The first pin was a novelty and prepaid by the masses..... And lots of drama surrounded it obviously.

I think the success (or lack thereof) of the 2nd title will be more telling.... If they can ship TH without all the shenanigians we saw with WOz, THEN Stern might take JJP seriously. If that happens, we might see Stern respond/react.... So far they havejt really needed to..... Except to see the market price for pins has gone up.

Id LOVE for Stern to react by kicking things up a notch.... Mustang certainly didnt do that

If the LCD isnt revolutionary, its certainly a major "evolutionary" step.

Im hoping to see even more integration of the LCD with TH.... I think it will be a baby step closer to "evolutionary" - certainly more innovation than weve seen from Stern lately.... Maybe EVER.

Having said that, a pinball is more the sum of its parts (or toys). THAT is why im anxious for TH.

I was thinking about what would qualify as "revolutionary"

Id consider pinball 2k revolutionary.... But... That didn't turn out too well

Different question:
Do we really WANT revolutionary? I mean, a huge part of pinballs appeal is nostalgia. A radically different design (revolutionary?!) might not really be what pinballs current fanbase really wants.

Anyways, just some random musings...

For me, im happy with some 'evolution".... and perhaps mire importantly some "creativity."

Awesome.

In other news, *I* am now a higher quality build than I was 10 years ago

I might agree..... Unless they pre-ordered.

In that case- I'd suggest almost the exact opposite. I'd say that anyone who buys a game (sometimes before they even play it!) cannot have an objective opinion. That's like allowing a parent of a contestant to judge one of those child beauty patents.... No-one is going to admit their own kid is ugly.

I consider WOZ a special case here because 99% of the fanbase fully paid for one before they ever played it.... Or even saw one.... However, I put stern LE pre-order folks in the same bucket.

Granted some people can still be objective even though they dropped 6, 7, 8k sight unseen and then had to defend their decision for years.... But most are NOT.

Obviously I'm old fashioned. I like to actually SEE and PLAY a game before deciding I want to buy one. For the folks that "tried before they buyed"- I would agree they will have a less emotional, more objective opinion about the game....but not the preorder crazies.

Good stuff.

Next please compare WOZ's revolutionary led board design (you know, where 1 failure can take out half the lights on the whole game). I know that's a "feature" operators have been raving about....

Lol... Guys in glass houses....

All pinball game have the ability to suck in their own, unique and special way. Notwithstanding All of Jacks chest-thumping, WOZ's have proven to have their issues JUST like Stern.

However, the difference is Jacks berating of the competition when he was stumping for JJP makes him an easy target now that a few of those chickens have come back to roost.

Well, yes THAT (the toys macro).... but also the crowing about complete code/software.

I agree the WoZ code looks pretty damn deep (I love the graphical map of it), but if we measured final code from when the FIRST Woz was delivered, I think its fair to say JJP (like Stern) has delivered incomplete code at machine release.

classic.

I think he's STILL a bit sensitive about that... he's jumped in like 8 times to re-re-re-re-defend himself on it.

Most people let it die, but the irony of Tank (hey, that's what Panzer means in English, btw), ripping on someone else's screen-name made it fair game....

You'd think he would have learned that the more he re-spun the story and defended himself, the sillier he looks... Ahhh, makes me want to crack open a Shasta and re-reread the original....

For those that missed it the first time... it was funny... here's where it all started (downhill):

Proof point #6,455:

Nothing good comes after page 5 of any thread.*

*notable exceptions: SW translite and shasta threads.

Dude... please dial it back a bit.

You're posts are starting to make me agree with Pinchroma, Tank, and company.... Thats just not right.

i think I understand the recent rash of prickly comments:

Someone's Mom grounded them from attending ComicCon last month....

Maybe not after post #1, but not too far after page #1