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(Topic ID: 142684)

Hey, Todd..........

By Boatcat

8 years ago

Topic Heartbeat

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23 posts
14 Pinsiders participating
Latest reply 8 years ago by Rascal_H
Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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#1 8 years ago

???

Boatcat

Pinside member

Ormond Beach, FL

9y 36,400 535 11

> Paper that was sold and rightfully belongs to the owner
> as part of the game to safely operate it both for themselves
> in today's mostly home market, and on location. To take,
> and then shill people into paying again for same item of a
> game is damn near if not criminal. Even worst is the noobs
> get it in the keister first, and often last. Its sad to
> have a hobby where the entry door to owning a game is being
> bent over for something that should be available online for
> free.

Hey, Todd,

When are you going to get over this? Schematics are part of the Gtb. Product Fesjian owns. They will never be online for free. You should be out there teaching the noobs to request a price discount from the seller for lack of an original schematic.

#2 8 years ago

WAR

wayner

Pinside member

10y 95,300 2,584 25

Wow for a moment I thought I was on RGP!!

#3 8 years ago

HBS

herbertbsharp

Pinside+ Frequent

Ballston Spa, NY

12y 146K 6,109 22 24 1

#4 8 years ago

ROB

RCA1

Pinside+ Addict

St Joseph, MI

11y 128K 8,681 28 11

I got here a little late.......
Can someone please catch me up?

(Edit: Didn't realize it was that Todd you were referencing. Ugh.)

#5 8 years ago

SDM

EMsInKC

Pinside member

Kansas City, MO

10y 79,550 4,024 22

Quoted from RCA1:
I got here a little late.......
Can someone please catch me up?

There's an idiot on RGP that calls himself Frank Fuhrter. Basically, he exists to make stupid posts. He's supposedly been identified at someone named Todd Nathan. He knows little to nothing about fixing games, he just trolls the board constantly.

In this case, every time someone wants a schematic (mainly for Gottlieb games since they are not online) he goes on idiotic rants about "paper thieves" who "rape" games on schematics/manuals, then want to charge you to buy them (meaning, basically, Steve Young). Of course, these games have been through the mill and have been in so many hands, those items have gone missing over the years. But he believes that since they came with the game, Steve Young is obligated to make them available for free. I guess that also means that if the game is missing legs, or a lockdown bar, or some other part, since those originally came with the game Steve should also supply those to the current owner at no charge.

Once, I asked him, since I bought a car that was missing the owner's manual, should the manufacturer replace it for free? I got no answer, nor did I expect one, since he's just a troll. We're actually giving him what he wants here, attention. I'll need to go take a shower now after doing so.

Whenever he posts on RGP his posts are immediately flagged and hidden, but he just keeps truckin'...

#6 8 years ago

???

Boatcat

Pinside member

Ormond Beach, FL

9y 36,400 535 11

Quoted from EMsInKC:
since he's just a troll. We're actually giving him what he wants here, attention. I'll need to go take a shower now after doing so.

Hey, EMsInKC,

No need to take a shower! I figure it's OK to exploit Todd in this forum since no one cares to flag his posts. I guess they actually appreciate his level of knowledge here.

#7 8 years ago

Darcy

Pinside member

Leduc, AB

11y 124K 6,360 17

OP
Quoted from Boatcat:
I guess they actually appreciate his level of knowledge here.

I would surmise that most just ignore him, and care little to respond.

#8 8 years ago

Darcy

Pinside member

Leduc, AB

11y 124K 6,360 17

Quoted from EMsInKC:
In this case, every time someone wants a schematic (mainly for Gottlieb games since they are not online) he goes on idiotic rants about "paper thieves" who "rape" games on schematics/manuals, then want to charge you to buy them

He has done this here, a few months ago.

#9 8 years ago

SDM

EMsInKC

Pinside member

Kansas City, MO

10y 79,550 4,024 22

What's his handle here? I'm surprised he could last five minutes on this forum.

#10 8 years ago

???

Boatcat

Pinside member

Ormond Beach, FL

9y 36,400 535 11

Quoted from EMsInKC:
he goes on idiotic rants about "paper thieves" who "rape" games on schematics/manuals, then want to charge you to buy them (meaning, basically, Steve Young).

Well..........It's not Steve Young removing the schematics from games, I'm assuming Todd means other private sellers.

If I were buying a Game without a schematic from a guy who then turns around and wants any improved monetary value for the game WITH the original schematic, I'd have a problem with it, EVEN if the schematic came from another like-model. Without a schematic, it's incomplete! I'd have much less of a problem if the schematic were a photocopy.

As far as Todd is concerned, he thinks they should be available online for free. If that's the case, then backglasses, playfield plastics, etc, should all be allowed to be re-created by anyone, anytime without interference, which isn't the case. Someone, (Fesjian), owns the Gottlieb Name. You need his permission.

My argument is not with those hoarding schematics, it's with those buying games and bitching about having to buy the schematics later when they should've checked for it, and asked for a price adjustment initially.

#11 8 years ago

SDM

EMsInKC

Pinside member

Kansas City, MO

10y 79,550 4,024 22

OP
Quoted from Boatcat:
Well..........It's not Steve Young removing the schematics from games, I'm assuming Todd means other private sellers.
If I were buying a Game without a schematic from a guy who then turns around and wants any improved monetary value for the game WITH the original schematic, I'd have a problem with it, EVEN if the schematic came from another like-model. Without a schematic, it's incomplete! I'd have much less of a problem if the schematic were a photocopy.
As far as Todd is concerned, he thinks they should be available online for free. If that's the case, then backglasses, playfield plastics, etc, should all be allowed to be re-created by anyone, anytime without interference, which isn't the case. Someone, (Fesjian), owns the Gottlieb Name. You need his permission.
My argument is not with those hoarding schematics, it's with those buying games and bitching about having to buy the schematics later when they should've checked for it, and asked for a price adjustment initially.

Most games I've bought are missing the schematics, and I've never once had someone want more money for a game to include the schematic.

As for FF, the guy simply doesn't understand copyright law. Nor does he understand much of anything else. I do have to admit that reading his EM "advice" is hilarious. Almost without fail, he tells people to check the Ax relay-even on games that don't have Ax relays. I've caught him on that more than once.

The only thing that is better than that is his insistence that all games are worth no more than $150 while he has nothing in his collection that is less than "minty fresh" and he only paid $100 or something for them.

He's FOS.

#12 8 years ago

EDG

Richthofen

Pinside member

11y 75,800 2,697

Did we really need a thread on pinside about this? Please don't feed the trolls.

#13 8 years ago

???

Boatcat

Pinside member

Ormond Beach, FL

9y 36,400 535 11

Quoted from EMsInKC:
The only thing that is better than that is his insistence that all games are worth no more than $150 while he has nothing in his collection that is less than "minty fresh"

For a while, he stopped posting this, I'll bet because I asked him if he proved the value of his offer to the seller by showing him the Boston Pinball Website, or any other website, (LOL). There's very little around for $150!

1 week later

#14 8 years ago

???

Boatcat

Pinside member

Ormond Beach, FL

9y 36,400 535 11

Quoted from Richthofen:
Did we really need a thread on pinside about this?

Yes! This is where most newbs are.

#15 8 years ago

???

bonzo71

Pinside member

Boothwyn, PA

11y 57,300 1,248 32

I've used the pdf Williams and Bally scematics on ipdb to fix some games. Having them available online could result in more working games.

#16 8 years ago

SAF

Hauntflies

Inactive member

8y 10,650 38

OP
Quoted from Boatcat:
Yes! This is where most newbs are.

How does feeding a troll from RGP protect newbs? Seems to me that you're helping to spread the disease.

Quoted from EMsInKC:
Whenever he posts on RGP his posts are immediately flagged and hidden, but he just keeps truckin'...

The only reason trolls keep on truckin' is because naive people help them along the way.

#17 8 years ago

???

Boatcat

Pinside member

Ormond Beach, FL

9y 36,400 535 11

Quoted from Hauntflies:
How does feeding a troll from RGP protect newbs? Seems to me that you're helping to spread the disease.

Ahhhhhh.............Where do they come from ???

#18 8 years ago

TRG

TomGWI

Pinside member

12y 143K 10,945 156

OP
Quoted from Boatcat:
Yes! This is where most newbs are.

Nope, this is where most of us came to get away from the RGP crap.

#19 8 years ago

???

Boatcat

Pinside member

Ormond Beach, FL

9y 36,400 535 11

Nope! The "RGP Crap" has for the most part been removed. Todd and the newbs need to know that schematics are part of a game a seller says is, "Complete."

If anything, I could've titled the thread better, but it is in the best place.

#20 8 years ago

MCC

mcc

Inactive member

Seattle, WA

11y 31,900 183

Quoted from EMsInKC:
Once, I asked him, since I bought a car that was missing the owner's manual, should the manufacturer replace it for free? I got no answer, nor did I expect one, since he's just a troll.

https://owner.lincoln.com/tools/account/how-tos/owner-manuals.html
http://www.toyota.com/owners/resources/owners-manuals
http://www.teslamotors.com/sites/default/files/Model-S-Owners-Manual.pdf
etc..

#21 8 years ago

TAM

tamoore

Pinside member

Grayling, MI

11y 123K 6,661 37 58

Every time I see this thread, I'm like..."WHAT NOW???"...

#22 8 years ago

SBS

o-din

Pinside+ Addict

11y 158K 58,804

Hey, Todd!

Todd.jpg

#23 8 years ago

TOM

Rascal_H

Pinside member

Cumberland, RI

12y 138K 6,567 2 36

..image.jpeg

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