD and the gold SE dragon graphics on LCD I know I know it doesn't make it more fun to play or contribute to the all around experience And don't worry I love me some Stern but it's really getting ridiculous.

JP DeWin talent's are excellent. I'm extremely happy with what Keith, JP and Ted have done with video integration on both JJP games so far.

3 months later
16
#9151 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

Wait...didn't you just order a few months ago? I had been in since October of 2013.

I'm in since day 1, November 30 2012. I'm in the first 50 that will go out the door.

Since then I ordered and Rec'd AMH (ordered 10/18/2014, rec'd April 6 2015), I ordered and Rec'd GoT LE (ordered 10/19/2015, rec'd 12/6/2015), Had 4 Dutch Pinball BoP 2.0 software upgrades, ordered/Rec'd Star Trek LE; Spooky on list June 2015, deposit 12/2015, expect mid-2016?. I get it, The Hobbit has taken a long time. I'm ok waiting.

If you don't like waiting on an unknown, don't buy before you see it, know others have one, and you have played it.

I talked to Jen 1/8/16. I know a lot more details than what I read here, and a lot of the speculation, accusations, and downright wrong "facts" are laughable.

Here's what I know, X games are done. many more times X is number of PFs on the line, 12 cabinets we ready for PF (we saw that in an accuracte photo above), there will be more extensive testing and more testing time than WoZ before the 1st x are shipped. I left out numbers, b/c whats the point and I promised Jen I wouldn't.

I know, because of chats with Jen and Jack and Keith, that we only see bits and photos of bits b/c there is only downside - because Pinsiders parse every photo, every word, 24/7. What's the advantage of showing anything to anyone, except direct communication with the first 10-50 customers getting games? None, nothing but downside.

Rarely are there 10% of more positive reactions to an email update, photo or comment made by Jack at a show. Its 90% negative comments - e.g.; that's all you are gonna reveal? when will there be more? Delays? Fights with vendors? slow = not enough $? Skip a show in London = not enough $?

How much exageration and downright slams were there, when the test game was sent to Jason in MN for a party - it gave JJP some valuable feedback for tweaks for final production - yet many said the first game has shipped! Look Nov 2015! Geez! Even clarification from Jack on the facts? Didn't matter, speculation continued.

Its our own fault that we don't see pinside or public news. I get way more information when I call about my order, than I'm going to share here, or that any wise pinsider bothers with the effort to add a comment or post about it.

#9152 3 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

Wait...didn't you just order a few months ago? I had been in since October of 2013.

dup

#9153 3 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

"Not going to give up this close..."
Bingo.
This mentality is exactly why JJP has categorically LIED about the production schedule over and over and over, with WoZ and now TH.
Does anyone really think they DIDNT know the game was a year off last year? Of course they did. Why lie? The exact statement above. Keep stringing people along, keep them thinking 'we're close, maybe next month' and they keep their preorders. Surely no one wants to be the 'dolt' who cancels the week before shipment starts.
THIS is the dichotomy of JJP that makes me crazy: the cool things they are doing with pinball on one side, their dishonesty on the other side....

Or, isn't is possible lowpeg could be wrong?

-2
#9156 3 years ago
Quoted from Concretehardt:

I think it would boost everyone's confidence if Jack would post a pic showing a line of games being built, not so much to show a line of cabinets and games in process but to show a full crew of workers building games. The one thing that most all of the JJP pics lack isn't games and parts its people working on them... The factory looks deserted

Nothing will boost peoples confidence - just generates more questions. Why should Jack bother? IIRC, didn't Jack kick you from the google owners group forum - I can't help but think there is some bias in your posts.

#9167 3 years ago
Quoted from dgposter:

You sure about that date being "day 1"? My invoice is dated 11/26/12.

Yes, that's what Jen told me, and it was a day 1 order

#9250 3 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

Wrong about what? Do tell?

Um, post #192. I hope I'm wrong....(there's a first time for everything).

I'm not going to defend Jack, just to defend him. Saying he missed an estimated date is lying has 2 flaws - how is missing an estimated date, a lie? and you know Jack's intent was to lie, mislead to keep people from running - how can you know Jack's intent?

Two questions:
1. are you pre-ordered on TH?
2. have you talked to Jen or Jack about any of your concerns?

-4
#9276 3 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

Yes, I assumed that was a pretty commonly established fact by now.
His fans often prefer euphemisms like:
"Jack is a visionary pinball guy, but, you know, he sometimes has a loose relationship with the truth"
Or
"Jack stretched the truth a bit, but, He couldn't have accomplished all this without it"
Etc, etc,etc.
It really comes down to 2 camps:
The "end justifies the means" crowd, which will forgive Jack of all his shenanigans as long as they get their games, and,
Others who think ethics matters....
Neither group is likely to be convinced otherwise, so we see the same arguments played out over and over again.

I repeat b/c you conveniently avoided...

Questions:
1. are you pre-ordered on TH? (If not, why do you care about this update thread)
2. have you talked to Jen or Jack about any of your concerns? (otherwise its all speculation on dates, intent, facts)
3. unless you have news from talking to JJP directly, its just bitching and off topic to this update thread (so why repeat it so many times?), perhaps start a new thread on Jacks ethics.

I'll use the 'ignore button' to fix my problem with it and save time for everyone else reading my reaction posts

#9281 3 years ago
Quoted from ninjabones:

Sorry if this question has already been asked (read through a bit of this thread but not all 186 pages)... I found someone willing to transfer a Smaug allocation to me. I'm a bit nervous about several aspects of this potential purchase, mostly related to serviceability, reliability, and availability of parts down the road. I've had a few new sterns and a few older games... all have required some TLC (even my new GOTLE required a new node board, requiring 13 days of downtime). What has the experience been like for WOZ in terms of maintenance, customer service, availability of parts, complexity of fixing things?

My WoZ has had 2 problems, fixed easily, with good customer service and reaction time. I had 3 calls to LTD and Frank trying diagnose a monitor issue, and a sound issue. They sent out a new video board, but ultimately is was some wire connections and the wires themselves to dvI and the sound bass speaker. The good part was they stayed on it over a period of 4 days, to make sure it got fixed, and as soon as possible. To me, the "not give up" attitude really made me appreciate that I wouldn't be on my own to get it done - they were as committed to getting it up and running as if it were their machine.

The complexity for my stuff was actually pretty complex problem, but easy to fix with a new connection, cord, and board. Shipping the one back was painless too. All the parts needed, were there, and arrived in 2 days, installed and diagnosed and tested the day they arrived with Frank on the line making sure it all worked.

My 2 Stern warranty fixes were the same experience, parts on hand, but no personal time on the phone, but didn't need any.

Spooky was the best customer experience ever, two quick fixes, Charlie knew the issue & fix and personally walked me through the cause, fix and test. Twice. When the owner, who built the machine on the line, and handled the support call, can help walk through the fix personally? - hard to beat that.

1 week later
30
#9329 3 years ago

I talked to Jen today and good news. Mine is coming in March.

Silverball Museum and Allen's game are likely delivered with the understanding of test focused, two very hands-on operators in public places with lots of plays, and an operator onsite to fix and feedback to JJP immediately, so consider them test locations in my opinion. And worst case, close to JJP techs if an on-site is needed for diagnostics or tough fixes. I'm glad those will get hundreds of plays and feedback to the factory before my game goes in a box.

There are 70 on the line in various stages of assembly, they have another 1-2 weeks of testing before shipping, but several dozen will be ready for boxing and shipping when they feel testing is complete.

Why is testing taking weeks? My thinking re: type of testing at this point is small tweaks to position of wiring harnesses, does shipping affect things that we could tie wrap here, or another fastener under the PF or cabinet for a cleaner look or easier servicing. Something as simple as a connector to the PC boards (like that dang speaker connector on the WoZ board) which comes loose during boxing or shipping, can be found, fixed and avoid headaches for them and us.

1 month later
#9410 3 years ago
Quoted from DougPiranha:

Jen just called. Mine may arrive Friday and I am not a business. Woot!

Jen told me today, that either Friday, or early next week. Im a regular customer too.

1 week later
25
#9541 3 years ago

In the house! Rainy day, but a little sunshine in a box arrived today.
IMG_8752_(resized).JPG

IMG_8751_(resized).JPG

1 month later
#9749 3 years ago
Quoted from B9:

I've been playing the game for almost two months and it's gotten better with each of the two code updates.
There's plenty in there to be excited about!

Great video. There is one mode I'd like to get on film, but my video skills suck. I've also had the game 2 months now, and uploaded 1.10 last night. What a riot. What will be great on film is the 5 ball MB combo smaug/beast frenzy: very intense, and for anyone who said the PF was too open, I challenge you to try to shoot the 10+ smaug jackpots with 4 random beasts popping in and out of the PF, and hit Thorin for supers without getting hosed by the goblin or orc. I swear Keith even put in the logic to know when a ramp shot is coming back to the left flipper, to pop the warg so you can't combo with the right orbit - there are so many ways to mess with the player - and Keith is taking advantage of any/all ways to mess you up, block a shot, and time it so you almost have time (but never do) to hit that second shot without something in the way. Brilliant so far.

Scores are much higher now. There are many more assets in 1.10 vs. 1.01. There must be a ton more which I expect each version will roll out. 1.10 likely has only a small fraction of the assets - even its 50% now, there will be so much more on the way.

There are still 2 obvious major things missing - mode completion points and a hold-flipper-for-status-report.

What level of awesomeness will it be at by version 6.0???!!!

1 month later
#9817 3 years ago

Loving v1.21 - EB at 50k and 100k, so not as impressive but still 3,818,853
IMG_9476_(resized).JPG

3 months later
#9858 3 years ago

I think I'm getting the hang of this new code.

IMG_1529 (resized).JPG

2 weeks later
#9920 3 years ago

Get the Escalara. I've moved many a pin up and down the basement stairs, with a 90 degree turn. I moved hobbit and woz BY MYSELF with this thing (not recommended, but did it anyway). TH was pf and cab separate, just because it's so darn heavy. Believe me - it's worth it. I'm 54 now, and saving the back is worth the $$$. Larry kitchen is great - get one from him and mention my name - he's at flipnout pinball.

Now, where is that new code?

#9966 3 years ago
Quoted from vireland:

Compare the "final" Woz 2.0 to the actual pretty close to final WoZ 6.06. HUGE difference in all aspects including objectives. I think Hobbit will evolve similarly.

I trust Keith and Ted aren't done. I think Keefer knows what he is doing. If 31 modes aren't varied enough, sell hobbit and buy 5 Stern to get your 31 modes back. Even then, you might find Tron or LOTR limited by the zero drop targets. (I own Woz , TH and 7 Sterns - so not bashing any of them )

You are the first I've heard saying TH modes are too similar.

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