Nope, I promised Kevin I wouldn't chime into the thread no matter how bad it got, regardless of the idiots that have nothing better to do than sit around pissing in someone's cheerios. But I have been watching every post and I have to admit I am amazed at how many people CAN'T READ the information we provided.....
.....Back to watching.....

See, Case In Point, YOU can't read Either.......Kevin DID NOT "TELL ME" Anything.....Frikin Child Care around here....

I'm sure that if you wanted to create your own Cabinet with Backbox for the Dual Backglasses (including Chaser Lamps ) and also make up your own Complete Game Wiring Harness it's possible....Most of the Mechs are generic to the Classic Bally Games.....

I just bought a project Vector for $150 ( no board set ), made 2 phone calls and boom there it was > $150, so I jumped all over it.....They made 3,500 Vectors so there are plenty out there ( most have trashed out playfields ) so not too hard to find.

Actually this is the way it is already Planned, as Noted on the Pre-Order Page.
The Kit is being done by CPR, and all the other components are being done by 3rd Party Partners.

---Note the Text in Bold: Sold separately (game-specific options) by Other Producers:

---Note the Text in Bold: Sold separately (further options) by the common distributors:

---Note: Cabinet Decals will not be $600...More on the lines of $350 +/-

---Note: Altec MPU Board is $199 ( and will have the New Code Pre-Installed )

Screen shot from the Pre-Order Page:

HotG Components.jpg

CPR has no intention of taking it any further than a Kit. CPR is a "parts" manufacturer not a Pinball Machine manufacturer, and CPR refuses to even "try" to become a Game Manufacturer, or even a Cabinet Manufacturer.....CPR will always be a Parts Manufacturer plain and simple. This is why we utilize 3rd Party Partners for these other things like Cabinet Decals, Boards, etc....

....all of the new parts that will be available will be pretty much a 'no-brainier' for installation, certainly a lot easier than installing a new style rectifier board in a classic bally ( dame I wish they would label stuff on the boards since it's not a direct replacement part ).....

If a Coder steps up we may take that into consideration, but not until we have a Coder....

Altec MPU Board will have the New Code Pre-Installed and will not be available for download

Well, let's see, I think it has something to do with Rock & Roll and the fact that the designer chose to spell it that way...

Deaf Leopard = Def Leppard
Gods = Godz

same thing happened with Dolly Parton when the Lost Vegas Kit was announced. Prior to the announcement you couldn't give them away, then the day after the announcement for Lost Vegas the price shot up to $1400 ( even for a super crappy piece of junk Dolly - basically firewood ).....

.....I did mention about a month ago in several different threads that the price of a Bally Vector was going to go up soon....

A buddy of mine was at Allentown looking for a Vector and was curious about the same thing ( Backbox Size/Configuration ) and he determined that Vector & Xenon were the same Backbox, but Space Invaders didn't fit due to a Deeper backbox depth.....

The Sound Board is in Development.....I am in the [ long ] process of going through the Vector Sounds right now and logging in everything so that Replacement Sounds, New Call-Outs, and Music can be recorded for the new sound card. We are developing the new sound card so that the end user can upload anything they want via a USB port.....

....of course with the New Rules comes New Sounds as well.....I am taking everything into consideration.....

.....and if someone wanted to the could over-right the new sounds/music with all new music....

Read about here: http://www.classicplayfields.com/hammer-documentation.pdf

I see in your poll that you have a vote line for "Yes, if the art and inserts gets tightened up"......

These 2 votes really can't be counted as it is well documented on the marketing page:
"Lots of detailed photos will reveal the designs and prototypes that are now considered Final."
http://www.classicplayfields.com/hammer.html

When looking for a "Trashed Out Project Pin" you need to stay away from Pinside, Craigslist, and especially eBay ( for the most part ). Most of these sources are only going to have Players Versions available and they wont be the most economical financially. I currently have 29 Classic Ballys in my collection and all I buy is Trashed-Out Projects so that I can get them Cheap and Restore them myself. Purchasing a trashed out game is fairly easy if you look in the right places. I contact the "old school operators" that have warehouses of old trashed out games that are more than happy to get rid of the Project Junk that they have been sitting on for the past 25 years....You can get these games Cheap "IF" you look in the right places.... But Pinside, Craigslist, and eBay are Not the right places....

LOL, there is no Sound Card yet, the HotG project is what's driving the Development of the Sound Card....

Yeah, there are No Warehouses like that around here either. I stopped looking Locally a long time ago. The Project Vector I bought for $150 I found in Connecticut and had to ship it into Phoenix....But worth it.

I don't think you understand the true meaning of the word "Re-Theme".....Moving the inserts was Never a consideration for many reasons.

HotG is a Re-Theme NOT a Re-Design

Kewl, So your offering to "Fund the Development" of the Sound Card...Sweet, now we don't have to.....Please let us know when you are ready to release it.....

That was "part" the "original plan", to CNC all the HotG Boards and then continue cutting some "25-30 extras" for a future run of Repro Vector Playfields, which was pretty much the original driving force behind doing HotG as a "straight Re-Theme" instead of a Re-Design. However, HotG took on a whole new life of its own with the addition of the New Display, New Sound Card, Etc. AND the Center Insert on Vector above the playfield window is Off-Center ( due to the artwork ) so that 1 Insert was moved 'slightly' to be more symmetrical with the new artwork ( the movement is within the parameters of Not having to make adjustments to the Wiring Harness ). Then, Mike contacted me, after the artwork was completed, and wanted me to change the Bally Style Arrow Inserts to a Newer Style due to uber-high costs involved with the purchase of the old arrow style inserts ( $2.50/Ea vrs $0.37/Ea ). At $2.50 ea. times 16 Inserts, times 150 playfields, the cost would have been $6,000 just for the Bally Style Inserts ( that does Not include all the other Inserts for the playfield ).....with the New Style Arrow Inserts at $0.37 ea the cost is $ 888.00 ( a Savings of $ 5,112.00 that is passed along to the Customer ). With the addition of the New Style Arrow Inserts doing an extended run of the CNC Wood Cutting became impossible without it costing us a shit ton of money, and for a title like Vector we figured we would only be able to sell a very short run of them, so it became cost prohibitive to do it.....

P.S. Shit-Ton is a Industry Term

yep, Without knowing all the Facts > You Are THAT GUY.......

I already had 2 other Pins sitting at a friends house in PA, and he met up with the seller at the Allentown Show and picked it for me for free and took it home. Then he palleted all 3 pins separately and I had NAVL Ship all 3 of them for 1 fee of $ 630 ( $ 210.00 / EA. )
So I'm really only into this pin for $ 360.00

NEVER Assume that you know the entire story.......

I have been collecting Pins for 28 years now, in that time frame I have made a lot of connections/friends/sources for find my games...
When I started collecting Pins there was no such thing as Buying Pins on Pinside, Craigslist or eBay, we did it the Hard Way and actually had to Search things out via other channels, and it was a Long Draw-Out Process but alos made Collecting Fun....Nowadays "collecting" isn't really fun anymore as there is no longer such a thing as "the search"...You can simply be a keyboard commando in your underware and find a pin with little to no effort ( as compared to "the search" years ago ).....

Yes, Tons.....I also just picked up 2 other games from a buddy of mine in San Diego that bought out an old operator ( he bought 27 Pins and 14 Video games all in 1 purchase ).....

No, it's $150 Pin ( + Shipping )...Had I been "local" to the seller I would have paid the $150 price of the Pin.....

No, but Spending $6,000 just for the Bally Arrow Inserts IS a Big Deal (Bally Vector Playfield). And then we would still have to create new vector artwork for Vector. Creating a new Cut File for Vector is most likely about 40-50 Hours for Mike, and for a meesly 20-30 "extra" playfields for vector is just doesn't pay for itself for all that work.....Then there is the Added Costs of a New Set of Films ( $1,200 ) and the added costs of Screens, + an entirely New Run separate from HotG....it all adds up quickly folks......

a "few"?....Creating new vector artwork for Vector is a shit-ton more than a few....There's that industry word again, and what did you say it meant? Oh Yeah "NO"....

PPS sent us the List of Films for Playfields, Plastics, And Backglasses that were considered useable, Vector was not on the list.....

LOL, yeah anyone with a large format inkjet printer can do that...We Don't. We use an Imagesetter for Real Film Separations which gives us the Best possible Dot for reproduction. InkJet printers, no matter how good they are, are still InkJet, which means a nozzle "spitting" ink onto a surface which does Not give you a perfect Dot for reproduction. InkJet printers are great for printing on paper, and in some cases for creating film, but Not film that needs to be used for recreating Artwork on this level. And most Playfield Film Sets are 12 Colors, so 12 sheets of film roughly 2' x 4', printed as Separations. I have been working in this industry professionally using Imagesetters for 23 years and as a professional I can tell you that there is no InkJet printer that will produce the films on the level that we require. And getting CMYK + Spot(s) Color Separations on this level has to be done on an Imagesetter, anything less than that would look like crap & we refuse to put out crap.......

You are going to Finance this 'second' run right!

Bob,

Thanks for the offer but the decision has already been made & the final artwork has already been prepped....besides, using the new arrow styles helps to bring this project from 1982 into the new millennium, along with the addition of the alphanumeric display & the new sound board....

Keep in mind Vid that this is a Re-Theme Conversion NOT, I repeat NOT a Re-Development, Re-Engineered GAME. The sub-reason for leaving all the Inserts in their respective positions is so that pretty much Anybody that wanted to do this conversion "Can do it" with little knowledge of the electronics. Most people don't have the ability/knowledge to Replace the Lamp Sockets and Re-Wire them in new positions. Many people Can do it, Many Can't, so we did it this way to serve ALL the customers.

Also note: The Main reason is that when I started this project Kevin wanted me to "Leave All Inserts in the Original Positions" for 1 Reason: So that when it came time to CNC the Playfields we could CNC Extra Boards for a "Later" run of Vector Playfields with Little to No Effort other than Artwork. I respected this request and from a Financial point of view it made perfect sense....

Again, HoTG is a Re-Theme Conversion NOT a Newly Engineered Game....If you want a Newly Engineered Game buy something NIB from a Pinball Machine Manufacturer, which we are Not, we make Parts, Not Machines.....