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(Topic ID: 94039)

Hobbit Artwork revealed!


By JoeJet

6 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 376 posts
  • 138 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 years ago by Geremy13
  • Topic is favorited by 7 Pinsiders

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There are 376 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 8.
#251 6 years ago

I am really liking the layout of the game still. 3 flippers makes more sense. all the different troll type targets and smaug. Seems like no lack of bash toys. I like the lower portion of the PF but as others have stated the heads look tacky. Put a few main characters in the art but not copy paste style.

Overall the game looks like it will be fun to play. I will look for one used later I am sure.

Thanks for sharing.

#252 6 years ago

Art could have been better, but at least it's got a unique feel. I was worried it'd look too much like lotr. Really like how different the lower, center inserts look.

#253 6 years ago
Quoted from NFK:

@Jersey Jack: Do yourself and all pinball fans a favor, get over your business mind and don't use license stuff anymore. Let it pass. Leave that part to Stern. Do something new. Free your mind and your ass will follow.

You don't have to buy this game! Wait for JJPs next.
JJP and STERN can do both, Movie licences and original themes if they want. But why do people think that movie themes have to look like original artworks?
Perhaps you don't have the freedom to do what you want but you have so much more material that you can use. And you have a theme that is already in the minds of the players.

I don't want to bash STERN with this post. I love my AC/DC and Metallica pins, but I am very happy that JJP and not STERN got the licence for "the Hobbit". I know how much love and detail the JJP will put in this game, and I thrust Keith to make the rules awesome to play like WOZ and thruthful to the theme.
It's a movie licence, there are restrictions from Warner Brothers. We all knew this from the beginning. But JJPs "The Hobbit" pinball will be epic, they will do the best they can.
It's personal taste, I just want "The Hobbit" to be more like WOZ or LotR. And less like Batman, PotC, Star Trek,Transformers or Avengers.

#254 6 years ago
Quoted from Asael:

You don't have to buy this game! Wait for JJPs next.

Indeed! I've heard people being enthusiastic about Pats theme and his ideas (though I do not know what it'll be myself)

#255 6 years ago

Well i don't have to buy it, but at least i want to play it and all the things you said would also work with an original theme.

IMO nowadays an original theme is much quicker in the pinball heads than another movie license.

#256 6 years ago
Quoted from Asael:

But JJPs "The Hobbit" pinball will be epic, they will do the best they can.

I think that nails it. The features are truly nothing less than EPIC!

Just look at this thing: Drop-Targets everywhere, 2-way-subway, a ramp-diverter making the huge ramps into a fast u-turn, four (!) pop-up targets, a shooting left outlane with aiming device and a smaug toy we haven't even seen yet but that seems very promising just looking at the ramp design in that area.

VUKs, Magnets, Rollovers - you name it, it's there.

Still they should correct some of the playfield artwork to make it worthy of this epic package.

#257 6 years ago

The problem with getting a bit of education is that ignorance is bliss.

I was perfectly fine with the art package of THLE until I read this thread. During my ignorance, I was very happy with the playfield.

Now, thanks to this thread, I notice the little things that need to be corrected.

In the end, I believe I will still be happy since I am very easily pleased with regards to art.

I appreciate those that have added constructive criticism.

I enjoyed reading this thread. I am excited about getting THLE whenever I get it.

Marcus

#258 6 years ago
Quoted from Xerico:

The problem with getting a bit of education is that ignorance is bliss.

So that's why I'm such a happy guy! I loved the playfield art, and still do...

#259 6 years ago

Greetings all, here's my useless comments.

1) I own a WOZ standard on location, beautiful game but its a ball drainer and while the bling keeps its earnings up a common complaint I get is that its just too damn complicated. Casual players have a steep learning curve. Kind of like the Twilight Zone syndrome but no where near as bad of course. What I see with this game is a wide open "just hit shots" layout that could easily provide that instant gratification that you need to get a casual player hooked on a game and pumping in money. I LOVE those big a$$ ramp entrances right in the middle that will provide for easy, feel good shots. I want my customers to feel good playing pinball. This game might provide that.

2) Barrels in the pop bumpers is an obvious "duh". Of course that's there, that makes sense.

3) I did a search through all the pages of this thread and (unless I missed it) still haven't seen a good reason for the upper flipper other than just to have one. IMHO upper flippers need to be there to provide access to a shot that can't be hit from the lower flippers (aren't I a genius). My other concern is shots from the upper flipper hitting the upper bash toys at odd angles from the side and causing additional wear and tear. They can be dropped by software of course on a switch hit coming out of the pop bumpers but....... (insert concerns here) And its just one more damn flipper to keep working. One of the main reasons I bought an AC/DC pro vs the premium was the lower playfield (and the existence of the Helen sticker to cover up that face). Cool, but it doesn't do much and it's just more crap that can break.

SO JUST WHAT THE HECK IS THAT UPPER FLIPPER FOR? Someone must have explained that in a thread somewhere that I missed.

4) I'd give the art a great big "OK", but I'm not blown away by it. Good components, blah components, and if there's any way to brighten up the playfield I'm all for it.

PEOPLE ARE LIKE RACCOONS, THEY LIKE SHINY STUFF!!! It's too late now but its a bummer that they couldn't have incorporated Smaug sitting on his pile of gold into the playfield art and really lit it up. That would have really been a great attraction feature. I remember walking past LOTR machines back in the day (and before I got back into pinball) and just moving on because they were so dark. Shiny sucks money out of people's pockets, dark doesn't.

All this being said I'll wait til they are built, and probably buy a standard model.

#260 6 years ago

I really think there were a lot of very helpful comments made so far and this has been an interesting dialogue.

The take-away I ultimately come up with is that IMO, it would have been better to license the JRR Tolkien source material and not the upcoming movie license (plus if the movie turns out to be a dog, the game has an unforseen liability to compensate for). If they'd licensed the generic Tolkien stuff, it is the best of both worlds and there's no reason why the game couldn't be released and bask in the attention of the movie, but not have as many restrictions on the content and art design. I don't think hardly anybody here cares if the game doesn't pander to a specific movie as much as it pays homage to the Tolkien universe.

-2
#261 6 years ago

Well, I'm so happy that the code is being handled by Keith, at least we can be sure that's it's going to be great, because let's face it the art is no where near epic. Smaug is all wrong and the bottom with Baggins with his back to us is not epic either, with that said I'm still in till the next update.

#262 6 years ago
Quoted from PinballHelp:

The take-away I ultimately come up with is that IMO, it would have been better to license the JRR Tolkien source material and not the upcoming movie license (plus if the movie turns out to be a dog, the game has an unforseen liability to compensate for). If they'd licensed the generic Tolkien stuff, it is the best of both worlds and there's no reason why the game couldn't be released and bask in the attention of the movie, but not have as many restrictions on the content and art design.

Thing is it's ultimately a lot more expensive to do that, assuming you could get it. Licenses really aren't that pricey when you compare them to needing to hire artists to actually create all the artwork from scratch (and you're talking paying for a license anyways here). Remember we're talking the cabinet, backglass surround, and playfield, but that's just the beginning, because after that is all of the art and animation for the LCD screen. No movie clips and PR stills to lean on.

With the way the business has been going I doubt Jack wants those kinds of expenses. I'm speculating though.

That ship has sailed, no point in going down that rabbit hole now anyways, all we can do is provide feedback and let JJP respond as they can and see fit. It's obvious some things can't be changed, but it's sounding like parts will see tweaks, so let's just see how it goes.

17
#263 6 years ago

Post edited by Vongoosewink: speculating - post deleted - I crossed the line of politeness, my apologies

#264 6 years ago
Quoted from Vongoosewink:

It is almost like someone has inexplicably dictated that all 13 dwarves must be represented on the playfield

I'm sure that's exactly what happened, yes. Welcome to doing a licensed game.

I have faith that whatever it ends up Keefer will make it make sense.

#265 6 years ago

Vongoosewink,
Excellent observations.. hopefully JJP is listening and will correct this major error.. thanks for pointing it out!

#266 6 years ago

(Quote deleted per request)

Best constructive criticism yet! I hope JJP reads this!

#267 6 years ago

[post deleted as it was based on feedback removed by fellow pinsider]

Post edited by PinballRulez: deleted quote from fellow poster

12
#268 6 years ago
Quoted from Vongoosewink:

This is a VERY good observation. It seems like the artist has ignored the intention of the game designer, and renamed all of the targets after the 13 dwarves just to get all of them represented on the playfield. If you look at the playfield and the screen, this was clearly not the game designers intention:

As the artist I can thank some people (like you) for their constructive feedback, but all you do now is speculate on the rules which you don't know at this point...
Do you really think I ignore the designer or the programmer while we develop this game as a team?

I think you'll feel better once you see the game lit up, filled with plastics, decals and toys

#269 6 years ago
Quoted from TheDude75:

As the artist I can thank some people (like you) for their constructive feedback, but all you do now is speculate on the rules which you don't know at this point...
Do you really think I ignore the designer or the programmer while we develop this game as a team?
I think you'll feel better once you see the game lit up, filled with plastics, decals and toys

Hi Jean-Paul thanks for coming here and give us some feedback

#270 6 years ago
Quoted from TheDude75:

As the artist I can thank some people (like you) for their constructive feedback, but all you do now is speculate on the rules which you don't know at this point...
Do you really think I ignore the designer or the programmer while we develop this game as a team?

My apologies, guys. My last post crossed the line of good behavior.

Please do not take offense at my comments, and thank you for taking the time to comment on the thread.

11
#271 6 years ago
Quoted from Vongoosewink:

It seems like the artist has ignored the intention of the game designer, and renamed all of the targets after the 13 dwarves just to get all of them represented on the playfield. If you look at the playfield and the screen, this was clearly not the game designers intention:

Sorry but you are completely wrong here. The art is doing exactly what I wanted it to do. There is no miscommunication there is no ignoring.

I get commenting on various technical issues of design and what not, and some changes have in fact been made already. However, now you're going into contexts which you do not understand (and how could you understand it since we have not disclosed anything in that regard).

I'm not going to go into it right now, either, sorry. Either I'm full of crap and an idiot gameplay designer, or things will work out just fine and won't be that confusing. That's probably an even-money bet. But everything is conveyed properly as far as I'm concerned.

#272 6 years ago
Quoted from pinball_keefer:

Sorry but you are completely wrong here. The art is doing exactly what I wanted it to do. There is no miscommunication there is no ignoring.
I get commenting on various technical issues of design and what not, and some changes have in fact been made already. However, now you're going into contexts which you do not understand (and how could you understand it since we have not disclosed anything in that regard).
I'm not going to go into it right now, either, sorry. Either I'm full of crap and an idiot gameplay designer, or things will work out just fine and won't be that confusing. That's probably an even-money bet. But everything is conveyed properly as far as I'm concerned.

Quoted from TheDude75:

As the artist I can thank some people (like you) for their constructive feedback, but all you do now is speculate on the rules which you don't know at this point...
Do you really think I ignore the designer or the programmer while we develop this game as a team?
I think you'll feel better once you see the game lit up, filled with plastics, decals and toys

I feel better already having seen the artwork. As somebody who has preordered TH, I'm so glad that everything is living up to my expectations and exceeding the expectations that WOZ set forth by simply being an amazing game. That being said, I wonder how many of the people being critical of the artwork actually have some skin in the game. I do, and I trust that JJP will deliver the best product they possibly can. Please keep up the great work, gentleman, and remember that it's usually the critics that have the loudest voice. And while they are certainly entitled to their opinion (and sometimes even right!), there are many of us who are VERY happy with what's been done...and what is still to come.

#273 6 years ago
Quoted from pinball_keefer:

Either I'm full of crap and an idiot gameplay designer,

No.

Quoted from pinball_keefer:

or things will work out just fine and won't be that confusing.

Absolutely! You've earned your stripes many times over and most recently with WOZ - a masterpiece. Thank you for what you are doing on The Hobbit.

Post edited by txstargazer3: typo

#274 6 years ago

I just like reading commentary from programmer AND, now, artist, too!

Very cool.

Can't wait to see this with all components interacting (lights, software, toys)!!!

#275 6 years ago

Thank you for sharing with us Jean-Paul and Keith! As a day 1 orderer and now paid in full, I'm looking forward to getting this great pin over the holidays. And yes, I believe it will be ready for those who ordered early.

#276 6 years ago
Quoted from pinball_keefer:

Sorry but you are completely wrong here. The art is doing exactly what I wanted it to do. There is no miscommunication there is no ignoring.
I get commenting on various technical issues of design and what not, and some changes have in fact been made already. However, now you're going into contexts which you do not understand (and how could you understand it since we have not disclosed anything in that regard).
I'm not going to go into it right now, either, sorry. Either I'm full of crap and an idiot gameplay designer, or things will work out just fine and won't be that confusing. That's probably an even-money bet. But everything is conveyed properly as far as I'm concerned.

Here it is: '...........and some changes have in fact been made'

and 'However, now you're going into contexts which you do not understand (and how could you understand it since we have not disclosed anything in that regard)'

I think we should give it a rest. Based on the feedback of the JJP team (thanks for that) have trust that they indeed will make a game that will raise the bar beyond what we think is possible.

#277 6 years ago

Only thing i dont like is the art of the dragon.

Its should be impressive and now it looks like an annoying fly, way to small. We need to see the angry head in close up.

A smaugs' selfie on a bad day.

#278 6 years ago
Quoted from Plungemaster:

Only thing i dont like is the art of the dragon.
Its should be impressive and now it looks like an annoying fly, way to small. We need to see the angry head in close up.
A smaugs' selfie on a bad day.

I agree with this and not that it all has to be kept in "perspective" This is pinball and not a movie board (although understand has to look like it) I would love to see the mountain and smaug, maybe from behind, wrapped around like he is protecting it and up front and personal! Artistic, dead center and sure keep the blue sky! Incorporate artistic with movie board kinda thing. Is there at least that kinda latitude?

#279 6 years ago

.

Post edited by Pimp77: Removed at request of quoted

-1
#280 6 years ago

Hey all you armchair pinball designers, go create your own! Why not? Everybody is doing it!! JJP has a handle on this and I trust it will all make perfect sense once all is revealed.

#281 6 years ago

My assumption (and I'll be the first to admit I might be way off base) is that the drop targets pull double duty. The three individual banks each have their own meaning (Elf, Dwarf and Man modes), and there's probably some mode where you need to collect all targets (including the Thorin Newton Ball, Bilbo and Gandalf ramps, and the two dwarf orbits) to "assemble the team." Put in that perspective, everything would make perfect sense.

-3
#282 6 years ago
Quoted from John_in_NC:

Hey all you armchair pinball designers, go create your own! Why not? Everybody is doing it!! JJP has a handle on this and I trust it will all make perfect sense once all is revealed.

Agreed, stuff a sock in it..

#283 6 years ago

OK, as usual when I make some criticism of a JJP game which is still in development Keith comes on shortly after and makes me look like an idiot. It's great that they have listened to the suggestions regarding some of the minor changes but obviously this is going to be a complex game with many layers which we have yet to understand and the playfield art reflects this.

I still think this has been a constructive process though and one of the better exchanges we have had here on Pinside between a pinball company and its audience. Think of it as putting the artwork out "on test". At the very least the thread was a medium for the discovery that Nori and Ori had been reversed. Many thanks to Keith and JP for their participation.

#284 6 years ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

Many thanks to Keith and JP for their participation.

Yup. It is encouraging to know they are listening. I for one am all the eager now to see that big box at my door.

#285 6 years ago
Quoted from Rick432:

I just like reading commentary from programmer AND, now, artist, too!
Very cool.
Can't wait to see this with all components interacting (lights, software, toys)!!!

I also and wouldn't it be great if we here on PS had that kind of input from programers and artists whenever a new game was being developed, it would stop 99% of the bs that surfaces as we "speculate" what's going on behind closed doors.

Is it just me and my faulty memory or are people who are only involved with JJP actually listening to our suggestions and making changes to the game? It's really refreshing to hear from the above programmer AND artist working on Hobbit. I wish they could find the time to keep us more informed.

#286 6 years ago
Quoted from MustangPaul:

I wish they could find the time to keep us more informed.

I don't know why they would want to after the shellacking they took from people about the artwork. I'm starting to see things from Stern's POV...keep everything close to the vest, then just release the product. You don't like it? Don't buy it.

#287 6 years ago
Quoted from MustangPaul:

I also and wouldn't it be great if we here on PS had that kind of input from programers and artists whenever a new game was being developed, it would stop 99% of the bs that surfaces as we "speculate" what's going on behind closed doors.
Is it just me and my faulty memory or are people who are only involved with JJP actually listening to our suggestions and making changes to the game? It's really refreshing to hear from the above programmer AND artist working on Hobbit. I wish they could find the time to keep us more informed.

I agree. Having interaction with the design team at JJP has put my imagination to rest for the moment. But, we all have to agree that Rick over at PPS and Ben Heck have gone above and beyond what is expected of them.

#288 6 years ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

I don't know why they would want to after the shellacking they took from people about the artwork. I'm starting to see things from Stern's POV...keep everything close to the vest, then just release the product. You don't like it? Don't buy it.

Yes they were taking a shellacking UNTILL they came on and cut them all off at the knees. THAT'S what we need more of and I applaud the guys at JJP for doing it. The only 2 positive things (form my POV) that came out of this is that the boy spotted the name switch and the artist and programmer came on and stopped all the uninformed bs.

Flame suit on.

#290 6 years ago
Quoted from Craig:

Yup. It is encouraging to know they are listening. I for one am all the eager now to see that big box at my door.

This....

#291 6 years ago

Yes, this seems apparent now from Keith's response.
Awesome to now have both the artist and programmer provide feedback and responses on this forum.
I'll now give it a rest too and trust all is well with the Hobbit...
Can't wait to see it in person in just a few months.
Keep up the good work JJP!

Quoted from Jargus:

My assumption (and I'll be the first to admit I might be way off base) is that the drop targets pull double duty. The three individual banks each have their own meaning (Elf, Dwarf and Man modes), and there's probably some mode where you need to collect all targets (including the Thorin Newton Ball, Bilbo and Gandalf ramps, and the two dwarf orbits) to "assemble the team." Put in that perspective, everything would make perfect sense.

#292 6 years ago

I think it would be more accurate to call this playfield "graphics" not "artwork".

It's more common now than not. WOZ was notable different (as is Metallica) among recent machines.... The reality is- playfield graphics don't "make" the game. Proof positive is ACDC. It's a favorite of mine, but calling it's playfield "artwork" is a joke.... However, it's a fantastic playing machine.

Given the people involved in TH, I'm hoping for a similarly fantastic playing machine.

This playfield reveal is just "meh" for me. I suspect the LCD for this game will be phenomenal however!

#293 6 years ago
Quoted from mcluvin:

Do rollovers have to be round? Any other shape would stay in place right?

I am not aware of any other shapes for rollovers (other than the old-style star rollovers). A new shape would require new tooling, or modification of the existing tool(s).

#294 6 years ago

There were non star rollovers, but the last time I saw them was 1985 in Fireball Classic

rollover.jpg

#295 6 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

There were non star rollovers, but the last time I saw them was 1985 in Fireball Classic

rollover.jpg 5 KB

Still round.

I suppose a rollover can be any shape you imagine if you use proximity sensors ala TOM

#296 6 years ago
Quoted from lordloss:

Yo Keefer, Have Jack send that guys kid something cool for finding that.

I agree with this..

#297 6 years ago
Quoted from John_in_NC:

Still round.
I suppose a rollover can be any shape you imagine if you use proximity sensors ala TOM

You can have it be round and still index the top of it. A keyway slot would do just that. Should have been done like that in the first place probably, but now you have what you have. A circular rollover that is indexed would allow for a decal on top and then the space where the decal's image used to be is freed up.

#298 6 years ago

An article on the Hobbit playfield spirals out of control into a lament for hand-drawn playfield art. Such is life as a pinball fan.

NEWS: JJP's Hobbit Playfield
http://creditdotpinball.com/2014/06/16/news-jjps-hobbit-playfield-a-lament-for-hand-drawn-artwork/

#299 6 years ago
Quoted from spiroagnew:

An article on the Hobbit playfield spirals out of control into a lament for hand-drawn playfield art. Such is life as a pinball fan.
NEWS: JJP's Hobbit Playfield
http://creditdotpinball.com/2014/06/16/news-jjps-hobbit-playfield-a-lament-for-hand-drawn-artwork/

Tell creditdotpinball they don't know anything aboot licensing or what it takes to make a pinball machine buddy!

#300 6 years ago
Quoted from desertT1:

You can have it be round and still index the top of it. A keyway slot would do just that. Should have been done like that in the first place probably, but now you have what you have. A circular rollover that is indexed would allow for a decal on top and then the space where the decal's image used to be is freed up.

Or u can just eliminate it from the game, cost u nothing and do a phantom lock into some drop targets... Easier to not reinvent the wheel.

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