(Topic ID: 239350)

Wonka is Coming !!! Who’s in?


By Beez

4 months ago



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  • 383 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 days ago by smalltownguy2
  • Topic is favorited by 69 Pinsiders

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#1431 3 months ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

It's possible that Wonka was purposely scaled back a bit in terms of mechanical features due to JJP wanting a more reliable on location pin?

Yes, it appears to be scaled back in many areas, over the last standard body made. Mechanical features is what we’re all looking for in a new machine. The way Bally/Williams did it. The way WOZ did it. Today’s company is charging us big money, but don’t want the hassle of mechs that don’t work well. Just charge us less for less being sold and we’ll all be happy.

-1
#1461 3 months ago
Quoted from Guinnesstime:

Less on the playfield than DI

Great, now JJP is charging us $500 more for less on the game. How can that be “in a good way”? That was part of the attraction of their first standard body table, lots of things to do on the play field.

-10
#1532 3 months ago

Can’t believe many always making excuses for JJP flipper strength. Their flipppers are weak no matter which game you play and when. Every JJP game of all my friends have the same issue: weak flippers. It is the inherit design of JJP flippers. It appears they don’t want things to get bashed and broken on their tables, which is understandable, but makes for a less fun pinball experience. Play a JJP table anywhere and you’ll soon realize it is a universal JJP issue.

-3
#1534 3 months ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

My JJP flippers aren’t weak, nor have any other JJP games I’ve played at various places.

After seeing many of your post in this thread, I wouldn’t expect you to say anything else. Do you own stock or something?

#1536 3 months ago
Quoted from PinDoctor82:

I got more games in on Wonka today as I caught it at times where the lines were somehow short. I played it enough to come to the conclusion that as of now, I'm not going to be getting one.

Thanks for the honest review. Haven’t played it yet myself, but worried too, that it is missing something(s). Compared to DI standard body it appears to be missing quite a bit. POTC also has way more in it.

#1540 3 months ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

Not doubting your evaluation of JJP but I suspect as the feedback from f3honda4me might be a bit more correct as he actually owns all the JJP games? Could be you are playing at locations not correctly setup or beat down but I own most all JJP titles and I have never had a flipper issue? Other titles not always the case...

Thanks for the heads up. Maybe the places I’m playing are problematic for whatever reason. Flippers at those places just not as strong as Sterns or CGC.

#1541 3 months ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

Because I talk about pins I like? Just like everyone else here? I like sterns and CGC and spooky too, I better be careful I don’t say good things about those too!

Lol, that’s a point.

#1544 3 months ago
Quoted from bigd1979:

Its totally fine and stuff on the playfield don't always equate to fun factor (look at sterns) . The four flippers with multiple shots from each one is what's awesome(with great flow). Throw in 2 physical ball locks, lots of magnets , 3 ramps, some diverters, captive ball and all the shots and its dam fun imo. I think once the code is matured and your able to play in a controlled setting with full sound/music, video and full rgb lighting with tons of inserts its really gonna be something special for most people. I love and have owned most jjp pins and this one brings it all together imo .

Hope you’re right. I am a big Pat Lawlor fan. Will reserve my opinion until I play it, but it’s interesting to see what all the rest of you think.

#1563 3 months ago
Quoted from trilamb:

no no, I get how it works. Just don't really get why it's worth an extra 2k. The fact that it was at a show and hundreds of people played it and 3 balls were locked in an entire day makes it sound pretty rare and useless.

Have to agree with you buddy. There’s not an extra $2k of fun there or can’t see any justification for spending $2k more. Surely when one resells their WWLE potential buyers won’t see it either. That $2k gap is wide on reseller market and potential buyers will pound you over it. A few extra decals of artwork doesn’t do it either, imo.

#1567 3 months ago
Quoted from Aurich:

This multiball is sounding pretty dumb to be honest. It's so hard to get that the only way people will see it is with lock stealing across multiple players or games? That's a feature that's fun for simple games, and doesn't really belong on complicated ones.
I have a TNA with lock stealing, I've owned EATPM that had lock stealing, but those are really basic multiballs that present a simple risk/reward strategy for ball locking. Do you lock because you're likely to get the multiball yourself? Or skip it because you're afraid you'll drain before you start it?
If Wonka is so hard that it takes multiple games before people are seeing the multiball then that's just a terrible design. I have to think people are exaggerating about it, because otherwise that hilariously bad. Especially if they're tying one of the 'expensive' toys to it.

Another well stated opinion that has me rethinking an LE purchase. Proves even more that $2k extra for what appears to be an almost worthless ball lock is not worth a whopping $9.5k. Think the $7.5k might be better (although still seems high compared to a Stern Pro, which is even $2k again less?). Just add a couple of GW stickers to the side if desired and a save $2k and buy PDI glass which is better anyway, imo.

-9
#1576 3 months ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

I’ll stick with the LE. Saw wonkavator multiball in person at MGC and it was great. The ball lock mech is cool and the wonkavator mod from mod couple makes it even better. I also want the shaker, invisiglass (which has been just as good as my PDI glass), powder coated rails, lockdown, legs, and wireforms, external volume control, and I like Gene on the artwork.

Lol, there you are cheer leading again. You’ve got to be in JJP sales department if your not a stock holder. Lol

#1577 3 months ago
Quoted from romulusx:

Quite a few extra[quoted image]

Glad to see this, thanks. Proof there’s not an extra $2,000.00 there in my opinion. Signed cards, numbered plate, couple more decals, invisiglass, some extra paint, a ball lock, is this stuff worth an extra $2,000.00? All pretty much fluff, wow, again thanks for sharing. Invisiglass is only item there that cost anything (probably for JJP $150 or less in volume). SE or nothing it seems, after reading all these posts or a Stern pro and save $2k, lol.

-2
#1579 3 months ago
Quoted from DeeGor:

Contain your excitement f3honda4me. Pinside isn't for pinball fans. It's for bitter people who like to complain about everything.

Not bitter or complaining at all, just trying to figure out like everyone else what to buy and what has value. That’s it. Thought that is what these forum discussions were all about? This isn’t an owners club thread right?

#1581 3 months ago
Quoted from romulusx:

I suggest you get a Stern pro

Thanks for the suggestion, but do like the Willy Wonka movie and what Pats done on the layout. Just trying to justify the much higher costs. I wonder, maybe because JJP volume buying is not as high as Stern’s, that’s why prices are so much higher than a Stern pro for a WWSE? Suppose when Stern buys 100,000 pieces of whatever, JJP probably buys 1000. Volume discounts have to be better, so that’s passed on to us the customer in lower MSRP, it appears from the two business models? Maybe that’s the $2k difference, I wonder?

#1582 3 months ago

Mod couple sure has some cool looking mods done already for WW.

#1584 3 months ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

Thanks so much for the kind words jimwe5t! I understand your justification concerns as all models are honestly great as long as the game play, fun, and code match the theme which I think it does really well! While we have made some strides putting our spin on things we are still finalizing a replacement to the margarine factory ball lock for all models. Just seems wrong to us for such a key spot on the playfield. Here are our current final sneak peak pics of the direction we Think a Wonka factory would look. Coming shortly....
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

That is a wow mod for sure! Great job!

#1587 3 months ago

Love your title of the JJP factory installed WW factory. It’s a crack up and looks just like my families “Land o Lakes” butter container here in Cali. Modcouple WW factory mod is so much better!

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-1
#1597 3 months ago
Quoted from LordHelmet:

It’s great to seek out others input/justification on which model to get but at the end of the day it’s your money and your expensive toy. We all go through this process. Even your current life situation plays a major factor so you just have to review the spec sheets and choose. As always, try playing it before you buy. Not trying to be mean but several of those posts have felt more like you are trying to sway others opinions rather than making your own. At any rate I’m sure you will make the best choice for yourself and I wish you luck.
Part of the fun is knowing you are fortunate enough to make this decision and you have several options to choose from.

Thanks, but I suppose whenever we offer an opinion it could be construed to be swaying others, but I don’t work for Stern, JJP, CGC, or any game company and could careless what you or anyone buys. (Unless I’m offered a commission and that’s another story, lol.)

-2
#1606 3 months ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

You say this, but your actions are the opposite. Any time I state a positive opinion that is on topic and relative to the current conversation, you selectively jump all over me for some reason. This implies you care a great deal about what others say, do, or buy. When I say anything negative about a game, like when I said I was disappointed in the lack of innovation Wonka had compared to Dialed In, you seem to ignore that though.

Sounds confusing I guess, but I enjoy reading your posts and opinions. Thank you.

#1608 3 months ago
Quoted from EagleEd7:

DISAPOINTED!!! I seen and played several times the new Wonka and I wanted to like it and add it to my collect. But I was badly disappointed. It does no live up to the JJ machines of the past. I expected so much more in the modeling of items on the play field like OZ. They had so much they could have used from the movie. But they cheaped out. So sad for a great title. I guess I will have to wait till something more worthy comes along to add to my collection. So sad!

Thank you for your honest review. Means a lot from a person that’s been able to play the table. We are all trying to see if this is worthy of over $10,000.00 by the time delivery and sales tax is added.

#1609 3 months ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

I'm guessing your just not a Packers fan! lol Everyones view and opinion matters and is worth sharing.

LA Chargers/Rams fan all the way. The problem is, which LA team does one choose? (Lol) Although “selectively”, I’m an Aaron Rodgers fan too! (Lol) Can anyone throw the exciting game changing deep bomb like he does?

#1616 3 months ago
Quoted from romulusx:

What about the other 100 good reveiws of people that played Wonka.Do you appreciate their honest reviews?

Yes, of course.

#1618 3 months ago

I love who gives my family the best enjoyment and entertainment value for our hard earned money. And the greatest resale value if we get tired of it. Not a fanboy of any company. Just trying to see the value in WW and it’s getting more difficult to find, because of the very high costs compared to other companies offerings.

Saw the value in WOZ when it was $6,500, now the same table is being offered for $11.5k value to dollar ratio is not good at all at new high prices. WW is not even close to WOZRR in value for money ratio. Difficult to find in BK as well and did have money on an LE but cancelled for the time being till I can play it.

I fear what most should be very concerned about. Is JJP pricing themselves out of the market?

#1624 3 months ago
Quoted from JY64:

This was his first and only post tell me who did he jump on "DISAPOINTED!!! I seen and played several times the new Wonka and I wanted to like it and add it to my collect. But I was badly disappointed. It does no live up to the JJ machines of the past. I expected so much more in the modeling of items on the play field like OZ. They had so much they could have used from the movie. But they cheaped out. So sad for a great title. I guess I will have to wait till something more worthy comes along to add to my collection. So sad"

Agreed he didn’t jump on anyone. He gave us all an honest appraisal and something we should be thinking about before possibly blowing over $10 grand is what I’ve gotten from it. Not saying an SE is totally out yet, will still look into it. Value to dollar ratio is getting very hard to justify. It seems to appear that, JJP pricing for NIB might be way too high?

Like my new friend f3honda4me said, “I was disappointed in the lack of innovation Wonka had compared to Dialed In”. I would have to agree with him. My problem is, I like the movie and Pat’s work, so trying to justify it. But the more reviews that confirm my fears...

-2
#1642 3 months ago
Quoted from bigd1979:

I have a crazy idea... how about you play it and make your own decision. Not everyone likes the same stuff so basing your purchase power from others reviews isn't the answer. I know it sounds crazy but just wait to play it in a controlled environment and decide for yourself.

Have an even crazier idea...find a place that has one to play so I can play one? Lol, until then, have no other way to judge than others honest reviews that have already played WW. Fanboy reviews for the most part don’t offer much do they?

So as you put it, it would be a “crazy” idea to rely on a fanboy review. That’s why many are looking here, to find out from the non-fanboys if the game has innovation, uniqueness, fun toys that actually interact with the ball, won’t grow tiresome, etc. and plays well enough to plunge over $10k into it. This isn’t an owners thread right? No one has WW yet and probably won’t till fall or later, judging by JJPs past. If earlier, will be pleasantly surprised like everyone else. JJP is not like Stern, that announces and in short order delivers. Now that’s a crazy idea: keep to promised delivery schedule...

#1651 3 months ago
Quoted from arcadenerd925:

I have ignored 99% of the above (no offense), but since your in LA. There should be one local next week only in Van Nuys, see the CA for sale thread post here: https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/official-california-for-sale-club-and-wanted-too/page/158#post-4982884
Cheers

Thanks for the heads up! Will look forward to playing.

#1653 3 months ago
Quoted from romulusx:

Please,get back to us with your honest review.

Yes I will thanks. I’m really hoping to like it. It looks good on the SDTM film. Only issue I’ve ever really had with it is the pricing, other than being somewhat barren compared to the flagship WOZ or POTC and even DI like Matt said.

-4
#1682 3 months ago
Quoted from Breger1:

But a JJP is better in quality overall then stern.

Tell me how and in what way “But a JJP is better in quality overall then stern.”? Prove it please, because I’ve learned this is a fabricated falsehood, by fanboys. How is quality better on JJP? I’m open if you can prove it true. Please list all the reasons and backup your statement.

#1695 3 months ago
Quoted from mountaingamer:

= troll dupe acct

Lol, always using this old worn out name calling to put down people trying to figure out from a forum what is good or isn’t. Is it really necessary?

#1696 3 months ago
Quoted from Breger1:

Hey I own more sterns than JJP. In fact my favorite game is BM 66. But it’s not a secret JJP parts, build is better quality. But like Mercedes quality doesn’t mean things don’t break down. My boss had a Mercedes in the shop all the time. My Chrysler 5 years no major issues. Just stating quality and reliability within an individual entity/company should not be varied.

You keep saying this and still haven’t given any proof, only car analogies. Please give actual reasons of pinball build quality differences. Want to know what you’ve found?

#1702 3 months ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

Maybe go and play a JJP machine, especially the more recent releases like DI, JJPOTC and WONKA. The answer to this and many of the other questions you have been asking will be answered immediately when you do.

Have a friend that has Munsters sitting right next to a POTC. Played them both and see zero differences in build quality.

This is why I’m asking what are the differences, in case I missed something? Please list build quality differences for a comparison of those two tables, Stern and JJP. Have yet to have any solid proof from anyone here?

#1703 3 months ago
Quoted from mountaingamer:

Naa... I just call it like I see it - your pontificating and trolling the last week, but you also saw value in WOZ 5 years ago... whatever.

Do you feel good bashing and name calling others legitimate questions?

Yes, WOZ, when it sold for $6.5k, was a good value for a family’s hard earned money. See the value in that one and the very reason it has outsold all other JJP tables combined by far, as I’m learning here from others posts.

#1705 3 months ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

Cabinet wood is one of the most obvious. Leg bolt areas reinforced. You don’t see a massive difference in what’s on the playfield? Mechs, toys, etc?

Thanks for pointing one thing out. My friend and I compared Munsters wood cabinet and POTC. They are both equally solid and made from nice wood. Looking at older Sterns, I can’t say the same for the cabinet, but Munsters is equal to JJP.

We also noticed the Stern locking mechanism is far superior, as well as Sterns Apron design is better in that it doesn’t require ugly metal fence to keep the ball from slamming into the glass above the apron. Sterns actually follows the contour of the glass incline by special design (this observation doesn’t make me a Stern fanboy).

Mechanical items are not the same. Munsters has had no issues for him, where his POTC has had numerous. I’m giving actual reasons that I’ve discovered. Now will those that wish to point out from these two tables, please tell me quality differences? Unlike many, I’m open minded and want to know. After all these things are big purchases.

-2
#1718 3 months ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

They are not the same wood. You also ignored my comment about the corners. The way the cabinets are made is a huge difference. There’s a reason this thread exists for stern and not JJP:
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/reinforcing-stern-cabinet-legs-step-by-step
And these differences continue throughout. You wanted specifics, I gave you a couple examples. If you still don’t understand there are differences then no point in continuing to name more.

You gave one example that all had to do with the cabinet. I think MK6PIN answered that nicely thanks! Thanks for also answering MK6PIN about how top notch Stern mechs are in Munsters!!

Quoted from MK6PIN:

Might be an interesting comparison using Munsters and POTC (different thread?). Munsters has plywood bottom, cabinet wood definitely harder than prior Sterns, and leg bracing is at least the equal (w extra cabinet bracing)..built like a tank. It has (arguably) the most inclusive and innovative "toy/mech" of any machine...legit, multiball, mini lower pf, a bash toy that appears from under a ramp, another w magnet hold in front, and way crazy light show, interactive to gameplay. Like it or not..a serious, innovative add. Mono targets and basic coding have been attacked endlessly. We know POTC strengths and weaknesses (this is sort of a JJP thread).
Which machine is built better for what it does? My Munsters has hundreds of plays, and short of one lower pf ball stick (nudged it free, and they've already modified wireform down there to correct..yes, a wireform on lower pf) have had zero problems...not one.
POTC? hmm......back on topic...I'm still in on WonkaCE and love my WOZ. Would just be nice to know when they actually show in a completed state and delivery schedule. Release to ship dates simply cannot be debated, after years. A clear winner exists here. PLEASE BRING ON WONKA...ALL VERSIONS W ACTUAL RELEASE DATES SO I CAN MAKE AN INFORMED DECISION. (sorry for all the caps).

Now I’m disappointed, that you (f3honda4me) nor anyone else can give me actual proof that I can take to say to my wife and tell her, here is why we should spend $2k to $7k more than say Munsters (depending on model). Looking at WW, some say it’s been “cheaped out” on mechs etc. so I can’t tell her that’s the reason. Build quality is equal, at least since Munsters, so that’s not a reason. So what’s the real reason for such a wide chasm price wise between the two companies products???

-4
#1721 3 months ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

Dude, just go get a Munsters Pro if that's what you want, there's some super cheap ones on the marketplace right now.

You're right I could, but this thread is about looking into purchasing a Willy Wonka.

-16
#1723 3 months ago
Quoted from solarvalue:

I rest my case.

Don’t rest, please give me why such a large price difference so I can justify a WW purchase. Can you list why quality is better?

-20
#1725 3 months ago
Quoted from Tranquilize:

Dude, are done sort of Stern shill? This has been discussed to death on pinside. Use the damn search. Here are some reasons Sterns are cheaper and lack quality as you appear to be lazy and/or incompetent:
- No knocker
- Cheap power sources with loud, crap Chinese fans
- crap power switch location
- board system that cannot be repaired. Wait till they start failing, and they WILL.
- mechs made of cheap pot-metal (imdn etc.)
- historical cabinet issues (crap wood)
- cheap leg brackets that leads to splitting
- graphite plumb Bobs
- crap coin mechs
- smaller lcd with larger translites lit by a tiny led strip
- cheap speakers and amp
- etc etc etc. (Use the search feature)
Are they improving? Only because of market pressure. I own Sterns and enjoy their machines, but it does not blind me to their penny pinching business model.
JJP machines have issues, but they are often due to challenges related to innovation, not sucking every dime out of production.
Can't wait for Wonka

Thanks for a crude and not to the point list, that has little solid evidence and is your opinion mainly.

Is your premise so weak that name calling and put downs are your only answers?

Your points with comments:

- No knocker - (when I play Stern games I hear a knocker)
- Cheap power sources with loud, crap Chinese fans (no power source issues, but WW has power source issues to many reports of weakened flippers - do admit fan is too loud - good point)
- crap power switch location (power source location many times better, since little children can’t reach it turning on and off like under table mounts)
- board system that cannot be repaired. Wait till they start failing, and they WILL. (My friend has 20 tables with no failures)
- mechs made of cheap pot-metal (imdn etc.) (heard imdn did have some issues, but so has POTC, DI, WOZ (they stopped including the monkey for that very issue)
- historical cabinet issues (crap wood) (you’ve had several comments above to the contrary on Munsters)
- cheap leg brackets that leads to splitting (you’ve had several comments above to the contrary on Munsters)
- graphite plumb Bobs (how is JJPs different?)
- crap coin mechs (how is JJPs different and in HUO, this is a moot point)
- smaller lcd with larger translites lit by a tiny led strip (within a couple minutes everyone’s eyes focus on the content and not screen size. That’s why it’s indiscernible between say for example watching a 55” versus 65” proven in study after study)
- cheap speakers and amp (This is the first actual difference, except from Munsters onward)
- etc etc etc. (Use the search feature) (This is a non-point)

Your unkind ways of trying to help me is pushing me towards not buying WW. Are you an example of the typical JJP owner? Your mouth has such negative comments coming out of it. Please consider how to speak with people about your point of view without calling them a shill, lazy and incompetent. Not cool. Grow up...

#1727 3 months ago
Quoted from Tranquilize:

Clearly you have a preconceived answer for every Stern criticism, so why bother asking? You sound like a shill, and your previous post supports my suspicion. I call a spade a spade. Your previous responses to experienced collectors were baiting and insulting. You seem to know quite a bit about the companies and their games, easily enough to form your own informed opinion. If not, you have a friend with over 20 games to talk to. Your feigned ignorance is wasting people's time. I hope you don't buy a Wonka - I truly do - as you sound like a horrible customer to deal with. Save JJP the effort and stick to your beloved Stern. Munsters sounds right up your alley with it's wonderful quality and features.
Bring on Wonka!

Your continued insults prove my point. Are you just plain unable to deal with people with opposing viewpoints, with integrity and some modicum of decorum? You sir should seriously consider reading the great book, “How to win friends and influence people”. Good manners don’t seem to be your strong suit? Ill mannered people always resort to: name calling, put downs and “get out of this thread” when they lack skill in getting their points across. Very sad indeed...

Again I reiterate, I’m not a fanboy of either company. Trying to learn from those that have actually played WW, that’s it, since I’ve not been able to play WW yet.

#1730 3 months ago
Quoted from ronaldvg:

Ok, I will bite as I am overly irritated by this. As has been pointed out, if you do not notice the difference in quality between JJP and Stern something is wrong with you.
That said: I have both Munsters LE and JJP POTC standing next to eachother. Munsters is one of the better built Stern of the last years, so in that area it really shines for a Stern. But take BM66 for example and the differences are huge. Lift the playfield of both and have a look under it. The service rails of JJP are so different from Stern. The lockbar mechanism is a point of discussion as I personally like the Stern clips better than the old sliding mechanism that JJP uses.
Now look at the screen. JJP is combining HD video with professional animations all over the place, Stern uses mostly videoclips and the animations on top of that are only scoring and info about the ball count.
Whatever anyone says, the playfields of Stern are softer. My Munsters has got a lot less plays than the POTC and the POTC still looks like new. Munsters dimples way more. I also have a Beatles Gold here with 250 plays and the playfield looks like an orange. But the Sterns do play well and the clear does not chip.
Furthermore, the JJP games consistently make use of full RGB leds throughout the plaffield. For me this enhances my experience playing the game very much. It also provides unique ways to present the game and to do effects on the playfield (like the "fire" in Hobbit. Stern playfields mostly flash a lot. The programming of all the effects with RGB is a lot more labour intensive than just turning a led on or off when needed.
The sound: the speakers that are being used at Stern are crap. Munster LE uses the Kenwoods, but even those are crap for a device which main function is entertainment. I always change out the speakers from my Sterns, never did so with any of the JJP's.
The games itself: JJP games are coded like no other (except for the Sterns that Keith Johnson programmed). Not everyone likes the deep games that JJP offers, but what everything is forgetting is that the JJP games can also be played more simple. WoZ: lock balls on right ramp and start multiball, Hobbit: Lock balls on right ramp and start multiball, POTC: lock balls in chest and start multiball. But if you have those games at home that would become boring quickly (for me that is). I am already bored with Munsters, as it has about the same complicated ruleset as the moving ship (Black Pearl) alone in POTC. I am exaggerating of course, but it feels like it. Again this is really dependant on the game, as BM66 and TWD offer much more game than say AS, Munsters, Bealtes etc. With Stern it is very dependant on who is coding it, with JJP every game up until now is great.
One little thing that always bothers me of every recent Stern is the location of the power button. They should put it where it belongs. Also the noise that the PSU fan makes even when just in idle is always making me asshamed of it when it turns on. Again something that I change out with a quality fan every Stern.
As has been pointed out, all these things are not about the fact if it will work reliably or not. I have had as much problems with my Stern machines (nodeboards and CPU boards mainly) as with my JJP, but the JJP ones were most of the time just things that had to be fine tuned, not repaired. If there is so much more on the playfield, more can go wrong. The way that Stern solves that problem is just by not putting as much on it
Long post but I wanted to put out my opinion as this point keeps getting raised. Here in Europe Stern is as expensive as JJP so in that light my opinion is that I get a much better experience with JJP than with Stern. Playing a JJP is going on a journey, playing a Stern is just playing a pinball machine.

Thanks so much for this. Actual real results that I was looking for and I actually agree with some of your opinion.

Although still doesn’t answer WW questions and issues. But you don’t have one yet so you can’t comment, but thanks for your opinion and in an inoffensive manner. Cheers!

PS: Playfield dimpling happens on both product offerings.

#1753 3 months ago
Quoted from Lermods:

I have owned all four jjp games and most spike games, including Munsters pro. In my view there is no comparison between the two with Stern being much lower.
-Have you ever tried to move a stern or jjp game or even lift a playfield? There is a reason jjp games weigh more standard body DI). Beefier mechs, higher gauge wire, higher gauge connectors, lack of fuses, more toys and just a ton of stuff on the play field.
-The quality of the board set is much lower for spike games, they are literally meant to be non-repairable throw away items. Your friend should consider himself lucky nothing has failed, plenty have. What will happen in 5 years? You can replace a fuse in a jjp game whereas in a stern game, the entire board needs to be replaced, that’s a huge quality difference.
- Relatedly, spike Node board failure puts a game down for at least a week, replacing a fuse, 5 mins.
-Sound quality/parts.
-cabinet construction method and wood thickness (do the research)
-monitor quality.
I like stern games, they are all fun, but for the long run, I’d rather own a jjp. I feel the stern game’s from the mid-2000s were built much better than the games of today.

Thanks for the good information. This is more of what I was looking for in this thread.

#1807 3 months ago

Promised game play honest impressions: WW is a bright cheerful table that brings out the kid in anyone that plays it.

Game is cleaner looking, more than DI the other JJP standard body pin. Unlike DI, where the left side looses the ball much of the time, WW has good visuals on the ball on all sides, with some fun stuff happening to the right backside.

Four flippers are a treat especially since Pat gave real targets on the east and west shots, not just north and south (still don’t know why JJP doesn’t add target themed covers? Like other companies do), adding to the action for fun for all points of the table and not just from a traditional fan layout. That patterned Lawlor silky smooth shots grooving left and right, make for an energy feel of the overall table and plays really well. Really like the shots and layout! Well done Pat/JJP!

However for the money, the table feels barren compared to other JJP offerings and seems to lack innovations, that we always look forward to from JJP. Innovations is what help set JJP apart from the rest. But now this effort seems to be following the rest, rather than leading the pack as before. So it seems very hard to justify such high prices for any of the three WW tables as the core issue.

It feels like JJP service department might have had a big hand in recommending a big pull back on adding mechs that might break down in the future. This could be good if JJP bean counters also pulled back the pricing to reflect these obvious downgrades. No real center point to hit that interacts with the ball. There is a target under the gob stopper, but no real ball interaction with the gob stopper itself, which is what pinball is all about. It does have a revolving hole in the front that swirls around and seems more like “how can we make a mech that won’t break down” rather than using the old standard trap door (which Stern also has tried to stop using, as they pulled out the trap door in grandpa Munsters lab - bad move on Sterns part). Bally/Williams used trap doors aplenty, which made their games remarkable.

Still need to get bunch of games on the table and let the honeymoon phase fade away to ensure it has staying power. Now only if this table were $2k less, then many; including myself, would jump right on it and take a chance anyway. This is not a Stern fanboy statement, because their tables are also priced high for what they are offering, but Stern’s pricing is low enough to allow all of us collectors a much smaller depreciation than JJP tables that are priced so astronomically high in comparison.

Think K hit it on the head, the missing movie parts are immense from WW and are the achilles heal of this game. And is the missing something I’ve experienced from gameplay. Other than those omissions, the game plays well, as should be expected from most Pat Lawlor tables. My hope is for coding to be improved, with much needed missing iconic scenes and call outs, added from the movie. But this hope is lessening by every reveal, as K spent almost 45 minutes explaining to those of us that have listened.

#1867 3 months ago
Quoted from Vdrums:

I don’t want to mis speak but from what I heard (from an extremely good source) While wonka will obviously get a lot more code and rules, it will not be getting a much more media assets incorporated into the game.

This is a deal breaker for many. No real assets again will really hurt sales. Just collecting wonka bars as one of the main task is going to become over the long haul, a real chore in a home environment. Like chopping wood. Sure don’t like hearing this to be the case.

#1870 3 months ago
Quoted from hockeymag8:

I normally agree with both your and MKs posts....but I am with MK on this....it is not hasty...it is prudent. These prices at least for LE are $10k ish....that is crazy coin so I get him/others wanting to back off. I like Wonka and POTC but for those prices...not feeling the buys either.
"To whom much is given.....much is expected"
This is one of my favorite sayings...and if JPP wants to lead the way in the coins they collect for these games, they need to lead in quality, toys and code.

This post is right in the money (pun intended, lol). Exactly how I’ve felt and what I’ve been saying all along.

#1871 3 months ago

Looooool, thanks for that, good humor. Meaning toward Romulusx comment above.

#1876 3 months ago
Quoted from wesman:

I'm the opposite. I'm already tired of the asset clips used as is, and if more were added, over time I'd be equally as fatigued. One can only see video clips so many times before they burn into your retinas. Seeing Bilbo run down those stairs, time and time again for multi-ball, sans even owning it, but wanting to, makes me batty.
This is kind of where I miss well done, and brief, DMD animations.
Though I'll say the multi-ball animations in JJPOTC, fill in that same exact perfect snippet for me.

Thinking you might be in the minority on this title (agree with your assessment of Hobbit). WW film clips are just too fun and never seem to tire watching such a well acted and written script.

Who gets tired of WW iconic scenes? Especially when you’ve reached different points in the game. Who doesn’t want to be rewarded with such movie integrations upon achieving different movie/game goals? You’ll surely be thinking them in your mind, even if not present. How much more authentic to actually have them play out on screen? How many times does one hear the candyman song or other music and still enjoy hearing it again? It’s part of the movie assets. Just like any themed games music and scenes. If they are not there, will be hugely disappointing.

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