(Topic ID: 77386)

Hobbit Update


By B9

6 years ago



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There are 10044 posts in this topic. You are on page 177 of 201.
#8801 4 years ago
Quoted from Goronic:

I agree. And to be honest I don't see how the hell JJP is making any money putting so much value in WOZ and TH. ..

Who says they are?

I'd be surprised if JJP didn't take a net loss on the pre-order batch of Woz. When you consider the extremely long delivery time, the design problems that required rework and lots of field replacement, etc. Add in designing a new platform, etc, etc.

As long as the pre-pay model exists, it will always be an open question as to whether they are "borrowing from Peter to pay Paul."

The moment of truth is fast approaching though (I hope) with game #3 - which has been promised WITHOUT prepay.

Let's see what the price tag is on THAT game.

I'm predicting we're going to see a healthy bump in the selling price.

#8802 4 years ago
Quoted from wcbrandes:

I'm gonna bite my tongue here as well, Its a point, if it flies over your head then put up a butter fly net! I simply do not want JJP to increase price, however when you compare what goes into a JJP pin and a Stern pin the numbers, to me, don't add up. If there are a ton that don't care and keep buying then more power to Stern "business wise". So Chessiv you are right and I should and will go back to Business school. My motto anyway....."Everydays a school day"

I understood exactly what you were selling.

#8803 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

The DMD dot picture is pure garbage by comparison. Along with pretty much everything else with Stern.
I love my Stern pins but looking to the future I'm all about JJP first. Hopefully they succeed and created dozens of pins in the future.

Would AC/DC be "more" fun if you cut the head off and slapped one on with a TV panel ?
The fun part is on the PF and the other stuff is attract mode eye candy IMHO.

Its great JJP is making something different but not everyone wants a monitor on their pinball machine.For those that do JJP is your pick.
Hopefully they can actually start steady production and eliminate the hugs gaps between machine delivery.

#8804 4 years ago
Quoted from cal50:

Would AC/DC be "more" fun if you cut the head off and slapped one on with a TV panel ?
The fun part is on the PF and the other stuff is attract mode eye candy IMHO.

I think it would be. That's why I have Mike's video mod on Ac/dc. It really does add to the playing experience for me.

I would LOVE a full screen LCD on my TWD, show clips and heads getting lopped off! Now the topper I paid $400 is useless other than eye candy.

Sounds like we are getting Stern's version of the LCD next year, for me it will make a huge difference.

#8805 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

I'm predicting we're going to see a healthy bump in the selling price.

Man I hope not. The prices (of all pinball machines) are stupid crazy already.

#8806 4 years ago

I personally like GOT better than The Hobbit from a theme standpoint. But there's no arguing that JJP did a better job of incorporating that theme into their pinball machine. They are making a compelling case for my next pin purchase. If only they hadn't hiked the price up $500 recently. That really ticked me off. And I don't believe they allow distributors to go lower than MSRP, is that correct?

#8807 4 years ago
Quoted from cal50:

Would AC/DC be "more" fun if you cut the head off and slapped one on with a TV panel ?

Hellz Yes. Absolutely. Live concert footage, live audience footage, massive HD Bell swinging and clanging. Live in the now.

#8808 4 years ago
Quoted from cal50:

Would AC/DC be "more" fun if you cut the head off and slapped one on with a TV panel ?

Maybe not more fun by itself, but definitely better, absolutely cooler and way more interesting and possibly more exciting for the overall player experience. That might make it more fun.

And if prices remain relatively close, the TV panel version is the obvious better game for my money (and I own AC/DC!)

#8809 4 years ago

Also babes from hell in glorious HD

The possibilities are endless and, I'd dare say, lascivious!

#8810 4 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

The newsletter that went out today where mummite pulled the links from:
jjp_newsletter_2015-10-01.jpg
[edit]: well, pinside seems to be compressing the image so that it looks awful. I tried a PDF instead:

Hobbit_Pinball_Update___Pinball_Expo___New_WOZ_Code_in_Beta_Test.pdf

Is there a shipping update in there somewhere?

#8811 4 years ago
Quoted from SilverBallz:

Is there a shipping update in there somewhere?

No, there are no timeframes mentioned. It looks like they're in the "gathering parts" stage and starting to figure out what each playfield assembly station will do.

#8812 4 years ago

Latest I've seen is still that JJP "hopes" to have Hobbit on the line this fall (i.e. by late December). So if they can stick to that hopefully the first owners will be receiving games early in 2016.

#8813 4 years ago

A big video screen on TWD would be cool, on AC/DC less so.

What about on an original theme? The multiball graphics on WOZ really aren't great IMO. Kind of like the 90s bowling arcade ones. I suspect the ones on the Hobbit will be better as there is slicker source material.

What happens with an original theme though? I suspect a lot of money will need to be spent shooting/creating footage. Poor graphics on a DMD will get picked up on but can be ignored. Graphics on a large LCD screen will be far more of a focal point. Hope they get it right

#8814 4 years ago

It's not so much the LCD screen as what you do with it - how it's integrated into the game. I think Hobbit will be much better than WOZ and the game after that even better. People say they can't look at the screen while they play WOZ but you learn you can, you just have to know what the right moments are....when the game pauses like at the start of a multiball or being held in a VUK, etc. I'd love to see a well done AC/DC with an LCD of concert footage, maybe an outtake from an interview. I don't think we'll be seeing a NIB game without a screen in 5 years or so unless it's retro.

#8815 4 years ago

Also cradling the ball with the flipper is a great way to review the screen.

#8816 4 years ago

Agree with latest posts. Plenty of potential players think pinball is history after 20 years of no innovation ( leaving aside p2k which had the plug pulled but probably wasn't the solution then and certainly not now ) so what JJP is doing is saying pinball is timeless. Like with a sport such as soccer always been a great game but this is the modern version. It's the only way to really multiply sales.

31
#8817 4 years ago

Folks trying to claim "the LCD is useless" are starting to sound silly....

You may NEVER look at it during a game- fine- I myself suck at pinball, so I can barely keep track of my score- much less watch an LCD during gameplay- but i certainly still DO cradle a ball and check status every once in a while for stuff needed for next multi ball, mode, etc. Seems an LCD is pretty sweet in this situation...

Also, it seems these folks keep wanting to ignore that a significant value of the LCD is in ATTRACTING people over to play the game. Walking past a row of traditional pins and ONE JJP machine? Impossible to NOT have your attention caught....

I'm anything but a JJP-fanboy, but it's foolish to suggest the LCD (done right) will not improve the experience.

I'm extremely pissed off at Stern for not including it in their latest title- it's a phenomenal opportunity LOST.

#8818 4 years ago

IMO, Stern does not care about what the customer wants. Stern is out to cut costs and make money. They are in it for personal gain. Don't get me wrong, JJP is also in it for the money as well. We all have to make a living, but it appears to me the JJP cares more about their customers and their opinions and they have shown that with all the changes the have made to TH. The difference between JJP and Stern is that this is Jack's Passion. He loves what he does where as Stern is more like, send me a check and ill show you a machine.

Jack is the Willy Wonka of Pinball.

Just MHO.

#8819 4 years ago

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#8821 4 years ago
Quoted from Skyemont:

image.jpeg image_1.jpeg image_2.jpeg image_3.jpeg image_4.jpeg image_5.jpeg image_6.jpeg

Mmm hobbits cakes.

12
#8822 4 years ago

Video screen useless? I love getting to LITZ, but it doesn't quite match this sequence!

15
#8823 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

Folks trying to claim "the LCD is useless" is starting to sound silly....
You may NEVER look at it during a game- fine- I myself suck at pinball, so I can barely keep track of my score- much less watch an LCD during gameplay- but i certainly still DO cradle a ball and check status every once in a while for stuff needed for next multi ball, mode, etc. Seems an LCD is pretty sweet in this situation...
Also, it seems these folks keep wanting to ignore that a significant value of the LCD is in ATTRACTING people over to play the game. Walking past a row on traditional pins and ONE JJP machine? Impossible to NOT have your attention caught....
I'm anything but a JJP-fanboy, but it's foolish to suggest the LCD (done right) will not improve the experience.
I'm extremely pissed off at Stern for not including it in their latest title- it's a phenomenal opportunity LOST.

Exactly. Having an LCD screen is not going to make the game play more fun. Or the rules/code better. Or the geometry of the shots smoother. But obviously having an HD LCD screen capable of showing high def clips from the actual movie (Hobbit in this case) will most certainly add to the overall immersion of the theme, and therefore the overall enjoyment of playing the pin.

Everyone will have their own priorities when it comes to things like an LCD screen and how important it is to the overall experience. And while it isn't super high on my list of priorities when it comes to a pin, it's ridiculous to claim there isn't significant benefits to having one.

I think Hobbit has infinitely more ability to impress with the use of the LCD screen that WoZ did. Fire breathing dragon > flying witch on a broom.

#8824 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

I'm extremely pissed off at Stern for not including it in their latest title- it's a phenomenal opportunity LOST.

It is an opportunity lost, but it's the content that can make an LCD really add value. I don't know what kind of implementation we will see from Stern with the speed at which they puts out games. So, I'm keeping my expectations in check.

#8825 4 years ago

I am quite fed up with Stern, lack of effort really to me. Stern is getting by with shipping games, but the lack of innovation and ruining of themes is wearing thin.

Now the other side of the coin is that JJP needs to start shipping more pins more often. IMO

#8826 4 years ago
Quoted from rai:

I am quite fed up with Stern, lack of effort really to me. Stern is getting by with shipping games, but the lack of innovation and ruining of themes is wearing thin.
Now the other side of the coin is that JJP needs to start shipping more pins more often. IMO

I agree with both of these statements. STERN ships quick but is lacking in quality. JJP takes forever but quality is fantastic. So, if JJP can ship atleast 1-2 games per year no one will be able to touch JJP. JMO.

#8827 4 years ago

Frankly I like both companies. Keeps the manufactures honest and on there toes. The hobbit is gonna be badass I will have one. But just bought a twdle cuz by the time the hobbit is ready. I'll have enough money saved for it too. I love my woz! I love my xmenle. Can't say anything about twdle cuz don't have it yet. Anyway bring on that hobbit pls! And keep that competition alive!

#8828 4 years ago
Quoted from Skyemont:

I agree with both of these statements. STERN ships quick but is lacking in quality. JJP takes forever but quality is fantastic. So, if JJP can ship atleast 1-2 games per year no one will be able to touch JJP. JMO.

Problem is I won't touch JJP games because of the price. I don't need Stern Pro cheap, but north of $6500 and I'm hard pressed to buy.

#8829 4 years ago
Quoted from Skyemont:

I agree with both of these statements. STERN ships quick but is lacking in quality. JJP takes forever but quality is fantastic. So, if JJP can ship atleast 1-2 games per year no one will be able to touch JJP. JMO.

50 games a week for 50 weeks= 2500 games. (Higher math) I great game a year would be good. Guess I'll be waiting for Lawlors game a while though.

#8830 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

Folks trying to claim "the LCD is useless" is starting to sound silly....

Its very selective, I personally couldn't care less about the display in a pinball, I bought Colour DMD's for a couple pins and after a few games the novelty wore off. JJP has a hell of a display and it looks great but if was between TH and the latest Stern the display would be the last thing I took into consideration.

#8831 4 years ago
Quoted from RobT:

Exactly. Having an LCD screen is not going to make the game play more fun. Or the rules/code better. Or the geometry of the shots smoother. But obviously having an HD LCD screen capable of showing high def clips from the actual movie (Hobbit in this case) will most certainly add to the overall immersion of the theme, and therefore the overall enjoyment of playing the pin.
Everyone will have their own priorities when it comes to things like an LCD screen and how important it is to the overall experience. And while it isn't super high on my list of priorities when it comes to a pin, it's ridiculous to claim there isn't significant benefits to having one.
I think Hobbit has infinitely more ability to impress with the use of the LCD screen that WoZ did. Fire breathing dragon > flying witch on a broom.

Good points. Also, another big pro for an LCD...value. NIB pins costs $5k-$9k today and an LCD screen with HD animations should be included at those prices. I think many people could stomach Stern's prices if they included an LCD as their main display.

#8832 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Problem is I won't touch JJP games because of the price. I don't need Stern Pro cheap, but north of $6500 and I'm hard pressed to buy.

I don't like spending north of 5k to tell u the truth. But, if I must spend that kind of cash it's going to be JJP and not a Zizzle (stern).

#8833 4 years ago
Quoted from ForceFlow:

No, there are no timeframes mentioned. It looks like they're in the "gathering parts" stage and starting to figure out what each playfield assembly station will do.

Isn't that the only update that matters at this point?

#8834 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Problem is I won't touch JJP games because of the price. I don't need Stern Pro cheap, but north of $6500 and I'm hard pressed to buy.

Just a tad over Aliens 6300 dollars

Which is probably a reasonable price for the nice pin Highway is making

#8835 4 years ago
Quoted from Jvspin:

It is an opportunity lost, but it's the content that can make an LCD really add value. I don't know what kind of implementation we will see from Stern with the speed at which they puts out games. So, I'm keeping my expectations in check.

Fair point.

Had Stern put an LCD into GoT, it probably wouldn't be to the level I'm fantasizing about it (especially seeing how they 'mailed it in" on there artwork).

I'm not that easy to please:

I *JUST* want:

Games with the attention to immersive detail in sounds, music and video that JJP is putting in TH
and
Machines manufactured and delivered with the reliable velocity of Stern
and
Built like JJPs
and
Priced like Stern Pros...

So, yes, I want it to LOOK like its taken 3 years to build but I wanted it cranked out on a few months time.

Geez, is that so much to ask?!?!?!?!?

12
#8836 4 years ago

makes me think of....

dnuts.jpg

#8837 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

Fair point.
Had Stern put an LCD into GoT, it probably wouldn't be to the level I'm fantasizing about it (especially seeing how they 'mailed it in" on there artwork).
I'm not that easy to please:
I *JUST* want:
Games with the attention to immersive detail in sounds, music and video that JJP is putting in TH
and
Machines manufactured and delivered with the reliable velocity of Stern
and
Built like JJPs
and
Priced like Stern Pros...
So, yes, I want it to LOOK like its taken 3 years to build but I wanted it cranked out on a few months time.
Geez, is that so much to ask?!?!?!?!?

Seriously though, at current prices, I just want a game to be an excellent representation and implementation of it's theme. I have plenty of games to keep me occupied, so I see no value in cutting corners on a game just to get it out to me quickly.

#8838 4 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

Its very selective, I personally couldn't care less about the display in a pinball, I bought Colour DMD's for a couple pins and after a few games the novelty wore off. JJP has a hell of a display and it looks great but if was between TH and the latest Stern the display would be the last thing I took into consideration.

If you want to sell your color dmds now that the novelty wore off let me know.

#8839 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

makes me think of....
dnuts.jpg

This makes me think of Sterns GOT dragon.

5db47deab65b627b8c5375b6e8b9d777.jpg

#8840 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

makes me think of....
dnuts.jpg

Those are for the LE buyers only right? lol

10
#8841 4 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

I bought Colour DMD's for a couple pins and after a few games the novelty wore off. JJP has a hell of a display and it looks great but if was between TH and the latest Stern the display would be the last thing I took into consideration.

Do you really think the novelty wore off? Here is how you fix that... Play a different copy of the game without one. After you get used to color in a game, an actual DMD in it looks horrible to my eyes. It instantly looks outdated.

#8842 4 years ago
Quoted from DaveH:

Do you really think the novelty wore off? Here is how you fix that... Play a different copy of the game without one. After you get used to color in a game, an actual DMD in it looks horrible to my eyes. It instantly looks outdated.

Agree. If there is a ColorDMD option for your game I would recommend it.

#8843 4 years ago
Quoted from Goronic:

Agree. If there is a ColorDMD option for your game I would recommend it.

I hear you guys but I just can't bring myself to upgrading. It's way down on my priority list. I know it looks a whole lot better but it won't be long now before LCD's are standard on every pin.

My sweet WH20 might get one someday though

#8844 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I hear you guys but I just can't bring myself to upgrading. It's way down on my priority list. I know it looks a whole lot better but it won't be long now before LCD's are standard on every pin.
My sweet WH20 might get one someday though

I took the ColorDMD out of my White Water when I needed to test the beta of Shadow. It was painful to go back to orange. Bought a new ColorDMD to restore it back to color right away.

Quoted from Goronic:

Just a tad over Aliens 6300 dollars
Which is probably a reasonable price for the nice pin Highway is making

I promise, I'm not trying to start a big comparison between Heighway and JJP. I'm just saying, Heighway has full RGB lighting, wide body, Alien will be full of toys, multiple flippers, etc. Oh, and an LCD. Which is admittedly smaller. And JJP has more processing power for their animations, they can do some things on the fly Heighway can't. Trying to be fair here. The point is they're in the same ballpark here as far as features go. Different strategies to get there, and not one to one the same, but on paper they're offering a lot of the same things.

But the reason I bring this up is isn't to start a pissing match, or say who's better. Alien isn't even out yet, let's not start blowing too many horns here, the game hasn't proven itself yet.

But Heighway can sell Alien at $6300. If JJP was selling their Standards in even roughly that ballpark I'd be interested. But when the cheap version is eight grand plus shipping it's just too much for me to justify on a pin.

I'd love to see competition lower prices, instead of raising them, which seems to be all that's happened so far. I just can't see the market for people willing to pay that much being that big. It feels like it's hard to sustain anything with those prices.

#8845 4 years ago

JJP is aiming for top of the market but if someone can deliver something close for 2/3 the money it'll be a winner also. I like all the options I can get.

#8846 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I took the ColorDMD out of my White Water when I needed to test the beta of Shadow. It was painful to go back to orange. Bought a new ColorDMD to restore it back to color right away.

I promise, I'm not trying to start a big comparison between Heighway and JJP. I'm just saying, Heighway has full RGB lighting, wide body, Alien will be full of toys, multiple flippers, etc. Oh, and an LCD. Which is admittedly smaller. And JJP has more processing power for their animations, they can do some things on the fly Heighway can't. Trying to be fair here. The point is they're in the same ballpark here as far as features go. Different strategies to get there, and not one to one the same, but on paper they're offering a lot of the same things.
But the reason I bring this up is isn't to start a pissing match, or say who's better. Alien isn't even out yet, let's not start blowing too many horns here, the game hasn't proven itself yet.
But Heighway can sell Alien at $6300. If JJP was selling their Standards in even roughly that ballpark I'd be interested. But when the cheap version is eight grand plus shipping it's just too much for me to justify on a pin.
I'd love to see competition lower prices, instead of raising them, which seems to be all that's happened so far. I just can't see the market for people willing to pay that much being that big. It feels like it's hard to sustain anything with those prices.

I hope you're right and Heighway proves that a game that is comparable to a JJP game, but at a much lower price, can be made.

JJP showed Stern that people were willing to pay a lot more for a machine. Would be nice to see something going in the other direction.

#8847 4 years ago
Quoted from DaveH:

Do you really think the novelty wore off? Here is how you fix that... Play a different copy of the game without one. After you get used to color in a game, an actual DMD in it looks horrible to my eyes. It instantly looks outdated.

It did for me, I had many other games without it and it wasn't like they were all of a sudden less fun to play, I'm not saying it didn't look better but it didn't make the overall pin any more enjoyable in the long run, I find lighting more of an enhancment to the gameplay than the display, JMO

#8848 4 years ago
Quoted from Hazoff:

It did for me, I had many other games without it and it wasn't like they were all of a sudden less fun to play, I'm not saying it didn't look better but it didn't make the overall pin any more enjoyable in the long run, I find lighting more of an enhancment to the gameplay than the display, JMO

I agree.I tried Color DMD and went back to original.It just looked wrong to me.

Im probably the wrong guy to ask as I prefer old school original stuff mostly.I will go kicking and screaming into LED usage.

1 month later
#8849 4 years ago

Zzzzzzzzz. Any news?

#8850 4 years ago

Nope. Another guarantee that it will be produced "this month" by Jack is the latest offering.

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