I have been able to tell you everything that I have been told. There is nothing to tell right now.

Spot on here. The sounds just bothered me so much in the stream. I want one, because I played it and it shot great, but not with these sounds. While the sounds may “fit” the theme, together they’re just not a good package. Can JJP ever add an enthusiastic “Jackpot!” callout in a game?

At least they are more enthusiastic than the ones from Dialed In!

"CE's are still waiting on parts"......

It’s hard not to be!

Just curious if you really banned kaneda from the stream? Seemed like he was just asking good questions about what was going on but just curious your side of the story?

Thanks for streaming.... Going to watch now.

EDIT great stream. Sound is coming in really loud and I like all of the different cameras.

Wow the announcer on this game is one of the worst I've ever heard. I really hope you can change that or they redo the call outs. Absolutely kills it. The effects are also already annoying me. Damn it JJP. Don't mess this one up!

Promised game play honest impressions: WW is a bright cheerful table that brings out the kid in anyone that plays it.

Game is cleaner looking, more than DI the other JJP standard body pin. Unlike DI, where the left side looses the ball much of the time, WW has good visuals on the ball on all sides, with some fun stuff happening to the right backside.

Four flippers are a treat especially since Pat gave real targets on the east and west shots, not just north and south (still don’t know why JJP doesn’t add target themed covers? Like other companies do), adding to the action for fun for all points of the table and not just from a traditional fan layout. That patterned Lawlor silky smooth shots grooving left and right, make for an energy feel of the overall table and plays really well. Really like the shots and layout! Well done Pat/JJP!

However for the money, the table feels barren compared to other JJP offerings and seems to lack innovations, that we always look forward to from JJP. Innovations is what help set JJP apart from the rest. But now this effort seems to be following the rest, rather than leading the pack as before. So it seems very hard to justify such high prices for any of the three WW tables as the core issue.

It feels like JJP service department might have had a big hand in recommending a big pull back on adding mechs that might break down in the future. This could be good if JJP bean counters also pulled back the pricing to reflect these obvious downgrades. No real center point to hit that interacts with the ball. There is a target under the gob stopper, but no real ball interaction with the gob stopper itself, which is what pinball is all about. It does have a revolving hole in the front that swirls around and seems more like “how can we make a mech that won’t break down” rather than using the old standard trap door (which Stern also has tried to stop using, as they pulled out the trap door in grandpa Munsters lab - bad move on Sterns part). Bally/Williams used trap doors aplenty, which made their games remarkable.

Still need to get bunch of games on the table and let the honeymoon phase fade away to ensure it has staying power. Now only if this table were $2k less, then many; including myself, would jump right on it and take a chance anyway. This is not a Stern fanboy statement, because their tables are also priced high for what they are offering, but Stern’s pricing is low enough to allow all of us collectors a much smaller depreciation than JJP tables that are priced so astronomically high in comparison.

Think K hit it on the head, the missing movie parts are immense from WW and are the achilles heal of this game. And is the missing something I’ve experienced from gameplay. Other than those omissions, the game plays well, as should be expected from most Pat Lawlor tables. My hope is for coding to be improved, with much needed missing iconic scenes and call outs, added from the movie. But this hope is lessening by every reveal, as K spent almost 45 minutes explaining to those of us that have listened.

Fantastic stream. thanks for sharing!

Quick question: where can you see all 4 players scores on the display during gameplay? Seems you can only see the current player score?

Awesome stream! Karl really is the gold standard of pinball streaming. It was great being able to see what was on the small display the entire time. The game is really coming along nicely and looks like a lot of fun to play.

It does seem like the game could use a bit more excitement and fanfare around the jackpots and big scoring moments. For example, during Karl's best game the score suddenly jumped from around 800k to 1.3 million but nothing showed up on the screen. Was this from collecting the Gumball Golden ticket? It displayed that on the screen but didn't show a score value associated? If you have a scoring moment that big the game should let you know it!

The other players scores are right underneath the current player's score in a smaller font.

He was, but not by me. One of my chat mods banned him, and as a joke unfortunately. Why, I have no idea. He wasn't saying anything bad in chat and there was no reason to ban him. I had a short chat with the mod to unban him, which he did, but the damage had already been done. Since then I've sent an apology to K detailing what happened.

Thank you! Now I see them!

This is early code,JJP take your time and get it right

Excellent job as always with the stream, Sir.

Joke?
I know its not as extreme as the unpersoning of people going on with facebook these days but freedom of speech in pinball atleast people?

Thanks for the explanation. It was sort of weird when it happened.

I was on the stream from the start and Kaneda didn't really say or ask anything that seemed offensive or trolling (whether you like his podcast or not). As a person who wants this game to be it's best, I was thinking some of the same comments he was making in chat.

I feel that JJP has laid down a beautiful/flowy PF which is positioned to be a huge success. Now it comes down to adding the final strokes and details in code that will complete the painting and make it a master piece of fun!

Again, excellent job on the streaming and Karl is a pin master who is fun to watch!

Cheers!

What he said is so true!

I didn't understand either. All I know is it won't happen again in my channel.

Watched a lot of the twitch stream, and, man, this game looks fun to shoot. It's so interesting that Pat's games have such a unique feel to them, and I can see this game is no exception. I love the innovation in the lighting with magnets, and the small screen use. The use of the camera is going to make newbs spit their beer out when they watch their face move across the screen! That said, the integration on screen needs some pretty serious work. To hear Gene's voice and see a clip of him not talking reminds me of Karate overdub. It appears that they are listening and moving away from the slot machine experience, which I am grateful for. If they support this game like they have their previous titles, the final code will be grade-A from the sweat and tears of their programmers. I'm stoked! Now if I can just choose a model...

thanks for addressing. Stand up response. Great job streaming.

iepinball Your stream was the best I've ever seen.

I'm curious about the hardware you use for the various direct captures? Also, it sounded like you had direct feed audio without your mic catching any echo. Top notch.

This game could have been so great. As of today, I'm only half way in...my deposit on an LE still exists, but...just baffled at the current state of modes, clips and callouts.

Sorry but things sound like the "sos" on pinside. I can't begin to count the number of posts that threatened or stated they cancelled their POTC order because of the chest lock and/or spinning disc changes. To be honest, I said the same thing until lucidity set in and I kept my order in place. So glad that I did because the game is amazing. We all know that now POTC is in high demand. Chill people. Give JJP and Joe a chance to get a game ready to ship. Code updates undoubtedly will come later. JJP has always kept its word on code updates. The Hobbit, for example is much improved over the game that I got NIB and POTC continues to improve despite licensing limitations. If you decide to bail on WONKA now, I think you will regret it later. Me, I am standing firm on my WONKA CE order and, despite Kaneda's lamentations, I am confident in that decision. BTW, my wife opines that if you really need all the modes that are not coded yet, watch the damn movie again until they are.

I actually -did- pull my POTC order over discgate - friend did also - and both of us are now very happy POTC owners. So yeah, that was a mistake.

I am not going to lie, I'm a little concerned about Wonka. I am already a little bored of the repetition I'm seeing on the streams and hope the game has enough depth and variety to interest me long term. Keeping my CE order though, because what else is worth buying right now NIB?

Glad to hear Derek that you're staying the course. You will be a valued member of the WONKA Owners club just as you are for the POTC Owners Club. BTW, re. needed code enhancements, I'd wager that Jack is working hard to keep his 60 day interval for shipping after reveal and that may require a skeleton code first with much to follow. Got to get money flowing and keep the doors open. And, isn't that what Stern typically does and now it appears that AP is following the same model with OKT. I guess what it all boils down to is who do you trust. On the matter of continuing to improve the game. I am willing to give Jack the benefit of doubt.

Why? That asinine.

Just buy it later if you want it later. Don't buy games on potential, buy them because they're already good. If they get better later? Bonus! If they're not good enough now? Close your wallet and wait, use a little adult patience.

That is definitely not anyone on Pinside's problem. If JJP goes out of business then it's because they ran business badly, not because people didn't buy a bunch of unfinished product to support them.

I guess you could say the same thing about Stern Pinball buying unfinished product from them right ?

Heck I'd be lying if I told you I wasn't having an occasional second thought. I was hoping for more polished code by now, and hoping that we'd hear a solid start date for shipping. The code though is the big thing, it's missing a lot of voice clips and whatnot. I know from Hobbit that JJP has the ability to do amazing integration with clips and video, however, they need to NOT do it the same way Hobbit was which was well after the pin was out and sold and it took a long time to get the code to a good place.

If code is still unfinished at release, it gives me pause to think about buying it later when the code is actually completed.

I’ll be honest,I do root for JJP

Glad to hear that kind of response.

I really need to watch this when it gets youtube ready, my Twitch streaming via phone often freezes. Really looking forward to it, as your POTC stream was phenomenal!

Obviously, yes. I don't understand this comment, are you trying to turn this into some childish Stern vs JJP thing? Don't be dumb, don't wear company jerseys or root for them like sports teams. Don't buy unfinished games from anyone unless you're fully aware of what that means, that's just common sense.

What's the rush? I get it, new pin, it's exciting. Fun to get in on, fun to show off, etc. But after that first couple days of New Pin Feeling™ wears off and you have a game you're not sure you're really excited enough about?

Not saying don't buy it if you want it. Do you. Some people just like supporting companies, or enjoy the journey of watching a pin develop. I'm sure JJP will deliver a complete game. I honestly have no doubts about that. But will it be the game you want it to be? That's the rub, buy it for what it is, not what you hope it will turn into, because whatever work they do it might not be that thing you imagine.

Edit to add this:

Fine, whatever. But if rooting for them means blindly buying anything they do and encouraging others to do the same just because you're a fan then that's dumb. If you hope they do well and like their work and enjoy their games that's different. I'm down for the second thing, and not for the first.

buy it for what it is

I couldn't agree more. I have no regrets about my preorder of the SE because Pat is my favorite designer and I absolutely love the movie.

The only game I have purchased new is Dialed In and that was after playing it at the Louisville show.
After a lot of discussion sold my Addams Family and bought a DI and have never been sorry.
I remember what Stern was putting out before JJP stepped up with WOZ.They made Stern make
more complete pins.So no I don't dumbly or blindly purchase pins a lot of thought goes into my choices.
I do know on Pinside the negativity becomes very annoying sometimes about the smallest of issues

The displays are both DVI/HDMI so I just used two different HDMI splitters to feed back into the game displays and into my HDMI capture cards. The computer for this stream had 1 Magewell Pro Capture Quad HDMI card and 1 Avermedia Game Broadcaster HD. Audio was a headphone splitter on the game side, so we could still hear audio on-site, going into a Rodecaster Pro along with the XLR mic.

38.6GB just started uploading to YouTube. We'll see how long it takes to finish and to process at 4k...

We played it extensively at MGC. We really like how it plays. But the package needs to be completed. At MGC you couldn’t really hear it anyways. But in a home environment you hear it and now hearing it via streams it needs a lot more of the IP in the sound and a bit more video/etc.

Makes sense to me. So wait a bit, and buy if it feels better.

I don’t think I’m espousing sage wisdom here, it’s just common sense. This isn’t a limited commodity that will be available now or never. If they improve it and you like it? Buy it. If for some reason it doesn’t turn out like you hoped? You’ll be glad you waited.

I really think this forum can both be excited and exercise basic restraint. Be into the game, talk about it, and get it if and when it’s right for you. Your neighbors won’t know or care either way.

Restraint = logical sense.
Pinball Collectors, Rarely use logic and gotta have now for the most part.

They will if you need them to help move these heavy buggers inside.

Nice, not enough pinball streamers upload to high resolutions, looking forward to seeing it in 4K.

Also, glad you set the record straight with banning people, I thought that was really messed up what happened. Censorship is lame unless someone is being extreme.

I played wonka last night right after it arrived @GSPF, my thoughts:

- Many thanks to doomid for braving crappy traffic form SoCal to bring it up here for everyone to check out.

- Much more fun that I thought it would be. It was my wife and kids that were pushing for a Wonka after seeing the reveal (I was interested, but not 100% sold). I had watched all the streams (that last one in LA was extremely impressive, Jack should hire them, heh) to try and get a good feel for the game play and features and I just wasn't making the connection. Playing in person was just different (obviously) I was just surprised at how different. My one gripe is that the game at the show is set on 2 balls per player and no ball save (not even a few seconds). So I feel like the majority of people playing we're leaving the game frustrated with how short their time was on it. That being said, GSPF was not packed last night so I just waiting in line a whole bunch of times to get some decent time on it.

- Wonkavision on the streams (specially the ones that did not have the direct video input on the screen) just looked hidden and obscured. In person it looks awesome. I feel like they need to use it more and be a little more creative with it, but I think that will come as the code continues to be updated.

- My initial gripe after the reveal was that it was not crazy packed like WOZ, but after playing it, i like it. There is room/space, it doesn't feel crammed. It's just a beautiful pin. Congrats to the JJP team, I think they did a great job.

- The game has serious flow. My buddy compared the flow to DI, but my .02, the closest comparison I could come up with was deadpool (not a typical fan layout). Lots of looping shots that feed the various flippers that feed other shots. Lots of opportunities for combos. The upper flippers all feel useful and have a purpose. It was just plain fun to shoot.

- The gobstopper toy/hole, while not a game changer, was just plain fun to shoot.

- I wasn't seeing anyone get any balls into the Wonkavator lock, but I felt that had more to do with the limited balls, no ball saver and people generally not knowing the rules. Not really a concern for me at this time.

- I can't comment on the sounds as I couldn't hear shit at the show. I'll be going back Sunday with my kids so they can try it out and will be sure to bring head phones. That being said, its Wonka.. it's going to have music from that theme that I'm sure some won't like. I'm sure they will mix things up as much as possible as the code matures.

My goal playing it this weekend was for me to be happy that I plunked down a deposit, so far the answer is YES. Assuming the Fam still likes it Sunday we are still IN.

20190517_181812 (resized).jpg

It's a shame too, since, IMO, the "Jackpot" callout on Twilight Zone is by far the best one in all of Pinball. I wish that same sound team had followed Lawlor.

I'm disappointed by the "generic narrator" they used for callouts as well. Surely there is a Gene Wilder impersonator out there, right? Or were they worried about issues with his estate (like I heard they apparently had with Serling's on TZ)?

Excited by the game though. I just hope they get the code right.

Thanks for the report! It's always so different to play a pin versus watching it on a stream. What's frustrating is that it's also different to play a pin at home than on location sometimes too, can make the decisions very difficult.

It looks like this is at the very least going to be a very fun shooting pin with an appealing theme for a lots of people. That's a pretty good base to build a pin on. Now if they can nail the code and bring in enough clips and iconic sounds to up the theme integration I think they'll have a winner here. Sure, it's not looking like it's going to be a journey through the movie that some people are hoping for, but there are other ways to make a great pin.

We just got home from putting about 10 games on Wonka, and I’ve gotta say, the hype was REAL! I agree with about everything arcadenerd925 said, but I was able to crank the volume which was a bonus. The flow is better imho than Dialed In, and the game just feels amazingly good to shoot. It really has it all - theme, layout, and is just plain gorgeous - code wise I think some more variety and bass with the music, tweak the callouts, maybe throw in some different music to change it up a little, and the pin is truly a must have. I paid for Pirates today which hopefully gets delivered next week - Wonkas definately next!

E6965D52-D3CA-430D-9658-43D9E06C6519 (resized).jpeg

Doesn't make any sense that alot of new games have lame jackpot callout and sound effects. They spend all this money and time and skip one of the most rewarded things to do in a pinball machine. It should be so loud and exciting that people will come over and say wow what happened. Twilight zone and addams have great jackpots. Also WW needs the candy man song in the game. To me this is one of those songs that made WW a great movie, need more movie clips that are full screen, instead of showing that boring factory all the time. This game has the flow, now add the show.

Agreed with the above. The recent stream shows the pin looks to flow smoothly with plenty of fun interactive shots.
Now, let’s hope that more movie clips are added complete with the actors voices. Can’t see what would prevent JJP from doing this unless it’s another licensing issue.
I’m close to ordering an LE but would love to see more of the Wonka movie magic.

Unfortunately I’m one of those that has too much attachment to the movie and this just does not give me the same feeling. I’m sure it’s a great shooting pin, but for me the issues are with the overall mode structure and mechs which cannot be changed without a 50% redesign. Polished code with video done like POTC or Hobbit and changing that generic narrator will make it worthy of playing on location for sure. I don’t see how they could improve it enough with just code to make me want to own it though.

To hit a homerun with this theme, it would need better mechs like a real model wonkavator that can receive the ball, and an Augustus pipe for a ball lock and perhaps an eggdicator. Each kid would need a dedicated mode leading to a golden ticket and a Multiball. Then of course the wizard mode after all 5 golden tickets.

I was really hoping this one would be as innovative as WOZ and POTC, but it just misses the mark for me. I cancelled my wonka and bought a POTCLE. It will ship out in a few days. I’m so excited!

Got to play a Wonka LE today at the Golden State Pinball Festival and all I have to say is, I'm completely in on my CE... This game may not have the "wow" of POTC or WOZ but it's sooooooo much fun that even on a two ball limit with no ball saves, I kept going back and back and back and back... This game is just straight fun and with the Mezel Mods that they've already shown, this game is going to be special....

Jeff

For me this game seems to be a turnaround for JJP in many ways. They want to be able to produce more and probably also somewhat cheaper to become more profitable. Also they want to change to two games per year so that automatically means they do not have that much time anymore for coding the games. That is only natural. Same people making more different games means less time per game.

Coming to the question if I am in. No. I am sorry to say that this is the first game of JJP that I have not ordered immediately. And maybe - I will probably get shot down for this - it is because it is a Pat Lawlor game. Undoubtedly he makes nice games but give me the more innovative games like Eric has made. POTC is a masterpiece, especcialy considering it is Eric's first.

Just let the old designers retire. They have done great work and it is VERY much appreciated and enjoyed, but it is time for new blood. That is why this time I ordered an Oktoberfest instead of Wonka. Don't get me wrong, I might still buy a Wonka down the road, but I first want to see how the game pans out to be codewise. Joe is a great coder, so who knows, but Wonka needs the integration that Hobbit has. The movie deserves that.

Anybody else at the show want to post your reviews of Wonka in person?

But....Joe Balcer isn't exactly a spring chicken either.