(Topic ID: 77386)

Hobbit Update


By B9

6 years ago



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  • Latest reply 2 years ago by GravitaR
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There are 10044 posts in this topic. You are on page 162 of 201.
#8051 4 years ago

I keep hearing that GoT will beat TH to market, but what is the unofficial guess on the GoT release? Are we anticipating September or October?

15
#8052 4 years ago
Quoted from GravitaR:

Nice to know a mod team member views the lack of on topic material the right to post anything they want anywhere despite the thread subject. Thanks for the clarification.
Now all that time the staff has spent on off-topic matters can be shelved to do something much more site useful.

OT: TigerLaw is probably the most fair and decent mod on this forum! He gives a ton of time and energy here and is an all around good dude! If you think you can do better maybe you should contact Robin and tell him you want to join the team. I'm guessing it's not easy to walk the line the Mods have to walk.

20
#8053 4 years ago
Quoted from GravitaR:

Nice to know a mod team member views the lack of on topic material the right to post anything they want anywhere despite the thread subject.

Read my post again. I think it's related topic. My opinion. Sorry you don't share it.

#8054 4 years ago
Quoted from GravitaR:

Nice to know a mod team member views the lack of on topic material the right to post anything they want anywhere despite the thread subject. Thanks for the clarification.
Now all that time the staff has spent on off-topic matters can be shelved to do something much more site useful.

Wow.

#8055 4 years ago

Question to those that have played TH:
What happened to the drop targets that drop and raise independently, is that functionality still in there?
-mof

#8056 4 years ago
Quoted from mof:

Question to those that have played TH:
What happened to the drop targets that drop and raise independently, is that functionality still in there?
-mof

Yes. Very cool.

#8057 4 years ago

I think people are failing to realize that Jack's show yesterday was more of a get together than an actual pinball show. IMO, it wouldn't make any sense to reveal any big news. It wasn't the right setting. This is coming from someone who was there for 5 hours...as I said before, the Hobbit has the potential to be epic.

#8058 4 years ago
Quoted from TigerLaw:

JJP could have filled this thread with news and buzz had this past weekend been what we were lead to believe it might be.
Regarding the discussion of Stern's LCD display as it relates to the Hobbit, I personally don't feel it's off topic. Stern's employees have been hinting that GoT is going to surpass the Hobbit and have this massive BOM with a dragon ball lock and what not...now we hear that GoT might not have an LCD display like the Hobbit will...
Directly relevant? Nope. Ballpark relevant? In lack of other news I'd say it's certainly ballpark relevant. Similar themes. Supposed to have a similar release date (though now it seems GoT will beat it to market). Similar price points. Rival development teams.
The lack of an LCD display will mean GoT is less likely to poach customers off the NIB market from TH.

I talked at length with Butch yesterday and he told me that the LCD was a pretty expensive piece to the BOM. I really believe that would cut into the profit margin of GOT and that's probably why we may be hearing that it may not be in. I don't need a LCD to play pinball but I do think it adds a great deal to the gameplay. Also, I love being able to pull of the diagnostics on that huge screen. After playing the Hobbit I'm definitely still in.

#8059 4 years ago
#8060 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

You don't think people will be raving about the LCD when Stern puts it in? I will.

Don't know & don't care, if a person is amazed at a flat panel then likely so.
I like games that are more fun to play than look at.
YMMV.

#8061 4 years ago
Quoted from cal50:

I like games that are more fun to play than look at.

I like games that are fun to play and fun to look at. That's the best way to get me to open my wallet, do both.

With the rate that JJP puts out games I don't think they can afford to think any other way.

#8062 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

I like games that are fun to play and fun to look at. That's the best way to get me to open my wallet, do both.
With the rate that JJP puts out games I don't think they can afford to think any other way.

True that.

JJP has shown they can produce a game ( singular ). The long delay/s ( plural ) is not helping them.

I think any true pinball fan appreciates a nice game no matter the source but not many of that group will spend several thousands of dollars and wait years get a game, ANY game.

#8063 4 years ago

Anybody have any idea WHEN Hobbit finally ships?!?! Good grief, this game has been in development FOREVER. (And no, I'm not buying one.)

#8064 4 years ago
Quoted from txstargazer3:

I keep hearing that GoT will beat TH to market, but what is the unofficial guess on the GoT release? Are we anticipating September or October?

Stern typically has a newer game at Expo... so if its GoT or something else... who knows.. but I expect a new Stern for Expo dates, and it better not be Kiss

At this rate no way Hobbit is at volume by that date.. best hope seems to be aiming for production starting by then.

#8065 4 years ago

I won't be pre-ordering from JJP again. So so slow. And no updates re delivery dates.

#8066 4 years ago
Quoted from jiffy:

Anybody have any idea WHEN Hobbit finally ships?!?! Good grief, this game has been in development FOREVER. (And no, I'm not buying one.)

My serious guess, not trolling, just being realistic: early next year.

We have no idea what the software status is, but given what we know about the voice acting it's pretty obvious it's still being worked on in some capacity. So it's not just the playfield, or all the incredible amount of work JP is spending on the LCD screen (can't wait to see more, JP is talented and has a great touch with motion graphics). The software has been under construction too. No doubt because Keith is murdering it, I'm sure the code is going to be something we'll be talking about for a long time.

The game just took longer than planned, bottom line. It happens! No criticism from me, just how it seems to have gone.

Then whatever happened with the money. Let's just stick with the obvious fact: you don't take on investment capital if you're flush. Lot of talk about people owed money, from a lot of sources. I'm sure there was some level of truth there. Not gonna help you get parts.

So here they are. Game supposedly done(ish), they have the capital infusion in theory (has it happened already?) and they're waiting for parts.

Well that's a whole new journey, it ain't over yet. Parts are late. They don't fit because someone screwed up a measurement. The ball guides look like shit instead of chrome. The final part doesn't match the prototype.

This is especially true for newer companies. JJP and Heighway and Spooky and Dutch Pinball are all new. They don't have long standing relationships with suppliers like Stern.

Just getting all the parts right and set is work, let's put it that way. And it takes time. When something is wrong you don't get a new one the next day.

I just don't see given all that, and the historical realities of JJP, and the fact that they're still playing catchup on WOZ (40 I think I heard?) ... that sounds like people not getting games until next year. At least with the info we have now, which is pretty thin.

I know Alien and Hobbit are competitors in a way, but hopefully I can post as a fan of pinball, that I wish the game luck.

#8067 4 years ago

I love JJPs platform and design philosophy. I think the Hobbit looks very promising.

But pinball is such an expensive toy, that if GoT gets announced before TH arrives, it would be stupid for me not to consider cancelling my Hobbit order and shifting the funds towards GoT, which has a similar theme.

Now, it is unlikely I'll do that, if anyone cares, if there is still no Stern color display. And I think the individually controlled drops sound like a lot of fun. But I won't rule out the possibility that GoT won't have some innovation that trumps all that. And I can't be the only one in that boat.

That said, I think it would be a fatal error for jjp to rush hobbit out at this point half baked. Jjp only has the sales maintained at this point because of the perception that they're simply better in software, features, display, and quality. Anything that alters that would be more damaging than the delays. But having Sterns release overlap with their release with such similar themes isn't great news for jjp, obviously.

#8068 4 years ago

I admit that I am disappointed that we haven't heard any recent TH updates. I am in on the pre-order but only needed a $500 deposit with my distributor (that was 2 years ago). So it's not like I have had a big investment tied up but the buzz is really off for me when it comes to the game. The movies are a distant memory and as such I am seriously considering moving my funds over to Alien or GOT. So 1st impressive game to market will probably win me over. I suspect quite a few hobbit orders could be in jeopardy as a result of the delays. The delays may not have any effect on the pinheads amongst us that can afford every new pin produced but I suspect that it does on those of us that only buy NIB every so often.

I really want this pin to succeed as I love the innovation but in the end I may end up not being an owner due to the long delays.

#8069 4 years ago
Quoted from PBFan:

I am in on the pre-order but only needed a $500 deposit with my distributor (that was 2 years ago).

Wait, are you getting it for $7500 with only $500 down?

#8070 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Wait, are you getting it for $7500 with only $500 down?

Damn, if so I wish I got that deal. The other question would be - did you still get a chance to get the Smaug edition with only 500 down?

#8071 4 years ago
Quoted from DaveH:

Can you share the drawings or prototype video you used to make that assessment?

I am assuming it will. Never mentioned that I saw a playfield design. I personally do not like the design of the hobbit. I am a Steve Ritchie fan so that is why I'm assuming that I'm going to like the layout better.

#8072 4 years ago
Quoted from txstargazer3:

I keep hearing that GoT will beat TH to market, but what is the unofficial guess on the GoT release? Are we anticipating September or October?

At this point it appears that even if its not Sterns NEXT pin, it might beat TH to market....

But the Million dollar question is (well, more like $9K, but it's getting there), what will Stern *DO* with GOT?

Play it safe with some very minor expansion of Spike, or
Showcase something really new?

I think ether way, assuming the pin is fun (and they don't f-up the voice work, artwork, etc) they will sell very well.

The wildcard is an LCD. If they release THAT, and the game is legit, it will siphon TH buyers...

Frankly, Stern will cash-in on this title regardless.

I will be VERY disappointed if they "play it safe"

#8073 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

The wildcard is an LCD. If they release THAT, and the game is legit, it will siphon TH buyers...
Frankly, Stern will cash-in on this title regardless.

Yep, a whole lot of TH buyers siphoned.

Hobbit isn't even relevant anymore and was a poor movie trilogy.

GOT marches onward, an LCD would be awesome but from all the insider comments its looks doubtful. Maybe its a very well kept secret.

#8074 4 years ago

Just for clarification, when people are hoping Stern puts an LCD into the game, do you mean an LCD the size of JJP's or an LCD roughly the same size as a DMD?

#8075 4 years ago
Quoted from Trekkie1978:

Just for clarification, when people are hoping Stern puts an LCD into the game, do you mean an LCD the size of JJP's or an LCD roughly the same size as a DMD?

Yes.

#8076 4 years ago
Quoted from Trekkie1978:

LCD roughly the same size as a DMD?

LCD the size of a DMD. Would not want one the size of JJP - that is way, way too big. A 14 inch laptop screen would be perfect.

a2.jpg

#8077 4 years ago

I lost my job last week and am giving serious thoughts to giving up my Smaug LE. Anyone interested in buying for $8k? Yes that's $500 more than what I got in at but I've also had this money tied up for so long and would like to get something back for it, plus in a real bind. I believe my number is #493.

#8078 4 years ago
Quoted from cscmtp:

I lost my job last week and am giving serious thoughts to giving up my Smaug LE. Anyone interested in buying for $8k? Yes that's $500 more than what I got in at but I've also had this money tied up for so long and would like to get something back for it, plus in a real bind. I believe my number is #493.

Sorry to hear about your job, but if I could offer up some advice, lower your price and get rid of it fast. When GOT in announced and Spider-Man comic, people are going to be looking to raise some cash............You will not be the only one selling their Hobbit. With no production date in sight and a high probability for potential future issues, there will be plenty running for the doors. I had two preorders at two different times......Happy I got out. I know there will be plenty of time to jump back in. Best of luck finding a new job.

#8079 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Then whatever happened with the money. Let's just stick with the obvious fact: you don't take on investment capital if you're flush.

Not necessarily. In young companies especially, taking more investors can be about growth. You don't have the capital reserves to do the expansion you think you need. But the reason I don't think that applies at jjp- is because there appears to be no pitched plan in how they will address their biggest issue... Production output. When asked how they would change when there were multiple games to build (new opportunities!) jack basically side stepped the question. The man who loves to boast... Is dead quiet on production rates and concurrency. That's all I need to see.

Quoted from Aurich:

I just don't see given all that, and the historical realities of JJP, and the fact that they're still playing catchup on WOZ (40 I think I heard?) ...

The 40 number was in reference to a days to ship quote from jack. Basically that they had a backlog of orders.. Vs having stock on hand

-3
#8080 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Yep, a whole lot of TH buyers siphoned.
Hobbit isn't even relevant anymore and was a poor movie trilogy.
GOT marches onward, an LCD would be awesome but from all the insider comments its looks doubtful. Maybe its a very well kept secret.

Unbelievably stupid post! The Hobbit is a fantastic theme. It doesn't matter how perfect the movies were. It has great characters, monsters, action and its middle earth!! Tron was a shit movie but it's a great theme for a pin. Infortunately JJ really screwed up the planning on this pin, but all will be forgotten when it's released.

#8081 4 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

In young companies especially, taking more investors can be about growth.

That's fine if you have a market to rapidly expand into. There is no huge market for pinball machines that cost $8000+, and likely never will be. Even if they can solve their production problems.

#8082 4 years ago

I am a big Walking Dead fan. After I bought the Hobbit it was announced and I was like oh crap - this may be the pin that get me asking for a refund. But after seeing the pin decided it wasn't for me. GoT is another oh crap moment - so we'll see if it can peel me off my Hobbit order (I doubt it will - but we'll see)

#8083 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

That's fine if you have a market to rapidly expand into. There is no huge market for pinball machines that cost $8000+, and likely never will be. Even if they can solve their production problems.

There already is another company sharing that market... That jjp would not take market share from if they are so constrained...

And let's not forget... The market leader said there wasn't a market for a game like woz before jjp...

#8084 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinballs:

I won't be pre-ordering from JJP again. So so slow. And no updates re delivery dates.

same thoughts here as well. i have a RR and my SE-TH is paid in full . im sure it will be worth the wait, but this is ridiculous , you dont keep customers in a closet on their purchase.

#8085 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

There is no huge market for pinball machines that cost $8000+, and likely never will be. Even if they can solve their production problems.

Something has got to give sooner or later.

#8086 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Something has got to give sooner or later.

Couldn't agree more.

I don't see location pinball driving sales of JJP games. $5,000 vs $8,000...If I'm an operator, I'm going for the $5,000 machine every time.

The market for high end pins can't be that big of a market. The same people can't keep buying $8,000 pins every few months.

#8087 4 years ago
Quoted from Trekkie1978:

The same people can't keep buying $8,000 pins every few months.

Agreed. But I think there is new blood in this hobby that will buy.

#8088 4 years ago
Quoted from Goronic:

Agreed. But I think there is new blood in this hobby that will buy.

Just seems like a pretty big expense for people who are new to the hobby.

When people ask me how much my pins cost (I cringe telling them), I always get a "they cost how much?!?!?!?!?!" Then I reply that it is something I love and I work hard, so I like to treat myself.

I hope no one misunderstands me, I want Stern and JJP to sell 10's of thousands of games a year. Two healthy, competing companies, is a huge plus for all of us.

#8089 4 years ago

They ain't cheap...NIB that is (well almost any good pin really)

11
#8090 4 years ago
Quoted from Trekkie1978:

Just for clarification, when people are hoping Stern puts an LCD into the game, do you mean an LCD the size of JJP's or an LCD roughly the same size as a DMD?

SOMETHING.

I like the JJP LCD.... I like the TBL LCD.... Hell, I even thought the Magic Girl LCD design could have been interesting....

I just don't want to spend $6k-$8K and then IMMEDIATELY start begging for colorDMD support so I can rip out a near-new DMD and replace it for another $500.....

It feels like booking a room at the Ritz and finding they have a black and white tv in the room...

#8091 4 years ago
Quoted from Goronic:

Agreed. But I think there is new blood in this hobby that will buy.

I saw a buttload of WOZs being built in the factory pics from this past weekend...and they are still have 40 more orders to catch up. As most of the Pinside crowd have already bought their WOZ, that tells me there is plenty of new money out there to support $8k games. The current prices are higher than I would like to pay - but those prices are here to stay I'm afraid.

#8092 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

That's fine if you have a market to rapidly expand into. There is no huge market for pinball machines that cost $8000+, and likely never will be. Even if they can solve their production problems.

What's the market like in the UK then ? $11,383 for a WOZ standard ( Pinball Heaven ) They are selling some JJP machines at those kind of prices.

#8093 4 years ago

Yes crazy prices, but bear in mind Europe has 20%+ import (sales) tax vs approx 5% in US, so it's not the retailer ripping us off.

It also means it's a lot cheaper for US folks to get Alien from UK.

The shipping is surprisingly cheap for such a heavy, large item, particularly when done by the container load.

All that said, NIB prices are so high now, it puts me off buying new. Yet we all still do it

#8094 4 years ago

And $8000= £5193 rather than the £7395 ($11383 ) we pay. Heighway has a good chance to compete. £4550=$7008 Full Throttle

#8095 4 years ago
Quoted from Trekkie1978:

I don't see location pinball driving sales of JJP games. $5,000 vs $8,000...If I'm an operator, I'm going for the $5,000 machine every time.

Right now today the choices are a NIB standard WOZ for $8500 or you can grab two of the seven available NIB Stern pros for $9k shipped.

#8096 4 years ago

What was somewhat disappointing for me looking through the pics of the open house was that there was no indication of a second production line being assembled (for concurrent WOZ/TH production). JJP can't say "we are just waiting on parts" as an excuse for not building out the second production line.

So either:

A) there will never be two production lines and they are going to build a surplus of 200 or so WOZ machines before changing the line over to TH.
B) a second line will be built at some point for TH...but I am highly doubtful they can spin up an entire production line in time to "start production in Oct"

My only hope is that those stacked cabinets were hiding the second line...but I'm not sure why they wouldn't want to show that off at the open house?

Either way it doesn't give me much hope that production will start in Oct. Bummer.

#8097 4 years ago
Quoted from Damonator:

I saw a buttload of WOZs being built in the factory pics from this past weekend...and they are still have 40 more orders to catch up. As most of the Pinside crowd have already bought their WOZ, that tells me there is plenty of new money out there to support $8k games.

Plenty meaning what though? It could be a couple hundred, and good for JJP, but that's not a big market still. It's just going to be a niche thing. Even if measured in the thousands.

#8098 4 years ago

Words...words....words.....

Is there a Hobbit update somewhere buried in this mess!? Is it still scheduled to release this year?

#8099 4 years ago
Quoted from lowepg:

SOMETHING.
I like the JJP LCD.... I like the TBL LCD.... Hell, I even thought the Magic Girl LCD design could have been interesting....
I just don't want to spend $6k-$8K and then IMMEDIATELY start begging for colorDMD support so I can rip out a near-new DMD and replace it for another $500.....
It feels like booking a room at the Ritz and finding they have a black and white tv in the room...

Times 1000. That's the most insane practice ever. Paying 6-8k and then immediately dropping another $500 to color a BS dmd.

Please stop the madness! "SOMETHING", anything that doesn't require another waste of $500

#8100 4 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Words...words....words.....
Is there a Hobbit update somewhere buried in this mess!? Is it still scheduled to release this year?

Nobody knows with any degree of certainty.

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