Quoted from rotordave:
That’s exactly what they’ve done. Gary Stern long said he wanted all levels of player to be able to obtain some satisfaction when they play - his famous line was “put it close to the start button”.
Don’t get me wrong - you aren’t getting the GC just batting the ball around. But you’re getting some good points while you do it.
Play games from the 80s and 90s and compare them to todays Sterns. Big difference.
One good example … on ACNC Charlie got a lot of flak because he used posts at the sides of the ramps. Rather than standups like Stern now use. People are now used to missing shots and getting points. Go back in the ACNC thread, people are literally saying that.
Most of the classic BW games from the 90s - they have posts there. You hit the ramp - or you don’t.
Here’s two from the 90s:
And here are two of the same designers games at Stern.
Hey, that’s cool .. it’s just a different design philosophy. And it makes perfect sense.
It has nothing to do with you either miss the shot or get something, it's again that the game essentially bricks for almost every single shot. pumpkin modes also turn off any secondary features the game has. Like it every game you put as an example, yea you missed, no points, but you aren't forced to keep making that SINGLE shot over and over again to move on, if you want, you can go play elsewhere on the playfield, score points elsewhere, attempt to start a new feature, and so on.
In your idea you are also turning off two entire modes from the game while a pumpkin is going on, so that makes the center ramp useless in majority of the modes, no need for upper playfield, and center playfield on majority of modes wont be used either.
So literally you take a game with a couple shots and say only other scoring now is hedge or judith? Both of which turn off btw once you complete them so that will remove even more gameplay.
To get the good points and strategy of play, you got to make your shots, but pretty much all games since the beginning have kept majority of the playfield active in some manner.
I had this exact issue and posted it here weeks ago, where I had a long game, and was in a pumpkin mode, I had a SINGLE shot to make, and one hedge shot available. Every other thing was turned off cause I accomplished the other modes supers, so they could no longer be triggered.
So in my example which I had running, I had only two exact shots that I could make, every single other shot and feature in the game was turned off. Left orbit one of the harder shots too, so constant misses, and literally 5 minutes of smacking the ball around and missing and scoring 0 points for all my time.
This isn't fun, nor is it something I've ever encountered in pinball. I can't make the shot, other games the mode will time out (they don't in Halloween pumpkin modes), you can go and start a different mode (which you want to remove two of those now?), or you can go play other features and score points elsewhere.
This isn't some magic design of Gary Stern, pinball forever has always kept scoring open, in the pre 80s games there typically was no modes at all and everything granted points at all times, far more freebie points for anything you do in the old days. When they started adding modes, it changed that hitting the ball around scores you points sure, but to really score and make the big points to compete, you had to play and earn it with the modes and making the right shots.
It boggles my mind folks are actually interested in removing shots and options in the game to focus on just running singular modes. As they stand now,it would be a disaster.