Out of curiosity, when was the last time they actually released a game with complete code (not counting minor updates)?

Gary always said "We're not in the games business, we're in the manufacturing business"...however, they were delivering good games, complete & fun experiences. However, over the past few years, Gary's mantra has finally come true - Stern has proven without a doubt that they're not in the games business. Creativity and fun aren't at the core of their goals. They're 100% a marketing and manufacturing business. If a good & fun game actually comes out of that factory, it's a fluke at this point.

This is a smart business decision. Wait for the code.

Is it? Do average location players even care? I would think the 'strike with what's new and hot' would work better - regardless of finish details. Sure, repeat regular customers might be disappointed by it, but on a route operation how much of that is really where the money is versus "OOOH GUARDIANS (puts money in)"

Seems a tad melodramatic. Whatever Gary's goals may be, I doubt that the many experienced hands Stern has making machines have given up on "creativity" and "fun." And I'd have a hard time taking much seriously from anyone that thinks none of Stern's games made in the past few years have offered "fun experiences."

I need to get ahold of Lonnie and let him know I'll be his code guinea pig. :>

good question...

I remember GB as being the best in the past few, before that SMVE (does that count since just a vault with minor tweaks?), before that probably mustang, before that MET.

Basically 1 out of every 3 or 4 is what I would consider feature complete 'enough' to be ok at release. I may not be remembering 100%, but those strike me as the best out the door.

Reality is NONE of them are even remotely close to the release code for DI or TNA.

In my opinion only, I think you need the best initial wow factor on the 1st play in order for additional coins to be dropped. My 16 old son and other friends of mine immediately walk away from a pin after the 1st game if there isn't that wow factor. Why not wait and make it a bit better? Glass is half empty or half full. Make as much $ up front or hope to make more money in the long run waiting. Not sure. Don't own a route. Don't really care. Just making a comment.

Come on.

Hes right

It all depends on what you're comparing Stern to. I wouldn't disagree with what you're saying. But, I'm also not 100% convinced that a passion for pinball is what's driving Stern. They definitely have a passion for manufacturing pinball... but I'm not always so sure they have a passion for the game as a driving force.

Lol, so because you didn't like how SW turned out you are going to not buy another NIB? Not because of code, QC, secondary market price drops, NIB price increases, spike concerns, etc, but because they didn't do your dream theme how you wanted.

Aerosmith was pretty close. I couldn't tell a difference from ship date to the current release, 1.03.

Everyone making the games are trying, but they do not have the time or resources needed to complete their jobs before the shipping deadline hits. That shipping deadline is more important than testing, finishing, and refining a game.

Don't take me seriously. My experience and time in this hobby speaks for itself. I don't need your validation. In MY OPINION, their last phenomenal game was Metallica. I'll throw Walking Dead in there as a good one - I'm not a fan of it, but I know it's good. Everything since then has been mediocre to horrible...and have continued the trend of incomplete and untested upon shipping.

Yes!

Metallica is one game I wish I had've owned by now. I feel like I would've kept it. Maybe even Kiss.

That. Opposing forces.

What's amazing is that games are being shipped with .65 code..? If the code is almost a copy of AS and the layout a mash of IM and MET then 80% of the work is already done before they even start. I dunno, I like Borg and I think his talent is being wasted at Stern.

if the code was any good we would be talking gameplay and not having these code bad/good/incomplete discussions.

bottom line stern is selling you a cab and you are going to have to wait for code.
so wrong in so many ways.

lol, do you really believe that? I'm curious if you still have that GotG you opened yesterday?

It's got lights in it too! Don't mislead people now.

Yes and yes.

Besides, I've only gotten two offers on my GotG so far, neither of which interested me.

Layout is great (it’s MET 2.0), art is pretty damn good, sound/music and code are lacking. Two out of four isn’t bad.

Seriously, the layout is a proven winner and the theme rocks. If Lyman was on this it would be a winner in a year or so. With Lonnie, expect Aerosmith rules on this game. If that’s enough for you AND you don’t have MET or AS already it might be a winner for you. I don’t have MET or AS yet...so if this is close to MET in quality when the code is done I might go for one. It’s a much better theme than MET for me.

But then I think, why risk a SPIKE system when I can get MET on a SAM system?

Ah, even if you get a good offer you should still hold on to it....at least until you put some time into it with good code.

I know a guy who is straight up trading his NIB GOTG for a S-M Vault with colorDMD and mods. Smart move, since he can always go back and get another GOTG when the game is more fleshed out.

Is Met still being made or is Stern done with them?

I'd do the same thing tbh, SM Vault is another dream theme of mine.

So, there are two COMPLETE games you like...why did you get GOTG instead of Spidey or Met?

Cause both of them were more expensive than GOTG.

(Well, Metallica probably isn't, but I can always easily get a Met out of GotG in the future)

LOL

Hey, I said the future!
Tomorrow is a new day!

I'm one that buys to keep so I'm fascinated at how quickly you go through games. Your For Sale/Trade and Wanted threads are quickly becoming classics around here.

To say I had a few fun talks at GOGX with some pinsiders would be a huge understatement. By and large you guys are awesome!

Well I guess that old saying rings true, 2 dickheads are better than 1. Thank #2

Aerosmith was the last one that shipped with 1.00 or greater. BM'66, Star Wars, GotG all shipped with much less than 1.00, and Batman'66 shipped as little more than a box of lights. ALL the Sterns that shipped with less than 1.00 at launch happened in the last 12 months. Before that it was pretty much unheard of in modern Stern history.

They re-upped the license a while ago, so probably still making them as needed.

SW was great right out of the box and is quite complete a few months later. GOTG could all of sudden get a major update by the end of the month and everyone bitching will look like fools but that's the norm on this site especially with regards to Stern, wait a year if you want a complete game but if someone wants to buy now then good for them, the only stupid thing is to buy a NIB Stern and expect final code, doesn't happen.

is TWD license still active?

Remember CGC as well. Old BWs go very well with late model Sterns and they compliment each other giving you a nice all round collection.

No idea on that one.

thanks. I had heard from a typically reliable source that TWD vault was coming where they will have the PRO model with walker bombs, spinner, and extra magnet. I was told the only thing holding it up was that Lyamn is still busy on other titles with code.

If true, it would be enough for me to likely by a TWDve for home finally.

Meh. I played the pro and wouldn't call it great. Huge missed opportunity.

This isn't happening anytime soon. There are a huge amount of design issues evident in the way GotG works now. There is a LOT of work to make something cohesive out of the mess they're shipping currently.

Not even wait a year for a complete game. Wait a 6-18 months for a non-beta 1.00 version that Sterns USED to ship with as recently as a year ago. That is a change for the MUCH WORSE with Stern in the past year. They're now unapologetically shipping alpha and beta-stage games that stay that way for up to a YEAR or MORE. This isn't even about complete games, or extra modes, they don't ship feature complete games anymore.

AP's Houdini look's pretty hot, too. But yeah, if everyone took a break from Stern NIB for a year or two, there might be some awareness in Stern management that no, Gary can't sell boxes of lights like he says he can.

BTW, hilarious that you downvoted a post with nothing but facts about Stern's shipping version numbers in it.

Those are very much on the radar as well. There's quite a few BW games I would love to add to the collection one day. For now, JJPOTC is next in line though.

I wonder what the price point would be on that though. Somewhere in between a Pro and Premium?

I am sure that you are going to love it! It is no secret that I am a fan of CGC. We will add a JJP to our line up one day soon as well.

Why would they do this? They could just make more premiums. Doesn't make any sense.

Not sure why we're piling on. If ASOA is/is not actually thinking of buying 10 machines and is/isn't a large operator, I don't know and don't really care. There are plenty of folks on here that are either actually rich and occasionally come across as rubbing it in peoples faces or are just faking it. Wouldn't be the first time these things occur on the internet. I really only care in those situations where someone may be trying to commit fraud via falsehoods posted in the forum.

.83 code now on BM66. Its becoming a phenomenal “fluke” thanks to Lyman of course

ASLE is a damn good “fluke” too

Another typical dopey ass statement from the “pin whisperer” RH

BM66 will be as good or better than TWD. Yep, heard it here first. And I’ve played as much TWD as anyone

TWD has already been made using Spike technology. Stern spent a fortune developing Spike and have publicly said many times that they can produce old titles with Spike. Plenty of customers still around that would buy TWD VE. It is an awesome game for the home collection.

I haven't heard them say that? George Gomez has definitely stated that any remakes, reruns, whatever you call them will use the same boardset as originally supplied. Maybe TWD:VE would be an exception because they have made one with Spike tech?