(Topic ID: 163660)

Help me choose between World Cup Soccer and The Shadow


By Albanylifer

3 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 55 posts
  • 37 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 3 years ago by Frax
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

There have been 3 images uploaded to this topic. (View topic image gallery).

a0cff8795993516d7352388e22b962435cbab949 (resized).jpg
gwaxt_wcs_ts_(resized).jpg
WCS_TS_(resized).JPG

There are 55 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.
#1 3 years ago

First post here. I hope I'm in the right place.

Someone I know is selling two machines. I've played both, but only a couple of games, and I don't know which one I want. The games in question are both routed, but have been in his home for the last 15 years. I'm getting "good buddy price" on either one, I can't afford both.

So, please convince me of why I either want to buy World Cup Soccer or The Shadow.

#2 3 years ago

Never played TS, but not a huge fan of WCS. That said, a lot of other people who played mine before I sold it loved it, so it is definitely a popular game.

If you're getting a good buddy price, you must know him well enough to ask to sample the games. Go in a couple times, play only one machine for an hour or so one night, then play only the other on a different night. Get a feel for them and see which you cotton to more. Then take it home with you.

#3 3 years ago

Shadow is better in my opinion by a good margin but wcs is more family friendly. That said, you will play it more than anybody else so get the shadow.

#4 3 years ago

It's my buddy's uncle. I don't know him "well", but I've known him since I was a little kid. I've played both games, and they both play well. They are both dirty and could use new rubber. I guess my question is whether or one game or the other has longer playability than the other. The World Cup Soccer is immediate gratification, but I'm not sure that there's much beyond that. The Shadow was disappointingly hard to me, but from what I'm reading people say it has lots to offer and it's one of the all time greats.

I'm just not experienced enough to know any better.

#5 3 years ago

Thanks Don - what is it about the shadow that makes you say that it is so much better?

#6 3 years ago

Most people would say get the Shadow, but WCS has bumpers. I know that doesn't help.

#7 3 years ago

Shadow is worth more so if your "good buddy" price is the same for either it's a no-brainer.

They are both good games but I've gotten tired of WCS pretty fast whenever I've owned it. Shadow, with it's modes and a much better wizard mode, along with more multiball features and a third flipper, has more staying power and more to offer in my opinion.

#8 3 years ago

WCS94 is a fun game for all levels of skill. Non pinball people / guests usually love it.

Shadow is a players game. Requires thinking ahead and setting up your shots with the diverters.

For me this is not even close. Shadow is the much better game.

#9 3 years ago

Only you know what's right for you. If you say WCS offers the instant gratification and you like that - then it's right for you right now. If you want the harder game & think it will grow on you - only you know that. Whoever said play them some more gives good advice. Hopefully your buddy's uncle will let you buy the one you want now, and hold the other for when you want to buy it. Good buddy prices aren't out there all over for most of us. You will want to add another after you buy your first. So, get the one you think you'll like more right away and start saving for the other one.

#11 3 years ago
Quoted from Albanylifer:

Thanks Don - what is it about the shadow that makes you say that it is so much better?

The magnet that locks the ball is cool and the upper playfield. I had mine for about 2 years and sold it to get another pin since I have a small collection of 4. I really like wcs as well but tired of it in less than a year. If you tire of the shadow, its probably an easier sell down the road to get something else

#12 3 years ago

No question -- own both and shadow is far superior. Better call outs better sound better dots and better gameplay. Unless you enjoy an easier game-- then Wcs would be your choice.

#13 3 years ago

Wow you guys are fast!

I don't want to disclose his asking prices, as they are well below what I found a couple here for. He's asking $250 more for the Shadow than the World Cup Soccer. I found an ad in the for sale page for a Shadow (ironically, only about 30 minutes away from me) that has similar wear above the flippers. Is there some sort of sticker I can get to cover that up, or do I just have to live with it?

As far as "players" games, I don't really know what I do and don't know or like. I like the instant gratification, but if that's all there is to the game I will probably get bored with it. The Shadow seems much harder. My only game currently is a Solar Ride that my parents bought for me, and to be honest, it's not that much fun. The only arcades that I know of are an hour away, and their games are in terrible condition. I've only played a total of about 10 different games, including the two I'm looking at.

As far as reliability goes, is one considered better than the other? Both have a lot of moving parts compared to my Solar Ride.

#14 3 years ago

I own both. So different they probably shouldn't be compared. WCS is an excellent game that will have you playing long games trying to get to the final match. Shadow is brutal and you will have short, exciting and frustrating games. I'd buy whichever is in better condition, and then buy the other title later.

#15 3 years ago

He's selling both. I pick one, the other goes on the market. I'm in grad school, so it's going to be a few years before I can afford another one.

An edit: because I'm new it won't let me make more posts right away. Any idea about the sticker? The wear on The Shadow is a concern.

#16 3 years ago

Like others said, Shadow is the more desirable game. I just picked one up this summer and love it. There is a variety of ways to play the game and very challenging. The diverters make gameplay a ton of fun. I love just playing vengeance modes and hitting ramps. Artwork, callouts, dots, and humor are very good. WCS is more friendly to non players but still a pretty good game. Just doesn't grab me like Shadow.

#17 3 years ago

Shadow is so much fun. World Cup Soccer I find loses its luster much quicker. For me though, condition means a lot. If it was a shadow with limited magnet wear and working 100% it is a no brainer.

I could have owned a shadow early in my collecting days and have wished I would have purchased it ever since. I guess the only time WCS would be better is if you are a real hard core soccer fan. And love hearing GOOOOAAAAL!!!!

Shadow has great modes, super flow, upper playfield and the unique ramp diverters. It can kick your butt and other times you can have a great game. You just can't go wrong with a shadow in a single game collection.

#18 3 years ago

Based on the factors weighing into your decision, from a guy who owns both.....The Shadow over the WCS. Both great games...but The Shadow will challenge you in more ways, and will make you a better pinball player than WCS in the long run.

I would however factor in condition. If Shadow has a lot of playfield wear, then get on the CPR pre-order playfield list, and tell the seller that the price needs to be dropped to compensate the future work you will need to put into it.

Let us know your final decision!

WCS_TS_(resized).JPG

#19 3 years ago

Personally, I think The Shadow is a far superior game.

I looked at pics of the other one for sale to see what you meant by flipper wear. Honestly, that's a little unusual, and no, there is no "sticker" or anything else you could use to cover it up. If you can't live with it, it would be a fairly expensive thing to fix, and I personally could understand why that would be enough to turn you away unless you were getting a killer price.

Good luck on your decision!

#21 3 years ago

I would easily go World Cup Soccer 94. I do like the shadow but find the ramps have a little too clunky feel to them. Saw them both at same time in 1994. Played a little of both and then played some more WCS94! Made mistake trading mine a few years ago.

#22 3 years ago

The Shadow all day.

I own both and I've only had WCS94 for a few years and it's already worn out its welcome to some extent. I've been thinking about selling...and picking up a MET. BUT... I still hold on to WCS because it's a great game for family and friends and that's the main reason I keep it around. After you've made it to the World Cup finals for the 100th time it just doesn't give me that rush it used to have. It's a great game that I don't have to take real serious but still get enjoyment from.

The Shadow beats my ass down on a regular basis but I find that it's a much more engaging machine to play. Incredible flow... it's probably my favorite game to loop and combo on... if you get that 7 way combo call meh! The wizard mode is fairly difficult to get.. I've been LITZ a hundred times over but I only get to the final battle every so often... and the closest I've ever been to completing the final battle was one shot away. I've heard of it taking players years to complete this mode. I could go on but I really think The Shadow has some of the greatest rules ever for this era... they're not real deep but not shallow either and what it lacks in depth it makes up for in difficulty. This is a keeper for me.

They're two really different machine and you should choose the one that best fits the way you like to play pinball...

#23 3 years ago

I'm not an expert on either machine, but I'm local. I'm not helping you lift a machine up a flight of stairs, but if you need help evaluating condition, feel free to call on me if I can be of assistance.

#24 3 years ago

Both games on my wanted list. For a $250 difference I'd always take The Shadow, but I'd explore ways to buy them both. In my time in the hobby, I have yet to regret buying a game. In contrast there are more then a handful of games I regret not buying.

#25 3 years ago
Quoted from fish1975tx:

Made mistake trading mine a few years ago.

I have been considering moving my WCS for something different....PM me if interested in seeing if we can find a match.

#26 3 years ago

Thanks guys. The flipper wear on this machine isn't as bad as the wear on the one in the ad, but it's wear nonetheless. There's a clear sticker over it now, but I don't like the way it looks. I don't need my machine to be perfect, but I think how visible that is will bother me. If there's no sticker available, what other repair options do I have?

The World Cup Soccer is really, really dirty. His kids played this one a lot, but everything works and as far as I can tell there are no spots that the playfield is bare wood.

One of the parts I asked before that no one answered, is one of these more reliable than the other?In reading up on the Shadow, some people say it's mechanically complicated, should that be a concern? Is the parts situation better for either? Gameplay aside, are there other factors I should be thinking about in my decision?

#27 3 years ago
Quoted from Albanylifer:

First post here. I hope I'm in the right place.
Someone I know is selling two machines. I've played both, but only a couple of games, and I don't know which one I want. The games in question are both routed, but have been in his home for the last 15 years. I'm getting "good buddy price" on either one, I can't afford both.
So, please convince me of why I either want to buy World Cup Soccer or The Shadow.

I've had both. Both are gone, but I would own both again. I think it would come down to player ability. If you want a more approachable game that is fun for both newbies (score goals) and advanced players (defeating Germany) than WCS would be the choice. If you are a more skilled player who isn't concerned about the play ability for others besides himself, I would get Shadow. For only $250 more, I would personally go with Shadow. It's a more challenging game and has more value. I honestly think they are both great games though and you can't go wrong with either one.

#28 3 years ago

I had a WCS for a bit, but didn't really get into it...it's gone. I'd say buy the WCS and get me the "buddy price" on The Shadow!!!! Good luck.

#29 3 years ago

I own WCS and it's a pain to clean well. Take a look at the saucers on your uncle's pin. My guess is there is wear and tear there that might be comparable to the amount on shadow. Other than that, I found WCS to be really fun and my kids liked it so that was important.

#30 3 years ago

The parts for The Shadow are somewhat limited. I would say the diverter assembly (left or right) is about impossible to find. The gun handle for the plunger good freaking luck. The plastic phurba daggers sold my first born child. Mantis has some great replacements for the ramp entrances.. those are usually busted up. The rings are hard to find but I've heard they are on the slate to be repo'd but I've never seen them for sale.
I would definitely check those diverter assemblies... I've seen cases where the damn things were welded to the machine...total PITA.
The divot or the compressing wood that you find above the magnet area is another issue that is really common. It's honestly an easy fix but 95% of the games out there have some kind of wear in this area. You'll have to make a judgement call on that but if the magnet has come through the playfield that might be some serious repair work. The mini playfield can be a little turd as well... I would make sure the optos for the mini playfield are working as well as the pop up targets... some of those parts can be hard to find.

WCS94 this game is pretty straight forward mechanically. The ramps, soccer ball, plastics are usually what get banged up in this game. The plastics and the ramps might be a little hard to come by but this machine has never given me any real problems and it's a fairly straight forward game to work on. You might make sure the motors for the soccer ball and goalie work as the should as those are fairly costly to replace... Check the diverter on the left ramp and make sure it works properly and holds properly. Alot of them have damage on the ramps because the diverter chewed through it. I've seen cases of gimpy diverters that would hold for a few minutes then basically flap around or not even hold at all.

I probably missed a few things here but those are the major things off the top of my head.

#31 3 years ago

There's no cheap fix for bare wood right above the flippers. Either learn to live with it/ignore it, or prepare yourself for an expensive, time consuming and labor intensive undertaking of tearing down the playfield and sending it out to be restored and clear coated. And then putting it all back together again and making sure everything works!

As far as complexity/reliability, both should be about the same. Stuff will break, you will be confused, you will think you can't fix it. Then eventually you'll search Pinside or RGP and find out that you aren't the first one dealing with the issue, you'll take several deep breaths and get the guts to dig in and try to fix whatever is broken. And you'll have a great sense of accomplishment when you fix it, along with a bit of hair-pulling along the way. And the next time something breaks the whole process will seem a little easier.

#32 3 years ago

I have WCS and i love it. Its easy to get started with but it takes a bit to master. If your not a hardcore pinball player i doubt it would get old for a long time. I took a long time to decide before making it my first pin. Shadow makes me angry its not for a casual player but i can see why that makes others like it. Its the kind of game you cant just walk up to and enjoy if you dont know what your suppose to do. WCS hit the ramps hit some goals and if you have no idea what your doing it still seems fun. Two very different games depending on what you want out of it.

Other than ramps you can find most parts for WCS. I cant speak for Shadow.

#33 3 years ago
Quoted from examiner:

There's no cheap fix for bare wood right above the flippers. Either learn to live with it/ignore it, or prepare yourself for an expensive, time consuming and labor intensive undertaking of tearing down the playfield and sending it out to be restored and clear coated. And then putting it all back together again and making sure everything works!

Man, it's really all or nothing with some of you dudes.

I've seen perfectly serviceable touch ups, covered up by clear nail polish to protect it, many times. I had a friend do this for me on a High Speed and it took about an hour. I bought him dinner and gave him 20 bucks and everybody was happy.

#34 3 years ago
Quoted from Albanylifer:

Thanks guys. The flipper wear on this machine isn't as bad as the wear on the one in the ad, but it's wear nonetheless. There's a clear sticker over it now, but I don't like the way it looks. I don't need my machine to be perfect, but I think how visible that is will bother me. If there's no sticker available, what other repair options do I have?
The World Cup Soccer is really, really dirty. His kids played this one a lot, but everything works and as far as I can tell there are no spots that the playfield is bare wood.
One of the parts I asked before that no one answered, is one of these more reliable than the other?In reading up on the Shadow, some people say it's mechanically complicated, should that be a concern? Is the parts situation better for either? Gameplay aside, are there other factors I should be thinking about in my decision?

Condition will be big key if/when you resale down the road. Once playfield or cabinet is damaged, its a lot of work/expense to fix. Just like getting a dent on your new car or a scratch on your hardwood floors..... If this machine will be a keeper, and you plan to add the other later, then the better condition game might be better for you now. WCS will have you fist pumping around the room when you beat Germany in the Finals!

#35 3 years ago
Quoted from Bwilson:

The parts for The Shadow are somewhat limited. I would say the diverter assembly (left or right) is about impossible to find. The gun handle for the plunger good freaking luck. The plastic phurba daggers sold my first born child. The ramps are probably hard to come by as well.

Actually you can buy the ramps brand new for $165 a set.

#36 3 years ago

vvvvv This vvvvv

Quoted from mdclips:

I own both. So different they probably shouldn't be compared. WCS is an excellent game that will have you playing long games trying to get to the final match. Shadow is brutal and you will have short, exciting and frustrating games. I'd buy whichever is in better condition, and then buy the other title later.

#37 3 years ago

I have the Shadow which is a fun game. I chased that game incessantly for a couple months. I would NOT purchase The Shadow unless. #1 No Sanctum Wear #2 Plastics around Battleground are all there and #3 everything works . The Shadow is definitely a deeper game if that is your thing.

WCS is fricking fun out of the box. I can't speak to what to look for condition wise.

#38 3 years ago

You really can't lose either way. WCS is much easier to play and anyone will be able to play it and have fun. TS will not be as much fun for those who are not pinball players--they may become frustrated and not play it at all. It comes down to instant gratification on WCS, or a more challenging TS. If non-pinheads are gonna be playing, I'd go WCS.

#39 3 years ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Actually you can buy the ramps brand new for $165 a set.

Nice! Who has these?... I know a guy that could use a new set someone did a really bad weld job.

EDIT-- I should have mentioned the wireform ramps... if these are the ramp entrances I think that would be mantis.

#40 3 years ago

If instant gratification is your thing, WCS can't be beat. Everyone figures it out right away. I love The Shadow, but for you, I'd recommend WCS.

But really, just play both and take home your favorite.

#41 3 years ago

Depends on collection. To me wcs is just fun shots....ts is more of a mode completion and cool gadgets in the upper pf and ramps. If the upper pf had real flippers I think ts would still be in my lineup. Long term I think it would be ts for me.

#42 3 years ago

Does the shadow have all 4 rings and 2 phurbas? Those parts are pretty damn near impossible to find, especially the rings so make sure those are on there. But I would recommend WCS for you right now since u sound like a new player and i think Shadow might frustrate you more than give you enjoyment at this point but WCS will be fun right out the gate.

#43 3 years ago

The Shadow is one of the best pins ever made. It's fun, hard, beautiful, and odd. Unless you are a huge soccer fan, got to go Shadow.

#44 3 years ago

There is no choice to be made---Shadow x 4.
This one's a layup.

#45 3 years ago

If you like a fun, relatively easy game and want your friends and family to play - WCS94
(Plus parts are easier to find with the exception of the ramps)

If you want a game that is hard yet rewarding and had stating power and don't mind short ball times - Shadow
(Unless the diverter assemblies are jacked up or its missing other hard or impossible to find parts)

If this is your first game, I would lean towards recommending WCS94.
That being said, The Shadow is the better game of the two. It just can be kind of evil.

Good luck with your choice. Both are very fun to own.

#46 3 years ago

Id go with what is in better condition and from the sounds of it both are dirty and not maintained well and shadow has playfield wear which will make it difficult to sell or trade later on. More likely the shadow has some issues your not seeing and has sanctum wear also. Seems lots gets broken on ts . Wcs usually has saucer wear and some broken plastics. I wld take someone that knows what to look for on pins and go from there. Both are fun pins but for your first pin od probably go witth wcs

#48 3 years ago
Quoted from Albanylifer:

One of the parts I asked before that no one answered, is one of these more reliable than the other?In reading up on the Shadow, some people say it's mechanically complicated, should that be a concern? Is the parts situation better for either? Gameplay aside, are there other factors I should be thinking about in my decision?

I don't think either is that complicated. Shadow is pretty easy to work on for me so far. The upper playfield lifts up and you have easy access to entire playfield. Condition is really important. If things are not working right or parts are missing that would be a big concern at any price on any game.

#49 3 years ago

Go Shadow Go!!

#50 3 years ago

These go great together!!! See if you can swing them both.....here is a pic from a for sale thread today:

gwaxt_wcs_ts_(resized).jpg

Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
From: $ 20.00
Cabinet - Other
Rock Custom Pinball
$ 279.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball LEDs
Trade
Machine - For Trade
Garden City, NY
4,000 (OBO)
Sale Pending!
Winston-salem, NC
From: $ 35.00
Boards
PCB Emporium
There are 55 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 2.

Hey there! Got a moment?

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside