Gottlieb System 3 (Shaq Attaq) sound issues ...Hey Viperrwk...

My Shaq Attaq project is coming along nicely, but I'm having some intermittent sound issues. The game will sporadically have a single tone come on and stay on for a while, or get garbled and then just sound like a beeping for a while. I found this thread indicating it might be the RAM: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.games.pinball/ZV1CGOJ8Tvg
Does it sound like my issue is RAM as well?

I don't have the manual in front of me; does anyone happen to recall whether the RAM on the sound board is socketed?

Thanks,

Collin

#2 10 years ago

TIM

ralphwiggum

Wish I could help you, but I am not Viperrwk.... LOL

I remember from another post that your 5 volts was at 4.89. You are starting to enter the threshold for some logic wonkyness. The easiest step would be to bring up your 5 volt slightly (Potentiometer on small Power supply board) to get it closer to a solid 5v and then troubleshoot from there.

Usually the double beep is indicitive of your sound board booting up, but if it continues to do it, you may have it resetting due to low logic.

#3 10 years ago

JDR

Jdawg4422

Inactive member

Scottsdale, AZ

12y 42,900 787 6

i will say look at the 5v and make sure it is high enough. I had to replace my 5v potentiometer on my teed' off when i had the same problems.

#4 10 years ago

CDF

Collin

Pinside member

Quoted from ralphwiggum:
Wish I could help you, but I am not Viperrwk.... LOL
I remember from another post that your 5 volts was at 4.89. You are starting to enter the threshold for some logic wonkyness. The easiest step would be to bring up your 5 volt slightly (Potentiometer on small Power supply board) to get it closer to a solid 5v and then troubleshoot from there.
Usually the double beep is indicitive of your sound board booting up, but if it continues to do it, you may have it resetting due to low logic.

Hah! I just made reference to him as he helped in the RGP post I was referring to. You've been more than helpful in my previous Shaq thread (and Varathane threads, and playfield touch-up thread, and.....)

Sorry, forgot to mention in the original post - I brought my 5v up to about 5.05v (didn't want to risk going over by too much, lest I damage board components.) That seemed to help a little bit, but didn't completely fix the problem.

#5 10 years ago

CDF

Collin

Pinside member

I could turn the 5V up higher if needed (and I've heard of people cranking it way up.) With arcade games, I'd heard many can be damaged if the 5v goes above 5.1v. Is that the case with these as well?

#6 10 years ago

TIM

ralphwiggum

OP
Quoted from Collin:
I could turn the 5V up higher if needed (and I've heard of people cranking it way up.) With arcade games, I'd heard many can be damaged if the 5v goes above 5.1v. Is that the case with these as well?

Your 5 volt is fine... no need to crank it up. I havent gone through my schematics in awhile, but have had to repair a few System 3 Soundboards. The culprit in two of my boards was the 6116 (and yes it was socketed)....

#7 10 years ago

CMX

viperrwk

Inactive member

New Haven, CT

12y 42,650 4,167

No need to go above 5.1v - anything above that and you'll get funky things happening with the machine.
The memory is not socketed on the sound board - unfortunately. You need 6116s to replace them at H2 and H3. For Sys3 sound problems first you check the voltages. I'd also confirm them on the sound board - 5v on pin 8 on the 6502. Also check the +/-12 v coming into P2 (+12 P4, -12 P3.) Then verify the ROMs, After that you can suspect the RAM.

viperrwk

#8 10 years ago

TIM

ralphwiggum

Quoted from ralphwiggum:
The culprit in two of my boards was the 6116 (and yes it was socketed)....

Sorry to clarify, it got socketed once replaced. (They aren't socketed from the factory)....

#9 10 years ago

CDF

Collin

Pinside member

Thanks guys! I'll go ahead and throw some 6116s on my next Great Plains order along with some sockets for them.

Does anyone have the ROM images for the sound ROM(s) on this game, by chance? I'm hoping to get an EPROM burner soon, and figure I can probably burn a replacement easy enough if the RAM doesn't take care of the issues.

#10 10 years ago

TIM

ralphwiggum

OP
Quoted from Collin:
Thanks guys! I'll go ahead and throw some 6116s on my next Great Plains order along with some sockets for them.
Does anyone have the ROM images for the sound ROM(s) on this game, by chance? I'm hoping to get an EPROM burner soon, and figure I can probably burn a replacement easy enough if the RAM doesn't take care of the issues.

The official answer is that Steve Young at PBR is where you get the roms from. The unofficial answer is that you can get all of the Gottlieb rom images from a popular virtual pinball forum (not posting a link, but it should be pretty clear using the Google machine).

3 weeks later

#11 10 years ago

CDF

Collin

Pinside member

Quoted from viperrwk:
No need to go above 5.1v - anything above that and you'll get funky things happening with the machine.
The memory is not socketed on the sound board - unfortunately. You need 6116s to replace them at H2 and H3. For Sys3 sound problems first you check the voltages. I'd also confirm them on the sound board - 5v on pin 8 on the 6502. Also check the +/-12 v coming into P2 (+12 P4, -12 P3.) Then verify the ROMs, After that you can suspect the RAM.
viperrwk

Where's the 6502? I must be blind, as I'm not seeing any chip with that marking.

Quoted from ralphwiggum:
Your 5 volt is fine... no need to crank it up. I havent gone through my schematics in awhile, but have had to repair a few System 3 Soundboards. The culprit in two of my boards was the 6116 (and yes it was socketed)....

Is it possible it's 5116, not 6116? I'm looking at my sound board and see this:
1203132043a.jpg

#12 10 years ago

AMS

barakandl

nvram.weebly.com

12y 132K 10,417

SH5116 is probably just sharp's dumb ass coding for a 6116. That looks like a standard CMOS ram near ROMs and CPU. Can probably use a 2016 here since there is no battery backup.

#13 10 years ago

CDF

Collin

Pinside member

The 6116s I got from Great Plains are only half as wide as the chips marked LH5116 (which are the two right below the socketed sound ROMs)

It's entirely possible I'm misunderstanding some posts here, though.

#14 10 years ago

CMX

viperrwk

Inactive member

New Haven, CT

12y 42,650 4,167

Andrew is correct. Sharp had a different designation for the 6116. Ed sells two different types of 6116s - "wide" and "narrow." Last I looked he was out of the "wide."

The 6502 is in the upper left hand corner of your photo. It is a 65SC02 which is a later version of the 6502. The "S" means it is a static core which means it can be clocked to zero and keep its contents. The "C" means it uses CMOS technology instead of NMOS like the original 6502. Program-wise, they are identical.

viperrwk

#15 10 years ago

CDF

Collin

Pinside member

OH, okay! That makes sense now. Thanks for the explanation!

#16 10 years ago

DJP

Chitownpinball

Pinside member

Aurora, IL

11y 102K 7,314 5

Viperrwk is the man...

It looks like some one already replaced the RAM chip under your YROM..unless that was you.

#17 10 years ago

CDF

Collin

Pinside member

Quoted from Chitownpinball:
Viperrwk is the man...
It looks like some one already replaced the RAM chip under your YROM..unless that was you.

Yeah, I'd concluded the same thing. Wasn't my doing, and I think that's the bad one. Might be a really easy job.

5 months later

#18 9 years ago

RJS

thepita007

Pinside member

Jacksonville, FL

11y 32,050 279 3

Did you ever discover your problem? I am having a similar issue.

1 week later

#19 9 years ago

CDF

Collin

Pinside member