Could be that Ripley has the same distributor as me, I'm not sure. His was a pro, right? I like my le and would like to keep it in my collection, the problem is that my distributor doesn't have a Le to replace mine with. For now I assume that my playfield will be replaced, if not then I think I have no other choice then to demand my money back or look at legal action. I don't want to go that way and I'm confident I haven't, but we will see.

I assume that distributors don't have anything to say about when the playfield meets the 'requirements' and when not. Hopefully stern will communicatie these criteria in the upcoming weeks, so we as "bad playfield customers" can review for our selfs if we're entitled to get a playfield swap.

3mos and no response? Class action time for you guys?

agreed.

I would be looking for a new distributor after the issue is dealt with.......

should be
now, again, all cases are differents, and i'm not sure evbd will go thrue this as it was for my case : pin was the very 1st run, few cases only reported (here), than STERN was still not aware, well in fact not the big prob it seems to be now...

btw, in your case (which is shit for sure seeing the pics), i have no doubt that STERN will do what they have to do

I am NOT suggesting or endorsing and I shouldn't say this but with the number of inserts being the disqualifier all someone has to do is "make" a few more to qualify. No one will care if they take the tip of a knife under a edge to chip the clear coat or a couple of ball smacks next to a insert to have one that barely doesn't qualify if that's what they have to do to get theirs replaced. And no i don't have any Sterns and no plans to get one. I can buy SEVERAL very nice sorted out used machines for what they are asking for one of their new ones.

I am betting most of your problem lies with the distributor, rather than Stern. Now I have not been a fan of a lot they have done, but I can tell you I was standing next to a friend who took a call from his distro 2 days ago regarding his pro. He has a couple of minor ghosted inserts, and the distro opened a case with Stern. They took a look at the pics and said it would be taken care of in a month or so. Now I will admit, they did not tell him exactly what they would be doing for him, but they left the distinct impression it would be a new playfield. So what I am trying to say is I think they are really wanting to fix all of this, but they are not being very vocal about it and just handling the cases as they come in. If your distributor is yanking you around, they are either not taking the time to bring the case to Stern, or they don't want the hassle and/or deposit for shipping the playfields back and forth. I would contact Stern directly, and tell them you have gone through your distributor with no results, so the next step is contacting them directly.

Let me stop you there.

If Stern were being forthcoming and had made clear that they would look after the resellers and distributors overseas and in a timely fashion, who are compelled by law to look after their customers with defective product (unlike the US), then I see no reason why some of them would be difficult or try to make the problem go away. On the contrary, this would be a good opportunity to win the trust of their customers and show good service.

But Stern are categorically not doing anything of the sort.

And then when Stern denies the warranty you are left with a really crappy playfield.

Update on the program-

Revenue taken from pre-orders of future as yet unreleased games will help cover costs of filling orders and fixing current released games and each future release thereafter will be priced accordingly.

This sounds like something from Monty Python or Fawlty Towers.

If serious, no wonder they're saying nothing.

To be clear it is only a conclusion I came up with.

But they are not exactly saying nothing....

Batman66
Manufacturer’s Suggested Retail Price:
Premium Model: $US 8,599
Limited Edition Model: $US 9,999
Super Limited Edition Model: $US 14,999

Cleesian economics!

Are those prices real? $8599 list for a Premium?

We have finally answered the eternal question.

YES THEY ARE SERIOUS!!!

they have to pay for the playfield swap outs some how

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/sterns-game-release-history

Serious indeed. I guess I'll look back fondly on 2016 as a time when I could still get a Premium shipped to my home for $6700. Wow, that's a huge increase and out of my future price range.

I don't disagree with what you said in regards to how the manufacturer has handled things. Stern HAS made a big mess of this from the start, no question. But the problem the distributors and re-sellers have is with Stern, and they should not be hanging the customer out to dry. (if that is indeed what is happening) They take the money and reap a profit, they should be standing up for the customer with stern, no matter how crappy the deal is for them. They can't take the money and run away and then say "fend for yourself" when the going gets tough...it is the risk they take when they sell another person's product. (which is why they are legally responsible). The only way you will see change, is if the true buyers from Stern, which are the Distributors and re-sellers, say they are not going to handle a crappy product any longer. 1 sale is no big deal to them....but having to find a new distributor is costly and time consuming. Only with action like that will you see change......but regardless, the end customer should be taken care of by whomever they wrote the check to.

So to summarise what I think the 4k plus posts say. Stern does seem to have a programme of swapping PFs in place for North America for people with problems on 3+ inserts. Outside of North America no one has heard anything yet.

That right?

Don't know about outside of North America, but I don't think there is a "magic number" of ghosted inserts. The one I was referring to had a small ghost on the Tobin insert, and a very very small ghost on the corner of another, and Stern said they would cover it. If you have ghosting, no matter how small, it stands to reason you will have more over time, and I think Stern knows that. I do wish luck to all of you outside the country. I really hope they do the stand-up thing and take care of you all. It's not like you can jump in the car and drive over to the plant.

who is your distributor, and what have they said to you regarding your issues?
Has your distributor contacted Stern as a priority? they should be hassling the shit out of Stern for answers.

Ghosting started on my extra ball. Ugh. I had even put Mylar over it.

image (resized).jpeg

I don't think mylar will keep your inserts from ghosting. When was your playfield made?

Ha, I know. But I was hopeful. 7-21 is the PF date. I was actually expecting it to happen sooner, but it took a few weeks. I would say two are ghosting, but the one arrow hasn't gotten worse in a week or so.

Im very curious to see how this next batch of playfields that are coming out look. I want a GB Premium but if the next batch of playfields have issues im out. I dont have 7k to just throw away. I demand perfection at that price.

My PF has the same date. 3 ghosting inserts, chipping clear in 4 places

Yeah, I'm up to 3 now, the lane is damaged, and a chip appears to be coming at the ball exit.

I carefully inspected 3 GB's this week on location PHOF, Big Apple Arcade and Game Works in Las Vegas. All were in better condition than some of the machines posted in this thread. There may have been a little ghosting, but honestly I didn't see any and I was looking for it.

I was planning to hold off for a bit longer before posting but if this info helps anyone looking for a pin based on a PF date here ya go:

Model: Pro
PF Date: June 9
Cab Date: July 28
Purchased: Aug
Games: 396
Ghosting: None

Grab your four leaf clover & lucky rabbits's foot and buy a lotto ticket tonight. You sir are a Winner!

This is not my GB although mine does have issues this the GB PRO at Start Bar in downtown St louis, place has only been open a couple months and there machines are getting filthy but don't think this is normal wear.

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20160910_214628 (resized).jpg

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The one I've played in London had much worse saucer wear than that. In 6 months it will probably look worse than the T-Rex saucer on my JP that has probably had 200K or more plays.

We need to give Stern sufficient time to react to the problem. If they decide to avoid this problem in the next 6 to 8 months, then it's time. Make sure you keep all written communication with both your distributor and Stern (usually Patrick Powers). You will need proof they were informed and did nothing regarding their defective product.

There is a downside to this process, if enough people join the "class" you have the possibility of hurting Stern and putting them out of business.

Just got accepted into Stern's Club F**ked. Not too bad as of now, but we'll see what the future holds. Specifically had my distributor ship me his last allotted GBLE in hopes of avoiding the early playfield issues. Shame late build LE's are still doing this.

image (resized).jpeg

image (resized).jpeg

image (resized).jpeg

Congrats! Right there with you! Too bad, as I love the game.

Maybe everyone should submit to Stern's Batman contest... but make the video a rick-roll that is really a video of your PF issues

People suing Stern wouldn't make them go out of business. Supplying defective goods and then subsequently not addressing the inevitable complaints would be what could make Stern go out of business.

So it's been over 2 months now since I got my ghostbusters and still no word from Stern on my ghosting issues. My distributor is looking into it they say

Has anybody gotten word about theirs being swapped for a good one.

Here in Europe from what I know, same situation. My GBLE playfield is very bad (4 ghosting inserts and cracked clear coat on one of them) Distributor and Stern know, but still no official statement from Stern..... According to my Distributor Gary is in Europe this week and he is meeting him, so hopefully they will work out a solution.

Stil can't believe that Stern is handling this mess like they do, really disappointing.......

looking into it . yeah.

distributors are the go between for communication.... what else. oh theres one that went above and beyond, and offered a refund, the buyer got another pin instead ... refreshing, but definately in the minority. hopefully a resolve for all those affected before the years out.

You know building the premiums is taking all their time now. Not that there is anything wrong with that unless your affected. Just a bad situation overall.

They'll continue to wall and stall until such time as lawsuits come tumbling in, and then they'll keep doing until they think it's no longer in their interests.

They haven't gone this long without addressing it for no reason. It's now 6 months since the first (large clusters) of reports came in. Soon it will be 12 months ...

LOL. No one is going to file a lawsuit over this issue, much less a class-action lawsuit, even in tort-happy America. Seriously, man, where do you come up with this stuff?!?

I don't think they will at all. Hence why Stern won't look after people. The cheapening is to increase margins. Replacing stuff (with higher quality product) would lower them again. Though given the scope of the problem, I'd be surprised if nobody in the US initiates a lawsuit.

Outside the US, it's very different. In the EU the sellers are legally obligated to fully repair, replace or refund the owners at no cost to them, given that the goods are demonstrably faulty. If this drags on, some who want resolution will force the resellers' / distributors' hands. At that point, if Stern still won't budge, it'll be the latter that take them to court. Some will be forced to, as they won't be able to sustain the losses incurred due to Stern's inaction.

When Distributors start getting chargebacks and have a whole warehouse of returned pins, THEN the distributors will start declining orders from Stern and THEN Stern maaaaaaaaaaaay make a change. On the off shoot chance some one orders a pin and it is FUBAR and that person is a savvy lawyer............maaaaaaaaaybeeeee, but doubtful he or she goes after Stern, but if it does happen and he or she wins.........OPEN THE FLOOD GATES! My buddy has a GB and seems to be problem free......for now......but with all this drama I will not own a GB new or used for fear that a year down the road it starts ghosting (pun intended) and I am SOL. Unless Stern implements a year long warranty, which will never happen, I am out for good.

Looking at your pics I think it is BS if they don't replace your playfield.

just a precision about the full refund, i have to correct : it was not in cash money but with a credit note on another pinball (quite logical, and OK & perfect for me of course) ! my distro is still great

Gary will/could be at the Belgian Open Pinball than (!?)
not sure he will be ok to listen few<>lots of guys with PF complains...

and something else : i dont know why, but i think/hope we could have the next GB code ready & available for this next saturday

ok. yeah, definately a distributor i would be working with.
thanks for clarifying that.
Not many would do a credit note on another pin... unless im mistaken.

I wanted to share that 3-4 weeks later, This Friday, I did finally receive a Return call from Stern and an Apology.
While my issue was not playfield ghosting, it was play field rails not tightened.
The end communication was to make right anything and everything they could at this time.

Slow, but satisfactory, and a Thank you to amend the issue to a tentative close.

Thats very good news, glad to hear this.