(Topic ID: 278459)

Guns N' Roses...It's here!

By pin2d

3 years ago


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#2001 3 years ago

AIQ jumped up $100, while JJP is trying to lower it's price for the SE. It seems to me that the market is coming to a balance. The top end models are all selling out within hours, so obviously the market will bear an even higher asking price.

I know it's easy to compare AIQ and GnR2 because they're both the newest thing available, but maybe it's possible that they're both good games and priced appropriately for what they are?

#2002 3 years ago
Quoted from Trogdor:

Yeah, is this pinball or pachinko?
I’m also not a fan of the concert vids. Cool ass pinball, why not use the coolest GnR years? Dizzy, Melissa, Richard? Like hitting targets for Rey and Finn in Star Wars.

Yes. Yes.

I think who the hell are these women?

I’m sure they’re fun people, great musicians etc. but until yesterday I didn’t even know there was a woman in GnR.

It’s like SW pin with JarJar as one of the main characters.

However I understand why they went with the modern video assets lots more hi-def and more clear lighting. Tons of assets compared to 30 year old film.

#2003 3 years ago

Maybe I'm oversimplifying things, but a code update to allow you to choose if you want to activate multiball at the start of the song mode would go a long way based on early video. Could keep you in single ball much more. Perhaps an option to hit the action button during gameplay to drop balls to maximize points or get out of trouble, too.

Basically, some options to keep this from being constant multiball would be huge. Put the player in control.

#2004 3 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

True but it looks like the center shot is a scoop and the left ramp locks 6 balls...

Yeah like I mentioned, you guys may very well be correct. Mechs aside, I dont think it can be denied the theme integration seems amazing. I cant wait to see the light show in person, im a dweeb for that stuff.

Surely there will be a mod, but I would be VERY tempted in the standard if the standard had the mechanical stage lights, those are absolutely amazing. I realize it sounds silly, but the light show on this game is my personal favorite feature.

#2005 3 years ago
Quoted from onemilemore:

Maybe I'm oversimplifying things, but a code update to allow you to choose if you want to activate multiball at the start of the song mode would go a long way based on early video. Could keep you in single ball much more. Perhaps an option to hit the action button during gameplay to drop balls to maximize points or get out of trouble, too.
Basically, some options to keep this from being constant multiball would be huge. Put the player in control.

The player controls how many balls they lock prior to activating the song. Unless you don't have very good aim
In which case you probably WANT the multiball during the song to help you complete it.

#2006 3 years ago

I was the one playing in the vid at helicon. I would wait for the JJP gameplay reveal to judge the pin. The one at helicon was set up very easy for me as a tournament player game had no pitch. I bet on a properly set up game it will not seem that multiball heavy.

#2007 3 years ago
Quoted from rai:

You mean $7700+ for premium?

Not quite that much but no way is anyone getting a NIB premium for under $7k in 2020. Maybe a show special, when we had shows.

#2008 3 years ago

I agree, on that video the legs were on the floor and had no sling action it was a poor example of how the machine will play. Wait till someone gets their machine next week (that’s me) and jacks it up, super sensitive slings, reduces all multiball timers, no ball save, advanced outlanes and if that isn’t enough pull some rubbers and change out for lightning flippers then we will see how this game really plays.

Quoted from Coolpinballdino:

I was the one playing in the vid at helicon. I would wait for the JJP gameplay reveal to judge the pin. The one at helicon was set up very easy for me as a tournament player game had no pitch. I bet on a properly set up game it will not seem that multiball heavy.

#2009 3 years ago

I’m interested to see how the modes play. Are they all same-same-same. Look we have infinity number of modes but they’re all same. Or will the song modes have their own rules and personality? Like R&M for example??

#2010 3 years ago

People are stoked the le/ce are packed but the standard is stripped down, are missing the fact that from a shot perspective there is very little difference. I think the real argument is more to do with stern the JJP. A lot of recent sterns have had little real differences between the pro and premiums when standing over the game. Think moving dinosaur on Jurassic park or projector on stranger things, so the pro and premium look comparable in screen shots maybe not in actual game play. For gnr it’s more like looking at a stern got premium vs a stern got pro, there is no denying the pro looks a lot more stripped down when you remove the upper play field. With gnr this is amplified even further due to the additional wire forms feeding from the upper play field to ball lock or back to the flippers.

Personally i think jjp could of made the standard a lot more cohesive with the higher models by simply removing the guitar sculpt on the left ramp and adding a diverter like on the le and ce models. The diverter could have fed the ball onto the upper stage and back through plastic ramp back to the left flipper. This would have been a way to better simulate the virtual locks on the standard vs physical locks on the other models. No actual upper playfield, no real additional costs as the diverter/ simple plastic ramp and the custom guitar sculpt probably equal out in BOM. I think this would of made the left side feel far less barren and pretty much brought the standard in line with the le/ce as far as play integration.

However taking the above out of the equation, I still commend jjp on a lot of things they have added to the standard that i don’t believe you would have got in a stern pro had they been doing the machine.

1. Custom sculpts specifically for the standard , the guitar in the left ramp is unique to the standard and the axel ridding skulls is significantly larger on the standard and a totally new mold.

2. The side playfield bar lights well not rgb would never have made into stern pro.

3. The inclusion of Bluetooth head phone support, no doubt stern would of kept this as a premium feature.

4. The hexagon lighting bar above the playfield mini screen again would of been dropped from stern pro.

5. No way would of stern incorporated the same number of rgb play field lights on their pro and premium models

There is no point arguing about the animations and theme integration as this is always the same on all model trims from all manufacturers. So you can’t praise jjp for delivering the same theme asserts on their standard and premium models, this is par for the course if you going to have a multi tiered model approach. In fact I would argue it would cost the company more money to strip assets/songs/animations from the code then to keep it consistent across all models.

#2011 3 years ago
Quoted from Dr-pin:

I'm currently looking at a stranger things pro.
Honestly it's...

affordable.

#2012 3 years ago
Quoted from SimonBaird:

3. The inclusion of Bluetooth head phone support, no doubt stern would of kept this as a premium feature.

I don't think the standard gets bluetooth. At least it isn't a listed feature on their website.

-4
#2013 3 years ago

Having Buffalo Pinball stream this will be so much better than well......the other person

14
#2014 3 years ago
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#2015 3 years ago

Standard gets Bluetooth and wifi connect listed under headliner act in comparison document I.e features in all models.
The Le/ce get additional head phone input jack with volume control at the front of the machine. Small point but still not convinced stern or others would have blue tooth audio in their base model.

#2016 3 years ago
Quoted from SimonBaird:

Standard gets Bluetooth and wifi connect listed under headliner act in comparison document I.e features in all models.
The Le/ce get additional head phone input jack with volume control at the front of the machine. Small point but still not convinced stern or others would have blue tooth audio in their base model.

Extraneous features that have nothing to do with the game and 99% of people don’t care about. I agree that Stern wouldn’t try to pass those “features” to pro owners.

#2017 3 years ago
Quoted from Trogdor:

Yeah, is this pinball or pachinko?
I’m also not a fan of the concert vids. Cool ass pinball, why not use the coolest GnR years? Dizzy, Melissa, Richard? Like hitting targets for Rey and Finn in Star Wars.

I guess it wouldn't be impossible, but it would complicate licensing. You had some different bandmates back then.

- Izzy Stadlin
- Steven Adler
- Matt Sorum replaced Steven
- Gibly Clarke played with them a lot

#2018 3 years ago
Quoted from Pinzzz:

Well it looks like a ton of multiballs! 21 multiballs (one for each song). and 5 additional unique multiballs on top of that. So, 26 multiballs total...
[quoted image]

'playable in multiball' doesn't mean each is it's own multiball...

-2
#2019 3 years ago

Glad that Kevin at Buffalo is doing the Stream tonight. Buffalo has by far the most enjoyable Pinball Streaming Crew out there.

Glad that they are involved in the Gameplay Reveal.

18
#2020 3 years ago

Why there is always Stern (apple) jjP (oranges) compared.
Buy the f*****g game you want and play.

#2021 3 years ago
Quoted from pinballwil:

Why there is always Stern (apple) jjP (oranges) compared.
Buy the f*****g game you want and play.

Everything is like that no biggie. Ford Mustang vs Chevy Camaro. Competition is good.
Now someone loan me 9500.00. Lol.

#2022 3 years ago
Quoted from SimonBaird:

Standard gets Bluetooth and wifi connect listed under headliner act in comparison document I.e features in all models.
The Le/ce get additional head phone input jack with volume control at the front of the machine. Small point but still not convinced stern or others would have blue tooth audio in their base model.

Normally you get bluetooth with wifi in a bundled controller. I would expect these to be common platform features going forward for JJP. They are going to be pushing them as JJP features... not LE vs SE features.

#2023 3 years ago

Really looking forward to seeing more gameplay, and hopefully getting to play it soon on location or at a friend's house.
I hope that in-person, the light show / concert experience doesn't get in the way of conveying to the player where to shoot the ball. The videos I've seen thus far are blinking lights EVERYWHERE -- which is fine for enjoying a concert/show where I can take it all in and even close my eyes at times while I sing along. But for pinball?
We'll see. I trust in the skills/passion of the JJP team to adjust the light shows as needed.

#2024 3 years ago
Quoted from cooked71:

OMFG, lets start listing the Stern clusterf*cks over the years....

LOL I guess two clusterf*cks wipe each other out what a dumb-ass idea

#2025 3 years ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

Half those features aren’t available in the standard. Last thing I’ve ever thought of playing a stern is “man I wish this screen was bigger”. Not sure how video of a 60 year old axl Rose is better than custom made comic art on the screen.
I’m the desperate one yet you’re pointing out a drumstick ramp return, a pick spinner, and two plastic molded figured as great features. LOL

I didnt point it out, it was mentioned before hand and I was replying to that. I was saying that there was more than just drumsticks. Please read what I replied to next time.

As for custom art, literally the artwork is just static artwork than comes onto the screen. As of now, the character pictures just zoom into the screen with zero actual animation.

-3
#2026 3 years ago
Quoted from cooked71:

Here's the issue....Stern release and sell at least 2000 LE games a year, all sold out almost instantly. Good themes, good games.
JJP has not released a single game for 18 months. They suddenly release a great game and a great theme and only 500 CE's. It's not enough. I think they would be forgiven for increasing CE units in this case - hasn't ever stopped Stern.

LOL you are giving Stern far to much credit Avengers LE are still available "sold out almost instantly" I don't think so

#2027 3 years ago

It looks like the main difference between SE and LE game play is that the left ramp replaces the upper playfield ball lock & scoop. To me, that sounds like a faster, smoother playing game.

#2028 3 years ago
Quoted from Guinnesstime:

From the video, I've watched like 5 minutes. Is every mode a multi ball?[quoted image]

Yes and that is the only time the music seems to play

https://www.facebook.com/chronictown/

#2029 3 years ago
Quoted from heyitsjoebob:

The player controls how many balls they lock prior to activating the song. Unless you don't have very good aim
In which case you probably WANT the multiball during the song to help you complete it.

Fair point. Looked like the ramp just wants to feed into the lock more often than not so I am just concerned there will be a lot of locked balls. Between that and several add-a-balls and it seems pretty MB heavy. We shall see.

#2030 3 years ago
Quoted from onemilemore:

Fair point. Looked like the ramp just wants to feed into the lock more often than not so I am just concerned there will be a lot of locked balls. Between that and several add-a-balls and it seems pretty MB heavy. We shall see.

I see no other way for this to not be heavy with multiballs. We shall see tonight!

#2031 3 years ago

From videos the LE looks like same kind of gameplay feel as WOZ did to me but with one less upper playfield. Im hoping somebody does a Standard video soon and it plays faster but with that center scoop i dont feel its going to be able to play as fast as i prefer. MET might be a fan layout but its still the king of flow out of rock pins to me without seeing a Standard yet. GnR2 is the king of light shows by far though and will be hard to beat until the next JJP. Wonder what those lightsabers look like when playing in the dark compared to pin stadiums mounted facing down? Looking forward to Kevins stream tonight!

#2032 3 years ago
Quoted from Rockytop:

I guess it wouldn't be impossible, but it would complicate licensing. You had some different bandmates back then.
- Izzy Stadlin
- Steven Adler
- Matt Sorum replaced Steven
- Gibly Clarke played with them a lot

gilby sued them after the DE machine came out

#2033 3 years ago
Quoted from rai:

I believe they said in the rules explanation that you qualify the characters (or the mode) and you lock balls and you use those balls in each mode. So that the more balls you lock you get more multiball. I hope it's not every single mode but it may be. I think very noob pinball people or casual palyers would be attracted to multiballs galore but I don't want to be in MB all the time. LOL
I'm going to pay attention to that during the streams.
Love that GIF btw

I believe you can avoid the multiballs by not shooting the upper playfield that people love

#2034 3 years ago
Quoted from Snailman:

Really looking forward to seeing more gameplay, and hopefully getting to play it soon on location or at a friend's house.
I hope that in-person, the light show / concert experience doesn't get in the way of conveying to the player where to shoot the ball. The videos I've seen thus far are blinking lights EVERYWHERE -- which is fine for enjoying a concert/show where I can take it all in and even close my eyes at times while I sing along. But for pinball?
We'll see. I trust in the skills/passion of the JJP team to adjust the light shows as needed.

Does the mini screen on the playfield tell the player where to shoot?

#2035 3 years ago
Quoted from Guinnesstime:

From the video, I've watched like 5 minutes. Is every mode a multi ball?[quoted image]

Pfft...With mode locks all 31 of the modes in Hobbit can be multiballs. Each wizard mode is a multiball (Into The Fire multiball, Barrel Escapse multiball, and Battle of the Five Armies multiball). They also have Smaug multiball, Feast Frenzy multiball, Beast Frenzy multiball. And of course the There and Back Again multiball. So that's like 38 multiball modes...

So GnR has less multiballs than other JJP games - so it has that going for it - I guess :/

JJP loves them some multiball...

#2036 3 years ago

I showed the video to my wife last night, I had to pry the phone from her.

Think I'm in trouble.

#2037 3 years ago
Quoted from Bearcat:

It looks like the main difference between SE and LE game play is that the left ramp replaces the upper playfield ball lock & scoop. To me, that sounds like a faster, smoother playing game.

I guess....Lol, only game I know that's improved by removing a feature. joking aside without a game play on the different models it hard to know what we got here.

#2038 3 years ago
Quoted from gonzo73:JJP had the pinball world in its hands for 24 hours... then kablooie!
I'm rooting for JJP, looks like a rad game. Cant wait to play it.
But they need to get ahead of this story now.
I dont care what time it is in Chicago, but they need to call everybody back to the office tonight. And figure this out.
It can't be that hard to make an extra 100 CE's. All they need is 100 coma lock mechs.
Even if it was the distributors over selling, it looks bad.
C'mon JJP you finally did a game release right, dont blow it now, by ignoring a growing controversy.
Were rooting for you JJP!
Message from the Freeeek Kingdom.

I don't think it was over selling Automated Devices listed the price on the LE and SE games yesterday but had unavailable at this time on the CE not sold out

#2039 3 years ago
Quoted from JY64:

I believe you can avoid the multiballs by not shooting the upper playfield that people love

Congrats...first post today that made me lol!

Quoted from Goronic:

JJP loves them some multiball...

Yea... also long play times. If you are curious what rheumatoid arthritis feels like, just fill your game room with JJP pins.

#2040 3 years ago
Quoted from Palmer:

Congrats...first post today that made me lol!

Yea... also long play times. If you are curious what rheumatoid arthritis feels like, just fill your game room with JJP pins.

I fucking love multiball.

#2041 3 years ago
Quoted from Multiballmaniac1:

I fucking love multiball.

I would argue multiball stacking is part of the JJP magic, and something I really enjoy too.

#2042 3 years ago

I don't even see the issue.

All the modes on AIQ can be turned into a multiball (only mentioning AIQ since other people keep bringing it up). I guess the difference is there are only 5 gem quests vs 21 songs. So yes, in that way....it is a lot of multiball

As an aside, I think the Guitar Hero element to playing well during a song will prevent the game from being insanely long. It seems to discourage trapping up by having the meter deplete while a flipper is held up.

Also Eric has mentioned timed gameplay for the future. Which would be amazing for tournament play. Everyone gets the same 3 minute song or whatever, do what you can in 3 minutes.

12
#2043 3 years ago
Quoted from zaphX:

I would argue multiball stacking is part of the JJP magic, and something I really enjoy too.

4ho3e9.jpg4ho3e9.jpg
#2044 3 years ago
Quoted from spidey:

Stern prices include shipping and JJP does not. So add $300 roughly. And Stern can always be purchased below MSRP and JJP cannot.

The local distributor in the North East has always included shipping for both Stern and JJP till this game. I don't know if you can still get the discount but if you picked up the game and payed cash you got $300 off the price of the game

16
#2045 3 years ago

I just saw the folks at Pinball Garage unbox and jam on the LE for a bit.
One player got several multiballs in the first game. I love me some multiball, so I'm down with that!
As someone pointed out, in AIQ, you can turn every one of those modes into a multiball if you want as well.
Give me all the balls! (Phrasing)

Side Note, they open at 4 so you can go play GNR LE on location.

#2046 3 years ago

The game looks amazing but I have concerns on how fun it is to shoot.

Look forward to the stream tonight.

#2047 3 years ago

Anyone know the number of balls per multiball. To me 3 balls is ideal, I don't mind 4 if its more rare or earned through add a ball. Once you get past three balls I just stop playing and all I'm doing is keeping balls in play and it get super boring.

#2048 3 years ago

The game rules are: lock a ball for each instrument member. -> center scoop -> song mode

3C659545-6BEF-4C9F-8C58-5D2876D8CF23 (resized).jpeg3C659545-6BEF-4C9F-8C58-5D2876D8CF23 (resized).jpeg
#2049 3 years ago
Quoted from SimonBaird:

Standard gets Bluetooth and wifi connect listed under headliner act in comparison document I.e features in all models.
The Le/ce get additional head phone input jack with volume control at the front of the machine. Small point but still not convinced stern or others would have blue tooth audio in their base model.

That's great news. I can't find that document on their site. Not the most intuitive website though.

#2050 3 years ago
Quoted from pascal-pinball:

The game rules are: lock a ball for each instrument member. -> center scoop -> song mode

It's more like qualify each band member > optionally lock a ball for each qualified band member > center scoop to start mode and release any locks

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