(Topic ID: 211296)

Gottlieb Target Alpha game reset issues

By FatPanda

6 years ago


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Topic Stats

  • 81 posts
  • 5 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 years ago by FatPanda
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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TA.pdf (PDF preview)
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#2 6 years ago

Likely it's the "0" pos. sw. on that reel. Those reels are rather tetchy, and something that looks ok can actually need a slight bit of adjustment.

So, with the game off, manually push the plunger to advance the reel to 0, then make sure the 0 pos. sw. is making good contact. Also not a bad idea to make sure all the player unit contacts and rivets are nice and shiny clean, as they're part of the Z1 and Z2 relay reset process at the beginning of games. PU is in the middle of the backbox. Use 600# or so sandpaper.

Read more here: http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index2.htm#reels

#6 6 years ago

The gap on the contacts of the "0" relay, FatPanda. They have to touch when the reel is at 0. The two others don't then.

Note the make/break AX sw. on the snippet that HowardR posted. Those are also on the tetchy side; have to be adjusted so that they have a nice snap when they lock and unlock. So, check for correct gap and cleanliness on that, as it affects the O sw. as well. Educational moment: figure out which of the two M/B's it is by the wire colors.

#8 6 years ago

No, the zero sw. on your 10K reel. Note edited remark above.

Note difference b/w '0' (zero) and 'O' (Oh).

#10 6 years ago

Solid contact? If so, now move on to the AX.

#13 6 years ago

Yes, it's on the bottom right of the cabinet, first one. Re-read my comments. Here is more info: http://www.pinrepair.com/em/index2.htm#clean

That switch, like the rest, are held on by a cotter pin in the back. Be very careful taking it out and replacing because if you lose it and it goes under the board it can be a pita to find. You will have to take it out to properly check it. Be careful not to squeeze anything that shouldn't be; I've done that. The O sw. is probably ok and just being affected by something else.

#16 6 years ago

Besides making sure that the contacts were clean, you need to push the plastic piece and look REAL close to make sure they're making good contact and "wiping." Also that the screws are tight. Good idea to check all the solders, too. Does the AX snap when you lock/unlock it?

And yeah, once you pull the blades out of those slots you usually don't do it again unless you have to.

#20 6 years ago

Any change in play?

#31 6 years ago

Give the BX relay (last ball) a good going over like you did with the AX. Score motor 4C fourth sw. is also worth a look. You have the schematic, yes? There is a pic on the bottom left of the score motor sw. pos., and also one of the "L" and "S" 'switch dogs' pos. ; make sure they're on right. 2 is the only one that is in the "L" pos.

And that is one clean interior! Shiny score motor, too.

TA score motor (resized).jpgTA score motor (resized).jpg

#35 6 years ago

Here's something I should have posted before.

Aren't the relays labeled? BX is the second on the right on the bottom.

TA start up (resized).jpgTA start up (resized).jpg

#37 6 years ago
Quoted from FatPanda:

Tbh, and I know you won't like hearing this, but this is turning me off to EM ownership so bad.

Blasphemy! Haha, keep at it and it will come to you. At least you don't have to deal with burnt boards and the like.

TA.pdfTA.pdf

#38 6 years ago

Take a little break, relax, and think about it a bit.

#43 6 years ago

What happens if you switch to 5 ball? and did you check the score motor 4C sw?

#48 6 years ago

Score motor lettering starts at the bottom. I can see the sw. your pic. 4 is at the bottom of that pic. 3 1/2, the single-blade brake, is always a good reference point.

#51 6 years ago

Looks good. Making solid contact?

Now try switching over to 5 ball.

#53 6 years ago

Mmm, don't worry about the lights. Alright, check the make/break on "R" - the hold relay. What's the story on the relays, are they labeled?

I really think it has something to do with AX and/or BX, so checking everything involved with them.

#59 6 years ago

It doesn't really look burnt. Do you have a multimeter, by chance? There is only one M/B on that relay; in the third pic down, is the outer part of the M/B making good contact and then when you push the plastic the inner one does?

In this case, R is part of the sequence that leads to Q. Look at 16I on the schematic and follow that up to Q.

#60 6 years ago

OK, check out the tail end of #5 on the start up sequence, and #6. To get to those Player Unit switches (P5A & B) you'll need to drop the Player Unit by unscrewing the bolt on the top and letting it hinge down. Clean all the P5 sw.,gently, with a swab and 91# rubbing alcohol. There are lateral solders, so be careful there. Be sure to let it evaporate on sw. that are closed. Be sure no lint is left behind (makes for some really odd behavior). Check DX as well.

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#63 6 years ago

Taking a step back and thinking about things is always a good idea. I get a fair amount of revelations if I leave things be overnight.

Soooo, as I said earlier, I think the improper shutdown has to involve the BX. And #6 on the start up seq, AX and BX resets, has to get done for shutdown to happen properly, so I would run thru my post 60 above.

#65 6 years ago

Also, did you clean the Player Unit rivets and contacts? Give them all a good sanding with 600# sandpaper.

#68 6 years ago

Alrighty, here is something we should have done early on: live check connections, as in poke switches with something non-conductive (eraser end of a pencil is good) with the power on, as visual doesn't always work. I've had more than one sw. that looked like it was making a solid connection turn out not to be. Also just pushing the plastic holder, and a key thing is not to jump and hit something if you get surprised by something kicking on. Esp. check the latch switches: AX, BX, DX, and any other sw. that have been mentioned before, such as R, and I just noticed a make/break on H, the Tilt Hold relay. See the sequence at 13.5 on the schematic that involves Last Ball relay reset? Give that a good look.

#74 6 years ago
Quoted from FatPanda:

Do you know if pinballninja cfh has this covered in his website?

I don't know what that is.

Looking again at Operating Instructions, #10, it is crucial that BX gets tripped. Check the NC sw. on "E" that goes into the DX at 15 on the schematic, and that is dependent, if you look back and up on the schematic, on the make/break on AX and the NC sw. on Q. So check all of those.

With the unit on and a game started, press NC switches and the closed part of make/breaks.

#76 6 years ago
Quoted from FatPanda:

Clay's pinside username. Is he not the pinball ninja? I thought he was.

Oh, he might be. I would guess that he'd say to check and follow the instructions thru.

#78 6 years ago
Quoted from currieddog:

Looking again at Operating Instructions, #10, it is crucial that BX gets tripped. Check the NC sw. on "E" that goes into the DX at 15 on the schematic, and that is dependent, if you look back and up on the schematic, on the make/break on AX and the NC sw. on Q. So check all of those.

Check out the Operating Instructions, Rolf, and the schematic for Last Ball relay at about 15. If the BX is not tripped it won't shut down correctly.

FatPanda-after you've played the last ball and while the motor is still running, try pressing the closed switches on the relays that have been mentioned, esp. E and BX.

I was trying to check some of the sw. on my TA so I could take pix and did something which took a while to straighten out. Shows how testy those lock switches can be.

#80 6 years ago

The outer sw? You might have caught your sleeve on it. Any rate, fabulous, and now you know most of the switches on the unit INTIMATELY!

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