(Topic ID: 125661)

Help me figure out Schematics? Some flashers don't work.

By woody24

8 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

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  • 14 posts
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  • Latest reply 8 years ago by Sheprd
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#1 8 years ago

I need help figuring out where my issue is with the flashers. I would be greatful if someone could help me figure out what I need to look for on the board. I just can't follow the schematics, and have no idea what I'm looking for. I have a multimeter, but not sure what to test for and where to test at.

Some flashers work. Most do not. There are two sets in the back box that both work. The playfield has numerous ones that don't work. I have marked all them in the picture. Red means they don't work. Green means they do. All bulbs are brand new, so I know it's something else.

I've also attached a few photos of the CPU board for reference if needed. Below is the link to the IPDB manual. If you need a closer view or better view of something, let me know and I'll scan in my copy.

Getting close to getting this machine back to 100%, and this will be one of the last pieces I need.

http://mirror2.ipdb.org/files/1415/Laser_War_manual.pdf

THANKS! I'll buy the first round if I can get this going again!

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#2 8 years ago

First, run through the coil test and list those not working. It would appear at first glance that something is wrong with this L/R relay circuit....it directs 32VDC flasher power to different flashers in the game. Make sure item #10 L/R relay works in coil test.

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#3 8 years ago

Each of the flashlamps I believe has a board under the pf with a 5ohm 10 watt resistor on it like the early system 11 games. These resistors like to fall off the boards and that disables the flashlamps

#4 8 years ago
Quoted from wayout440:

Make sure item #10 L/R relay works in coil test

Not sure what to make of the test. The first couple seem to be on the same number. Seems to be two tests on #1 and two on #2. I can hear clicks between some, but nothing visual happens. There's also a click sound happening on number #10, but nothing visual. All the kickers and outholes work.

So does the sound on #10 mean that it's working properly? Or should I be able to see something?

#5 8 years ago
Quoted from kbliznick:

These resistors like to fall off the boards and that disables the flashlamps

I'm guessing it has to be something like a Christmas light strand, where one little thing has gone wrong and knocked the rest out, since there's quite a few that don't work.

#6 8 years ago
Quoted from woody24:

I'm guessing it has to be something like a Christmas light strand, where one little thing has gone wrong and knocked the rest out, since there's quite a few that don't work.

no, not the case at all. You did check the bulbs first right? Take them out and visually inspect or run a meter on them (not in the socket, they will test good in the socket even when bad)

#7 8 years ago
Quoted from woody24:

Not sure what to make of the test. The first couple seem to be on the same number. Seems to be two tests on #1 and two on #2. I can hear clicks between some, but nothing visual happens. There's also a click sound happening on number #10, but nothing visual. All the kickers and outholes work.
So does the sound on #10 mean that it's working properly? Or should I be able to see something?

There should be two tests for all of the coils from #1 to #8 if any of the flashlamps work in those numbers then the relay (at #10) should be OK.

#8 8 years ago

There were a couple that worked in 1-8. But not all. I did pull one bulb out and look at it. It visually looked good, and the continual test with the meter check out.

I looked at the resistors, and visually they all seem to have good connections, and didn't see any that seem to be missing, or have bad solder joints.

#9 8 years ago

http://ipdb.org/showpic.pl?id=1415&picno=40841&zoom=1

shows pictures of the resistor boards under the game. Each board should have a 5 ohm resistosr and a 330 ohm resistor. The 330 resistor is not needed and if missing is not important. However if the 5 ohm resistor is missing the lamps won't work.

Double check all the bulbs, these were rarely replaced by ops as they burnt out and it's not uncommon to have 75% of these bulbs burnt out when shopping a game.

#10 8 years ago

Ok, found the main issue. Posted this in a local pinball group as well, and someone suggested that the relay may be missing power, and to reflow solder. An inspection showed that the brown wire was cracked. Reflowed, and all but the Green Shield are working. Replaced the bulb, and still nothing.

Would like to fix the Green shield, but if I can't, I can live with it being the only one not working.

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#11 8 years ago

OK ....good find. Now to fix the green shield, first find out if the power (DC volts) is making to the flasher. If it is, then the problem is with the grounding circuit. Look on the solenoid table for the green shield, and ground the tab of the appropriate transistor number with an alligator clip lead. If it doesn't turn on, then you have a connection problem between the transistor and the bulb....could be a connector or a broken ballast resistor for example. If it does work, then it could be the driving transistor or something further upstream.

#12 8 years ago

Ok, we may be able to narrow it down a little more. I noticed that the left most flasher at the top of the playfield is not flashing as well. Looking at the manual, I see that the Green Shield and this flasher are the only two that use this coil, as listed as 2B in the attached image. But, how do I find this coil?

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#13 8 years ago

They don't share a coil. Flashers are considered as coils. You will find all the flashers listed in the solenoid table in the manual. There you will find important information for the flashers such as wire colors, connector locations and triggering transistor numbers

#14 8 years ago

Dustin,

use a VOM to see if 32v is getting to one side of the flasher. Follow the other side to the 5 ohm resistor. Ground the other side of the 5 ohm resister and see if the flasher comes on. If not, look at connections or a bad resistor. If it comes on, follow the wire to the D15 diode pack. Again, on the other side, ground the line and see if flasher lights. Same here, if not working, check connections and replace open diode if that is the problem. If it lights, trace line to the CPU Q45 driver. Ground the tab there. If it does not light, look seriously at the connections on the board. If it does light, then it is Q45 or the drive to it.... probably need to have someone check and change that for you if that is the case.

MAC

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