(Topic ID: 169611)

Gtlb Spirit of 76 Startup problem

By bobnatlanta

7 years ago


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IMG_1590 (resized).JPG
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player unit above (resized).JPG
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#1 7 years ago

Here's what I got - zero position switch on the credit unit is closed, so I should be good to go there, and the replay switch is clean. All fuses have been tested out of circuit and are good. Power on, U relay actuates. Press the replay button, nothing happens. If I manually actuate the S relay, Ax pulls in, player unit goes thru it's reset, and any score that I've manually put on the reels resets to zero, the game shows player 1 up, ball in play 3 is lit (weird,) and the Ax releases. And nothing else. There is no apparent power to the playfield. A couple of features will score/chime, but no lights, and no coils fire, no other relays actuate.
I've been working on everything I can see in the circuit between the replay button and the S relay - Cleaned the switches at motor 2B and 1C, and adjusted a 1C switch that was not making, cleaned NC switches on Ax and W relays - so far with no discernible change. Am I missing something obvious or anyone have any other thoughts?

Thanks!!

#3 7 years ago

Progress! After another round of cleaning, including the coin unit switch, still no joy. I determined it was time to pull the pan out and do some serious cleaning, so I started to pull out the playfield, and noted the larger of the PF connectors slipped out way too easily. Hmmm...snugged up the female connectors and plugged it back in. Replay button still doesn't start a game, BUT, actuating S manually now illuminates the playfield AND completely resets the game. Outhole coil doesn't fire, but many of the targets chime and score as they should. One of the chime coils locks on, so I've got to find a sticking switch somewhere. I'm thinking my earlier instinct was a good one. I'll report back after everything has been properly cleaned.
One more thing, the first time the PF reset, almost all of the inserts that hadn't already come out, went flying.

1 week later
#4 7 years ago

Hmmm....Pulled the pan today and gave everything a nice cleaning, including a shine on the male jones plugs. The game is still not right. The behavior is still pretty much what I described above. The replay button does nothing. If I activate the start relay, any score I put on any of the four player reels will reset, but the the outhole coil does not fire. If I activate the outhole relay, the coil fires. Manually activating the 10s relay, it chimes, but does not score. If I activate the 100 or 1000 relay, it locks on. Once I force the reset, the score motor does not turn when any playfield switches are activated. Any thoughts on this appreciated!!

#5 7 years ago

Well...this is different. In testing the score reels I'd put scores on some random reels. This time around, I put a score on every reel, and the game refused to reset. So...yeah...score reel switches. And I feel like an idiot...

1 week later
#6 7 years ago

OK, guys, I need some guidance here. I've cleaned everything in the startup sequence again - S, V, U, R, Ax relays, all motor switches, coin unit, and player unit. Everything appears to be adjusted properly. Score reels all cleaned and adjusted. Absolutely no change. The replay button does nothing, if I manually activate the S relay, the score reels reset, but the outhole coil does not fire. Don't know what to try next. Thanks for any tips on next steps!

#8 7 years ago

Thanks - all of these contacts are good. It's the front end of the reset that isn't happening. Something in the V or S circuit...

#10 7 years ago

Thanks, Rolf! This is a slightly different reset sequence than the one I've been working from. First - this says (as does mine) that the Start or S relay pulls in from it's own switch and a motor 2B switch. I don't understand this, as all of the S relay switches appear to be normally open. If its pulling in from it's own switch, wouldn't one of them have to be normally closed? And, If I manually actuate S, the score reels do reset, Ax and Bx release, and the game shows player 1, Ball 1 on the BG. Looks like it might get stuck on step 6 - the U relay is energized, O and R are not. This is the position of the player unit when it stops stepping:

player unit 1 (resized).JPGplayer unit 1 (resized).JPG

player unit above (resized).JPGplayer unit above (resized).JPG

#11 7 years ago

OK, I answered my own question about the S relay and the normally open switch. Most (all?) relays have a wire going to a a switch lug that is also connected directly to coil power. Otherwise, how would a relay with all normally open switches ever get power...? See...I CAN be taught...This nugget of knowledge will go a long way, I think, toward making me better at interpreting schematics. And please, somebody tell me if I'm wrong before I blow something up.

#13 7 years ago

No luck. Actuating the S relay does not cause the R to pull in. Actuating S, then forcing the Hold relay closed doesn't complete the reset either. Hold is not getting power at all, and releases as soon as I let go.

#15 7 years ago

Thanks, Rolf - I'm traveling for work, so it will be Friday or Saturday before I can look at this again

#16 7 years ago

When I force the reset, the player unit is in the zero position, BG shows Ball 1, Player 1 lit. R Relay does not ever pull in, and will not hold when I actuate it, obviously it's getting no power during this procedure. Black cam tooth is in the up position, as shown below.

I'm going to dig out my DMM again, and test the coil on the R Relay. No discoloration that I recall, but you never know. Any other thoughts appreciated!!

IMG_1590 (resized).JPGIMG_1590 (resized).JPG

1 week later
#18 7 years ago

Yes, with the R relay jumpered to the 25 v line, R pulls in and stays engaged when I power on.

#20 7 years ago

Quick review - if I attempt to start a game, nothing happens. If I actuate the S relay, the score reels reset, player unit advances to home position, ball1, player 1 both lit, but the ball is not served, and the R relay never pulls in and will not hold.

With the R relay jumpered, it pulls in and holds, as soon as I power on, but I still cannot start a game normally. If I actuate the S relay with R jumprered, the playfield resets, Ax pulls in, but score reels do not reset, and score motor runs continuously.

So, it appears that with R jumpered, the reset sequence stops somewhere on step 4 or 5.

Thanks!!

#23 7 years ago

Thanks, gents. I'm traveling again, so it will be about ten days before I get a chance to test anything.

Cheers!
Bob

1 week later
#24 7 years ago

OK, once again, here we are: game will not start bia the replay button.
If I manually activate the S relay, the game resets properly, but the R Relay will not pull in or hold.

With R jumpered, the U Relay pulls in and stays pulled in. Q Relay does not pull in, but will hold if manually activated.

1 week later
#26 7 years ago

I haven't started the next round of testing, but forgot tomention earlier - the coin mechs are missing, and activating the coin switches does nothing.

#28 7 years ago

Well...something has changed. With this latest configuration of jumpers, the replay button resets the game, but the score motor runs continuously. The Hold relay is still not pulling in. I think I'm going to pull the pan and go over my switches again.

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