(Topic ID: 244043)

I was wrong. I'll own it, learn from it, and move on.


By jeffro01

3 months ago



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  • 209 posts
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  • Latest reply 3 months ago by orangegsx
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    -65
    #1 3 months ago

    Okay so I saw this CL post that's local to me as I've been looking for an Addams Family to add to my collection...

    sfbay.craigslist.org link

    $10,500 is quite high for a Addams Family so I emailed the seller to offer a more reasonable price in the $7K range... Turns out the seller is a self-appointed expert in "high-end" restorations and was quite rude regarding my offer.

    Just curious what others around here think about this... Seller says they have over $7K invested in said "high-end" restoration which to me is just nuts... It's not even a "gold" Addams Family...

    Jeff

    44
    #2 3 months ago

    You need to do some homework.

    19
    #3 3 months ago

    Jeff, not my pin but have played it.
    Best Addams I’ve ever flipped.
    You may want to do some digging into what a HEP restore is before insulting the seller.

    #4 3 months ago

    Well he says it’s a hep Resto. I would say that’s on par for his work. He posts on this site and can maybe chime in. But yeah I would say 7k is low for a hep Resto taf.

    10
    #5 3 months ago
    Quoted from Saveleaningtower:

    You need to do some homework.

    +1.

    A $7K offer for a HEP TAF is not "reasonable".

    10
    #6 3 months ago

    It's likely worth that. HEP is the gold standard.

    #7 3 months ago

    Apparently you are not familiar with the quality and depth of a High-End Pins Restoration. They are top rate, and knowing that it is a HEP restorations that Addams is actually VERY fairly priced. As previous poster said, you need to do some homework.....

    #8 3 months ago

    Games restored by Chris Hutchins do fetch quite a bit more than average . Chris is one of the best and people do pay extra for games done by him .

    #9 3 months ago

    Seems like a fair price for an HEP. Chris Hutchins' (HEP) work is stunning top to bottom.

    #10 3 months ago

    Game looks fantastic.

    #11 3 months ago

    Yep, this one will bite you back! If it's a true HEP restore it's worth it. Only thing you will ever have to do is wax and switch the balls. Here is a thread you can check out to see his work.
    https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/hep-this-week-9-17-18

    33
    #12 3 months ago

    This guy was out of line. Not me. You guys want to see the emails?

    23
    #13 3 months ago
    Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

    I was actually very polite. This guy was out of line. Not me. You guys want to see the emails?

    This is Pinside, of course we want to see the emails!!!

    Wait right there while I fire up the popcorn machine.

    #14 3 months ago
    Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

    I was actually very polite. This guy was out of line. Not me. You guys want to see the emails?

    ...but of course!!!!

    #15 3 months ago
    Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

    I was actually very polite. This guy was out of line. Not me. You guys want to see the emails?

    Guessing this is your game? Not sure airing dirty laundry is needed. Seems more ignorance in the buyers part.

    Who am I kidding of course pinside wants to see them haha.

    -29
    #16 3 months ago
    Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

    This guy was out of line. Not me. You guys want to see the emails?

    I approached you with a fair value and you insulted me, this is how you operate?

    Whatever post what you want, it's still an Addams Family standard...

    Jeff

    #17 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    I approached you with a fair value and you insulted me, this is how you operate?
    Whatever post what you want, it's still an Addams Family standard...
    Jeff

    Not sure what was said, but gold or standard has nothing to do with the price here. It’s a TAF restored by HEP. It won’t be cheap haha. I would politely tell you to pound sand as well.

    21
    #18 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    $10,500 is quite high for a Addams Family so I emailed the seller to offer a more reasonable price in the $7K range... Turns out the seller is a self-appointed expert in "high-end" restorations and was quite rude regarding my offer.

    Just curious what others around here think about this... Seller says they have over $7K invested in said "high-end" restoration which to me is just nuts... It's not even a "gold" Addams Family...

    A $10k price tag for a game restored by HEP is about the norm, even though it's higher than the typical price range for that title. That's just because of the amount of work and new parts/materials that go into it to make it look as new/mint as possible.

    I would suggest that you look at some of the restoration threads posted by high_end_pins to get an idea of what is done to a game that he restores. It is well beyond a typical shop job or teardown that most people do.

    -103
    #19 3 months ago

    I don't see the value in a specific kind of restoration done by a specific person, at the end of the day the machine is the machine. Flame me if you must.

    Jeff

    24
    #20 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    I approached you with a fair value and you insulted me, this is how you operate?
    Whatever post what you want, it's still an Addams Family standard...
    Jeff

    Take it on the chin, you made "an offer" that wasn't accepted. Move on. Not all offers have to be accepted.

    #21 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    I approached you with a fair value

    LOL

    88
    #22 3 months ago

    $10.5k is absolutely in line. I couldn’t build one today for that with a base game costing $5500 and up now.
    You can’t get leather on a vinyl budget unfortunately.
    You will have to lower your standards ,do the work yourself or increase your offer.

    10
    #23 3 months ago
    Quoted from eyeamred2u:

    Take it on the chin, you made "an offer" that wasn't accepted. Move on. Not all offers have to be accepted.

    That part I'm totally in agreement with. I can admit when I'm wrong. I didn't come here to pound on the seller, I came here to ask the community what they thought. Community says I'm in the wrong.

    Jeff

    #24 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    I don't see the value in a specific kind of restoration done by a specific person, at the end of the day the machine is the machine. Flame me if you must.
    Jeff

    Why bother to flame if you see no value in it? This post seems dead now. NOT!!!

    58
    #25 3 months ago

    First e-mail
    Good Morning,
    In an effort to not waste your time, I'll cut to the chase. Love the machine but for a regular Addams Family (not the gold collectors edition) I'd be around $6,500-$7,000. Not trying to low ball you in any way, nor am I some sort of scammer. I'm a serious collector that would love to add this machine to my collection. Are you even interested in a conversation? Totally understand if the answer is a hard no as you might get that much out of it if you're patient enough.

    Thank you for your time reading, hope to hear back but I understand if you're taken back at where I'm at currently.

    Thanks,
    Jeff

    My response
    What you need is an unrestored Addams Family. Your budget it sufficient for one.

    Second e-mail
    Good Morning,

    Thank you for your reply. I'd be shocked if you get anywhere near $10K for a standard Addams Family but good luck nonetheless, I totally understand. If you had a Gold then we'd be having a completely different conversation. I get my valuations from pinside if you're curious as to where my number even came from.

    All of that being said though, appreciate the super fast response and I can assure you my intention was not to insult you or or your price.

    Thanks, Jeff
    My response
    Citing Pinside average values tells me you are totally unfamiliar with the value of high-end restorations. The restoration itself runs well in excess of $7000. Your budget can get you an unrestored Addams. Good day.
    Third e-mail
    Good Morning,

    LOL... I tried to be nice and respectful but then you had to take a cheap shot... If you paid $7K to restore this machine then you're in no position to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about, you wasted $7k... Considering a standard Addams Family goes for around $7K, you're already in the hole so no wonder you're excessively pricing this machine. That's okay, I'm sure you'll eventually find a sucker who will grossly overpay.

    Good luck, you're going to need it...

    Jeff
    My response
    No, I'm the one who tried to be nice. Screw off you ignorant newb.
    4th e-mail
    Ignorant newb? I'm not the dumbass who spent more restoring the machine than it's worth... LOL... Again, good luck... I'm sure you'll find a sucker eventually.

    Jeff

    That is all.

    12
    #26 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    I didn't come here to pound on the seller, I came here to ask the community what they thought.

    Quoted from jeffro01:

    Turns out the seller is a self-appointed expert in "high-end" restorations and was quite rude regarding my offer.

    Yeah... no.

    14
    #27 3 months ago

    Let it go guys, there was an understandable misunderstanding in a hobby that is full of supposed 'mint' machines for top dollar which are obviously not. If I wasn't already aware of HEP pins I'd have scoffed too. You see people tell people on these forums all the time that 'just because you put that much money into it, it isn't worth it' when people go to sell.

    46
    #28 3 months ago
    Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

    First e-mail
    Good Morning,
    In an effort to not waste your time, I'll cut to the chase. Love the machine but for a regular Addams Family (not the gold collectors edition) I'd be around $6,500-$7,000. Not trying to low ball you in any way, nor am I some sort of scammer. I'm a serious collector that would love to add this machine to my collection. Are you even interested in a conversation? Totally understand if the answer is a hard no as you might get that much out of it if you're patient enough.
    Thank you for your time reading, hope to hear back but I understand if you're taken back at where I'm at currently.
    Thanks,
    Jeff
    My response
    What you need is an unrestored Addams Family. Your budget it sufficient for one.
    Second e-mail
    Good Morning,
    Thank you for your reply. I'd be shocked if you get anywhere near $10K for a standard Addams Family but good luck nonetheless, I totally understand. If you had a Gold then we'd be having a completely different conversation. I get my valuations from pinside if you're curious as to where my number even came from.
    All of that being said though, appreciate the super fast response and I can assure you my intention was not to insult you or or your price.
    Thanks, Jeff
    My response
    Citing Pinside average values tells me you are totally unfamiliar with the value of high-end restorations. The restoration itself runs well in excess of $7000. Your budget can get you an unrestored Addams. Good day.
    Third e-mail
    Good Morning,
    LOL... I tried to be nice and respectful but then you had to take a cheap shot... If you paid $7K to restore this machine then you're in no position to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about, you wasted $7k... Considering a standard Addams Family goes for around $7K, you're already in the hole so no wonder you're excessively pricing this machine. That's okay, I'm sure you'll eventually find a sucker who will grossly overpay.
    Good luck, you're going to need it...
    Jeff
    My response
    No, I'm the one who tried to be nice. Screw off you ignorant newb.
    4th e-mail
    Ignorant newb? I'm not the dumbass who spent more restoring the machine than it's worth... LOL... Again, good luck... I'm sure you'll find a sucker eventually.
    Jeff
    That is all.

    I'm just happy to have read a thread of emails from people who know the difference between "your" and "you're"

    #29 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    I don't see the value in a specific kind of restoration done by a specific person, at the end of the day the machine is the machine. Flame me if you must.
    Jeff

    It's not about the specific person per say, but the work that has been done to it.

    Like I said, it's way beyond a typical refurbishment. I highly suggest taking a look at HEP's restoration threads to see what is actually done to games. Brand new cabinets with new stencils/decals, full playfield restoration or replacement with clear coating, all metal parts polished to a mirror finish, and much more.

    18
    #31 3 months ago

    Just let this go...its over
    OP is just a little inexperienced
    Just going to get worse from here if both sides keep posting

    I would also like to add that the game looks incredible

    40
    #32 3 months ago

    He made it public. Felt inclined to defend myself. I'm over it.

    #33 3 months ago

    I've bought 3 pins from NorCalRealtor, one of the best pinsiders & sellers I've ever known. What a clown this tire-kicker is. Buy with confidence

    21
    #34 3 months ago
    ACFA33DF-9AEB-478A-A9CE-70D7D8A7159D (resized).jpeg
    #35 3 months ago

    A Mustang restored by Chip Foose is worth more than a Mustang restored by your neighbor. Same with pins.

    OP is hopefully going to learn something new today

    34
    #36 3 months ago
    Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

    First e-mail
    Good Morning,
    In an effort to not waste your time, I'll cut to the chase. Love the machine but for a regular Addams Family (not the gold collectors edition) I'd be around $6,500-$7,000. Not trying to low ball you in any way, nor am I some sort of scammer. I'm a serious collector that would love to add this machine to my collection. Are you even interested in a conversation? Totally understand if the answer is a hard no as you might get that much out of it if you're patient enough.
    Thank you for your time reading, hope to hear back but I understand if you're taken back at where I'm at currently.
    Thanks,
    Jeff
    My response
    What you need is an unrestored Addams Family. Your budget it sufficient for one.
    Second e-mail
    Good Morning,
    Thank you for your reply. I'd be shocked if you get anywhere near $10K for a standard Addams Family but good luck nonetheless, I totally understand. If you had a Gold then we'd be having a completely different conversation. I get my valuations from pinside if you're curious as to where my number even came from.
    All of that being said though, appreciate the super fast response and I can assure you my intention was not to insult you or or your price.
    Thanks, Jeff
    My response
    Citing Pinside average values tells me you are totally unfamiliar with the value of high-end restorations. The restoration itself runs well in excess of $7000. Your budget can get you an unrestored Addams. Good day.
    Third e-mail
    Good Morning,
    LOL... I tried to be nice and respectful but then you had to take a cheap shot... If you paid $7K to restore this machine then you're in no position to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about, you wasted $7k... Considering a standard Addams Family goes for around $7K, you're already in the hole so no wonder you're excessively pricing this machine. That's okay, I'm sure you'll eventually find a sucker who will grossly overpay.
    Good luck, you're going to need it...
    Jeff
    My response
    No, I'm the one who tried to be nice. Screw off you ignorant newb.
    4th e-mail
    Ignorant newb? I'm not the dumbass who spent more restoring the machine than it's worth... LOL... Again, good luck... I'm sure you'll find a sucker eventually.
    Jeff
    That is all.

    Hmm to be honest Jeff comes across as a nice guy in these emails, just a little uninformed. You are really short with him and I can see where he could take it as you being a dick. I don't think you were, and I get both sides. He doesn't understand an HEP resto, and you didn't want to waste your time with this guy who is clearly not on the same page.

    #37 3 months ago
    Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

    4th e-mail
    Ignorant newb? I'm not the dumbass who spent more restoring the machine than it's worth... LOL... Again, good luck... I'm sure you'll find a sucker eventually.
    Jeff
    That is all.

    Why is he so upset? He is a newb. Cites pinside but has been on since January of this year.

    #38 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    Okay so I saw this CL post that's local to me as I've been looking for an Addams Family to add to my collection...
    sfbay.craigslist.org link
    $10,500 is quite high for a Addams Family so I emailed the seller to offer a more reasonable price in the $7K range... Turns out the seller is a self-appointed expert in "high-end" restorations and was quite rude regarding my offer.
    Just curious what others around here think about this... Seller says they have over $7K invested in said "high-end" restoration which to me is just nuts... It's not even a "gold" Addams Family...
    Jeff

    If I were the OP, I'd beg the mods to delete this thread. People are so quick to attack without knowing what the hell they are talking about. Next time do some research first...

    Brian

    #39 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    I don't see the value in a specific kind of restoration done by a specific person, at the end of the day the machine is the machine.
    Jeff

    Could not be further from the truth, guess you are better off sitting at the docks waiting for containers of over seas water logged machines to come in. That might be more of what your looking for.

    #40 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    I don't see the value in a specific kind of restoration done by a specific person, at the end of the day the machine is the machine. Flame me if you must.
    Jeff

    What that game went through is the equivalent of a classic car going through a high end frame off restoration with every single part restored and or replaced. It's quality is far beyond any shopped or even HUO version of the game. Better then new.

    I see you own a Pirates LE as well. Imagine that game going through thousands of plays over 20+ years. A typical shop job would likely return it to working order but it would still look beat. Would you pay $10k or more for it though? No. HEP though would take the game and make it look better then new. Every part removed polished, cabinet redone or replaced, new artwork, multiple parts replaced, playfield professionally restored or replaced with high end clear coat job. Dozens and dozens of hours would go into the restoration.

    Price is fair.

    #41 3 months ago

    These statements were WAY out of line and tipped the scales for me.

    I'd be shocked if you get anywhere near $10K for a standard Addams Family but good luck nonetheless, I totally understand. If you had a Gold then we'd be having a completely different conversation. I get my valuations from pinside if you're curious as to where my number even came from.

    If you paid $7K to restore this machine then you're in no position to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about, you wasted $7k... Considering a standard Addams Family goes for around $7K, you're already in the hole so no wonder you're excessively pricing this machine. That's okay, I'm sure you'll eventually find a sucker who will grossly overpay.

    #42 3 months ago
    Quoted from pinghetto:

    If I were the OP, I'd beg the mods to delete this thread. People are so quick to attack without knowing what the hell they are talking about. Next time do some research first...
    Brian

    At this point, let people pile on. I'm not going to say anything else, flame me, call me what you will. I came to ask, got hammered and that's life...

    Jeff

    #43 3 months ago

    I've sold a pin to NorCalRealtor and it went flawlessly (other than me forgetting to pack the power cord!)

    And from the emails, the OP looked to be quite polite and respectful in his initial emails until he felt personally offended in the response.

    19
    #44 3 months ago
    Quoted from NorCalRealtor:

    He made it public. Felt inclined to defend myself. I'm over it.

    You defend in quite a rude manner, i understand the HEP bandwagon, but he almost apologized he made you an 7k offer .... , instead of saying thank you for your offer, you lashed out ... c'mon

    #45 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    Whatever post what you want, it's still an Addams Family standard...

    Correction: It's an HEP Addams Family standard.

    #46 3 months ago

    Just a misunderstanding. If I came into a hobby and saw a nice shiny "something" I wanted and then the price was way over my expectations due to some alteration or restoration, I'd be feeling like someone's trying to pull one over me. But then again, research may do people well in avoiding silly public threads like this. Also, being a veteran in the hobby, I'd probably just not respond after the first email bc I wouldn't want to ruffle feathers and let someone else take on the burden of explaining or teaching - dont care any on wasting time on that. Serious collectors have some serious coin into lots and lots of valuable and rare games. Most collectors collect anything. A serious collector won't say that they're a serious collector.

    #47 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    At this point, let people pile on. I'm not going to say anything else, flame me, call me what you will. I came to ask, got hammered and that's life...
    Jeff

    ...yet you'd rather have that than admit you made a mistake and apologize?? Seriously, everyone makes a mistake or misjudges something, how you handle dealing with that mistake it is what people will remember. It's how you are handling this is bringing on Pinside's hammering than the actual mistake/misjudgment.

    #48 3 months ago

    OP, if you stay in the hobby a few more years to give yourself time to learn more about HEP or even read his thread a bit, you may regret not spending just a few grand more for a work of near perfection sold to you by a well known and honest collector. Opportunity missed. The seller and HEP’s work deserve far more respect.

    #49 3 months ago
    Quoted from Ballypalooza:

    If you paid $7K to restore this machine then you're in no position to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about, you wasted $7k...

    Some collectors want the finest of the finest. We all have different tastes, and that's OK. Crazy to you, but a must have for someone else.

    11
    #50 3 months ago
    Quoted from jeffro01:

    At this point, let people pile on. I'm not going to say anything else, flame me, call me what you will. I came to ask, got hammered and that's life...
    Jeff

    I personally think if the title were
    High End Restorations? you would have fared better than “High End “Restorations...LOL

    Sometimes it is just the presentation that sets the tone here.
    Anyway I am sure you will have no problem finding a TAF that meets your budget and requirements and if you are new at this it is an easy mistake to make.

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