High Speed
Williams, 1986You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider Brewchap.
Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.
The left hideout rollover switch does not register in switch test mode. Shorting the wires together does nothing. Also the side switch in the left hideout do not register.
Also the game will not go into hideout mode.
On a side note, at game start up or going into switch test mode, I get the following errors. I also did a flipper rebuild this weekend.
The error suggest that I adjust the following switches. Adjusting does not change anything.
36 Ball Shooter
37 L Flipper EOS
38 R Flipper EOS
What is the best way to troubleshoot this? This is the first time working with a system 11 pin so I a bit lost.
Thank you for your reply! For got about a switch matrix tester that I had so I hooked it up and found this. https://www.pinitech.com/products/64switch_tester.php
Does this suggest that I have a bad chip?
2e3cd9f112842a1653637c3be1a361ff3880de19.png (resized).jpg
I found some loose wires on my switch matrix tester. Column 5 is still bad and Row 2 is good. Disregard the picture above please.
So the switch matrix tester is telling me that I have a MPU problem. How can I find the related chips for Column 5? Is there a diagram of the system 11 MPU like there is on the system 6 MPU?
What is the best way to trace the problem at the MPU board?
Quoted from acebathound:Here's how the tester works. If when your normal game playfield wire harnesses are connected you're having switch issues, and you connect the 64 Switch Matrix Tester (along with its own wire harness) and also have issues with the same switches or all the switches in the same row.. then most likely you have a problem at the MPU board. With using completely different wire harnesses for the tester and still seeing the same results (ie. same switches are not registering when using the tester), you've eliminated playfield wiring harnesses and playfield switches as the problem.
Is it a chip on the board for that row/column? Is it a bad SIP resistor or some other component in the circuit? Is it a solder joint problem somewhere? To figure that out you'll need to trace the problem further at the MPU board. A logic probe can help with this.
TerryB wrote up a guide on how to use a logic probe here:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/terrybs-guide-to-logic-probes
I also made a very basic tutorial years ago on logic probes @ http://techdose.com/electronics/Using-a-Logic-Probe/395/page1.html
I don't claim it'll help you tremendously compared to some other guides, but it might help give you a quick understanding.
---
http://www.pinitech.com - "Pinball Inspired Technology"
NVRAM, Bally/Stern LED Displays & Mods for pinball machines
Thank you for your input! And for the switch matrix tester. I do have a logic probe that I have used in some step by step testing on some system 6 boards. I'm sure that it will get a work out now on this system 11 board!
Quoted from GRUMPY:I would look at the Q-43, see if it has the face blown off. You may have gotten high voltage from the EOS switch onto the lane change switch.
Face is not blown off
Quoted from acebathound:Manuals/Schematics for most if not all Williams games are available on the IPDB.org pages.
For High Speed:
https://www.ipdb.org/machine.cgi?gid=1176
Scroll down to "Documentation" and pick the English Manual.
CPU Layout & schematics starts at PDF page #56.
The switch matrix drives (IJ8 connector) are on PDF page #58 (top left).
Transistor for that column appears to be Q43 (2n3904). With a logic probe, check logic pulses at R73 to see if it's pulsing or stuck high/low. Can also check the output of Q43 by probing the IJ8 connector at pin #5 with the logic probe. Let's say the signal is pulsing at R73, but stuck high or low on the output of Q43... transistor is probably the culprit.
Just FYI sometimes those SIP resistors can go bad and cause issues, those you should be able to verify those with a multimeter (pin #1 is the common pin on those particular resistors, so you'd use a mutlimeter on ohms setting.. and compare pin #1 with the other pins).
I have pulsing at R73 on one side of the resistor and on IJ8 at pin #5 it is stuck HIGH.
Looks like I need to place an order at GPE for some 2N3904. Is there anything else that I may need to order that is common replacement for system 11 boards? I got to come up with $5 worth to place order. 
Quoted from acebathound:Just FYI sometimes those SIP resistors can go bad and cause issues, those you should be able to verify those with a multimeter (pin #1 is the common pin on those particular resistors, so you'd use a mutlimeter on ohms setting.. and compare pin #1 with the other pins).
I tested this also and found that pin #6 did not ohm out. Looking that the schematics I didn't see a pin #6 listed. I'm guessing that it is not used.
Thank you again for all y'all help on this problem. My order came into day and I replaced the 2N3904 transistor and it fixed the dead switches!
However, I still have the problem of the 3 switches at boot up and at the start of the Test/Diagnosis saying that they need to be adjusted.
36 Ball Shooter (closed switch)
37 L Flipper EOS (open switch)
38 R Flipper EOS (open switch)
Quoted from frunch:Seeing how you recently rebuilt the flippers, I'd double check the EOS wiring and diodes to make sure everything's wired correctly.
I when back and re-read everything again and this time I decided to un-soldered the EOS wires for testing to see if the errors would go away. I had no errors at power up of pin nor at the start of the Test/Diagnosis after de-soldering. So Hey! I'm onto something.... I soldered each wire back one at a time only to discover that my problem when away.
Anyways I wanted to thank everyone for their help in teaching me how to find this problem or problems.
You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider Brewchap.
Click here to go back to viewing the entire thread.
Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.
Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, subscribe to Pinside+!
This page was printed from https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/high-speed-switches-not-working?tu=Brewchap and we tried optimising it for printing. Some page elements may have been deliberately hidden.
Scan the QR code on the left to jump to the URL this document was printed from.
South Haven, MI