When I think of someone on Pinside who posts more personal attacks than anyone, and whose posts almost always get more thumbs down than thumbs up, I think of you Cap'n!

And in the name of full disclosure, I *still* don't think that you are a real Cap'n!

And speaking of Homers, seems that you are the one that rated TOTAN a perfect 10.0. Freaking hilarious! That TOTAN thread must really piss you off!

Yes, that 8.23 vs 8.22 victory is overwhelming

Hopefully the mods will step in and put an end to insanely useless back and forth BS about other pins and personal sh!t.

Supposed to be a thread for updates on The Hobbit, regardless if there are any or not.

Huh? By my understanding half the tracks in the game are original by David Thiel (maybe you know him? ), and the female computer voice narrating portions of the game are also original. Maybe I misunderstand your statement.

There is only so much daft punk one person can listen too with no variability.

False

P.S. No Separate Ways.. Booooooooo.

100% agreed

You are misunderstanding. I meant i hate daft punk LOL I'm not a fan of the electronica genre. Just a personal preference but it wasn't good for me.

Well that's even worse

Interesting connection between daft punk and pinball:

http://www.space-eight.com/Daft_Punk_Helmets.html
http://www.space-eight.com/pinballSelect.html

Brian Cox is quite the fellow. Hope to meet him someday.

Sorry you're so sensitive about it, buddy. It's just my opinion. I thought that was what a forum was for. I didn't realize it was only for WOZ haters and Tron lovers.

I'll spend the rest of my day trying to defend WOZ on about 100 other JJP-bashing threads...where apparently it's okay to do the exact thing you're criticizing me for.

And I'm not bashing Tron. Love the theme, hate the game...and especially the music. Sorry that I'm not down with guys in stupid helmets putting out pseudo techno Euro-trash music. As a musician, it makes my head hurt.

There's a game for every person, and a million different opinions on each game. You're not going to change mine, nor should you attack people for having opinions who differ from yours. And goes for a few other people on here...

Forgot to address this. The list is a consensus, and I respect the consensus. I don't think MM is the top game...I actually thing AFM is a better playing game, although it's simpler by design. So yes...the top 100 represents a consensus of the opinions of Pinsiders. So it's correct. It's not MY top 100 (although I'd be hard pressed to come up with one because I just love pinball, period).

Doesn't matter to the sprinter in the Olympics that wins by .001 seconds, and it doesn't matter to me either. You sound like the guy who came in second. Or New York Giants fans when they lose a game.

So - the takeaway here is that there are no Hobbit updates but 4 years later we all still love Tron and it has the best music in pinball.

You got me. I’m not a real Captain. Here’s another startling revelation, genius: despite my Jolly Roger avatar, I’m not a real pirate either. I couldn’t care less what other people think about TOTAN as my game isn’t going anywhere. Who knows, maybe you’ll flop again like a blue fish just as you did with TWD and have a markedly different opinion of TOTAN inside a week. At this point, I’m done engaging you and your banal replies because every time I do, I feel like a kitten smacking around a ball of yarn. Cause you got ugatz! In the meantime, why don’t you walk away from the keyboard and bang a few balls around on your Bow and Arrow or Mustang. That should be fun for all of zero minutes.

Well....um.... yeah. yes.

EDIT: I'll add that the hobbit music may just pass TRON. I think the amount of music, and the way it will be able to set so many moods in the game, may put it in first place. But we'll see. I think it may just boil down to your thoughts on the theme and if you like epic cinematic sound.

David Thiel rules. I'm sure the music will be great.

I don't agree with any of the WOZ bashing for the most part. If people do not like the game play I completely understand. I'm also not sensitive about this at all, it's called not agreeing. I would not have even replied if you had not posted the below, pretty much telling us that we are to stupid to be able to determine if we like the game or not because of pretty lights. The ironic part of that post to me is that seems to be the number one complaint that I hear from people that don't like WOZ. "Pretty lights, drain monster, annoying music, not that fun to play". My opinion is that WOZ is a ground breaking game and I enjoy playing it for numerous reasons. For everyone, probably not though.

You also have not been attacked in anyway. You used the rankings to make a point. You however do not really agree with the rankings based on how you rank games (neither do I) so I don't see how your point is valid. We just disagree on tron, it's not personal

The machine doesn't have to have custom callouts if it's based on a movie. Well implemented movie callouts would be my personal preference. I have ST, and the Karl Urban sound package is so out of place.

Tron is just pinball perfection. The SOS music and mode are both just plain brilliant. Only about half of the music is actually Daft Punk too, the rest is composed by Thiel himself. But from the moment you press the start button you're just immersed in a dynamic mix of sound, lights and music. It's the only game that feels completely cohesive and unique to me.

It's just got so many unique sounds that are so rich and only synonymous, in my mind, with the Tron pinball machine.

I believe they're called "sound logos" in the business (someone correct me if Im wrong), but the "Seeeegaaaaa" from the Genesis days is a good example of one. That's how Tron feels to me; "Unmistakeably Tron". From the moment I hit the start button I feel like I'm in the grid. No other machine has been able to match that experience for me, and man have I searched high and low trying to find it.

No worries. Some people here live to tweak others...and downvote their opinions. You'll notice that I rarely downvote anybody - they all have a right to their opinion. I feel really bad for people who come at a complete stranger with thinly disguised troll posts. They're the first ones to criticize others and the last ones able to take a joke. Thanks for your explanation, and enjoy an upvote!

EDIT: Wasn't calling Tron lovers stupid, either. I was trying to say it's a sweet looking game, but ultimately doesn't live up to its looks.

...but it does...and beyond!

i'd be pretty happy if Jack released a rule set for the hobbit or a map or a gameplay video... or something..

Exactly, give us something so we can stop rambling on about tron.

My guess is that JJP is probably saving the complete ruleset release for their Expo presentation in October. I last heard TH production won't start until October, so they need something to talk about at Expo. Can't keep giving the same presentations over & over.

Highly unlikely that they'll be showing Lawlor's pin at Expo this year either, unless they feel like cannibalizing Hobbit sales. Maybe a theme/name reveal on Lawlor, but that's it.

I guess we'll know more in a week or so at the open house.

EDIT: Even though this is a Hobbit update thread, I'm not complaining about the Tron talk I'm a huge electronic fan, always loved the movies & would love to own one someday.

Anyone?

^^^ To my dismay, I must say I agree with Hoaky ^^^

I knew it!

Here’s another startling revelation, genius: despite my Jolly Roger Avatar, I’m not a real pirate either.

Not a "real" pirate huh? So you just like playing one on Pinside?

I couldn’t care less what other people think about TOTAN as my game isn’t going anywhere.

You sure about that?

Because this post of yours (with 16 thumbs down) would seem to indicate quite the opposite as you seem pretty pissed off with those who have said less than nice things about it:

Sounds like you probably *could* care less given that response.

Who knows, maybe you’ll flop again like a blue fish just as you did with TWD and have a markedly different opinion of TOTAN inside a week.

I doubt it as I've played TOTAN a lot, and I don't expect a code update to come out any time soon. Besides, it's not like I think TOTAN completely sucks.

As for TWD yeah, I definitely changed my tune on that one as all of my initial opinions were based on playing a pro on location that had terrible SDTM drains from the pops. Thank God I was able to play some HUO LE's to change my opinion. If I were someone who only cared about being right all the time, I would not have done a complete turn around on TWD. It's good to have an open mind. You should try it some time!

At this point, I’m done engaging you and your banal replies because every time I do, I feel like a kitten smacking around a ball of yarn. Cause you got ugatz!

Please do not make promises that you very well know that you can't keep. Too much data on this one. You obviously have a major personal problem with me, and you let me know it the very first time that you ever directly engaged me on this forum by telling me that "I don't like you one iota." You don't even post very often, but it seems that an unusually high percentage of your posts are spent responding to me with some type of personal attack. I think it would be great if you stopped "engaging" me and my "banal" replies, but I'm certainly not naive enough to think that will actually happen. Your dislike of me runs too deep for you to do that!

In the meantime, why don’t you walk away from the keyboard and bang a few balls around on your Bow and Arrow or Mustang. That should be fun for all of zero minutes.

Nice zinger!

Now that was a classic exchange, with insults fit for a Captain! Sadly, the quality of the Captain's invective in this thread just isn't up to snuff.

But you should really include the "Full disclosure:" bit when you're quoting the Captain (formatting adjusted to highlight the slant rhyme that gives it a poetic feel):
Full disclosure:
I don't like you one iota.

You can't think of it this way. More games available = MORE customers. You can't assume every potential JJP buyer wants a Hobbit. Do Stern's multiple titles available at any given time cannibalize sales? No, they bring in more customers as there are more choices - they keep revenue coming in and the factory churning. A pinball company needs multiple titles on the line to be a successful manufacturing company.

I agree. If they show JJP #3 at expo and some people like it enough to skip TH it's just as likely that they would have jumped ship for the next stern instead. If it's nearly complete they should show it as people that love it will start planning on saving the cash to pay for it in 6-12 months (or 3 years ) when it starts shipping. JJP will be a lot more viable if they can run WOZ, TH and the JJP #3. If both games are awesome I'll buy both. There's starting to be some competition in the market so JJP needs to make a statement and show that they are moving from a startup to a real player. If both games are awesome people will buy both instead of a competitors game.

Well I don't see it that way. These JJP games aren't cheap & most people on here can't afford both, let alone one of them.

If Lawlor's pin is revealed before Hobbit is well into production, then a lot of people might ask for a refund on the Hobbit & move that money to Lawlor's pin. I don't see how that helps JJP. They aren't producing multiple titles like Stern, just barley 2 at the moment. There's also the chance that if Stern's GOT is revealed at Expo (which it probably will) & it turns out to have all kinds of new Stern tech (LCD), then it also has a good chance to cause additional refunds from Hobbit pre-orders.

Yes in the long run JJP needs to be producing multiple titles at the same time. But getting the Hobbit out the door is the immediate priority right now.

"People on here" are a minor fraction of pinball sales. They're trying to sell games to all kinds of customers around the world - not just the hardcore forum fanatics.

I would argue that people on here (operators & pinball fans) drive the industry, not a bunch of mythical worldwide deep pocketed buyers that are out there buying up $9500 WOZRR & Hobbit Pre-orders left & right as Jack would have you believe.

I'd also be willing to bet that the majority of operators & fans feel that almost 10K for a NIB JJP pin is ridiculous. All I'm saying is it's not in there best interest to reveal a THIRD title when it's taken over 3 years to get the SECOND title out the door (which it has yet). It will cannibalize their own sales. My two cents, moving on....

You're wrong. We're a small set of buyers. A pinball company cannot thrive with just us. Stern has 8 titles in production. More titles = more customers = more sales = more growth. Think long term. JJP's games will be in production for years. If even *one* sale is "cannibalized" - that buyer might come back in a year and buy another JJP game. In the short term, more titles = more choice = more sales. The facts...moving on....

The only guy local to me who has taken delivery of a WOZ is a non-operator who never even heard of pinside.

Hobbit Hobbit Hobbit

Let me try and address a few of your assertions. I will try my best to keep it civil. I do not have a “major personal problem” with you, but where I take umbrage is with your sanctimonious and arrogant tone as if you invented pinball. You are not Steve Kordek. You make hundreds of posts on Pinside every week as well as a countless number in this thread over the past year plus. It’s a public forum with thousands of members - do you not expect dissenting opinions? And perhaps the occasional pushback to match your supercilious musings? In the spirit of accuracy, I did not state “Full disclosure: I do not like you one iota” the first time I engaged you. I was respectful. Your endless digs at WOZ, JJP, and TH were getting stale. Not much has changed in the last year. Oh sure, you’ll occasionally post some disingenuous message about how you hope JJP succeeds, but it reeks of phoniness. You’re as transparent as InvisiGlass in that regard. No, it was you who immediately went for the knife in the top drawer and came at me. Because it was easy. Because that’s what you typically do. Because you like to bully people. So instead of folding like a house of cards, I punched you in the mouth (metaphorically, of course). And I’ll continue to swing for the fences [at you] whenever I see fit. You picked the wrong Pinsider to strong-arm because I have no fear of poking around in the hornet’s nest at a “Pinside Immortal.”

IMO you hit the nail on the head with TOTAN, it's like the Anna Kournikova of pins, nice to look at but it's not a winner (IMO). There are a few suspect top10 pins, but TOTAN in the number one offender. I owned Totan, I know Totan and when it comes to playing I'd take Tron or IM every day and twice on sunday.

I feel Tron (and to an lesser extent) IM are somewhat under rated, how Tron is out of the top 20 is beyond me.

Lighten up Francis.

Thanks for proving my point, genius.

Exactly the reason to have game #3 debut at expo at least as a title and a few peeks of info. I plan on getting both. The percentage of game #3 hurting Hobbit sales is minimal in the overall picture.

More choices to potential buyers. It will hurt Stern sales and directly Steve's game. Pinball is on an all time high and competition is good ! Pat's and Steve's game are going head to head

Rob actually *IS* Steve Kordek! Steve was such a genius, one of his pinball machines actually allowed him to travel forward in time, & he took on the name "Rob T"! At some point he's going to have to travel back again so he can continue to make all those games...but in the meantime, he's here amongst us - so respect him! He did invent pinball!!!!!

Sorry to out you Steve, er, I mean Rob...

So instead of folding like a house of cards, I punched you in the mouth (metaphorically, of course). And I’ll continue to swing for the fences [at you] whenever I see fit. You picked the wrong Pinsider to strong-arm because I have No Fear of poking around in the hornet’s nest at a “Pinside Immortal.”

LOL! This is the most pathetic shit Ive ever read on Pinside.

Edit-----I mean, it honestly made me laugh that there are actually people out there that think like this!

The ribbing or "digs" are just hitting on the many promises made by JJP and the failure to execute them.
I think some WOZ fans take it all personally and WAY to seriously.

You are correct that not much has changed in the last year except some more ribbing or "digs".
YMMV.

I normally don't read posts this long but this kept my interest. It's insane and so outrageous. Wtf...

I feel you've chosen a poor analogy.

If it was the "ana kournikova" of pins, I'd never get tired playing with it....

I feel a song will make it's appearance right about now.

I see your point, maybe should have said the Tiger Woods of pins, got the name recognition but should be a better player. (IMO of course).

this thread reminds me of this song:

There is no winner here. You both look weak arguing back and forth.

I agree, but at least I'm not stalking the Cap'n/Pirate all over Pinside like he's doing to me:

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/plea-for-an-update-anything-really/page/3#post-2626197

Pretend captains like to stalk, they don't know any better.

Excuse me? It's not stalking when you post in every goddam thread on Pinside - and use emoticons like it's your life's work. Just give it a rest, chief.

What does this even mean?