Guns N' Roses (CE)
Jersey Jack, 2020
Guns N' Roses (LE)
Jersey Jack, 2020
Guns N' Roses (SE)
Jersey Jack, 2020Quoted from bounoun:I remember reading that DP ordered a bunch of new playfields a time ago, i would be very careful ordering a TBL now since the playfields by Micro are complete shit.
Word on the street is DP ordered a ton of playfields from Mirco 5+ years ago when they were starting production (prior to these issues arising), and are still working through those. I don’t know that they have a plan yet for who will supply new playfields if/when they run through the old stock.
I was the one that uploaded a scan of the playfields to fix an issue that
A: never ever should have taken place
B: never ever should have taken place
I agree a bit that it does not affect the gameplay persee, but if you pay so much for something it should be right. And it’s not new ,pinball has been here forever and the last 3/4 years this is happening and 99% comes from 1 factory so guess who need to change .... Us or the manufacturer? It’s like riding a bike with no tyres on it. Sure you can ride your bike without tires but does it ride nice? 
His playfield were awsome and almost bulletproof when hobbit was made and other brand playfields like alien etc etc
So we all know he CAN do it.
I watched the Robotic clear coat sprayer vid posted.
Does that not look like someones garage, curtains, and a taped together cardboard Box "clean" area?
I hope thats not the conditions for production?
Quoted from Vespula:Fail? These issues are purely cosmetic, and the game play itself does not fail. Semantics, yes, but I think proper perspective is important too.
Plan A
proper steps and care IN THE BEGINNING, they are optimistically avoidable per testimonies.
Plan B
Inspect often, Caught early, usually fixable, or repairable.
plan C
you have a pinside user who has taken high resolution art scans of the playfield which you could print and overlay just the small area with damage that occurred. I couldn't begin to imagine how to properly accomplish this but that's the concept and I'd rely on others for implementing / process.
Plan D
buy a new $500 playfield next year and keep it as insurance for the time if you ever do want to sell . And meanwhile, it's cool wall art.
Enjoy your game.
This is a 10k+ machine. Where I live, it's 20% more expensive than a Premium from Stern (which translates into 2k euros). So you're stating that when buying a 10k+ pinball, you're OK with performing all steps above ? And pay more for a replacement playfield ?
I mean think of it, let's make a parrallel: if you were to buy a PS5, and you had to disassemble it to add cooling fans, pay for a replacement enclosure in case the main one is damaged by heat, you would be pissed, right ? Customers would scream all day long and yell at Sony. I suspect they would even start a class action. And a PS5 is a $500 consumer device, not a $10k consumer device.
For that matter, I'm also super surprised no one started a class action against JJP on it, especially in the US (far more difficult to do in EU).
I'm really baffled. No wonder JJP can get away with it if the majority of buyers have the same opinion...
Enjoyment overpowers my Aggravation with This title. I get goose bumps during modes still way after my Honeymoon phase .
The JJP service you get for any problems that is the problem area so pray you get a game that has no issues ...Or costly ones that they do not want to address . A mess is JJP Warranty .
They could learn from MOEN a german Plumbing company that has the best Customer support and will replace the fixture if it gets pitted or looses it's luster FOR LIFE . Buy it for looks Buy it For life ..
Me as a plumber i could not get away putting in faucets tubs, or any other fixture and have it be Chipping , pitted or pooling without having to warranty it while warranty in place... Never
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:What a fckn' mess
I could not care less how great this game is - I have zero desire to own it and deal with this aggravation
Quoted from Doctor6:I mean, you cant be THAT concerned if you bought it knowing it will most likely fail on you.
I've played the game and sold 2 pins to fund it.
I'm concerned enough about it to take as much precautionary measures to protect it (new posts, if needed, washers, cliffy's etc). I agree, anyone spending this much money, shouldn't have to take these efforts.
I usually buy my pins and have them for decades, some over 20+ years.
Quoted from Vespula:Fail? These issues are purely cosmetic, and the game play itself does not fail. Semantics, yes, but I think proper perspective is important too.
Plan A
proper steps and care IN THE BEGINNING, they are optimistically avoidable per testimonies.
Plan B
Inspect often, Caught early, usually fixable, or repairable.
plan C
you have a pinside user who has taken high resolution art scans of the playfield which you could print and overlay just the small area with damage that occurred. I couldn't begin to imagine how to properly accomplish this but that's the concept and I'd rely on others for implementing / process.
Plan D
buy a new $500 playfield next year and keep it as insurance for the time if you ever do want to sell . And meanwhile, it's cool wall art.
Enjoy your game.
I love the justifications for poor quality.
If it floats your boat ... by all means
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:I love the justifications for poor quality.
It it floats your boat ... by all means
plan C
you have a pinside user who has taken high resolution art scans of the playfield which you could print and overlay just the small area with damage that occurred. I couldn't begin to imagine how to properly accomplish this but that's the concept and I'd rely on others for implementing / process.
Plan C should be done By JJP at the least. Not a Customer
I do not see his or my replies as Justification Of poor quality or poor Customer Service.
The Game / Game Play Justifies a few of the Aggravations of dealing with JJP Support and or repairing /bulletproofing it ourselves however
GO OUT AND LIVE YOUR DREAM !!
Their waiting for you to play !!
Melissa Reese GnR
JJP did this for early WoZ issues and produced decals to overlay the playfield. They worked ok, it wasn't a nice level cleared finished and the ball could get stuck in the TNPLH pop area. On top of that they sold the stickers, which seems like a slap in the face to me. BUT... at least the option was there, I guess.
Quoted from AMSNL:I was the one that uploaded a scan of the playfields
Right! Thanks very much! Great job and contribution to the community. Hope I never need it!
Quoted from Ashram56:This is a 10k+ machine. Where I live, it's 20% more expensive than a Premium from Stern (which translates into 2k euros). So you're stating that when buying a 10k+ pinball, you're OK with performing all steps above ? And pay more for a replacement playfield ?
Yes.
The post after yours from PinFever sums it up, I think:
Quoted from PinFever:Enjoyment overpowers my Aggravation with This title. I get goose bumps during modes still way after my Honeymoon phase .
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:I love the justifications for poor quality.
It it floats your boat ... by all means
The poor quality is specific to the play field issue. The game is everything but poor quality. Every owner knows this. reference PinFever post for a shared sentiment.
Dare I mention the twippys? Jk. A little comic relief...
We almost all agree that JJP builds 1 of the of the best pinball machines in the world . The weight is twice that of the other brands .The toys,gimmicks, screens etc is awesome. That’s also not the problem here.
The problem is the playfield. And also how JJP makes that problem our problem, they don’t give support and they blame us for doing the damage when we all know it’s mirco playfields and JJP s bad QC
And now when we put everything out in the open even more. We now have this topic.
I know that there are more things in the world then pooling and chipping.
But we all work hard enough in life to be where we are ,and to have a chance to buy these expensive toys.
I won’t go down without a fight!
That’s what this topic is for, Highclasspinball if you read this , don’t continue to walk this path or you can tell your lawyer to stir the chemicals good this time in the factory when you are out of work.
As you are breaking your own future here. Just use the search engine and type in your brand name and then let it sink in. Is it me or are those 10000 voices telling YOU something..
just man up and stir it yourself like you did with hobbit,alien,TBL and make those rock solid playfields again. ohhh and btw just apologize. Show your human part and we as a whole community will put this aside. We are all here to enjoy pinball and we all make mistakes.
From a guy that YOU are trying to SUE ,I still have a heart, time to find yours....
Quoted from PinFever:these Pteg washers are too thick imho
[quoted image][quoted image]
Quoted from PinFever:If you do not mind the self destruction .Do nothing and play this Very addictive one more play game till it looks like a whitewood
This machine does seem to have an appetite for destruction.
.
Quoted from Manic:This machine does seem to have an appetite for destruction.
.
Ikr!
GnR integration both inside AND outside the game... indisputably epic on so many levels!
Quoted from OLDPINGUY:I watched the Robotic clear coat sprayer vid posted.
Does that not look like someones garage, curtains, and a taped together cardboard Box "clean" area?
I hope thats not the conditions for production?
I love that video. It's an old one. I suspect it was a sales demonstration to show their capabilities when the robot was new. That new toy was awesome and they were likely proud of it.
Quoted from Ashram56:I mean think of it, let's make a parrallel: if you were to buy a PS5, and you had to disassemble it to add cooling fans, pay for a replacement enclosure in case the main one is damaged by heat, you would be pissed, right ? Customers would scream all day long and yell at Sony. I suspect they would even start a class action. And a PS5 is a $500 consumer device, not a $10k consumer device.
"""""bUT iT DoES NoT aFFEct GaMEPlAY""""
Some of the people here are either getting paid by JJP to spew this bullshit or have so much money it doesnt matter if their machine is a whitewhood after a few years.
As a buyer of gnr, I wanted to do some more research and decided to drop by a local bar on the way home. I knew they had a gnr on route, and wanted to see if the playfield has issues. They had two jj games, gnr and willy wanka. Both had playfield pooling, the ww had the artwork coming off by the star posts. This really speaks for itself. Jersey jack if your reading this, when you go to build my game, could you please have this sorted out?
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Quoted from butterz:As a buyer of gnr, I wanted to do some more research and decided to drop by a local bar on the way home. I knew they had a gnr on route, and wanted to see if the playfield has issues. They had two jj games, gnr and willy wanka. Both had playfield pooling, the ww had the artwork coming off by the star posts. This really speaks for itself. Jersey jack if your reading this, when you go to build my game, could you please have this sorted out?
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
It's not pooling like we've seen on other games.
These are bunching up like decals with plastic leg protectors, but easily tearing as well.
Quoted from Vespula:The answer of how to bulletproof is in a key post documented by fooflighter who implemented those measures and now at 1700 plays. zaphX is at more plays than that with similar measures. There are others.
Hi!
So, I hate jumping into playfield threads but to be completely transparent, I did not "bulletproof" anything in advance...I just played the game.
It eventually got some chipping around some key posts, at which point I covered the damage with Cliffy's carbon fiber rings.
They are large enough to hide the damage, thin so they don't raise the posts, and look "ok" - better than chips at least.
I *can* say that the damage has not spread since then. I estimate we've had around 1200 plays since doing these coverups.
It's a band-aid solution to be sure, but from the two "overview" pics you'll see it blends better than you'd think.
I plan on getting a new playfield set down the road and hopefully it will be more robust.
IMG_0355.jpegIMG_0356.jpegIMG_0357.jpegIMG_0358.jpegIMG_0360.jpegIMG_0361.jpegyou got lucky on Playfield lottery then . I have way less plays and way more damage at the Axl Extra ball area . Fuuugin lotteries i suck at that is why no Money for the kids Pinball Raffles for me
Quoted from zaphX:Hi!
So, I hate jumping into playfield threads but to be completely transparent, I did not "bulletproof" anything in advance...I just played the game.
It eventually got some chipping around some key posts, at which point I covered the damage with Cliffy's carbon fiber rings.
They are large enough to hide the damage, thin so they don't raise the posts, and look "ok" - better than chips at least.
I *can* say that the damage has not spread since then. I estimate we've had around 1200 plays since doing these coverups.
It's a band-aid solution to be sure, but from the two "overview" pics you'll see it blends better than you'd think.
I plan on getting a new playfield set down the road and hopefully it will be more robust.[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
Quoted from PinFever:you got lucky on Playfield lottery then . I have way less plays and way more damage at the Axl Extra ball area . Fuuugin lotteries i suck at that is why no Money for the kids Pinball Raffles for me
Well, you're seeing it after I covered the damage. I had 5 posts all with fairly severe chips.
Quoted from PinFever:you got lucky on Playfield lottery then . I have way less plays and way more damage at the Axl Extra ball area . Fuuugin lotteries i suck at that is why no Money for the kids Pinball Raffles for me
Checked my Wonka yesterday I noticed that the one post that had a little bit of pooling was not as tight as the other posts. I’m thinking it got a little loose over time and the play in the post moving back and forth caused the pooling. I had a silicone washer under a star post and replaced the silicone washer with a slightly larger acrylic washer which covered the pooling. I’m thinking that if the post and washer moving is causing the pooling maybe adhesive between the washer and playfield to keep the washer from moving would further prevent pooling. Even if the post is moving a little it’s moving on top of the waster and the part in contact with the playfield is stationary.
Quoted from butterz:As a buyer of gnr, I wanted to do some more research and decided to drop by a local bar on the way home. I knew they had a gnr on route, and wanted to see if the playfield has issues. They had two jj games, gnr and willy wanka. Both had playfield pooling, the ww had the artwork coming off by the star posts. This really speaks for itself. Jersey jack if your reading this, when you go to build my game, could you please have this sorted out?
Nope. That is all.
Quoted from butterz:
They had two jj games, gnr and willy wanka.
Quoted from fatality83:Is that a special edition
The one with the specially shaped plunger?
Quoted from fastchef:I just started to see pooling on a few posts on my GNR CE. Looking to go the Cliffy route. Do you think the whole kit is needed or just the posts?
sell that pos
Quoted from fastchef:I just started to see pooling on a few posts on my GNR CE. Looking to go the Cliffy route. Do you think the whole kit is needed or just the posts?
Market is hot at the moment…selling it would take little effort…
Not to me. I’m not into manufacturer ignored emails and crapfields, but I’m not your demographic.
Little to no update as time passed.... thank you all for backing me and the pinball community. 
Hope things change with the upcoming game
Quoted from AMSNL:We almost all agree that JJP builds 1 of the of the best pinball machines in the world . The weight is twice that of the other brands .
This is the most baffling argument in the pinball world, that weight equals quality somehow. That is a very old school way of thinking and I was also caught up in that antiquated thinking until my son pointed out, that a heavy door on an automobile, doesn’t mean it is quality. Today heavy weight in anything mechanical, other than a tank, means it is poorly engineered. Since JJP is such a small boutique pinball maker at best, they can’t afford custom and have to use heavy and bulky old off the shelf pinball parts, instead of custom parts like Stern uses. This along with poorly engineered heavy back box mechanics, heavy PC parts, poor use of tons of wire, poorly engineered layouts, excessive use of posts, etc.
Quoted from AMSNL:I won’t go down without a fight!
I’m with you on the constant fight that is dealing with JJP and also hope things change on the new machine. Good luck!
Just amazed after issues on multiple machines, they can't fix this.
It's printed wood with a clear coat - seems like there are multiple companies in the US that could figure this out.
Quoted from jimwe5t:This is the most baffling argument in the pinball world, that weight equals quality somehow. That is a very old school way of thinking and I was also caught up in that antiquated thinking until my son pointed out, that a heavy door on an automobile, doesn’t mean it is quality. Today heavy weight in anything mechanical, other than a tank, means it is poorly engineered. Since JJP is such a small boutique pinball maker at best, they can’t afford custom and have to use heavy and bulky old off the shelf pinball parts, instead of custom parts like Stern uses. This along with poorly engineered heavy back box mechanics, heavy PC parts, poor use of tons of wire, poorly engineered layouts, excessive use of posts, etc.
Some like fish some like meat ... just enjoy life
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:Just amazed after issues on multiple machines, they can't fix this.
It's printed wood with a clear coat - seems like there are multiple companies in the US that could figure this out.
With you on that one. Pinball is fun and meant to be played, not endlessly worked on. A friend spent over 40 hours trying to fix his GNR PF.
Quoted from jimwe5t:This is the most baffling argument in the pinball world, that weight equals quality somehow. That is a very old school way of thinking and I was also caught up in that antiquated thinking until my son pointed out, that a heavy door on an automobile, doesn’t mean it is quality. Today heavy weight in anything mechanical, other than a tank, means it is poorly engineered. Since JJP is such a small boutique pinball maker at best, they can’t afford custom and have to use heavy and bulky old off the shelf pinball parts, instead of custom parts like Stern uses. This along with poorly engineered heavy back box mechanics, heavy PC parts, poor use of tons of wire, poorly engineered layouts, excessive use of posts, etc.
Absolute horseshit.
Ask anyone in engineering about metal parts being replaced with plastic.
Less wiring and full sized transistors in machines does not mean the machines are better. Cheap Chinese PSUs are not better. Removing coils (knocker) is not better. Lighter wood is not better.
Newer Sterns feel like flimsy picnic tables. Give me an old w/b or jjp for WEIGHT any day. The extra effort to move the damned things is with it.
GnR Awesome! Godzilla Awesome! Stranger Things Awesome! Rock and Morty Awesome! Alien Awesome! Willy Wonka Awesome! Cactus Canyon Awesome! Jurassic Park Awesome! Avengers Infinity Quest Awesome! Halloween Awesome! Elvira Awesome! Iron Maiden Awesome! Houdini Awesome! Deadpool Awesome!
What a time to be alive!
GnR Awesome! Godzilla Awesome! Stranger Things Awesome! Rock and Morty Awesome! Alien Awesome! Willy Wonka Awesome! Cactus Canyon Awesome! Jurassic Park Awesome! Avengers Infinity Quest Awesome! Halloween Awesome! Elvira Awesome! Iron Maiden Awesome! Houdini Awesome! Deadpool Awesome!
What a time to be high!
Come on bogart, pass it on 
Quoted from jimwe5t:[quoted image]
Anyone who says that doesn’t understand the game. Like at all. Keep on trolling
Quoted from EricHadley:Anyone who says that doesn’t understand the game. Like at all. Keep on trolling
Exactly
Quoted from PinFever:plan C
you have a pinside user who has taken high resolution art scans of the playfield which you could print and overlay just the small area with damage that occurred. I couldn't begin to imagine how to properly accomplish this but that's the concept and I'd rely on others for implementing / process.
Plan C should be done By JJP at the least. Not a Customer
I do not see his or my replies as Justification Of poor quality or poor Customer Service.
The Game / Game Play Justifies a few of the Aggravations of dealing with JJP Support and or repairing /bulletproofing it ourselves however
GO OUT AND LIVE YOUR DREAM !!
Their waiting for you to play !!
Melissa Reese GnR
Quoted from jimwe5t:[quoted image]
You know this guy
EE287F41-3FBB-400C-B86C-6AB91724CBD9 (resized).jpegMirco Steffen from highclasspinballs aka https://mircoplayfields.com/ aka jjp supplier aka ... is not associated at all with Mirco from playfield protectors... Same given name - that's it.
But - of course it makes sense to protect all playfield with our playfield protectors... that includes playfields from the other Mirco 
All the best
https://playfield-protectors.com/
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