Quoted from epthegeek:
Who is this 'we' you're talking about? I don't really care about any of those things.
Agreed. I like shakers on certain games, but to be added at my own discretion. Real backglasses just meant they're that much harder to replace if I make an "oops" when servicing and quite frankly, I don't want to have to pay for anti-glare glass or special powder coat. I'd much rather see that money go into better game features, stronger cabinets, etc.
This confuses me - why would designers put giant plastics blocking the visibility of the outlanes? This bugged the hell out of me on The Avengers as well, and just learned to work around it on AC/DC (although still annoying as hell). Hopefully it's easier to see than the pictures suggest.
Quoted from EalaDubhSidhe:
The ramps are each made in two pieces because they cross over themselves. You can't make a ramp mould that does this, nor could you fit a single piece through the backboard like that.
Technically speaking, you could... Since the ramps are a thermoplastic you could in theory mold them without the overlap and then use a post process step to locally heat and bend one area to get the crossover. I'm sure STERN chooses to do the two parts because it makes the tooling simpler and total cost with the assembly is probably less than trying a post process as described before.
Regardless, as others have mentioned, I would have much preferred to see wire forms return from the connection point than another plastic ramp butted up against the other.
Quoted from epotech:
Technically you couldn't. They are vacuum formed and therefore it can't cross. As for the thickness, the thinner it is the easier it is to mold. Especially polycarbonate which it a b1tch to form.
Not to get into a pissing match, but yes, technically you can, I've done it myself on custom projects. After they are vacuum formed you can still reheat a section and bend it to cross it over.
More visualizations of mod ideas. Branches/roots on the ramps similar to what Back Alley did with TWD railroad tracks could be really cool. The scoop plastic I think can be better incorporated with the theme - not sure if it'll fit but the infiniti gauntlet where all the gems light up and represent one of the awards could be a cool alternative. Since the Orb is stationary on the pro, this is screaming for a better visualization of the infiniti gem inside - larger gem with more reflective lighting would make it look less like the basic clamshell it is. honeycomb flipper toppers. Also, the red flasher dome covers don't match well with the groot stickers on the ramps, I think a green or custom aqua colored dome would integrate better. Getting a tape player in there somewhere would be cool too, not sure where to keep the scaling looking right...
I'm really looking forward to playing this pin. Based on the rule sheet I think it's going to blend the best of many of Borg's recent games. Iron Man layout is fantastic (own it), fast and furious, but I wish the rules had more "mode" based structure (although maybe that's what makes Iron Man so good...) and wasn't so heavy on MB's all the time. Frankly, I can't stand Metallica rules and find the chopping wood as bad as on my TFLE, but I love the layout and the feel of that game. Aerosmith has great, simple mode based rules where each mode is unique to the others and each has their own level of challenge - being able to pick and choose how to progress through them makes it fun, I just don't want a pin at home with senior citizen rockers all over it. With the rule sheet indicating that the modes are selectable, it'll be nice to have that freedom to play the modes as I see fit. The wizard modes are already on the instruction card and on the playfield as well and have the same requirements to get to as the wizard modes on AS, so I'm guessing if you like the rules style on AS, GOTG will be right up your alley.
I also am glad to see that it looks like the action button on the lock down bar is going to be used frequently for mode advancement, etc. and can be earned through the stand up targets (which are always risk/reward, now there's a strong reason to go for those suckers more so than just the main shots) and not a random award from somewhere else in the game. The shot multipliers are a nice touch even if it's just a rehash of previous concepts - looking forward to figuring out which multipliers are the preferred ones to light. As for how long this game will take to complete the software, seeing how the base structure is a near clone of Aerosmith, I wouldn't be surprised if GOTG feels very complete sooner than later.
The "hater" comes into play when the same individuals post repeatedly in threads all over pinside their toxic opinions and preach it as gospel. Having an opinion and clearly stating it and why is one thing, ramming it down everyone's throat over and over transitions from critic to obsession.
Quoted from Whysnow:
similar to people that start hype threads for games before they are announced and then go in every new thread to say how much they love the game, it is incredible, and GOAT; yet they have not even seen it in person let alone played it
Exactly. Repetition of any opinion is annoying. Some could argue the same about playfield layouts...
I never understood the fascination with spinners. The paddle spins, big deal. I'm more interested in making the shot than how many spinner hits I'm up to. Clearly, I'm not the norm on this, but I really don't care if they're on the game or not.
Does seem cheap though that they'd be on the Prem/LE and not the Pro. Maybe if enough people complain (and don't buy the Pro) STERN will add them.
Side note, maybe they can be added after the fact like MET (assuming the switch logic and code info is there on the Pro...).
I just played the heck out of a Aerosmith on location - - if GOTG rules is anything like Aerosmith it's going to be a lot of fun. One thing I really hope gets coded in is multiple skill shots. Aerosmith does a fabulous job of tying in 3 different skill shots based on where you're at with the game - trying to get the ball lock shot, or one of the orbits to advance a mode or advance your Elevator lock is well integrated. Hopefully GOTG can and will do something similar - - harder plunge for the left orbit, soft plunge for the right orbit, or something more advanced for the upper lanes. Even bringing in a super skill shot that means something by holding down the left flipper and sending the ball all the way around for a flipper skill shot would be welcome. I just hope it doesn't ship with a lame skill shot like Iron Man has (probably the biggest beef I have with that game is the skill shot is so weak it probably shouldn't be called a skill shot - even with the post turned off).
Quoted from PW79:
Aerosmith doesn’t have a skill shot
That’s just us pinheads pretending it does
Lol. Maybe not one that is called out on screen as a "skill shot," but it definitely has three shots that you need to use your skill in order to award a shot. Maybe that's part of why I think it's great. It's definitely more interesting than plunging a ball at full speed, watching it hit a post, and then having all the time in the world to change a lane to award some worthless points and see "skill shot" displayed on the screen.
Why is everyone so worked up about the songs and how many are in there? Most of those songs are probably going to get old and repetitive quickly anyway. And as we've already seen, not everybody is gonna be happy anyway. I'd rather worry about STERN focusing their efforts on making the gameplay as exciting as can be and let pinballbrowser do the rest. One or two key songs during the right events with great custom background music will tie well to the movies and do me just fine.
Quoted from J85M:
At current prices it shouldn’t be a case of pinball browser will do the rest or getting one (music) or the other (great gameplay/code) it should be coming as a complete package not just because of current pricing but to do this licence justice, unfortunately for Stern they have picked a popular licence that is built around its music as much as the music is built around the film it’s integral, why people keep giving Stern a pass is beyond me, I want Stern to produce the best damn pins they can and remind the competition who’s daddy!
It's not a matter of giving them a free pass, it's a matter of personal taste. Hearing "ch-ch-ch-ch-cherry bomb" 20X a day for the next few years sounds like hell to me. More than anything I'm trying to reiterate that not everyone wants the same thing and no matter what, STERN won't be able to make everyone happy.
Yay, we get to here "ch-ch-ch-ch-cherry bomb" over and over and over again every time we play a game. Augh. I guess maybe a handful of pinsiders will be happy about hearing that over and over again...
At least the original musical score sounds really nice and seems to be more predominant.
Quoted from flashinstinct:
Thanks for doing my idea dan
The tape player is about as obvious as adding a Millenium Falcon to Star Wars Pro and almost every modder out there was probably at least thinking about that since (or before) the announcement. Differentiate your mod by making it the best one out there, it looks like you already have a great attention to detail and can deliver what we all want. I know you make the best IM decals out there!
Quoted from Rarehero:
Every game you own has a limited amount of songs, usually with 15-20 second loops. Why do people only complain about repetition when it comes to licensed music? The music is from the movie, so it's thematically correct. If you like the movie, you theoretically like the songs, and their placement in the game only adds to the immersion factor.
As stated before, it's because some music is composed purposefully to be looped and sound good even after the 100th time. Licensed songs, regardless of which, get old faster. Besides, just because someone enjoys a movie (or anything for that matter) doesn't "theoretically" mean they enjoy every single aspect of it.
It is nice that is an option (huge high five to the geniuses that figured that out, my TWD thanks you), especially since there are no inserts or other art dedicated to the songs like on the traditional music themed pins.
Quoted from jar155:
It's legit copy and paste though. Rules are Aerosmith. Missions are songs, Upgrade is Crank it Up, the Hadron is the VIP, the multipliers, the multiballs, and the wizard mode are the same. I hope there's more coming.
Not to sound crass, but so what? I love the rules on Aerosmith but hate the band. I love the shots and feel of Metallica but hate the rules. GOTG looks to combine the two elements I like most in two different games for one super duper pinfest. It's tough to make something new and unique each time (especially at the risk of this hyper-sensitive and often insulting forum) that the gen pop will accept. Bring on GOTG!
Quoted from PW79:
So if it’s a copy/paste of Aerosmith it’s a copy/paste of KISS which means... the song selection bug will be on 3 games + there will be no programmed skill shot + the smart button won’t do shit + the wizard/mini-wizard modes will be nearly impossible & carry little scoring value?
We've already seen in the videos that it's not a direct copy/paste and probably could never be and still work. (Skill shot shown during GOTG gameplay) The baseline will probably be very similar but I'm sure there will be tons of differences and things that will still make GOTG code unique.
Quoted from waspinat0r:
Also, how do you start modes if you complete a mode during the ball? Scoop?
Edit: I'm kind of concerned about Groot's lower jaw...won't the ball pounding it scratch it/dent it/etc terribly almost immediately?
I always buy a back up for high wear parts like that and not worry about it. Then you can play the hell out of your game and know you can get it back to mint at any time.
So, after 50+ pages of posts, the general consensus from what I've read:
From those that have actually played GOTG in person: "This game is fantastic, the shots are smooth and fast, the sounds are great, it's a heck of a lot of fun, I can't wait to see where they take this game. I really liked playing it."
From those that watched pixels flicker on and off of a screen: "This game stinks! I'm mean, sure it has phenomenal art, a fantastic layout, fast shots, a drop target, a magnet(s), physical ball lock, real backglass (LE), and licensed songs we cried for, but what the hell, where are the callouts that we've been told are coming?"
The stream may have been a little underwhelming in the custom callout department and a lack of complete theme integration with lighting and video at this point, but I'm going to wait to reserve judgement until I play it first hand and get my own idea of the game and where it is going to go code wise.
Ps. Ch-ch-ch-ch-ch-cherry bomb. Augh.
Quoted from jgentry:
I think it's more disappointment that stern is shipping a game with something that resembles code in it. The game has a ton of potential so to ship it out in that state is extremely disappointing. It might be amazing in a few weeks but people are going to be skeptical since this looks like BM66 launch code and BM66 is just now starting to get good. The art, layout and toys look great.
Maybe I'm an optimist (or don't need absolute perfection in my code), but other than BM66, the pins I've seen STERN release in the last five or so years have all been finished pretty well IMO. I know some of them could use a little more polish (GB, GOT, KISS, etc.) but the level they are at is still fantastic and light years ahead of where "finished" pins in the 90's were. In a perfect world we'd love to see a complete game ship with 1.0 code with no bugs or tweaks, but that's not reality. Besides, even if it shipped with complete code, there'd still be people on pinside whining about needing more (case in point the damn cities on KISS - if they never had those in there in the first place people wouldn't even know they were "missing" something). As for BM66, my heart goes out to those owners, but lets be honest - the game was poorly received from the start, has low sales, and as a result is going to have low focus for a very long time. If you want to avoid being in this predicament again, watch to see which games sell well because that's where my guess is you'll see the most/best code updates.
Quoted from rubberducks:
That doesn't seem very representative of what we've seen so far.
From the mouth of the first and only GotG owner to post about his (delivered) machine on Pinside, in this very thread:
Also, you don't need to play it to see that the audio, LCD and code are all in a terrible state.
I guess code may some day be acceptable, and audio almost certainly will be.
But the LCD? I really, really doubt it. It looks absolutely horrendous. Not just sins of omission. Terrible, flagellation worthy sins of commission.
IMO, this is a game that beyond the initial sales rush, its initial reputation and the cadence of Stern's subsequent releases will completely bury it.
I said general consensus, not cherry pick one or two quotes. Besides, it was more of a general thought of those that have played versus those that have just watched someone play.
Anyone else notice the cool magnet effects? One thing that struck me as a really good/cool thing was the ball eject from Groot's mouth - it was nice to see the magnet pull them over to the left slightly and create some more randomness at the get go and not just 3 or 4 balls going SDTM. Can anyone who's played both the pro and premium comment on how well 1 magnet versus 3 plays?
Quoted from epthegeek:
I think Stern's problem with the LCDs is they really aren't using them very well. The displays just aren't that well designed. The stuff JJP does with the display is gorgeous. Stern's attempts so far are ... not. I'm no graphic designer, so I can't really speak to what they should do different -- just as an end user, what they've done so far is ... meh. If they were amazing, I think you'd have less of a 'I miss the DMD' feeling.
That's interesting - I agree and disagree at the same time if that's possible?? I agree JJP's displays look fantastic and they seem to be really well integrated but for the life of me I have a hard time really seeing the content that I want to see. STERN's displays seem very generic so far and I agree definitely lack the "wow" factor in presentation, however I fully believe the important information and content right now on STERN's displays is much easier to read at a quick glance. Not sure if you can have a happy medium between the two because they seem a little bit mutually exclusive. I guess time will tell as both JJP and STERN advance their understanding of their own displays and leverage feedback from players/customers.
Full disclosure - I have a GOTG Pro on order. Hopefully that doesn't bias this info too much...
Played GOTG on location yesterday. The game has a substantial amount of "play" code in it already with all eight of the main modes, both multiballs, a super skill shot, the hadron enforcer, shot and bonus multipliers, upgrades, mystery, outlane saves, etc. All outward appearances indicated to me that it shipped with a similar level of code as Aerosmith. The rules themselves are strikingly familiar with Aerosmith with many of the modes having similarities: groot MB ~ toy-box MB, orb MB ~ elevator MB, looks to be two wizard modes - 1 for playing all the modes and MBs, and 1 for completing them like Aerosmith, the two targets by Groot (I believe) light the right outlane ball save like the two on Aero, play three modes lights an extra ball, scoop shot for mode selection - mode selection available on plunge sometimes as well. The hadron enforcer targets are well implemented - it's nice to be able to go for a risky shot like those stand up targets knowing that the payoff is being able to hit the action button for a needed mode/MB shot. I paid particular attention to the ramps and rejects - the few times the ball didn't make it all the way around it came back to a flipper or was salvageable. From a geometry perspective, I don't think these are necessarily rejects as in the ball is banging back and forth and losing momentum, it's just that the ramps are really, really high off the playfield (maybe twice as high as many others) and you just gotta hit them clean. The single magnet effect was really fun and implemented well. Mechanically the game didn't have any issues other than really hard hits to the orb shot sometimes would not register quick enough and the drop target wouldn't come up in time. I didn't have any SDTM balls that couldn't be saved like some of the scoop shots from some Star Wars Pros I've played on route, or some of the kick outs on GB prior to the ball save code. It was really fun to shoot and from a player's perspective there is plenty in this game right now to keep it going. Oh, the artwork - yup, it's fabulous. Colors are crisp and vibrant. Franchi did a great job of painting the characters photo-realistic but still with his own style. The graphic layout was well done and the integration of the ball save lights in Star Lord's eyes is just so well done.
With that said, the game still needs a lot of work in the audio and video department as others have been keen to point out. I did really enjoy many of the video clips and some I thought were really well integrated - the extra ball vid for instance where he almost drops the orb made me chuckle, and the ball save, etc. There's quite a few in there that are well done, others need some refinement and a sense of continuity. Hopefully the mode code gets another few passes too - "Sibling Rivalry" especially I think could benefit from a few adjustments - based on the name of the mode you would think it would be a battle between Nebula and Gamora and the shots should relate better. I'd love it if they made Groot MB an option to pass or extend like in toy-box MB as well (seeing how so much else is copied over, why not copy over that great idea). Points in the game are extremely unbalanced right now as well - Groot MB all day long. 40 - 60 million on that MB versus a couple million here and there in the main modes. As I said in other posts, pinside needs to be careful what they wish for - - personally, I like the song "Cherry Bomb" and "Hooked on a Feeling" but wow, do they get played on this pin. I heard those songs for 3 hours straight playing in all parts of the bar on other games. I'm just glad there is pinball browser because those are probably going to need a tune up after a few weeks - unless of course somehow they get integrated better or someway STERN gets licenses to 5 other songs and can play them at random during those times.
In any case, I'm very excited for my game and despite what others have said, I don't mind getting to explore and know my game on early code and relish the updates as they come. You could say I'm part of the problem, but honestly I had a lot of fun playing GOTG as is. With a title this popular and a license that I'm sure was expensive, I would hope STERN can't drop the ball on this and will polish it all up nicely. And yes, if you already own Metallica and Aerosmith, you may get bored with this game sooner than later. I don't own those games so it's a win for me.
Quoted from Whysnow:
I agree that I am very skeptical of putitng GOTG out in this current state. As you noted, many players will try 2 games on it, find the code lacking and buggy, and never return (even when the code gets polished in the future).
Time will tell on GOTG but I don't know that that will be an issue - last night I watched people of all skill levels play GOTG at Tilt in Minneapolis and they kept playing it over and over and over.
Quoted from Whysnow:
Everyone comes and plays the first month
I hope you are right as margins are razor thin on the current pricing model of Stern. Would be nice to see another title out of them that earns well and keeps getting played over the longer run.
Believe me, I hope I'm right too! If Aerosmith is still doing well on location my gut tells me GOTG will do as good or better. In any case I'd keep playing it on location as is (in fact I'm going to a different spot for lunch to check one out).
I can feel your frustration though - when Star Wars first launched I quit playing it on location pretty quick - too many cheap drains out of the scoop on too many different SW pins. Even the SWLE had so many cheap drains with the flipper bug where they'd go dead during the Death Star mode release or the right escape not working. I haven't seen any of these (yet) on GOTG after about 20 games or so.
Honestly, I'd be more worried about store owners turning the game off because they're sick and tired of hearing those same two songs repeatedly.
Quoted from hank527:
WTF dude! Nothing like Aerosmith as that was almost complete. GOTG code is barely playable. It flat out sucks and should have been delayed a bit. A C really? It's an F. Code is so pathetic it's inexcusable. Most people are saying this is why Stern should release two new titles per year. They cannot keep up like this GOTG as is is horrible. If you love it, I'll sell you mind at 5200.00 which is a 200 loss or about $20 per game. I've played less than 10 games, maybe 9 and think the code is really terrible.
Anyone thinking about this pin should buy something else like BM66 which is finally really fun. GOTG is months away from resembling fun. It's unfinished garbage code is laughable.
Anyone reading this has been warned as the game is really unplayable as is.
Care to share what version code your game got shipped with? Maybe its v0.000001 and it really is as terrible as you say it is.
As for speaking the "truth" your comments lack any specific info on why you don't like it and at this point sounds more like gutteral rhetoric.
Games I've played were v0.66 and as mentioned before from shots and mode point of view has a lot there at release (Besides the obvious of call outs, video, etc.) It's not subjective - anyone on v0.66 can list in detail all the code present. Even little nuances like using the action button are programmed - i.e. do i use it right away? Hold it for MB? Hit it at the beginning of mode start so i can go to the scoop for upgrade/crank it up? Do i go for a mode shot or try to light my action button, etc?
Everyone is entitle to get pissed off, whatever, but lets keep some facts straight and maybe point out some specifics instead of just rehashing "sucks" over and over again. Your posts make it sound like the game barely functions.
Please keep in mind also, Im not saying I love the game, I'm not saying I hate it. I'm just trying to post objective information.
Quoted from hank527:
Sure mine has v 0.65 and I do not deserve such an awesome game. I have no qualms about my Lonnie on code bias as I've gotten rid of most of his games. Avengers Hulk will be next. I just put a cliffy on GOTG today. I currently do not like the game as is. I once had a Firepower where the sound didn't work and until it got fixed I wasn't loving it. Now I tell people Firepower is awesome.
ASOA, you are something to behold. I think I'm just going to ignore your posts as you bring nothing to the table.
I have bought every Stern game since Tron NIB. Even WWELE which I did not love either. It was a mess. Right now GOTG is a mess. It's worse than Xmen upon release. I tell it how it pretty much is. Not a fanboy, but I admit I'm biased towards disliking Lonnie coded games. I still have some, but they will not last.
If you want it, come with 5200 cash. P.M. me as I'm ignoring your future posts.
Thanks for the context. Knowing you don't like Lonnie games and that Firepower went from zero to hero with just fixing the audio says a lot. No surprise that you don't like GOTG.
Based on the streams' obvious lack of audio clips and the fact that it IS lonnie code I can't believe you bought one in the first place.
Ps. Doubt it will change your mind, but I've heard v0.66 has quite a bit more effects and "immersion" than v0.65. (Not that you can get it though!) What I do think is BS is that they shipped some games with v0.66 code and some with less and don't have v0.66 available for download. That sucks.
Lol, besides, what would STERN say?? "Sorry we launched a game with zero call outs and videos that act more as placeholders, we hoped you wouldn't notice."
So... if my friend's game has v0.65, my game has v0.66, how can v0.72 be the "initial release?" I guess it truly was beta code...
Quoted from Azmodeus:
I never have embraced the mod thing. But I understand it now from a players perspective, I think.
I still think the game should be complete from the manufacturer. In all ways. When sold as new.
On the other hand I began to understand why others like mods. Not myself. No problem.
It's a part of pinball now. For sure.
But again completion from the manufacturer. That's what I like/ want.
I don't want to derail this thread too much more, but "completion" is all in the eye of the beholder. Many classic games that most everyone thinks were complete and packed with toys and features like Twilight Zone still have handfuls of very tasteful and well implemented mods (gumball machine marbles, etc.). The manufacturers could load the hell out of almost every game and everyone would think it was great and tasteful but at some point they need to say enough is enough and keep their bottom line at a point where they are staying in business. You could argue STERN could be adding some more to their games, but that's all speculation unless someone has seen their books.
Got to play an LE on location today. Seems the Pro has a lot of advantages... Not really sure why they put spinners in there if they are almost completely covered by the groot arms. Also baffles me that they wouldn't have moved the arms back just the slightest bit so as not to obscure the inserts identifying which shots were lit and which ones were not. If you think the left outlane is hard to see as is, just try and see if the left orbit insert is on or off. didn't notice any difference in magnet effect either in a few dozen plays with many orb shots and mb's.
Quoted from jmountjoy111:
I think there is a ton of hope for GOTG. The more I play it the more I like it. The shots are tight but completing the modes is challenging. The code is still in work and the voice overs aren’t great but I think each code update has improved it greatly. The game is beautiful!
Honestly my only complaint is that John C. Reilly is not featured in the game.
^^^^^ This. He would be perfect to add the call outs - - he's sort of a minor character in the show which would make it work better to have him do the call outs in general, he has a unique voice that people identify with, and quite frankly his tone and the way he delivers lines has a knack for being funny. This would have been great.
Quoted from rotordave:
I would agree. They have used basically the Aerosmith software, but the shots are way tighter on GOTG.
They really need to tweak the modes to make them “achievable” and award good points ... or else why play them? Just play “groot all day”. Groot gives mega points, which makes playing the modes a waste of time.
The rules need to be balanced, to match the games layout.
With Aerosmith, I think it is pretty balanced ... you don’t see players playing “toybox all day” as much. The modes are completable, and doing so awards good points from super ramps etc.
Balancing GOTG will make it a much better game.
Agree 100%. Although there can be TONS of points in the modes if you can just combo the crap out of your shots. unfortunately the shots are really damn tough which makes those combos tough to do and ultimately results in less points. Maybe they need to increase them even more - more points for regular mode shots and super points for combos.
The other key differentiator from AS to GOTG on Toy Box MB vs Groot MB is the risk of the shot - - most people don't hammer away at Toy Box all day long because it's risky - the magnet throwing the ball down the drain follow up with that super tough shot to load the ball. Groot is the easiest shot on GOTG, can be hit from either flipper and has the lowest risk of about any shot I've seen in pinball as of late (slow coming back and LOTS of time to react due to how far the shot is). Groot MB needs more than just balanced scoring to overcome the easy nature of starting it...
Quoted from mummite:
This is a must and should be the default settings.
I wonder how many people actually feel that way. I personally like being able to select my mode and start it off of the plunge. I don't recall this being complained heavily about in Aerosmith, KISS, AC/DC, Star Trek, Mustang, etc. all of which allow mode start right off of the plunge and yet GOTG is getting all this animosity?
In fact, requiring you to do too much to start a mode has historically more often been ripped apart by pinside and it's apparent effect on the play style feeling like chopping wood, i.e. Transformers, Xmen, Spider-Man, etc.
I guess it's at least nice to have the option and customize the game to your own liking...
Quoted from bobukcat:
My guess is that the better player you are the more you want the mode start disabled, casual players will struggle to get a mode started and many wouldn't even figure out how they are supposed to start one.
Personally I think it more relates to what else there is to do in the game - -games like TSPP, LOTR, GOT, etc. you have to build up and earn that mode start but there's lots of other things to do along the way like building playfield multipliers, shot multipliers, getting multiballs set-up, etc. GOTG just doesnt fell like it has many options during non-mode gameplay (rocket 2X scoring, shot multipliers, and the 2 MBs) as compared to many other modern pins .
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