Yes!

Even weightlifters at the World Strongman competition can barely deadlift two WOZ's. Rumor has it that with the Hobbit weighing even more then WOZ that it won't be allowed into next years competition out of fear that competitors may be injured.

WOZ.jpg

WOZ was the easiest pin I have ever moved. Two of us took it apart into the playfield, the cabinet, and the head, easily carried each part up some difficult stairs, and put it back together. 30 minutes and no hernia. I wish all pins were this detachable. Good design IMHO.

(Oops is there better thread to discuss the PF layout?)
-mof

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/jjp-woz-hobbit-update/page/13
It starts on post # 616

It was discussed and answered here.

Maybe I should come out with a special Hobbit LE Escalera Edition! LOL

[email protected]

334.jpg

Decent figures.

Bash target strength and styling - I really would like to see Smaug

Anyone know roughly the size of these? 2 x 2 inches or smaller?

Finally bothered to look up what "escalera" was. What a clever thing. I thought it was the name of a back medication at first. Never seen these in Australia, but we definitely need one for "communal hire" when TH arrives.

I can't imagine that these will be used for bashing. Those ears would never be able to withstand a direct hit at so close of a distance and those details on their faces would wear down very quickly.. Must be utilized in a different manner. Any ideas how?

They popup in the playfield are intended to get 'bashed'...MM troll style.

Spiders.... why did it have to be spiders?

Don't know what to say now. I think I must see them with a fully populated playfield.

If looked at individually I do find the Goblin look like a dog.

I think this was the example:
The Hobbit - Toys - Goblin.jpg

It looks the same to me.

Trolls in MM had ears to. If bash toys I think they will have something behind them to enforce the total structure.

That's being kind. They just have that "home made fan-mod sculpture" look that personally, I just don't find appealing. They don't look like real pinball toys. I don't have high hopes for Smaug…sorry.

No kidding...wow...

Okay ... based on others immediate reactions, I know I'm not alone. But ... I'll even take the most positive attitude I can looking at these and say they look "okay" at BEST. Given the price tag ... I would hope for much better than okay. If you weren't sure what to expect with Smaug before, I suggest lowering your expectations so you won't be disappointed.

I'm actually surprised these even passed the studio's approval process.

Not loving these at all. Sorry.

I have to admit, I'm not a fan of those sculpts. They're just too lumpy for my tastes. They look like craft fair magnets someone sculpted for Eugene's Saturday Market. Cute, and maybe fun to buy for your friend's kid who likes the Hobbit, but not the level of professional work I expect for the price of this machine.

It's not really a make or break for me, they pop up, you hit them, they go away. So okay. And hell probably able to be modded if you really care, or fully replaced even. But they are disappointing. Like the playfield it's just a "what could have been" kind of deal, but I'll wait to see it all in context.

Here's the thing: and I don't mean to bag on Matt who seems like a hard working and really solid guy. The work on WOZ and now these sculpts, they don't really fill me with confidence about Smaug. And there's really no forgiving that one. If the quality is only up the the standards of what is shown here, and that's what Jack is okay with, I'm concerned. It's gotta be bad ass. Period point blank. You can't eff up the dragon.

So I'll wait until it's revealed, but that really is make or break. For what this game costs I won't settle for something that disappoints me every time I see it. So here's hoping Matt shows some spark that these toys haven't revealed yet.

I know there is a really nice guy behind the creation of these figures. But I wish JJP would use him where his skillset is strongest. Doing things like powdercoating and creating non-character decorations (like walls and other inanimate objects.) Because detailed character creation is not his strongest skill IMO.

Actually, I kind of like the warg.

I'm sorry but these look like they are some 11th grade art project!

They do not look good, considering what STERN is producing with TWD and previous bash toys

late december, so no game ready when the movie comes out? well, maybe one...

Dog and spider look great to me, but the goblin and the other thing...not so much. Nice oportunity for some mods there.

Holy shit those are terrible. They look really bad compared to the Walking Dead zombies.

I am no JJP basher - proud WOZ owner here. They just look bad.

Lumpy

woah... this is pretty bad, sorry.

Is it too late to have another sculptor take a crack at it? Perhaps they could collaborate with Matt?

Mods............ its a 7.5k + game! Molds better look great! these cannot be final. . .

I agree the warg and spider aren't bad - the others need a redo. Maybe he spent most of his time on a kick ass Smaug?

Humanoid faces are probably the hardest to sculpt - evidence in the spider, warg, and barrels looking good. This should mean that the dragon has a better shot of looking good IMO.

I know you have to let some things go when you want to integrate a toy into a pinball machine. But I really hoped that there was a good expression of the mood and that for as far as possible (hard to do on the spider) the overall look is anatomically correct. In that context the Warg looks okay, the Spider weird and the Orc and Goblin.................

Below is a high standard, but I don't think impossible to get (yes, see what Stern has achived with TWD)

The Hobbit - Azog.jpg

Ah, it all makes sense now.

89994.jpg

This is more along the lines of what I was thinking the molds would look like. Good reference

By popular demand

89994.jpg

If that Orc carving is supposed to look like the Pale Orc from the films, then that's really an epic fail.

Actually it looks a bit like Dennis Rodman

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar came to my mind. Not trying to rag on these, but damn...

My thoughts are that someone on the JJP Hobbit team has to say something. They need to bring their A game on these toys - the rest of the team (programming, design, engineering, etc) can't let this drop the overall appeal of the game. Toys should enhance it for goodness sake...

Pinchroma, I don't suppose you'll stop your attacks on me simply because I stated I didn't think the toys in WOZ were well done at all? Apparently I'm not the only who doesn't think his art is always great.

And where are Panzerfreak, Spfxted, Beelzeboob, Gravitard, Txstargazer3, DaveH, etc. ? I'm curious what their opinions are on these?

No offence to matt or anyone else working on these at JJP at all. And I am not saying I could do better, but I was not impressed with the trees in woz and I think the troll and orc sculpts need work.

The spider and warg look good.
But please improve the look of the other two. They do not look professionally done.
Sorry.
They need brock from pinball customs working on these.
The last post on his TWD shooter rod looked fantastic.

Or Butt-Head after being set on fire.

The Goblin looks like an ugly cat with a cleft palate.

~~~~~~
Pinchroma said:
I think Matt R is one of the most universally talented artists I have ever had the pleasure of working with. I think his work is phenomenal and stands above anything you can buy from mattel
~~~~~~

I know you're a company man, but do you truly believe this?!

I think the main issue people had with off the shelf toys wasn't the fact that they were off the shelf…but just used as decoration - not truly interactive toys. They're essentially sculptures. Matt's toys are essentially sculptures. They're non-interactive or at best - bash toys. Really no different than the off-the-shelf toys, conceptually. So - if we're just comparing sculptures to sculptures - sorry, the off the shelf toys win. Stern's original toys of the last few years win as well. Wolv/Magneto are useless…but are good sculpts. Hulk looks great. Sparky & the Metallica toys look great. Walking Dead toys look great..

Matt's toys look like they belong in a Claymation film. They've got that "lumpy" (as Rob put it) clay look to them. It may work for castle walls, bt just doesn't work for all applications. State Fair Ballon? Why is it lumpy? Now we're getting into characters from a film with brilliant artistry behind it…these toys don't look like licensed toys from this franchise should look. The Witch didn't look that great, and neither do these.

No.

Yep.

-mof

Haven't seen those - so I looked them up. Yeah, those are nice and show what is possible for sure.

To me they look more like concept models or prototypes and not the finished work. Rough drafts if you will...

They are rough drafts right?